Is the Premier League too rich for us?

[Sarnia Cherie]

  On 06/08/2021 at 12:17, Turkish said:

No chance. We are a sinking ship, lots of players not good enough, up to our eyeballs in debt, thin, weak squad, no money to bring in decent replacements for outgoings. Our defence is terrible and we've just lost 1/4 of our goals, appears we're going to gamble on a cheap replacement to fill the void. The second half of last season was appalling and seen nothing to suggest anything is going to improve. 

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Apart from that things are great! 😁 You are right ,by the way.

[aintforever]

  On 06/08/2021 at 09:30, OldNick said:

Question, has anybody seen Armstrong play apart from the odd snippet on Sky???

Genuine question as we seem to be getting het up an unproven player in the PL

 

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Think people are more het up about the thought of us starting the season at Everton with Shane Long up front.

[OldNick]

  On 06/08/2021 at 14:25, aintforever said:

Think people are more het up about the thought of us starting the season at Everton with Shane Long up front.

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I just entered into a fantasy football league for the first time and put in the Everton keeper, sure fire clean sheet

[aintforever]

  On 05/08/2021 at 21:37, tajjuk said:

Wolves aren't spending, Arsenal aren't spending, Spurs aren't spending, Burnley aren't spending, none of the promoted clubs are spending much, Newcastle have literally not signed anyone, not even a freebie, Palace are only spending because half their team left on a free, Liverpool have bought one centre-back and have lost an influential centre mid.

Villa so far have only actually spent the money they got from Grealish.

Even money bags Everton have basically signed free transfers. 

The only clubs that can sustain real big spending are Utd, City and Chelsea. 

Clubs like Everton and Villa have had some investment, but the former have wasted it and I reckon are now restricted by their wage bill and I think Villa had the freedom because they were promoted.

Leicester do what we did, but now do it better, by cheaper, sell big and then re-invest wisely. Their transfers have largely been funded by selling Mahrez, Maguire and Chillwell for huge fees.  They look like the might do it again with Maddison, buy him for £25 million sell him on for £70 million. 

I don't really get this 'woe betide us' attitude everyone has like we are hard done by, 98% of the clubs in world football are run sustainably and only spend what they make.

The second biggest club in Germany that has 80k fans follows the exact same policy we do pretty much, buy cheap, develop youth, sell big. 

The biggest club in Portugal, Benfica have sold 1 billion Euros worth of players in the last year, that is an average of 100 million Euros per season in sales, their best players going year in year out and they are traditionally one of the biggest clubs in Europe with a big fanbase who regularly get 65k ever match watching them.

Even Real Madrid and Barcelona can't afford to buy players at the moment and Inter are having to sell their best players.

We get like £120 million in TV money, that is more than enough to run a decent PL club together with the usual income of gate receipts, merchandising, sponsorship etc. not exactly sure why people we are hard done by.

Until recently we have spent like £50-60 million on new players every season. We are only struggling in the last two to three years because of a string of poor signings who basically have not contributed anything to the club and have had next to no re-sale value. Carrillo, Hoedt, Lemina, Elyonoussi, etc. have probably cost us north of £150 million in transfer fees and wages, and we are still probably paying some of their wages now just to get other clubs to take them.

Add in the lost revenue from Covid and the club are probably £200 million down from where they should be, as either those players would have been successful so we would have sold them for a profit or they would be key first teamers and we wouldn't needed to have signed other players to replace them. Like if Lemina is a key first teamer we don't need to spend £12 million to sign Diallo, if Hoedt wasn't wasn't utter gash we don't need to spend on Vestergaard etc. etc.

A raft of utter crap signings that have had no re-sale value and have shackled the wage bill, plus covid on top, that is why we are skint. Not because we are crap and everyone elses owners splash the cash, because they simply don't. Even Man City are trying to run more sustainably and Chelsea's big splurge of spending was largely funded by sales, for example Hazard. 

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Covid has effected pretty much everyone this season so it’s a bit of a freak, if you look at the longer trend and we are only going in one direction. It wasn’t long ago that we finished above Chelsea and Liverpool, or Villa, Wolves or Leicester were a league below us, or teams like West Ham were perpetually shite. Slowly but surely other clubs are getting owners that are investing, every time one does it makes our position with our penniless owner more precarious.

[Turkish]

  On 06/08/2021 at 13:54, Sarnia Cherie said:

Apart from that things are great! 😁 You are right ,by the way.

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We've got a lot to be proud of there. The girls team are doing well, we've got posh new seats in the Kingsland, a wide and varied range of hospitality offerings, refurbished kiosks, a proactive social media presence and a new kit made from refurbished bottles. 

[Turkish]

  On 06/08/2021 at 09:01, tajjuk said:

Ah so the Express, my god how could I call something from such a might source a 'transfer rumour' lmao.

My god you are dumb, you get what the subject of the thread is yeh? It's about spending in the league, clubs being richer than us and everyone having owners that invest money to buy players that we can't. 

It LITERALLY says to survive in the league you apparently have to spend more than you earn, so OF COURSE their sales are important. Like I said when you can't understand the actual point being made and you respond with retarded strawman arguments, then it's pointless talking to you, you can't grasp simple points. 

They are spending money based on their sales FFS, that is the whole point, so when I said they are 'no spending' it means they are not just splurging the untold millions that every other club apparently has, it doesn't mean they are LITERALLY not spending because every football club has to spend money to actually exist, otherwise they would cease to actually be functioning businesses. 

Didn't think it was a particularly hard point to understand, apparently for numnuts like you it is. 

 

 

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Just a rumour that was in the express. Rely on rumours I really don’t have point. Oh wait…..🤣🤣🤣🤣 

 

Edited 6 August, 2021 by Turkish

[hackedoff]

Don't think it will be a problem for much longer.

[Turkish]

The sooner we’re back in the championship the better, fuck the premier league.

[RedArmy]

  On 06/08/2021 at 15:03, Turkish said:

We've got a lot to be proud of there. The girls team are doing well, we've got posh new seats in the Kingsland, a wide and varied range of hospitality offerings, refurbished kiosks, a proactive social media presence and a new kit made from refurbished bottles. 

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All we need now is our very own radio station broadcasting live from St Mary’s. 

[Turkish]

  On 07/08/2021 at 12:27, RedArmy said:

All we need now is our very own radio station broadcasting live from St Mary’s. 

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we had one 15 years ago. Such a shame we never invested in digital radio, another example of lack of ambition and failure to push on 😢

[Danbert]

We've had the longest current run in the Premier League apart from the big 6 and Everton. Quite an achievement really.

[Turkish]

  On 07/08/2021 at 12:39, Danbert said:

We've had the longest current run in the Premier League apart from the big 6 and Everton. Quite an achievement really.

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Which makes the fact that we are skint and had to sell to buy for all of the first two seasons even more embarrassing 

[Saint_clark]

  On 06/08/2021 at 08:46, SKD said:

You’re right, Leicester’s model is pretty similar to us and is where we were 4/5 seasons ago. 
 

The reason they do it better is because they are willing to invest a bit to pick up good young players who they know will give them a return on investment in the future. As an example Tielemans. 
 

We’re always on the hunt in the bargain bin. Who more often than not end up being a load of shite (hence why they’re in the bargain bin). 
 

in answer to the OP, yeah, the league is too rich for us. The question should be why.

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We showed a willingness to spend big fees but we just fucked up with who we were signing. Hoedt, Vestergaard, carillo, Lemina cost about £70million between them, essentially all of the Van Dijk money pissed away.

 

[SKD]

  On 08/08/2021 at 06:18, Saint_clark said:

We showed a willingness to spend big fees but we just fucked up with who we were signing. Hoedt, Vestergaard, carillo, Lemina cost about £70million between them, essentially all of the Van Dijk money pissed away.

 

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Hoedt - £15m

Vestergaard - £18m

Carillo - £20m

Lemina - £16m

Thats hardly big fee’s. 

 

[Saint_clark]

  On 08/08/2021 at 07:04, SKD said:

Hoedt - £15m

Vestergaard - £18m

Carillo - £20m

Lemina - £16m

Thats hardly big fee’s. 

 

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They were at the time. We were testing the waters paying bigger fees, got burnt and so went back to paying smaller amounts. If Carillo had worked out and got us 20 goals a season for the next two years we'd have been more willing to spend £20-30million on the right player. 

Conversely, those £69million in combined fees mean we could have splashed on one £30-40million proven prem player if we'd had the balls, and it certainly would have worked out better for us.

[whelk]

  On 08/08/2021 at 08:53, Saint_clark said:

They were at the time. We were testing the waters paying bigger fees, got burnt and so went back to paying smaller amounts. If Carillo had worked out and got us 20 goals a season for the next two years we'd have been more willing to spend £20-30million on the right player. 

Conversely, those £69million in combined fees mean we could have splashed on one £30-40million proven prem player if we'd had the balls, and it certainly would have worked out better for us.

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Carillo is an unforgivable transfer fuck up. Every one could see it and letting lame duck manager get his man was amateur in the extreme. 

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 08/08/2021 at 08:53, Saint_clark said:

They were at the time. We were testing the waters paying bigger fees, got burnt and so went back to paying smaller amounts. If Carillo had worked out and got us 20 goals a season for the next two years we'd have been more willing to spend £20-30million on the right player. 

Conversely, those £69million in combined fees mean we could have splashed on one £30-40million proven prem player if we'd had the balls, and it certainly would have worked out better for us.

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But one player at £30-£40 million would also come with a wage bill to match it and that would certainly unbalance the dressing room.

[Matthew Le God]

  On 08/08/2021 at 06:18, Saint_clark said:

Hoedt, Vestergaard, carillo, Lemina cost about £70million between them, essentially all of the Van Dijk money pissed away.

 

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  On 08/08/2021 at 07:04, SKD said:

Hoedt - £15m

Vestergaard - £18m

Carillo - £20m

Lemina - £16m

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You've mixed up history there as Hoedt and Lemina were not signed using the van Dijk money. 

Edited 8 August, 2021 by Matthew Le God

[Turkish]

  On 08/08/2021 at 09:14, Whitey Grandad said:

But one player at £30-£40 million would also come with a wage bill to match it and that would certainly unbalance the dressing room.

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That’s how it works in every industry though. Bring quality in from outside particularly from the competitors it cost a lot. 

[SKD]

  On 08/08/2021 at 08:57, whelk said:

Carillo is an unforgivable transfer fuck up. Every one could see it and letting lame duck manager get his man was amateur in the extreme. 

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Agree. The others, whilst obviously didn’t work out, you could see why we were interested (Hodet was also a weird one though). 

 

  On 08/08/2021 at 08:53, Saint_clark said:

They were at the time. We were testing the waters paying bigger fees, got burnt and so went back to paying smaller amounts. If Carillo had worked out and got us 20 goals a season for the next two years we'd have been more willing to spend £20-30million on the right player. 

Conversely, those £69million in combined fees mean we could have splashed on one £30-40million proven prem player if we'd had the balls, and it certainly would have worked out better for us.

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That’s a fair shout, but given the lack of available funds made from the owner, would we have spent 30-40m on 1 player? I’ve not seen anything to suggest we have ever had the appetite to do that. 
 

Long and short, we got cocky. With Koeman and his signings we got very lucky, that was never going to repeat. Once Mitchell left, we were in the mud and were effectively blagging things. 
 

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 08/08/2021 at 09:31, Turkish said:

That’s how it works in every industry though. Bring quality in from outside particularly from the competitors it cost a lot. 

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Yes indeed, but that wasn’t my point. Even in industry if you bring in someone who busts your pay structure you’re going to have complaints and unrest from all the other workers.

This is even more important if you’re workers are a bunch of primadonna footballers. Who’s going to pass to someone who’s paid three times what they are just so that they can get all the glory? And even more money.

[david in sweden]

  On 08/08/2021 at 07:04, SKD said:

Hoedt - £15m

Vestergaard - £18m

Carillo - £20m

Lemina - £16m

Thats hardly big fee’s. 

 

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Not BIG fees individually, but it is a quite a lot when you add it all up  = without any positive results.

*** I also note that no-one had mentioned Angus Gunn, (£13 mill) who didn't come cheap either, and I suppose 

that the jury is still out on Elyounoussi  (£16 mill.) .... unless Ralph can make a Prem. player of him. 

[Matthew Le God]

  On 08/08/2021 at 11:06, david in sweden said:

that the jury is still out on Elyounoussi  (£16 mill.) .... unless Ralph can make a Prem. player of him. 

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No chance, he is dreadful. Slow, unable to beat a player and is unaware of what is around him.

[Turkish]

https://www-cityam-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/www.cityam.com/uefa-close-to-e6bn-aid-package-for-european-football-clubs/amp/

wonder if this means we can refinance our loan as we have a supposedly very high interest rate

 

[Turkish]

  On 15/08/2021 at 09:10, adriansfc said:

This thread is ridiculous. Saints have stayed up for ten years. Far better than most clubs do and they're now an established part of the league. 

If you're mid table or fighting relegation you're often rubbish and losing a lot of games. This thread is just fans wanting to be Man City or Chelsea. 

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No it isn’t. It’s fans rightly expressing concern that despite us being in the premier league for 10 years and making a profit from transfers for most seasons, we are still skint, still have to sell to buy and most clubs appear to have greater resources than we do. 

[Lallana's Left Peg]

One of our genuine relegation rivals with a state backed takeover this evening.  One more nail in the coffin for our ability to stay in this league based on our current business model.

And its not that our model is fundamentally wrong, it's that it doesn't work in the rich playground like the Premier League.

[DT]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:01, Lallana's Left Peg said:

One of our genuine relegation rivals with a state backed takeover this evening.  One more nail in the coffin for our ability to stay in this league based on our current business model.

And its not that our model is fundamentally wrong, it's that it doesn't work in the rich playground like the Premier League.

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This. Newcastle will be fine now. They just will. If only we could get such investment (on the face of it)

[Lighthouse]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:01, Lallana's Left Peg said:

One of our genuine relegation rivals with a state backed takeover this evening.  One more nail in the coffin for our ability to stay in this league based on our current business model.

And its not that our model is fundamentally wrong, it's that it doesn't work in the rich playground like the Premier League.

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The flips side being that, based on the massive assumption that Newcastle spend their way into title contention, everyone else gets shuffled downwards. The net result being that the owners of Everton, Leicester, West Ham, Leeds and a few others may decide there’s no point in spending half a billion pounds on finishing 12th. If a couple of them stop investing, we’re kind of in the same boat.

[Turkish]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:11, DT said:

This. Newcastle will be fine now. They just will. If only we could get such investment (on the face of it)

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I heard the Saudis were interested in buying us but when they saw our rainbow shirts they realised we weren’t the club for them

[JRM]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:01, Lallana's Left Peg said:

One of our genuine relegation rivals with a state backed takeover this evening.  One more nail in the coffin for our ability to stay in this league based on our current business model.

And its not that our model is fundamentally wrong, it's that it doesn't work in the rich playground like the Premier League.

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I agree, the sums of money available to the Saudis is impossible for us to compete with, Geordies already getting giddy with talk of title challenges. 

 

[JRM]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:33, Turkish said:

I heard the Saudis were interested in buying us but when they saw our rainbow shirts they realised we weren’t the club for them

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Think you could well be right about that,  they might also have been offended by Saints fans choice of fancy dress at oldham in 1993 

[CB Fry]

One can only imagine how much development is going to be happening across Newcastle Marina in the coming years.

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:11, DT said:

This. Newcastle will be fine now. They just will. If only we could get such investment (on the face of it)

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How will it help them in the short term?

[verlaine1979]

  On 06/10/2021 at 22:18, CB Fry said:

One can only imagine how much development is going to be happening across Newcastle Marina in the coming years.

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Their plan to woo Newcastle city council is almost complete!

[Roo1976]

  On 08/08/2021 at 06:18, Saint_clark said:

We showed a willingness to spend big fees but we just fucked up with who we were signing. Hoedt, Vestergaard, carillo, Lemina cost about £70million between them, essentially all of the Van Dijk money pissed away.

 

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And non of em play for us any longer including CLUB RECORD FEE at the time  Carillio only surpassed now by  this season, Vesty and Ings...........nice.

[woodsaint1]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:01, Lallana's Left Peg said:

One of our genuine relegation rivals with a state backed takeover this evening.  One more nail in the coffin for our ability to stay in this league based on our current business model.

And its not that our model is fundamentally wrong, it's that it doesn't work in the rich playground like the Premier League.

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Will now leave just us and Burnley in that group of clubs without a pot to piss in

[Fitzhugh Fella]

  On 07/10/2021 at 08:19, woodsaint1 said:

Will now leave just us and Burnley in that group of clubs without a pot to piss in

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Perhaps the two clubs should participate in the piss pot trophy on an annual basis? We might get to put some silverware in the trophy cabinet. 

[LiberalCommunist]

I'm going to miss Steve Bruce. He always gives me a tinge of hope before the campaign starts. 

[woodsaint1]

  On 06/10/2021 at 21:48, JRM said:

I agree, the sums of money available to the Saudis is impossible for us to compete with, Geordies already getting giddy with talk of title challenges. 

 

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Sure they were talking about signing Mbappe and the likes before it fell through before. Hope it all ends in tears for them. Not having other club fans welcoming the news and saying how the newcastle fans deserve good news. You want your league rivals to struggle

[Turkish]

  On 07/10/2021 at 08:24, Fitzhugh Fella said:

Perhaps the two clubs should participate in the piss pot trophy on an annual basis? We might get to put some silverware in the trophy cabinet. 

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Sitting proudly next to the paint pot. The only club in the country to win the piss pot and the paint pot. Another record.

[Rebel]

so that means Newcastle will now be just another financially doped club owned by a questionable regime / person to go with Citeh, Chelski and Everton (and PSG in France)

and then you have the US owners at Arsenal, Liverpool and Man Utd who want a closed shop premier league or European Super League (Burnley?)

and lets not forget the owners from Asia - Saints, Wolves, Leicester etc

Although I don't really understand why you would buy Newcastle and not Inter Milan for example if you were the Saudis - you would dominate the Italian league like PSG do in France and Bayern in Germany and have a real chance at the Champions League.   Even Marseille would make more sense to me, or Juventus or AC Milan.

At best Newcastle will be one of the new top 4 along with Chelski, Citeh and United in the Premier League or smaller club in the European Super League when it comes

 

 

 

[Chris cooper]

So Burnley saints Norwich then relegated this season .. 

[Lighthouse]

Two seasons ago we finished above Everton and West Ham after they’d spent nearly a billion between them. I won’t be throwing in the towel quite so readily as some of you.

[Matthew Le God]

  On 07/10/2021 at 16:25, Chris cooper said:

So Burnley saints Norwich then relegated this season .. 

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For a start... Watford aren't better than us.

[Chris cooper]

  On 07/10/2021 at 16:38, Matthew Le God said:

For a start... Watford aren't better than us.

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Yes they are by far .. Claudio will steer them to mid table … saints are gone with the clown 🤡 at the Helm ..few grounds in the championship on the agenda for next season ..we can’t compete in this league .. now watching Newcastle fans in raptures on sky just drives the knife in even further for us !! The lid on the coffin is closing fast !

[Matthew Le God]

  On 07/10/2021 at 16:54, Chris cooper said:

1)Yes they are by far

2) Claudio will steer them to mid table 

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1) How have you worked that out?

2) How did he do keeping Fulham up in his last spell in England...?

[goodymatt]

  On 07/10/2021 at 16:54, Chris cooper said:

Yes they are by far .. Claudio will steer them to mid table … saints are gone with the clown 🤡 at the Helm ..few grounds in the championship on the agenda for next season ..we can’t compete in this league .. now watching Newcastle fans in raptures on sky just drives the knife in even further for us !! The lid on the coffin is closing fast !

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Didn’t work out for him at Fulham despite spending a fair amount. Wouldn’t say Ranieri is nailed on to keep them up. 

Sadly I’d agree that we are in that lottery group of teams that could go down. Hoping we can still avoid the drop though.

[Hodgey]

Think Newcastle would finish above us anyway as they have Wilson and ASM. This takeover means they can keep them and buy a couple more creative mercenaries. 
We are most certainly in the group of teams  at the bottom - just hope we are that bit better than Norwich, Burnley and Watford

[SaintsLoyal]

Players wages are the real problem. 

[Roo1976]

Sandcastle United..................who would have thought the British  Government would allow such a sensative takeover?...............human rights?...........

still half time entertainment live from Riyadh should be good.............................