Taking the knee

[badgerx16]

17 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It might make things worse. There's a bit of evidence to suggest that's the case. 

Precisely. People object to being lectured to about how they are meant to behave or think.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by badgerx16

[Turkish]

23 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Not at all. It won’t solve anything but might make a bit of difference, it’s impossible to tell. It definitely puts the issue more in the spotlight, the only reason racism is being discussed so much here is because they are doing it.

No one is expecting it to change the views of old gammons like you though.

As I’ve already asked you and you’ve ignored by highlighting the issue, which seems to be all its doing in your view, does that mean no one was aware of racism before?

[sadoldgit]

4 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Not at all. It won’t solve anything but might make a bit of difference, it’s impossible to tell. It definitely puts the issue more in the spotlight, the only reason racism is being discussed so much here is because they are doing it.

No one is expecting it to change the views of old gammons like you though.

Exactly right. No one expects racists to change their attitude just because some professional footballers kneel down for a few seconds before a match, but the whole point of the exercise as you say is to keep the issue to the fore. To that end it is clearly working because we are still talking about it. Sadly some people want to muddy the water by either trying to pretend that it has Marxist undertones or diss it because it isn’t going to stop racists being racists. Of course it isn’t. But what it does demonstrate is that there is no room for racism here and it will not be tolerated. 
it wasn’t that long ago when the Maohetson report concluded that the Metropolitan police were “institutionally racist”. Some reports from BAME police officers say that they still receive racial abuse from their colleagues yet there are those who know better and play down the problem even when they are told that people are suffering this abuse on a regular basis. To tell BAME people that White Privilege does not exist is not only deeply insulting, but it is extremely ignorant. Some people will use it to their advantage, it is just human nature, but to pretend it doesn’t exist is clearly ridiculous. 
Taking the knee, the Kick It Out campaign, Hate Crime laws and all of the other measures against racial (and religious) intolerance will not stop it alone, but they are all are part of the push to show that racists and racist behaviour has no part in our society. It isn’t going to happen overnight and at some point Taking the Knee will have to be replaced with something else, but eventually we will get to the point where these morons will learn to keep their abhorrent opinions and attitudes to themselves. Future generations will hopefully grow up without casual racist comments in their homes and eventually we will reach the point where we don’t spend hours discussion it on Internet forms because it really will be a very small problem, which it clearly isn’t at the moment.

[egg]

1 minute ago, sadoldgit said:

Exactly right. No one expects racists to change their attitude just because some professional footballers kneel down for a few seconds before a match, but the whole point of the exercise as you say is to keep the issue to the fore. To that end it is clearly working because we are still talking about it. Sadly some people want to muddy the water by either trying to pretend that it has Marxist undertones or diss it because it isn’t going to stop racists being racists. Of course it isn’t. But what it does demonstrate is that there is no room for racism here and it will not be tolerated. 
it wasn’t that long ago when the Maohetson report concluded that the Metropolitan police were “institutionally racist”. Some reports from BAME police officers say that they still receive racial abuse from their colleagues yet there are those who know better and play down the problem even when they are told that people are suffering this abuse on a regular basis. To tell BAME people that White Privilege does not exist is not only deeply insulting, but it is extremely ignorant. Some people will use it to their advantage, it is just human nature, but to pretend it doesn’t exist is clearly ridiculous. 
Taking the knee, the Kick It Out campaign, Hate Crime laws and all of the other measures against racial (and religious) intolerance will not stop it alone, but they are all are part of the push to show that racists and racist behaviour has no part in our society. It isn’t going to happen overnight and at some point Taking the Knee will have to be replaced with something else, but eventually we will get to the point where these morons will learn to keep their abhorrent opinions and attitudes to themselves. Future generations will hopefully grow up without casual racist comments in their homes and eventually we will reach the point where we don’t spend hours discussion it on Internet forms because it really will be a very small problem, which it clearly isn’t at the moment.

Keep the issue to the fore to achieve what though? Aintforever has already said its pointless and won't achieve anything. Turkish has made the valid point that the issue was known already. Thus, what will this actually achieve other than division, such as that evident from this thread? 

[Turkish]

4 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Exactly right. No one expects racists to change their attitude just because some professional footballers kneel down for a few seconds before a match, but the whole point of the exercise as you say is to keep the issue to the fore. To that end it is clearly working because we are still talking about it. Sadly some people want to muddy the water by either trying to pretend that it has Marxist undertones or diss it because it isn’t going to stop racists being racists. Of course it isn’t. But what it does demonstrate is that there is no room for racism here and it will not be tolerated. 
it wasn’t that long ago when the Maohetson report concluded that the Metropolitan police were “institutionally racist”. Some reports from BAME police officers say that they still receive racial abuse from their colleagues yet there are those who know better and play down the problem even when they are told that people are suffering this abuse on a regular basis. To tell BAME people that White Privilege does not exist is not only deeply insulting, but it is extremely ignorant. Some people will use it to their advantage, it is just human nature, but to pretend it doesn’t exist is clearly ridiculous. 
Taking the knee, the Kick It Out campaign, Hate Crime laws and all of the other measures against racial (and religious) intolerance will not stop it alone, but they are all are part of the push to show that racists and racist behaviour has no part in our society. It isn’t going to happen overnight and at some point Taking the Knee will have to be replaced with something else, but eventually we will get to the point where these morons will learn to keep their abhorrent opinions and attitudes to themselves. Future generations will hopefully grow up without casual racist comments in their homes and eventually we will reach the point where we don’t spend hours discussion it on Internet forms because it really will be a very small problem, which it clearly isn’t at the moment.

Did you copy and paste that from the guardian?

[sadoldgit]

7 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Precisely. People object to being lectured to about how they are meant to behave or think.

So that encourages rape and murder too? If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person. It might be obvious to most of us but clearly not all. We are lectured because there are people in society know need to be lectured. There are still people who text and drive, drink and drive or don’t wear seat belts. Should we stop telling them it is wrong just because it is a minority? People get lectured when there is a need. Just because it doesn’t apply to you and others doesn’t mean to say that there isn’t a need for it. This post will be followed by the usual gang of suspects who will try and find anything to discredit the campaigns to deal with racism. They are part of the reason the lecturing needs to continue. Don’t take a knee because it could make things worse. Seriously? God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists. Best not do anything about it and hope it blows over.

[badgerx16]

17 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

So that encourages rape and murder too? If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person. It might be obvious to most of us but clearly not all. We are lectured because there are people in society know need to be lectured. There are still people who text and drive, drink and drive or don’t wear seat belts. Should we stop telling them it is wrong just because it is a minority? People get lectured when there is a need. Just because it doesn’t apply to you and others doesn’t mean to say that there isn’t a need for it. This post will be followed by the usual gang of suspects who will try and find anything to discredit the campaigns to deal with racism. They are part of the reason the lecturing needs to continue. Don’t take a knee because it could make things worse. Seriously? God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists. Best not do anything about it and hope it blows over.

Of course not you twonk. I don't need to be told that racism is wrong, that is something that is patently obvious. The difference here is that rather than reinforcing a message to an individual who doesn't comply with the norm, everybody is being forced to loudly and forcibly demonstrate that they are in fact in agreement.

I believe that all forms of discrimination are wrong, and I also believe that the vast majority of people feel the same, but they would rather simply get on with their lives without having to make pointless gestures of visible compliance because a vocal minority of Social Media loudmouths will otherwise point the finger of shame at them.

Stating that "the knee" is gesture politics does not make me a racist, but I hope it indicates that I am a realist.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by badgerx16

[Lighthouse]

10 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

So that encourages rape

Please don't start this again.

11 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person

Personally I don't like being treated like a complete idiot and patronised by people who fundamentally don't understand the issue themselves. Worse than that, I believe some people responsible for the gesturing don't actually want racism to end. They want a cause to fight against, a racist bogeyman they can broadcast their moral superiority over.

11 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

there are people in society know need to be lectured

No there aren't. The message is out there and has been for decades. If it goes unheeded by some then you either need to accept it for what it is or try a different strategy.

12 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists.

How is 'stirring them up' in any way conducive to reducing racism? When has that ever solved any problem?

[hypochondriac]

20 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Of course not you twonk. I don't need to be told that racism is wrong, that is something that is patently obvious. The difference here is that rather than reinforcing a message to an individual who doesn't comply with the norm, everybody is being forced to loudly and forcibly demonstrate that they are in fact in agreement.

I believe that all forms of discrimination are wrong, and I also believe that the vast majority of people feel the same, but they would rather simply get on with their lives without having to make pointless gestures of visible compliance because a vocal minority of Social Media loudmouths will otherwise point the finger of shame at them.

Stating that "the knee" is gesture politics does not make me a racist, but I hope it indicates that I am a realist.

I think a valid point worth remembering as well is that for some who dislike the gesture politics it breeds resentment that their views are ignored or misrepresented. I reckon that's a net negative for race relations even if some people think it's a positive thing to have the issue continually raised. 

[hypochondriac]

17 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Please don't start this again.

Personally I don't like being treated like a complete idiot and patronised by people who fundamentally don't understand the issue themselves. Worse than that, I believe some people responsible for the gesturing don't actually want racism to end. They want a cause to fight against, a racist bogeyman they can broadcast their moral superiority over.

No there aren't. The message is out there and has been for decades. If it goes unheeded by some then you either need to accept it for what it is or try a different strategy.

How is 'stirring them up' in any way conducive to reducing racism? When has that ever solved any problem?

Because in reality for many it's not about "solving racism" it's about continuing a culture war and trying to upset as many people who disagree with them as possible because they view them as thick racist idiots. 

[hypochondriac]

39 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

So that encourages rape and murder too? If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person. It might be obvious to most of us but clearly not all. We are lectured because there are people in society know need to be lectured. There are still people who text and drive, drink and drive or don’t wear seat belts. Should we stop telling them it is wrong just because it is a minority? People get lectured when there is a need. Just because it doesn’t apply to you and others doesn’t mean to say that there isn’t a need for it. This post will be followed by the usual gang of suspects who will try and find anything to discredit the campaigns to deal with racism. They are part of the reason the lecturing needs to continue. Don’t take a knee because it could make things worse. Seriously? God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists. Best not do anything about it and hope it blows over.

I don't need a lecture about how murder and rape are wrong either. Would you be out murdering and raping people if you weren't given a lecture about how they were wrong beforehand? These are things people learn when they are in primary school or just know instinctively is wrong. The sorts of people who commit these crimes are the type of people that aren't going to give a toss about a so called lecture about it being right or wrong and it's just going to breed resentment in everyone else who has never engaged in any of these things anyway. 

[Dorchester Saint]

36 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Please don't start this again.

Personally I don't like being treated like a complete idiot and patronised by people who fundamentally don't understand the issue themselves. Worse than that, I believe some people responsible for the gesturing don't actually want racism to end. They want a cause to fight against, a racist bogeyman they can broadcast their moral superiority over.

No there aren't. The message is out there and has been for decades. If it goes unheeded by some then you either need to accept it for what it is or try a different strategy.

How is 'stirring them up' in any way conducive to reducing racism? When has that ever solved any problem?

Absolutely spot on!! People are literally making money from all this race grifting, they know they won’t ever stop the tiny minority of racist morons, they don’t care about that, they just want to keep on beating the ‘institutional racism’ drum because it suits their political agenda.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Dorchester Saint

[revolution saint]

I think there's a danger that this "national conversation" can be counter-productive and that it actually entrenches opinions and doesn't change them.  Let's be honest, it's perfectly reasonable to object to taking the knee on the grounds that it's a gesture that might not actually achieve anything without being called a racist but all too often that seems either the case or the perception that that's what's happening. 

It's the same with Trump supporters, Brexit supporters and anyone with views deemed to be on the right - they've been called racist, sexist, thick, stupid and general all round nutters for so long and all it's done is make them go into a shell.  It doesn't change their minds and, if anything, it actually reinforces their opinions.  I've been guilty of it myself with Brexit and Trump and it's really easy to do, makes you feel a bit superior and is ultimately self defeating.

Personally I don't have much of a problem with taking the knee.  It's no skin off my nose but I can see why people object to it and I can see their frustrations when an objection is perceived to be an admission of, or condoning, racism.  It isn't.  I think a lot of it stems from the fact that recently we seem to be bombarded with all these accusations that we're all closet racists, that even unintentional things can be deemed racist (people of colour vs coloured people for an example).  Naturally people are going to be a bit defensive when they sincerely believe that it isn't their intention to offend.  

Dunno what the solution is but getting a bit hysterical on either side of the debate isn't going to solve anything. 

[Turkish]

 

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

So that encourages rape and murder too? If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person. It might be obvious to most of us but clearly not all. We are lectured because there are people in society know need to be lectured. There are still people who text and drive, drink and drive or don’t wear seat belts. Should we stop telling them it is wrong just because it is a minority? People get lectured when there is a need. Just because it doesn’t apply to you and others doesn’t mean to say that there isn’t a need for it. This post will be followed by the usual gang of suspects who will try and find anything to discredit the campaigns to deal with racism. They are part of the reason the lecturing needs to continue. Don’t take a knee because it could make things worse. Seriously? God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists. Best not do anything about it and hope it blows over.

The problem with you soggy is apart from talking a lot of bollocks you do it in a very pious, condescending way. Talk about how other people need to be lectured, educated. For an older fella you come across as incredibly naive as well. Your stance of these issues is a little bit over the top, my friends say that the racism they experience these days are patronising comments from middle class white people. For example my mates wife who is white was asked by a white, fairly posh older women if he and their mixed race children’s be comfortable at a event she was organising for the local community as there wouldn’t be many other black people there. I’m sure she meant nothing by it and thought she was well meaning, I’d also assume she’d think she was one of those lovely people without a racist bone in their body. No one else had thought anything of how many black or white people would be there but she had to make the point. You strike me as that sort of person. 

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Turkish

[Turkish]

46 minutes ago, Dorchester Saint said:

Absolutely spot on!! People are literally making money from all this race grifting, they know they won’t ever stop the tiny minority of racist morons, they don’t care about that, they just want to keep on beating the ‘institutional racism’ drum because it suits their political agenda.

And it sells papers. Every headline with a shaking head, enough is enough from woke white people just fuel the fire and makes money. So what it ifs one dickhead out if 60m in social media. We need to raise awareness of racism! How is this still going on in 2021!

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

So that encourages rape and murder too? If people have a problem with being told that racism is wrong, what would that tell you about that person. It might be obvious to most of us but clearly not all. We are lectured because there are people in society know need to be lectured. There are still people who text and drive, drink and drive or don’t wear seat belts. Should we stop telling them it is wrong just because it is a minority? People get lectured when there is a need. Just because it doesn’t apply to you and others doesn’t mean to say that there isn’t a need for it. This post will be followed by the usual gang of suspects who will try and find anything to discredit the campaigns to deal with racism. They are part of the reason the lecturing needs to continue. Don’t take a knee because it could make things worse. Seriously? God forgive that we should stir up the poor racists. Best not do anything about it and hope it blows over.

Was this filmed in Romney Marsh?

 

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, aintforever said:

Not at all. It won’t solve anything but might make a bit of difference, it’s impossible to tell. It definitely puts the issue more in the spotlight, the only reason racism is being discussed so much here is because they are doing it.

No one is expecting it to change the views of old gammons like you though.

Wow!

Egg has already pointed out that you're all over the place, but you seem so obsessed with being as woke as possible that you've completely missed your own contradictions!

True to form though, you've run out of sensible things to say so have resorted to hurling insults.

[aintforever]

4 hours ago, egg said:

Keep the issue to the fore to achieve what though? Aintforever has already said its pointless and won't achieve anything. Turkish has made the valid point that the issue was known already. Thus, what will this actually achieve other than division, such as that evident from this thread? 

I agreed it won’t solve anything, but it might make a bit of a difference, it’s impossible to know for sure. As for Turkey boys point, as usual he is talking complete shite (he’s not the sharpest tool in the box bless him) - you can highlight something that is already known, it is getting the issue discussed which is better than just ignoring it.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by aintforever

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, aintforever said:

I agreed it won’t solve anything, but it might make a bit of a difference, it’s impossible to know for sure. As for Turkey boys point, as usual he is talking complete shite (he’s not the sharpest tool in the box bless him) - you can highlight something that is already known, it is getting the issue discussed which is better than just ignoring it.

And as I said, there's some evidence to suggest that it's made things worse not better. There's major disagreement about the seriousness and extent of this issue and continually getting it discussed has harmed race relations and isn't preferable to alternatives. 

[Turkish]

5 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I agreed it won’t solve anything, but it might make a bit of a difference, it’s impossible to know for sure. As for Turkey boys point, as usual he is talking complete shite (he’s not the sharpest tool in the box bless him) - you can highlight something that is already known, it is getting the issue discussed which is better than just ignoring it.

I wasn’t talking anything, I asked your view on it. Which you refused to give  and have now resorted to insults once again. Funny how you say I’m not the sharpest when you’ve once again been all over the place on this subject. Bit embarrassing that someone you think isn’t very clever ties you up in knots time after time 

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Turkish

[aintforever]

4 minutes ago, Turkish said:

I wasn’t talking anything, I asked your view on it. Which you refused to give  and have now resorted to insults once again. Funny how you say I’m not the sharpest when you’ve once again been all over the place on this subject. Bit embarrassing that someone you think isn’t very clever ties you up in knots time after time 

You genuinely asked me if people knew racism existed before they took the knee. 

No you’re not dim at all.

[egg]

10 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I agreed it won’t solve anything, but it might make a bit of a difference, it’s impossible to know for sure. As for Turkey boys point, as usual he is talking complete shite (he’s not the sharpest tool in the box bless him) - you can highlight something that is already known, it is getting the issue discussed which is better than just ignoring it.

"You've lost the argument when you resort to insults" is a very true statement. 

Yes, you can highlight something that's already known but you only need to if it serves a useful purpose. When you've said yourself that it's "pointless" and "that it won't solve anything", and that it leads to white guys seeking to lecture other white guys and hurling insults, I'm really struggling to understand your best point. Deep down, I think you know that you're struggling too. 

[aintforever]

6 minutes ago, egg said:

"You've lost the argument when you resort to insults" is a very true statement. 

Yes, you can highlight something that's already known but you only need to if it serves a useful purpose. When you've said yourself that it's "pointless" and "that it won't solve anything", and that it leads to white guys seeking to lecture other white guys and hurling insults, I'm really struggling to understand your best point. Deep down, I think you know that you're struggling too. 

I said it might make a difference, you clearly struggle with reading.

[Turkish]

15 minutes ago, aintforever said:

You genuinely asked me if people knew racism existed before they took the knee. 

No you’re not dim at all.

Unless you genuinely think I thought no one knew racism existed before they took they knee you’re Obviously not bright enough to realise it was a rhetorical question. Which Kind of sums up it up really. Either way you don’t come out of it very well.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Turkish

[Turkish]

Just now, aintforever said:

I said it might make a difference, you clearly struggle with reading.

Yep it’s everyone else, not you 🤣🤣🤣

[egg]

1 minute ago, aintforever said:

I said it might make a difference, you clearly struggle with reading.

Ah back to the insults. 

Here's an idea - read your own posts...amongst your words are it's "pointless" and "that it won't solve anything". 

 

[aintforever]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

Ah back to the insults. 

Here's an idea - read your own posts...amongst your words are it's "pointless" and "that it won't solve anything". 

 

I said “they should be respected for trying to do something about it, however pointless, not booed.” I never said it was pointless, just that even if it is they should still be respected for trying to do something.

You and Turkey make a great pair.

[Turkish]

2 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I said “they should be respected for trying to do something about it, however pointless, not booed.” I never said it was pointless, just that even if it is they should still be respected for trying to do something.

You and Turkey make a great pair.

Coming from the guy who either doesn’t understand what a rhetorical question is or believed I though people only discovered racism existed when footballers took the knee. Brilliant 🤣🤣🤣

[egg]

5 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I said “they should be respected for trying to do something about it, however pointless, not booed.” I never said it was pointless, just that even if it is they should still be respected for trying to do something.

You and Turkey make a great pair.

You really are struggling. You've agreed that it won't "solve anything" yet you persist with saying that it's a good idea to carry on with it. You know that you're contradicting yourself and are having to resort to childish insults. Carry on if you want to treacle, but we both know that you're all punched out. 

Edited 7 August, 2021 by egg

[aintforever]

5 minutes ago, egg said:

You really are struggling. You've agreed that it won't "solve anything" yet you persist with saying that it's a good idea to carry on with it. You know that you're contradicting yourself and are having to resort to childish insults. Carry on if you want to treacle, but we both know that you're all punched out. 

Of course it won’t solve racism, no one has ever claimed it would, it’s only fuck-wits like you and Turkey who bang on about it not solving anything.

[Weston Super Saint]

15 hours ago, aintforever said:

It highlights the issue which is a good thing but obviously won’t solve anything, I don’t think anyone is expecting it to.

 

23 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I said it might make a difference, you clearly struggle with reading.

Just to recap, which one is your current position? Is it that it 'obviously won't solve anything' or is it that 'it might make a difference'?

If it's the latter, what difference are you expecting that it 'might' make but that won't actually solve anything?

[egg]

Just now, aintforever said:

Of course it won’t solve racism, no one has ever claimed it would, it’s only fuck-wits like you and Turkey who bang on about it not solving anything.

It's you that wrote that it won't solve anything!! 

I'm not wasting my time debating with abusive people who throw their toys out the pram when their contradictions get highlighted. 

 

[Weston Super Saint]

5 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Of course it won’t solve racism, no one has ever claimed it would, it’s only fuck-wits like you and Turkey who bang on about it not solving anything.

WTF?

See my post above which has a post of yours 'banging on about it obviously not solving anything'!

When you say no one is claiming it will solve racism, are you completely ignoring the Premier League and their statement (I'm working on the assumption that you understand what the word 'eradicate' means) :

Quote

We remain resolutely committed to our singular objective of eradicating racial prejudice wherever it exists

source

All over the place.

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Weston Super Saint

[aintforever]

18 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

WTF?

See my post above which has a post of yours 'banging on about it obviously not solving anything'!

When you say no one is claiming it will solve racism, are you completely ignoring the Premier League and their statement (I'm working on the assumption that you understand what the word 'eradicate' means) :

source

All over the place.

Obviously that’s the objective, I seriously doubt they expect to eradicate racism around the World.

[Weston Super Saint]

6 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Obviously that’s the objective, I seriously doubt they expect to eradicate racism around the World.

Absolutely!  They've issued a public statement saying they are RESOLUTELY COMMITTED to their SINGULAR OBJECTIVE of ERADICATING RACIAL PREJUDICE wherever it exists.

Obviously that's an objective that they have absolutely no expectations of achieving 

It was only the other day that you were lecturing us that taking the knee wasn't so much for people in the UK as that is the least racist country in the world, but was more about educating the rest of the world and teaching them all to sing in perfect harmony.  I guess you've decided that's not woke enough today

Your exact words were :

Quote

Britain is probably one of the least racist countries in the World, but as Harry Kane said, the Premier League is watched worldwide and that is one the the reasons they are carrying on with their message. They want kids in countries which are not so tolerant to ask questions. It's just a harmless gesture, stop wetting your pants over it.

All. Over. The. Place.

[whelk]

Just to lighten the mood

[aintforever]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Absolutely!  They've issued a public statement saying they are RESOLUTELY COMMITTED to their SINGULAR OBJECTIVE of ERADICATING RACIAL PREJUDICE wherever it exists.

Obviously that's an objective that they have absolutely no expectations of achieving 

It was only the other day that you were lecturing us that taking the knee wasn't so much for people in the UK as that is the least racist country in the world, but was more about educating the rest of the world and teaching them all to sing in perfect harmony.  I guess you've decided that's not woke enough today

Your exact words were :

All. Over. The. Place.

You’re the one all over the place. Wanting to promote the anti-racism message in other countries is hardly the same as EXPECTING to eradicate racism from the whole planet.

Thick. As. Mince.

[Manuel]

Scientists can't read a duck's mind.  I suspect it's how they do yoga.

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, aintforever said:

You’re the one all over the place. Wanting to promote the anti-racism message in other countries is hardly the same as EXPECTING to eradicate racism from the whole planet.

Thick. As. Mince.

The sad thing is once again you fail to realise that you’ve been well and truly embarrassed on this thread, had to resort to sticking your fingers in your eyes and screaming how thick everyone else is. When you think it’s everyone else it usually isn’t hun 

Edited 7 August, 2021 by Turkish

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, aintforever said:

You’re the one all over the place. Wanting to promote the anti-racism message in other countries is hardly the same as EXPECTING to eradicate racism from the whole planet.

Thick. As. Mince.

It's encouraging that you understand what the word 'eradicate' means.

It's worrying that you don't have a clue what 'wherever it exists' means.

[sadoldgit]

I’m not sure how a few blokes kneeling for a few seconds before a game of football can be seen as counter productive. It is hardly going to turn people into racists is it? And as we keep saying, the point is to keep the issue of racism to the fore. It is also hardly lecturing or preaching at people. It is not as if we have to deal with an hour long speech about the evils of racism before every game. For those who are kicking off at being “lectured to” about something that doesn’t apply to them, why not just look at your phone for those 15 seconds instead of getting yourselves wound up about it and let those who want to make their point about something that is very clearly a problem in this country make their point without adding to the problem. Whatever a non racist thinks of kneeling down for a couple of seconds, if people who are on the end of abuse want to do it as a form of protest, that is their right. If you can think of a better way perhaps go and talk to them about it instead of polluting a football forum with negativity every single bloody day.

[Turkish]

9 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

I’m not sure how a few blokes kneeling for a few seconds before a game of football can be seen as counter productive. It is hardly going to turn people into racists is it? And as we keep saying, the point is to keep the issue of racism to the fore. It is also hardly lecturing or preaching at people. It is not as if we have to deal with an hour long speech about the evils of racism before every game. For those who are kicking off at being “lectured to” about something that doesn’t apply to them, why not just look at your phone for those 15 seconds instead of getting yourselves wound up about it and let those who want to make their point about something that is very clearly a problem in this country make their point without adding to the problem. Whatever a non racist thinks of kneeling down for a couple of seconds, if people who are on the end of abuse want to do it as a form of protest, that is their right. If you can think of a better way perhaps go and talk to them about it instead of polluting a football forum with negativity every single bloody day.

Your first line shows that you’ve not been keeping up with current views on it, probably blinkered by your own ignorance and arrogance. The rest of your post is irrelevant because you never speak to or see any none white people or go to football. 

[Weston Super Saint]

10 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

I’m not sure how a few blokes kneeling for a few seconds before a game of football can be seen as counter productive. It is hardly going to turn people into racists is it? And as we keep saying, the point is to keep the issue of racism to the fore. It is also hardly lecturing or preaching at people.

Presumably you've completely forgotten the fact that the ONLY person who claimed it was lecturing people was you!

[Turkish]

1 minute ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Presumably you've completely forgotten the fact that the ONLY person who claimed it was lecturing people was you!

Typical Soggy. He’s off preaching again whilst telling everyone else not to talk about it. I don’t think I’ve ever come across or more pious individual.

[hypochondriac]

16 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

I’m not sure how a few blokes kneeling for a few seconds before a game of football can be seen as counter productive. It is hardly going to turn people into racists is it? And as we keep saying, the point is to keep the issue of racism to the fore. It is also hardly lecturing or preaching at people. It is not as if we have to deal with an hour long speech about the evils of racism before every game. For those who are kicking off at being “lectured to” about something that doesn’t apply to them, why not just look at your phone for those 15 seconds instead of getting yourselves wound up about it and let those who want to make their point about something that is very clearly a problem in this country make their point without adding to the problem. Whatever a non racist thinks of kneeling down for a couple of seconds, if people who are on the end of abuse want to do it as a form of protest, that is their right. If you can think of a better way perhaps go and talk to them about it instead of polluting a football forum with negativity every single bloody day.

"we are lectured because there are people in society who need to be lectured" so which is it? Are we being lectured because some people need to be or are we not being lectured to because it's just a short amount of time at the syary of the game? 

[kyle04]

Colin Kaepernick took the knee in 2016 as a protest against the murders of black people by the police. It had genuine shock value as it went against all tradition when the US anthem is heard at public events. Although not all shootings by the police on blacks were primarily racially motivated, as much due to the ridiculous gun culture in that country, which perhaps is a far more disturbing issue, never to be resolved it seems. For all its wealth and power, America remains an uncivilized and deeply divided country. Importing a gesture/movement from that kind of culture, although well meaning, was never going to seamlessly fit the relatively minor "problem" in the UK. The sometimes bitter arguments on this forum alone are testimony to that. This isn't the 1970's, young black men are not being targeted by the police, the NF are no more, Nick Griffin has had his day on Question Time and disappeared, ridiculed and humiliated. Non-white people are if anything over-represented in many sports, on merit alone, and also in other areas such as advertising, as a patronizing knee-jerk panic by big business to appear all inclusive, although their board rooms are still stuffed with white men. The reported examples of racism in this country seem be be largely confined to a few nasty social media posts. Really, is that it ? The US has routine death at the hands of public servants, we have name calling....

[sadoldgit]

6 hours ago, kyle04 said:

Colin Kaepernick took the knee in 2016 as a protest against the murders of black people by the police. It had genuine shock value as it went against all tradition when the US anthem is heard at public events. Although not all shootings by the police on blacks were primarily racially motivated, as much due to the ridiculous gun culture in that country, which perhaps is a far more disturbing issue, never to be resolved it seems. For all its wealth and power, America remains an uncivilized and deeply divided country. Importing a gesture/movement from that kind of culture, although well meaning, was never going to seamlessly fit the relatively minor "problem" in the UK. The sometimes bitter arguments on this forum alone are testimony to that. This isn't the 1970's, young black men are not being targeted by the police, the NF are no more, Nick Griffin has had his day on Question Time and disappeared, ridiculed and humiliated. Non-white people are if anything over-represented in many sports, on merit alone, and also in other areas such as advertising, as a patronizing knee-jerk panic by big business to appear all inclusive, although their board rooms are still stuffed with white men. The reported examples of racism in this country seem be be largely confined to a few nasty social media posts. Really, is that it ? The US has routine death at the hands of public servants, we have name calling....

You’ve not read supersonics posts or listen to other BAME’s people’s experiences then. Can you imagine who you would feel having people constantly picking on you because of your colour or religion. Hate crime figures are on the rise. I am used to the usual suspects playing down the problems of racism because they are ignorant and have nothing better to do with their times than attack people on social media who speak out against racism but to come along and say that the “reported examples of racism in this country seem to be largely confined to a few nasty social media posts” takes ignorance beyond the level of Turkish and hypo’s tiresome crusade against anti racists. 

[Turkish]

2 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

You’ve not read supersonics posts or listen to other BAME’s people’s experiences then. Can you imagine who you would feel having people constantly picking on you because of your colour or religion. Hate crime figures are on the rise. I am used to the usual suspects playing down the problems of racism because they are ignorant and have nothing better to do with their times than attack people on social media who speak out against racism but to come along and say that the “reported examples of racism in this country seem to be largely confined to a few nasty social media posts” takes ignorance beyond the level of Turkish and hypo’s tiresome crusade against anti racists. 

I don’t have a crusade against anti racists. I just think you’re a self righteous prick.

[badgerx16]

6 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Can you imagine who you would feel having people constantly picking on you because of your colour or religion.

I do not belive that anybody in this country is 'constantly' being targetted.

[hypochondriac]

15 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

You’ve not read supersonics posts or listen to other BAME’s people’s experiences then. Can you imagine who you would feel having people constantly picking on you because of your colour or religion. Hate crime figures are on the rise. I am used to the usual suspects playing down the problems of racism because they are ignorant and have nothing better to do with their times than attack people on social media who speak out against racism but to come along and say that the “reported examples of racism in this country seem to be largely confined to a few nasty social media posts” takes ignorance beyond the level of Turkish and hypo’s tiresome crusade against anti racists. 

What about the BAME people who don't agree that it's like you describe? How do we know which ones to just listen and believe?