Tino Livramento

[SKD]

1 minute ago, TWar said:

Sorry you are so keen to be negative. I'm sure you can go back to crying about the club soon. We aren't signing Carlos of Cafu to be our back up fullback... Moderate your expectations.

For what he is he's a great signing and I'm not going to apologise for taking the word of the entire Chelsea training staff who say he is brilliant over some whiney prick on the internet who does nothing but complain.

He looks like a good option as a young back up who’ll hopefully Break through, I agree.

Hardly an ‘insane’ deal though, as you claimed. 

So insane, we managed to fight off fierce competition from errrr Brighton. 

[CB Fry]

13 minutes ago, igsey said:

Chelsea would just buy him back for £20m and immediately sell him for more, taking a nice tidy profit with them.

Of course, it would all be down to the player to say yes or no so hopefully he enjoys his time here!

Have they ever done that with any other player with a buy back?

I would think that Chelsea's genuine options after a couple of years are

a) if he turns out to be Chelsea standard buy him back for £20m

b) if he isn't Chelsea standard let us sell him to (say) Arsenal for £30m but they still cream off the sell-on etc.

I don't get the admin of buying someone to sell them on in the same window.

If there are real examples where Chelsea buy someone back to "immediately" sell him to someone else for more, i'd be interested to know, not something I remember. 

Edited 2 August, 2021 by CB Fry

[TWar]

18 minutes ago, SKD said:

He looks like a good option as a young back up who’ll hopefully Break through, I agree.

Hardly an ‘insane’ deal though, as you claimed. 

So insane, we managed to fight off fierce competition from errrr Brighton. 

And RB Leipzig, Man City, Arsenal, AC Milan and others I'd imagine. I stick by it, for what it is it's an insane deal. If we were signing him to be our starter it wouldn't be, but we aren't so it is. I am a big proponent of having youth as back up who can eventually take the role, there is no better youth player in the country in his position most likely, given he was player of the year at the top academy. It is an insane deal, everything is relative. This is someone you and others don't seem to realise with talk of Haaland and Cafu. 

Edited 2 August, 2021 by TWar

[Give it to Ron]

5 minutes ago, SKD said:

He looks like a good option as a young back up who’ll hopefully Break through, I agree.

Hardly an ‘insane’ deal though, as you claimed. 

So insane, we managed to fight off fierce competition from errrr Brighton. 

Why are you ignoring the others?? Agenda?

[stevy777_x]

7 minutes ago, SKD said:

He looks like a good option as a young back up who’ll hopefully Break through, I agree.

Hardly an ‘insane’ deal though, as you claimed. 

So insane, we managed to fight off fierce competition from errrr Brighton. 

Just to understand your expectations, what would make you satisfied in the transfer market?

[saintwbu]

7 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Have they ever done that with any other player with a buy back?

I would think that Chelsea's genuine options after a couple of years are

a) if he turns out to be Chelsea standard buy him back for £20m

b) if he isn't Chelsea standard let us sell him to (say) Arsenal for £30m but they still cream off the sell-on etc.

I don't get the admin of buying someone to sell them on in the same window.

If there are real examples where Chelsea buy someone back to "immediately" sell him to someone else for more, i'd be interested to know, not something I remember. 

Buying back and selling immediately seems to be more of a European approach, i’m sure Morata has had that done at least once. Not something you see over here very often. Chelsea had buy backs on Lukaku and Ake if I recall, and neither were utilised.

[Matthew Le God]

9 minutes ago, SKD said:

He looks like a good option as a young back up who’ll hopefully Break through, I agree.

Hardly an ‘insane’ deal though, as you claimed. 

So insane, we managed to fight off fierce competition from errrr Brighton. 

So you decided to ignore the article where this story broke last night says RB Leipzig, AC Milan, Arsenal and Man City?

[Dusic]

This is exactly the kind of signing we should be making!

Very highly rated player so a good boost that he sees the best pathway at Saints, and that will definitely catch the eye of other players which could benefit us in the future. He will surely get a decent amount of games and that is our USP - we will give players a chance in the first team that they won't get at other clubs.

Buy back clause doesn't bother me as quite simply without agreeing to one I doubt Chelsea would have accepted our offer. If he does well and they want him back for a lot more than we paid then fair enough - it would be a sign all round that the move is the right one for him at the right time.

Surely curtains for Valery, and makes you wonder if we will bother signing a specific LB cover or if we will use Livramento for that, with Djenepo and Salisu as other options?

Edited 2 August, 2021 by Dusic

[Saint Matty 76]

Little disappointed with the buy back but will wait to see what kind of fee it is before complaining too much. Anything upwards of £30m would be fine.

[Mozz]

The buyback clause is a little disappointing, but if it does ever get used then at least we'll probably be in a better position as a club then if Chelsea have no desire to invoke.

Man City had a buyback clause in the Angus Gunn transfer and how did that work out...

[SKD]

20 minutes ago, Give it to Ron said:

Why are you ignoring the others?? Agenda?

14 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

So you decided to ignore the article where this story broke last night says RB Leipzig, AC Milan, Arsenal and Man City?

Clearly he’s leaving to play football. Why would he leave the best U23’s to play for another U23 team. He wouldn’t get football at any of those clubs (other than perhaps Leipzig). 

Whilst others may be interested, realistically, it was between clubs like us and Brighton. 
 

18 minutes ago, stevy777_x said:

Just to understand your expectations, what would make you satisfied in the transfer market?

Please show me a post where I’ve said that this isn’t a good deal? It looks like it is. Exactly The sort of player we should Looking at, I’m happy. 

However, Let’s not get carried away and start calling it ‘insane’ though. My guess is probably only 1 or 2 people on this whole forum would have seen him play. 

[Ado]

"He's magic, you knoooooow

Tino Livramentoooooo"

[Miltonaggro]

Looks a terrific young player and something of a coup for the current Saints set up. Would be great to see these prospects blended with some quality experience (like Walcott with Tella) to hone their abilities. I am of the McMenemy era so a degree of romanticism in this regard but would be great, and moreover entertaining, to see and Christ we all need a boost! 

[SuperSAINT]

 

[Saint Matty 76]

That’s a bit vague, would be disappointed if it’s between £25-30m. Ultimately though we clearly didn’t have a choice.

[Roo1976]

11 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Sounds like a decent signing. I wonder if he can play in any other positions. 

Keeper maybe?...................or is Alex a safe pair of hands this season?

[SW5 SAINT]

5 minutes ago, SuperSAINT said:

 

Well if the buy back clause is about £35m, it will at least pay back half of that loan in 3 or 4 years time……..😀

[SKD]

3 minutes ago, SuperSAINT said:

 

Quick point on these clauses… let’s say it’s 25m (for arguments sake) with a sell on clause at 20% (my guess is it’ll be higher)… they’ll basically be able to buy him back for £20m. 

It’d probably cost them not too far off 20m in salary / bonus over 3 years if they kept him and he wouldn’t be getting first team exposure. 

Given they have the money to do so, that is great business by Chelsea. 
 

[Sideways Jim]

1 minute ago, SKD said:

Quick point on these clauses… let’s say it’s 25m (for arguments sake) with a sell on clause at 20% (my guess is it’ll be higher)… they’ll basically be able to buy him back for £20m. 

It’d probably cost them not too far off 20m in salary / bonus over 3 years if they kept him and he wouldn’t be getting first team exposure. 

Given they have the money to do so, that is great business by Chelsea. 
 

So on the Flip side that will cover the cost of Bonus/Salary over 3 years for us aswell. 

 

If Chelsea want to buy him back in 3 years time that would suggest he has been extremely successful for us which in turn would mean we would have done well as a club too. 

So great business from us aswell, much to your disappointment 

 

[Ken Tone]

1 minute ago, SKD said:

Quick point on these clauses… let’s say it’s 25m (for arguments sake) with a sell on clause at 20% (my guess is it’ll be higher)… they’ll basically be able to buy him back for £20m. 

It’d probably cost them not too far off 20m in salary / bonus over 3 years if they kept him and he wouldn’t be getting first team exposure. 

Given they have the money to do so, that is great business by Chelsea. 
 

Surely the sell on clause doesn't apply to a buy back? They'd have to pay the full 25 I'd have thought.  What I'm not clear about is how much power the buy back gives them. Anyone know?  Does it mean they can just pay that and take him back whenever they feel like it? 

[Saint Garrett]

Just now, Ken Tone said:

Surely the sell on clause doesn't apply to a buy back? They'd have to pay the full 25 I'd have thought.  What I'm not clear about is how much power the buy back gives them. Anyone know?  Does it mean they can just pay that and take him back whenever they feel like it? 

Would depend on the finer detail. Normally it would have an expiry date, and possibly an agreed time…I.e maybe it could only happen in the summer window, and has to be before the end of June for example. 
 

Like any contracts; anything can be put into it. Think this is really good business for Saints, look forward to seeing him play. 

[SKD]

1 minute ago, Sideways Jim said:

So on the Flip side that will cover the cost of Bonus/Salary over 3 years for us aswell. 

 

If Chelsea want to buy him back in 3 years time that would suggest he has been extremely successful for us which in turn would mean we would have done well as a club too. 

So great business from us aswell, much to your disappointment 

 

Yep, agree. As I’ve also said in another thread. 

No disappointment here. Obviously no buy back would have been preferred but in which case he wouldn’t have been sold. If you can show me a post I’ve not said it’s a good deal, ill Apologise (you won’t be able to)… play the post not the poster, nips. 

 

[Neef]

I think Buy Back clauses usually have a certain period within which they can be exercised. 

For example, Man City's buy back clause for Douglas Luiz at Villa expired in June (it was two years long). 

You'd hope we have something similar. North of £25M sounds decent tbf. 

[ant]

This seems a lower-risk version of the model we successfully implemented until ~2018.

Yes, it'd be galling to lose young players on the 'cheap' after several years, but:

1. If they're worth buying, that means they've done well;

2. If they've done well, they've improved the overall quality of the squad - meaning the club's more likely to have done well;

3. It shows youngsters at other big clubs that we may be a more appealing pathway;

4. Turning a smaller profit on a player is still turning a profit;

5. When did us directly sourcing players ever stop us losing them if they prove top-drawer?

6. If it doesn't work out, it's far less of a gamble in terms of transfer fees. And pending wages paid, those may be less of a millstone too.

[Dusic]

Strong argument that if Chelsea end up buying him back and he goes on to play for their first team then that shows other young talents that a move to Saints has played out absolutely perfectly, and starts to rebuild our rep as a strong developmental club.

If he turns out to be a player Chelsea want back then he will have done very, very well for us and will have cost just £5m.

With a 5 year contract we are well protected too so its a no brainer.

[CB Fry]

8 minutes ago, Saint Matty 76 said:

That’s a bit vague, would be disappointed if it’s between £25-30m. Ultimately though we clearly didn’t have a choice.

Disappointed in what way? If we end up with a £25m full back in a couple of years im not sure what the issue is to be honest. If it was one of our own academy players we'd be selling them at that point anyway.

[Lighthouse]

TBH I'd just like to have some good players for a change. If we 'only' make £20m profit on them, I can live with that.

[Ted Bates Statue]

2 hours ago, Crab Lungs said:

I thought we used to breed our success? 🤨

I know what you mean. I personally get very annoyed that despite bragging about it, we never seem to do any actual marching.

[VectisSaint]

I read somewhere that the Simeu deal may have influenced Livramento. Can play either side and CM so seems like a good fit for the squad, backup for Perraud and KWP and with Valery still here as well gives us strength in depth. Much better option than Williams on very expensive loan from Man U. Assuming that unlike Simeu he will go into the first team squad rather than the u23s, even though like Simeu he is yet to make a 1st team appearance, I guess the difference between a FB and a CB in terms of development.

[once_bitterne]

Ralph's main target?  That's a sad indictment of how far we've fallen from the Europe days of Koeman to where we are now and just trying to get what is effectively a loan of one of Chelsea's youth team players for a couple of years.

[Saint86]

1 hour ago, tunit said:

Say he's another Bale and in 3 years time his market value is £50m+. If the buy back is set at £20m then we are being screwed out of a lot of money. Thats the part of it I dont like. 

That's our choice though. If we could afford to negotiate a worthwhile deal and not have that clause we would do 🤷‍♂️ But if you banned these types of clauses we wouldn't get the player...

Edited 2 August, 2021 by Saint86

[Mikey88]

11 minutes ago, once_bitterne said:

Ralph's main target?  That's a sad indictment of how far we've fallen from the Europe days of Koeman to where we are now and just trying to get what is effectively a loan of one of Chelsea's youth team players for a couple of years.

Or it’s an indication of how good this lad could be given that Ralph see’s it as an opportunity we can’t afford to miss.

[gammon cheeks]

Can he play back up left back?  Stats say right back or right midfield ....just wondering.

[Saint Garrett]

5 minutes ago, gammon cheeks said:

Can he play back up left back?  Stats say right back or right midfield ....just wondering.

Can play both sides supposedly, which is great. 

[WALK DMC]

7 minutes ago, gammon cheeks said:

Can he play back up left back?  Stats say right back or right midfield ....just wondering.

The highlights clip had him almost exclusively playing on the right. Maybe he just doesn't have any highlights when he plays on the left ! 

[suewhistle]

It's even made The Guardian:  https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/aug/02/southampton-poised-to-sign-chelsea-tino-livramento-for-5m

[beatlesaint]

It’s the Chelsea way, isn’t this exactly how we got Bertrand cos his way to first team was blocked and he’d been out on loan a fair bit?

[SKD]

12 hours ago, SaintBitterne said:

Time for the obligatory YouTube compilation...

 

It's generally a good sign when the team selling him are gutted he's going...

Has anyone actually seen the lad play? Most of these highlights are him in the final 3rd. Looks like a winger / wing back. 

Looks good going forward, but can he defend? As we’ve seen with Valery, he looked okay in a back 5 but lost in a back 4, hopefully this lad has a bit more about him as potentially won’t suit our formation. 

He’ll certainly have more to do defensively with us than he has with Chelsea U23’s. 

[Jeremy Corbyn]

29 minutes ago, WALK DMC said:

The highlights clip had him almost exclusively playing on the right. Maybe he just doesn't have any highlights when he plays on the left ! 

KWP played a fair bit on the left in his earlier career so I wouldn't be surprised if he's seen as the versatile one.

[Billy the Kidd]

2 hours ago, Charlie Wayman said:

The youngsters were getting a chance under clubman Frank Lampard but now that he has been ousted to make way for another foreign manager with a big budget from Abramovich, they probably feel it's best to move on.

Yep, totally agree. What a shit tactic that will never win them the Champions League.

[tajjuk]

Yeh buy back is disappointing, but as others have said it may have an expiry date, plus the player has to want to actually go back, which is not a given. I mean he's leaving for lack of first team football opportunities, the same still could be a problem ins 3-4 years, especially as Reece James is likely to be their mainstay full back for many years to come so he might not want to go back to being an understudy, there are so many variables. Plus I am not sure of that many examples of where buy back clauses have been exercised, the player has top improve to the right level, the buying club has to have the available funds and not need them elsewhere, needs space in the team, the player has to want to go back. 

Seems a well hyped player, lots of talk of his speed and power which hopefully means he should be able to compete straight away in the league in the first team squad.

Seems Chelsea have effed up a bit here, obviously they hoover up a lot of young talent, but with Lampard gone and the transfer ban gone the pathway for it just isn't there, more keen on signing a 36 year old centre-back on massive wages than giving more time to young centre-backs like Tomori or Simeu etc. and now the youngsters are seeing that and want to move for more football chances. I'd imagine Sancho has set quite the precedent, in youth team of a super club, doesn't see a route the first team, forces a move to somewhere where he will get football, improves and proves himself and then moves to a huge club with likely massive wages 3-4 years down the line. 

Looks like they all want a piece of that. 

Good strategy by us to potentially set ourselves up as the PL destination for young players to do that, probably able to point to the likes of Tella (who iirc is ex Arsenal youth) and Smallbone breaking through for us in recent years. Plus we are not too far away from London for these players to still be pretty close to their mates and family. 

Edited 2 August, 2021 by tajjuk

[Matthew Le God]

 

Edited 2 August, 2021 by Matthew Le God

[ErwinK1961]

1 hour ago, WALK DMC said:

The highlights clip had him almost exclusively playing on the right. Maybe he just doesn't have any highlights when he plays on the left ! 

Maybe the mystery poster on the Transfers thread is right and we're getting that Doig lad from Hibs too?

Perraud / Doig - Left Back

KWP / Livramento - Right Back

Would be a turn up for the books (and I'll believe it when I see it)

Edited 2 August, 2021 by ErwinK1961

[Matthew Le God]

1 minute ago, ErwinK1961 said:

Maybe the mystery poster on the Transfers thread is right and we're getting that Doig lad from Hibs too?

I think all that was is someone seeing the news the Hibernian manager said Doig was leaving and a few minutes he made a random suggestion on this forum. Doesn't make him ITK.

[Sheaf Saint]

2 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

I think all that was is someone seeing the news the Hibernian manager said Doig was leaving and a few minutes he made a random suggestion on this forum. Doesn't make him ITK.

True, but the fact it was the poster's maiden post adds a little intrigue though.

[ErwinK1961]

2 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

I think all that was is someone seeing the news the Hibernian manager said Doig was leaving and a few minutes he made a random suggestion on this forum. Doesn't make him ITK.

Maybe, we'll see. 

[Matthew Le God]

Just now, Sheaf Saint said:

True, but the fact it was the poster's maiden post adds a little intrigue though.

 

Just now, ErwinK1961 said:

Maybe, we'll see. 

If he posted on here before it was all over the news the Hibernian manager said Doig was leaving then it would be intriguing. As he posted on this forum minutes after it was all over Twitter it looks extremely suspect.

[skintsaint]

Just now, Matthew Le God said:

 

If he posted on here before it was all over the news the Hibernian manager said Doig was leaving then it would be intriguing. As he posted on this forum minutes after it was all over Twitter it looks extremely suspect.

who really gives a shite 😅

[Ted Bates Statue]

1 hour ago, beatlesaint said:

It’s the Chelsea way, isn’t this exactly how we got Bertrand cos his way to first team was blocked and he’d been out on loan a fair bit?

True - and for a more recent example see also Oriel Romeu. Decent value for money at £5M.

[Matthew Le God]

Just now, skintsaint said:

who really gives a shite 😅

How about... people looking for Saints news rather than made up bullshit? Surely everyone on this forum of all forums wants the former of those two options... don't they?