Taking The Knee at Games

[JRM]

15 hours ago, Streaky said:

Moussa hardly speaks English so find that hard to believe, but whatever meets your agenda my friend.

✊🏿✊🏻 Solidarity.

I hope you're not assuming Moussa doesn't know much English just because he's a young African,  he's lived here for quite a while now. 

Some excellent unbiased training courses you can sign up for to cope with this issue. 

[TWar]

It's funny how people who complain about politics being brought over from America are happy to import red scare propaganda. I'd surprised if half the people who complain about it could even define Marxism, less say how it relates to BLM or a push for racial equality in a sport that has stories of racial abuse to players seemingly every week. 

 

Also some black players don't do it because they don't think it goes far enough and is just for show, not because they disagree with it and the cause. The "I'm against it, but so is Zaha" is such a silly argument that completely misses the point Zaha and Toney are making, and booing would make these players ashamed. 

[LiberalCommunist]

BLM has been healing the racial divide with grenades over the past year and a half, and I'm pretty tired of it. No room for politics in Football.......Kick it out. 

[Toussaint]

23 hours ago, manzo said:

Wanting racism ended is Marxist now, is it?

Don't be so naive

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, JRM said:

I actually agree with you and was one of your likes 👍

Much preferred the days when football was an escape from all this nonsense,  standing side by side with your fellow Saints fan unified in support of the team without interference of politics. 

100% mate. Football used to be a bit of a laugh, have a few beers and escape. Now it's all virtue signalling, politics, grassing hotlines, corporate bullshit. 

[Singapore Saint]

22 hours ago, SKD said:

 

Plenty of black players refuse to take the knee. Are they racists as well?

Good on Zaha, RESPECT!

[Singapore Saint]

21 hours ago, supersonic said:

Taking of the knee is a sign of solidarity to protest against racial inequality. 

Not sure why you feel so offended by that?

Its also not Marxist, but you keep telling yourself that it is as a comfort....

BLM was founded on Marxist principles (they admit it themselves).

One of the BLM leaders was recently discovered to be buying a number of properties in her own name with money donated to BLM (they don't have proper accounting).

The American football player who started it all disrespected the American flag whenever he took a knee during the singing of the Star Spangled Banner (and he couldn't get a job as a player afterwards).

There already was a proper campaign against racism going on (no need for another).

Edited 18 May, 2021 by Singapore Saint

[Singapore Saint]

16 minutes ago, Turkish said:

100% mate. Football used to be a bit of a laugh, have a few beers and escape. Now it's all virtue signalling, politics, grassing hotlines, corporate bullshit. 

You forgot money.

[TWar]

15 minutes ago, Singapore Saint said:

BLM was founded on Marxist principles (they admit it themselves).

One of the BLM leaders was recently discovered to be buying a number of properties in her own name with money donated to BLM (they don't have proper accounting).

The American football player who started it all disrespected the American flag whenever he took a knee during the singing of the Star Spangled Banner (and he couldn't get a job as a player afterwards).

There already was a proper campaign against racism going on (no need for another).

Regarding the first point, what Marxist principles? The principle that people should be treated equally? That's not a Marxist principle, it is universal. Again just using Marxism as a buzz word with little idea what it means or how it connects. 

Regarding the second point, gunna need some evidence for that. Sounds like a higher up person bought some houses, no evidence it was from donation money.

The third point is ridiculous. Firstly he wasn't protesting the flag he was protesting racism, and second who gives a shit its a flag? Embarrassing seeing arguments made defending a flag in america, even more embarrassing hearing them made on behalf of the american flag in the UK.

On the fourth point, clearly it wasn't working or we wouldn't need this one.

[SKD]

1 hour ago, TWar said:

It's funny how people who complain about politics being brought over from America are happy to import red scare propaganda. I'd surprised if half the people who complain about it could even define Marxism, less say how it relates to BLM or a push for racial equality in a sport that has stories of racial abuse to players seemingly every week. 

 

Also some black players don't do it because they don't think it goes far enough and is just for show, not because they disagree with it and the cause. The "I'm against it, but so is Zaha" is such a silly argument that completely misses the point Zaha and Toney are making, and booing would make these players ashamed. 

How often have you experienced racism at St Mary’s or at any football ground? Actually, go as far as saying any football at all. 

What is getting down on 1 knee for 2 seconds before a game actually achieving? If it hadn’t been adopted by far left loons using the death of Mr Floyd to cause anarchy then perhaps people wouldn’t feel so strongly about it. 

You get the odd racist or bad egg in all societies, of course you do. What we don’t want or need is it constantly pushed down your throat which is continually happening with Sky. You can’t watch anything without getting a BLM advert. 

The knee and BLM have pushed racial divides back 20 years. 

Let’s not even start on the idiot Leicester players waving the Palestine flag, AJ issue they clearly have very little knowledge about. Deserve a lengthy ban for that. 

Edited 18 May, 2021 by SKD

[TWar]

4 minutes ago, SKD said:

How often have you experienced racism at St Mary’s or at any football ground? Actually, go as far as saying any football at all. 

What is getting down on 1 knee for 2 seconds before a game actually achieving? If it hadn’t been adopted by far left loons using the death of Mr Floyd to cause anarchy then perhaps people wouldn’t feel so strongly about it. 

You get the odd racist or bad egg in all societies, of course you do. What we don’t want or need is it constantly pushed down your throat which is continually happening with Sky. You can’t watch anything without getting a BLM advert. 

The knee and BLM have pushed racial divides back 20 years. 

Let’s not even start on the idiot Leicester players waving the Palestine flag, AJ issue they clearly have very little knowledge about. Deserve a lengthy ban for that. 

Regarding point one. Never, it seems much more of an issue online. That doesn't make it not an issue worth doing something about.

Regarding point two. Very little, I think it is actually pretty useless and we need to do a lot more, but booing the kneeling is sending the message you don't care about the issue and just want people to get on with football, which is very counter productive. If anything people should do more. Also "far left loons" didn't cause anarchy, it was a mostly peaceful protest for a good cause that yielded results.

Regarding point three, racism is a systemic issue, not a "bad egg" issue. Also I have next to no sympathy that you have to watch a couple of adverts. Get over it.

Regarding point four, no it hasn't. The divides and issues were always there under the surface but the protests made them harder for people to ignore, which was basically the purpose of the protest. It's like moving your bookcase and seeing a bunch of damp behind it, moving the bookcase didn't give you damp. Clearly we had issues with racial inequality before BLM, hence the rise in hate crimes.

Regarding point five, Israel is a colonialist state that forces Palestinians out of their homes, murders journalists and children, and is using their power and sway in rich countries like America to sweep it under the rug. Everyone should oppose it and if you are thinking "well it's too complicated to pick a side, I've always been told both sides are equally to blame and I shouldn't comment" you are doing exactly what Israel wants.

[saintadjg]

People with far right views opposing far left views shocker.

 

[SKD]

1 minute ago, TWar said:

Regarding point one. Never, it seems much more of an issue online. That doesn't make it not an issue worth doing something about.

Regarding point two. Very little, I think it is actually pretty useless and we need to do a lot more, but booing the kneeling is sending the message you don't care about the issue and just want people to get on with football, which is very counter productive. If anything people should do more. Also "far left loons" didn't cause anarchy, it was a mostly peaceful protest for a good cause that yielded results.

Regarding point three, racism is a systemic issue, not a "bad egg" issue. Also I have next to no sympathy that you have to watch a couple of adverts. Get over it.

Regarding point four, no it hasn't. The divides and issues were always there under the surface but the protests made them harder for people to ignore, which was basically the purpose of the protest. It's like moving your bookcase and seeing a bunch of damp behind it, moving the bookcase didn't give you damp. Clearly we had issues with racial inequality before BLM, hence the rise in hate crimes.

Regarding point five, Israel is a colonialist state that forces Palestinians out of their homes, murders journalists and children, and is using their power and sway in rich countries like America to sweep it under the rug. Everyone should oppose it and if you are thinking "well it's too complicated to pick a side, I've always been told both sides are equally to blame and I shouldn't comment" you are doing exactly what Israel wants.

Racism is a systematic issue, yet, you’ve never experienced it at football? Which would suggest, it’s not an issue at football. 

How often have you experienced it in your daily life? How do you eradicate ‘systematic’ racism?

Internet trolling is a wider issue that needs fixing. Kids, mostly, will say whatever they can to get a reaction. Not just racism, but online bulling and many other issues. For example, you often see things like Hillsborough being mocked. It’s something social media companies need to resolve. Getting down on a knee isn’t going to do anything. Personally, I hardly use social media as it’s just a horrible toxic environment. 

The history of Israel, or more so Jews in that region, is a long and complexed. Ultimately, there will never be peace until both parties agree for their to be peace. Hamas, firing 300 rockets at Israel, is not really asking for peace. 

You can oppose Israel without having to support a terrorism (hamas) organisation. 

Idiots like those 2 Leicester players are encouraging scumbags to drive through predominantly Jewish neighbourhoods in London spouting absolute shit, as we’ve seen. 

[SKD]

6 minutes ago, saintadjg said:

People with far right views opposing far left views shocker.

 

Which surely demonstrates the exact reason why football should remain politically neutral? 

[Saint_Jonny]

4 minutes ago, SKD said:

Which surely demonstrates the exact reason why football should remain politically neutral? 

It's not a political issue. Stop pretending it is.

[SKD]

Just now, Saint_Jonny said:

It's not a political issue. Stop pretending it is.

There are political links to BLM. Stop pretending there isn’t. 
 

And as for Waving a Palestine flag, that is certainly political. 

[Saint_Jonny]

4 minutes ago, SKD said:

There are political links to BLM. Stop pretending there isn’t. 
 

And as for Waving a Palestine flag, that is certainly political. 

Footballers using their high profile and public platform to come out against racism and kids being bombed shouldn't offend you so much, but here we are, it does, and you are happy to go online and show everyone what a bigoted small minded person you are. At least you don't hide it.

[TWar]

6 minutes ago, SKD said:

Racism is a systematic issue, yet, you’ve never experienced it at football? Which would suggest, it’s not an issue at football. 

How often have you experienced it in your daily life? How do you eradicate ‘systematic’ racism?

Internet trolling is a wider issue that needs fixing. Kids, mostly, will say whatever they can to get a reaction. Not just racism, but online bulling and many other issues. For example, you often see things like Hillsborough being mocked. It’s something social media companies need to resolve. Getting down on a knee isn’t going to do anything. Personally, I hardly use social media as it’s just a horrible toxic environment. 

The history of Israel, or more so Jews in that region, is a long and complexed. Ultimately, there will never be peace until both parties agree for their to be peace. Hamas, firing 300 rockets at Israel, is not really asking for peace. 

You can oppose Israel without having to support a terrorism (hamas) organisation. 

Idiots like those 2 Leicester players are encouraging scumbags to drive through predominantly Jewish neighbourhoods in London spouting absolute shit, as we’ve seen. 

I don't know what you mean by an "issue at football". It is an issue that effects footballers, you'd need to have your head in the sand to have not noticed that recently. But Footballers have a platform, like american footballers in the US, they don't just have to talk on Football issues, they are some of the most listened to black people in the country, it's only natural they'd have something to say.

Systemic racism is hard to really measure as to when you experience it. It tends to be more employment discrimination, prison discrimination, housing discrimination ect. than some rando yelling racial slurs in a pub. Therefore most people who miss out on a job, for example, due to their race probably won't even know it happened. But employment statistics bear it out clear as day. As for how to eradicate it, very good question without an easy answer. Education, mainly, plus encouraging people to mix a lot at a young age. For instance most of my mates who went to uni and mixed with loads of different races came back much less likely to be racist than people who stayed at home in my very white town and didn't really get to know anyone.

Agreed regarding internet trolling and social media. I also don't really use it. I think its more a litmus test for issues than issues itself. Non-racists don't suddenly become racist when they get twitter, it just gives them a means. Banning twitter might stop the symptoms in some cases, but it wouldn't really solve the underlying issue.

Regarding hamas, if your country is invaded, you are forced from your homes, your children are murdered by a government while minding their own business at some point you are going to fight back. I don't endorse terrorism but I also find it hard to blame people in that situation who have nothing else to turn to. I will say though, the Leicester lads weren't supporting Hamas, they were showing solidarity with the innocent people who died at the hands of Israeli aggression.

People shouldn't blame jewish people for the actions of israel. Plenty of jews condemn israel. Attacking Israel, or standing up for Palestine, is not an attack on Jews in general. Therefore people who go after jews in london are scumbags, but that's not fair to lay on the doorstep of the Leicester lads who were talking up for a valid cause.

[SKD]

2 minutes ago, TWar said:

I don't know what you mean by an "issue at football". It is an issue that effects footballers, you'd need to have your head in the sand to have not noticed that recently. But Footballers have a platform, like american footballers in the US, they don't just have to talk on Football issues, they are some of the most listened to black people in the country, it's only natural they'd have something to say.

Systemic racism is hard to really measure as to when you experience it. It tends to be more employment discrimination, prison discrimination, housing discrimination ect. than some rando yelling racial slurs in a pub. Therefore most people who miss out on a job, for example, due to their race probably won't even know it happened. But employment statistics bear it out clear as day. As for how to eradicate it, very good question without an easy answer. Education, mainly, plus encouraging people to mix a lot at a young age. For instance most of my mates who went to uni and mixed with loads of different races came back much less likely to be racist than people who stayed at home in my very white town and didn't really get to know anyone.

Agreed regarding internet trolling and social media. I also don't really use it. I think its more a litmus test for issues than issues itself. Non-racists don't suddenly become racist when they get twitter, it just gives them a means. Banning twitter might stop the symptoms in some cases, but it wouldn't really solve the underlying issue.

Regarding hamas, if your country is invaded, you are forced from your homes, your children are murdered by a government while minding their own business at some point you are going to fight back. I don't endorse terrorism but I also find it hard to blame people in that situation who have nothing else to turn to. I will say though, the Leicester lads weren't supporting Hamas, they were showing solidarity with the innocent people who died at the hands of Israeli aggression.

People shouldn't blame jewish people for the actions of israel. Plenty of jews condemn israel. Attacking Israel, or standing up for Palestine, is not an attack on Jews in general. Therefore people who go after jews in london are scumbags, but that's not fair to lay on the doorstep of the Leicester lads who were talking up for a valid cause.

As I understand it, Hamas were first to fire. They also use civilian locations to hide. what about the innocent Israelis that have died at the hands of Hamas aggression? 

Neither are right, war clearly isn’t the answer, but there are 2 sides to every story. Peace will not be achieved until both sides want peace. That’s on both sides, not just the rich westernised ones. 

As I said, a complex situation, one that many don’t understand when they jump on the bandwagon. 

[TWar]

16 minutes ago, SKD said:

As I understand it, Hamas were first to fire. They also use civilian locations to hide. what about the innocent Israelis that have died at the hands of Hamas aggression? 

Neither are right, war clearly isn’t the answer, but there are 2 sides to every story. Peace will not be achieved until both sides want peace. That’s on both sides, not just the rich westernised ones. 

As I said, a complex situation, one that many don’t understand when they jump on the bandwagon. 

You understand incredibly incorrectly. Troubles started when Israeli officials and militias tried to force Palestinians out of their homes in Sheikh Jarrah, homes that their families had owned for centuries but israeli invaders tried to demand rent for. Following that, Israeli police officers and radicals attacked a Mosque, Al-Aqsa, while they were praying for the final day of Ramadan. Two days later there were stories of Palestians throwing rocks and fireworks. Israel at the same time bombed the gaza strip killing 9 people including three children. Since then, the Israeli death tole I think is like 10. Israel over the last couple of weeks have killed over 200 Palestinians, including 58 children in the Gaza strip alone.

One side is right. Israel knew it was impossible to claim Palestine was in the wrong because of how little power they have so instead they went with "two sides, complicated, anyone who takes a side is wrong, just don't talk about it" as their propaganda and with the support of a complicit media in the west, it has worked. Even the briefest examining of the facts shows who has the power and who is being fucked, but people can't be bothered to even look them up. 

Edited 18 May, 2021 by TWar

[SKD]

15 minutes ago, TWar said:

You understand incredibly incorrectly. Troubles started when Israeli officials and militias tried to force Palestinians out of their homes in Sheikh Jarrah, homes that their families had owned for centuries but israeli invaders tried to demand rent for. Following that, Israeli police officers and radicals attacked a Mosque, Al-Aqsa, while they were praying for the final day of Ramadan. Two days later there were stories of Palestians throwing rocks and fireworks. Israel at the same time bombed the gaza strip killing 9 people including three children. Since then, the Israeli death tole I think is like 10. Israel over the last couple of weeks have killed over 200 Palestinians, including 58 children in the Gaza strip alone.

One side is right. Israel knew it was impossible to claim Palestine was in the wrong because of how little power they have so instead they went with "two sides, complicated, anyone who takes a side is wrong, just don't talk about it" as their propaganda and with the support of a complicit media in the west, it has worked. Even the briefest examining of the facts shows who has the power and who is being fucked, but people can't be bothered to even look them up. 

No, just checked, you’re wrong. The first rockets were fired by Hamas. The reason their death toll is higher, because they’re fighting against superior opposition. They’re starting a gun fight with knives. 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/m.economictimes.com/news/defence/heres-a-timeline-of-the-deadly-gaza-violence-between-israel-and-palestine/amp_articleshow/82708027.cms

Forcing people out of their homes, breaking up protests with rubber bullets etc, does not in anyway justify firing rockets at people. 

Again, you can oppose Israel and the way they manage tensions in the Middle East, but supporting those (terrorist group) who fire missiles at people and get a kick in, in retaliation, is just stupid. 
 

As I’ve said, peace will only be achieved when both sides want it. Firing missiles at Israel Because you’re upset, isn’t the way to achieve peace. 

[sadoldgit]

3 hours ago, LiberalCommunist said:

BLM has been healing the racial divide with grenades over the past year and a half, and I'm pretty tired of it. No room for politics in Football.......Kick it out. 

No need for racism in football either. These people are trying to kick that out.

[TWar]

10 minutes ago, SKD said:

No, just checked, you’re wrong. The first rockets were fired by Hamas. The reason their death toll is higher, because they’re fighting against superior opposition. They’re starting a gun fight with knives. 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/m.economictimes.com/news/defence/heres-a-timeline-of-the-deadly-gaza-violence-between-israel-and-palestine/amp_articleshow/82708027.cms

Forcing people out of their homes, breaking up protests with rubber bullets etc, does not in anyway justify firing rockets at people. 

Again, you can oppose Israel and the way they manage tensions in the Middle East, but supporting those (terrorist group) who fire missiles at people and get a kick in, in retaliation, is just stupid. 
 

As I’ve said, peace will only be achieved when both sides want it. Firing missiles at Israel Because you’re upset, isn’t the way to achieve peace. 

It says very clearly in the article you linked that the first violent act was the displacement of people from Al-Aqsa. Also, in what way does forcing people from their homes not justify fighting back. What were they supposed to do, just quietly go live on the streets while their possessions and livelyhoods were stolen. The Hamas rockets didn't kill a single person by all accounts, hardly seems like an overreaction to losing everything you own. Clearly Israel were the initial aggressors.

The other issue with your comment is, even if Hamas did start it, that's on Hamas. That's not on the 58 children Israel has murdered. The terrorist group didn't get a kick, hundreds of innocent people got a kick. The terrorist group killed over 20 times less innocent people than the government. How can you possibly justify that? 

Edited 18 May, 2021 by TWar

[SKD]

3 minutes ago, TWar said:

It says very clearly in the article you linked that the first violent act was the displacement of people from Al-Aqsa. Also, in what way does forcing people from their homes not justify fighting back. What were they supposed to do, just quietly go live on the streets while their possessions and livelyhoods were stolen. The Hamas rockets didn't kill a single person by all accounts, hardly seems like an overreaction to losing everything you own. Clearly Israel were the initial aggressors.

The other issue with your comment is, even if Hamas did start it, that's on Hamas. That's not on the 58 children Israel has murdered. The terrorist group didn't get a kick, hundreds of innocent people got a kick. The terrorist group killed over 20 times less innocent people than the government. How can you possibly justify that? 

No, they could settle it diplomatically, like 90% of any other civilised nation would before they started firing rockets at people.

Also, who cares if their rocket didn’t kill anyone. Next time it could? I’d imagine The intention was for it to, otherwise, what’s the point? You’re literally supporting acts of terrorism and war here. Seriously have a think about what you’re saying. 

Hamas did start it and they’re absolute shit-houses who hide in civilian compounds. Incident people getting killed is on them. 

Im not sure why it’s so hard for you to understand that the reason they have killed less is because their tools aren’t as advanced. Not because they’re less aggressive.  
 

 

[aintforever]

1 minute ago, SKD said:

No, they could settle it diplomatically 

You seriously think that would work?

  Wow

[TWar]

2 minutes ago, SKD said:

No, they could settle it diplomatically, like 90% of any other civilised nation would before they started firing rockets at people.

Also, who cares if their rocket didn’t kill anyone. Next time it could? I’d imagine The intention was for it to, otherwise, what’s the point? You’re literally supporting acts of terrorism and war here. Seriously have a think about what you’re saying. 

Hamas did start it and they’re absolute shit-houses who hide in civilian compounds. Incident people getting killed is on them. 

Im not sure why it’s so hard for you to understand that the reason they have killed less is because their tools aren’t as advanced. Not because they’re less aggressive.  
 

 

Hmm, why weren't the group with 0 power able to settle it diplomatically against the one with a massive army and the backing of most of the western world... I wonder why they didn't think of that. Honestly, it's like talking to a child.

[SKD]

Just now, TWar said:

Hmm, why weren't the group with 0 power able to settle it diplomatically against the one with a massive army and the backing of most of the western world... I wonder why they didn't think of that. Honestly, it's like talking to a child.

Fair enough. You support the terrorists and war. I don’t (I don’t support Israel either, by the way). Let’s leave it there.

Each to their own. 

[Sheaf Saint]

17 minutes ago, SKD said:

No, they could settle it diplomatically, like 90% of any other civilised nation would before they started firing rockets at people.

Also, who cares if their rocket didn’t kill anyone. Next time it could? I’d imagine The intention was for it to, otherwise, what’s the point? You’re literally supporting acts of terrorism and war here. Seriously have a think about what you’re saying. 

Hamas did start it and they’re absolute shit-houses who hide in civilian compounds. Incident people getting killed is on them. 

Im not sure why it’s so hard for you to understand that the reason they have killed less is because their tools aren’t as advanced. Not because they’re less aggressive.  
 

Are you really that naïve about the situation?

[BERMUDASAINT]

1 hour ago, SKD said:

There are political links to BLM. Stop pretending there isn’t. 
 

And as for Waving a Palestine flag, that is certainly political. 

Stop pretending your not racist.......shut up white boy, and let the people who have been affected take a few seconds to recognize on a global scale that blm. Must you try to control everything? You don't get it, never will, so let the peoples who understand the issue have their few seconds.

[SKD]

15 minutes ago, BERMUDASAINT said:

Stop pretending your not racist.......shut up white boy, and let the people who have been affected take a few seconds to recognize on a global scale that blm. Must you try to control everything? You don't get it, never will, so let the peoples who understand the issue have their few seconds.

😂😂😂 shut up you idiot. 
 

Any evidence of being a ‘racist’, you slanderous fool. Go kneel to your shrine of Mr Floyd if it makes you feel better, keep me out of it. 

[aintforever]

9 minutes ago, SKD said:

😂😂😂 shut up you idiot. 
 

Any evidence of being a ‘racist’, you slanderous fool. Go kneel to your shrine of Mr Floyd if it makes you feel better, keep me out of it. 

No one is asking to take part in it you bell-end.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

Conflating millionaire footballers taking the knee with marxism really must be one of the least intelligent opinions an adult can possibly have.

[SKD]

5 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Conflating millionaire footballers taking the knee with marxism really must be one of the least intelligent opinions an adult can possibly have.

Out of interest, do you think they have a choice? If a white footballer decided he wouldn’t take the knee, for whatever reason, what would the public reaction be? 

I suspect he’d largely be supported by most, but the vocal minority would combust over it, the bloody nazi. 

[Saint86]

As a member of what I consider to be the silent majority, all I'll say is that IMO, BLM UK has zero place in football. Also fair play to those of you arguing that point.

However there really is no point arguing politics on a football message board 🤷‍♂️. 

Either way, I certainly think no one should advocate the use (or even threats) of banning orders against those who express that viewpoint. Free speech should be absolutely sacrosanct in the UK. And clearly, every person on both sides of this debate recognises that racism should not be tolerated in today's society. 

[Jeremy Corbyn]

2 minutes ago, SKD said:

Out of interest, do you think they have a choice? If a white footballer decided he wouldn’t take the knee, for whatever reason, what would the public reaction be? 

I suspect he’d largely be supported by most, but the vocal minority would combust over it, the bloody nazi. 

Yes, I think they have a choice.  I really don't understand what authoritarian, fantasy land you think we live in.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

Just now, Saint86 said:

As a member of what I consider to be the silent majority, all I'll say is that IMO, BLM UK has zero place in football. Also fair play to those of you arguing that point.

However there really is no point arguing politics on a football message board 🤷‍♂️. 

Either way, I certainly think no one should advocate the use (or even threats) of banning orders against those who express that viewpoint. Free speech should be absolutely sacrosanct in the UK. And clearly, every person on both sides of this debate recognises that racism should not be tolerated in today's society. 

The "majority" of people support anti-racism protests.  I don't think the majority of people in this country are racist, at least I'd hope not.

[SKD]

3 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Yes, I think they have a choice.  I really don't understand what authoritarian, fantasy land you think we live in.

They have a choice in that they’re not forced down on a knee, but from a PR point of view (let’s be honest, they’re not all that intelligent), there will be some who are scared of the consequences of not taking the knee. 
 

[TWar]

5 minutes ago, SKD said:

Out of interest, do you think they have a choice? If a white footballer decided he wouldn’t take the knee, for whatever reason, what would the public reaction be? 

I suspect he’d largely be supported by most, but the vocal minority would combust over it, the bloody nazi. 

I imagine they just agree with it. The best antidote for racism is to spend time around other races and footballers do that more than almost any other group. Doubt you get a huge number of racist footballers in this day and age, there will always be a few pricks though.

If a white footballer declared they thought BLM didn't matter and black people needed to stop complaining and get on with the sport that would be fine, it's their point of view. Similarly it would be fine for people to, en masse, point out how that point of view is bad as that would be there opinion. And if they didn't want to buy products from that person/see them on TV then that is their choice. It's what people don't get about "cancel culture", calling someone out for saying something shitty is itself free speech.

[SKD]

5 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

The "majority" of people support anti-racism protests.  I don't think the majority of people in this country are racist, at least I'd hope not.

The majority don’t support the ‘woke’ brigade that attach themselves and override these issues though. Hence why Labour take a pasting every election. 

[TWar]

Just now, SKD said:

let’s be honest, they’re not all that intelligent
 

Big claim from the person who's response to the displacement of Palestinians is "why didn't they just diplomacy it out, who needs houses"

[SKD]

2 minutes ago, TWar said:

I imagine they just agree with it. The best antidote for racism is to spend time around other races and footballers do that more than almost any other group. Doubt you get a huge number of racist footballers in this day and age, there will always be a few pricks though.

If a white footballer declared they thought BLM didn't matter and black people needed to stop complaining and get on with the sport that would be fine, it's their point of view. Similarly it would be fine for people to, en masse, point out how that point of view is bad as that would be there opinion. And if they didn't want to buy products from that person/see them on TV then that is their choice. It's what people don't get about "cancel culture", calling someone out for saying something shitty is itself free speech.

A bit like society in the uk as a whole, then, really. 

[Jeremy Corbyn]

Just now, SKD said:

The majority don’t support the ‘woke’ brigade that attach themselves and override these issues though. Hence why Labour take a pasting every election. 

Assuming we take "woke" as a disparaging term to essentially mean off the scale non-sensical, then I agree.  Being anti-racist isn't that though, and the majority support taking the knee because it is simply a gesture against racism.

The only people I've seen who are uncomfortable with it are either racists or people who aren't very bright and take their opinions from Facebook.

[SKD]

3 minutes ago, TWar said:

Big claim from the person who's response to the displacement of Palestinians is "why didn't they just diplomacy it out, who needs houses"

Sorry that my immediate response isn’t to bomb someone. 
 

Their shitty little 50 year old rockets didn’t kill anyone though, so I suppose it’s fine. 

Edited 18 May, 2021 by SKD

[TWar]

Just now, SKD said:

A bit like society in the uk as a whole, then, really. 

If only, unfortunately from this thread alone it evidently isn't the case.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

4 minutes ago, SKD said:

They have a choice in that they’re not forced down on a knee, but from a PR point of view (let’s be honest, they’re not all that intelligent), there will be some who are scared of the consequences of not taking the knee. 
 

The consequences are that people will perceive you as not caring about racism, which is fair enough.  You make get some kick back for that, but if you don't care about racism then of course you'll lose some support. 

[TWar]

Just now, SKD said:

Sorry that my immediate response isn’t to bomb someone. 

Your immediate response is to blame the people who were killed in their hundreds and driven from their houses because in response people unrelated to them did a little property damage.

[SKD]

Just now, TWar said:

Your immediate response is to blame the people who were killed in their hundreds and driven from their houses because in response people unrelated to them did a little property damage.

I’m honestly astounded that you can causally support bombing another nation.

Up there with the isis loons who use the war in Syria as an excuse to go round attacking people on the streets of London. 

2 wrongs don’t make a right. There are alternative ways to get around issues than to fire rockets, which had intentions to kill, at people. 
 

I’m not blaming anyone. I don’t blame Arabs from that region for being pissed, I completely understand that. But let’s not get it twisted, Hamas are a extremist Islamic group, who given the powers that Israel have, would cause significant damage. Firing rockets at your neighbours isn’t the answer. 

[SKD]

7 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

The consequences are that people will perceive you as not caring about racism, which is fair enough.  You make get some kick back for that, but if you don't care about racism then of course you'll lose some support. 

So other than the knee (which has links to far left organisations) there are no alternatives to show you oppose racism? Which, in this country, is pretty rare might I add. 

[TWar]

Just now, SKD said:

There are alternative ways to get around issues than to fire rockets, which had intentions to kill, at people. 
Firing rockets at your neighbours isn’t the answer. 

Go on then. What is the answer? So far your answer seems to be to ignore it and hope it goes away and if anyone doesn't ignore it (for instance the lads from Leicester) you actively punish them for daring to speak up with "long bans". Sounds like your answer is to make it as "not your problem" as possible, kinda like BLM really. "Stop saying things I don't want to think about, I was comfortable in blissful ignorance"

[East Kent Saint]

Steady on chaps , the Israel v Palestilian conflict has been going on since before the first world war . The ground was laid after the first world war after we ejected the Turks from Palestine and Lord Balfour campained for a Jewish State to be established in Palestine .It was now a British mandate . We appointed Zionist governors etc and then came the 2nd World War . German Nazi regime was defeated by an alliance of Britain , Russia , USA (eventually!) the empire nations etc etc .At this point Britain was losing it's world wide power and America was battling Britain for control/influence over the middle east for OIL . USA allied with Saudi and Britain with Iraq / Iran etc . As we were buried in debt to USA we lost a grip . After WW2 Jews , understandably tried to make it to Israel while Britain , despite the Balfour agreement tried to keep them out , meanwhile USA was raising very large sums of money via the Jewish diaspora in USA to fund the new Jewish state . Britain , apart from trying to keep the Palestinians under control by fair means or foul ended up in a terrorist war with several Jewish groups funded by $ . This resulted in the British Administration housed in the King David Hotel being blown up killing 92 people plus british soldiers being killed abducted and lynched etc. Then there was the 1948 war which forced Palestinians out of their homes / villages etc including a few masacres to become refugees . After that various Arab attempts to dislodge the new Jewish state failed , Israel has survived and declared itself a democratic state , then realising that within a short time the Arabs would out breed them and vote them out , set about introducing laws to make sure west bank arabs couldn't vote etc . We should remember in our lifetimes the various wars against the PLA etc and the terrorist type reactions by highjacking airliners , killing athletes at the olympics . The responce of slaughter in the refugee camps in Beruit etc . There is no solution , Israel wants complete control over Gaza and the West Bank and the Palestinians want to return to their homes .