Coronavirus

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 09/11/2020 at 07:42, egg said:

Do you think that the strain on the health service will reduce or increase if we can all mingle and do as we please? Straightforward answer please. 

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It’s not the job of the public to protect the NHS. Quite the reverse.

[egg]

  On 09/11/2020 at 11:38, Whitey Grandad said:

It’s not the job of the public to protect the NHS. Quite the reverse.

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Nonsense. It's the job of all of us to act responsibly, and in doing so reduce the strain on the NHS. The only reason we're in this "lockdown" is become there are too many dinlo's who refuse to obey simple instruction and guidance, thus a sledgehammer has been used to crack a nut.

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 09/11/2020 at 12:43, egg said:

Nonsense. It's the job of all of us to act responsibly, and in doing so reduce the strain on the NHS. The only reason we're in this "lockdown" is become there are too many dinlo's who refuse to obey simple instruction and guidance, thus a sledgehammer has been used to crack a nut.

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No, the only reason we are in this situation is a misreadong of the figures. We cannot and should not lead our lives by thinking of the NHS in everything we do. We should all take care of our own health as much as possible.

Out of interest, do you believe everything that comes out of the Government?

[egg]

  On 09/11/2020 at 13:14, Whitey Grandad said:

No, the only reason we are in this situation is a misreadong of the figures. We cannot and should not lead our lives by thinking of the NHS in everything we do. We should all take care of our own health as much as possible.

Out of interest, do you believe everything that comes out of the Government?

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What figures are being misread? What's the correct figures?

Back to the original point though, I'm surprised that you don't agree that we all have a responsibility to reduce transmission, thus reduce strain on the NHS. That sort of attitude has helped cause this mess.

I'm not sure why say ask if I believe what the government says, but are you disputing that cases are increasing and that hospital admissions are increasing? If you are disputing it, do you have any evidence or are you doing a Trump?

 

Edited 9 November, 2020 by egg

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 07:42, egg said:

Do you think that the strain on the health service will reduce or increase if we can all mingle and do as we please? Straightforward answer please. 

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It will increase.

Do you think the Welsh should be ending their 'firebreak' lockdown when everyone knows the number of infections will rise when people are allowed to mingle, at the same time that the number of patients in Welsh hospitals with coronavirus is now the highest since the height of the pandemic in April?

Straightforward answer please.

[aintforever]

It's all irrelevant anyway, Pfizer's vaccine works so we will be back at football/nightclubs/gang-bangs in no time at all.

[RedArmy]

  On 09/11/2020 at 14:43, aintforever said:

It's all irrelevant anyway, Pfizer's vaccine works so we will be back at football/nightclubs/gang-bangs in no time at all.

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If you call 2022 no time at all, yes. 

[aintforever]

  On 09/11/2020 at 15:38, RedArmy said:

If you call 2022 no time at all, yes. 

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Not sure it will be that long. You don't have to vaccinate everyone, once the vulnerable people get done we can just crack on as usual.

[Turkish]

Who else is looking forward to the anti vaccine protests to finish the year off nicely?

[RedArmy]

  On 09/11/2020 at 15:47, aintforever said:

Not sure it will be that long. You don't have to vaccinate everyone, once the vulnerable people get done we can just crack on as usual.

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Yeah good luck with that. 

[aintforever]

  On 09/11/2020 at 16:05, RedArmy said:

Yeah good luck with that. 

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The point in the lockdowns is not to stop everyone getting the virus or trying to wipe it out, they are purely to stop the NHS getting overwhelmed. Once the vulnerable are immune, or most of them immune, then hospital admissions shouldn't be at risk of getting too high.

Obviously it won't be party time from day one but as more and more people get vaccinated, restrictions will lift and I think normality will return pretty quickly.

[Turkish]

Professor Sir John Bell, a member of the government’s Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies, said he was confident that life in the UK would start returning to normality by next spring - assuming regulatory approval for the vaccine is granted.

[ecuk268]

  On 09/11/2020 at 15:56, Turkish said:

Who else is looking forward to the anti vaccine protests to finish the year off nicely?

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Especially when they realise that it contains microchips so that Bill Gates can monitor us all

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 09/11/2020 at 16:16, aintforever said:

 

Obviously it won't be party time from day one but as more and more people get vaccinated, restrictions will lift and I think normality will return pretty quickly.

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Normality will never return. The establishment have got the whiff of control in their nostrils. They’ve created an army of job worths and snitches that aren’t going to hang up their high vis jackets. I’ll bet my life there will be restrictions on what we eat & drink, and more monitoring and control of “bad behaviour”. The relationship between state & individual has changed for a generation and the state will be getting involved in things they’ve no business getting involved in. We’ve seen it with Rashfords school diners pony,and soft arsed lefties like you will want a permanent furlough type scheme every time there’s a down turn. Roll on The Reform Party. 

Edited 9 November, 2020 by Lord Duckhunter

[Jimmy_D]

90% really is promising if that holds up. It'd bring the r rate well below one once enough people are vaccinated.

That would put us back on a path that'd allow us to start getting back to normal.

[buctootim]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:06, Lord Duckhunter said:

Normality will never return. The establishment have got the whiff of control in their nostrils. They’ve created an army of job worths and snitches that aren’t going to hang up their high vis jackets. I’ll bet my life there will be restrictions on what we eat & drink, and more monitoring and control of “bad behaviour”. The relationship between state & individual has changed for a generation and the state will be getting involved in things they’ve no business getting involved in. We’ve seen it with Rashfords school diners pony,and soft arsed lefties like you will want a permanent furlough type scheme every time there’s a down turn. Roll on The Reform Party. 

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Haha. You've turned into a proper fully fledged bitter old git who's time has passed. Pity because you aren't stupid 

[Lighthouse]

This Brigadier is a bit up himself. Still fingers crossed on the vaccine.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:12, Jimmy_D said:

90% really is promising if that holds up. It'd bring the r rate well below one once enough people are vaccinated.

That would put us back on a path that'd allow us to start getting back to normal.

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Good job there won't be much demand for it then, so we can get as many vaccines as we want as soon as we want them, oh, wait, no, every man and his dog will want them!

The only safe bet right now is Pfizer shares  

Edited 9 November, 2020 by Weston Super Saint

[Jimmy_D]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:17, Weston Super Saint said:

Good job there won't be much demand for it then, so we can get as many vaccines as we want as soon as we want them, oh, wait, no, every man and his dog will want them!

The only safe bet right now is Pfizer shares  

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Hah, probably a bit late to jump on the Pfizer bandwagon now.

The good thing about a vaccination programme, though, is that everyone benefits from increasing herd immunity as it rolls out.

It's one of the 6 vaccines the UK had backed in advance, which is also a positive for us.

[buctootim]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:17, Weston Super Saint said:

Good job there won't be much demand for it then, so we can get as many vaccines as we want as soon as we want them, oh, wait, no, every man and his dog will want them!

The only safe bet right now is Pfizer shares  

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I think the discovery was actually made by some small start up. Pfizers involvement seems to be providing mass manufacture. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:13, buctootim said:

Haha. You've turned into a proper fully fledged bitter old git who's time has passed. Pity because you aren't stupid 

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Come back 4 years after any vaccine & we’ll see if normality has returned. 

[Jimmy_D]

Ah, that's a big caveat...

Unknown yet whether it prevents transmission, which is what would be required to get the benefit of herd immunity from the vaccine. Just have to wait and see on that one.

[The Cat]

Some sort of normality would return in the spring anyway as that's when the virus would start dying out again. Add in the vaccine and we should be ok to get back to St Mary's for the last few games to see Saints lift the Premier League trophy.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:31, Jimmy_D said:

Ah, that's a big caveat...

Unknown yet whether it prevents transmission, which is what would be required to get the benefit of herd immunity from the vaccine. Just have to wait and see on that one.

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Not really.

If it prevents infection, then if enough people have been vaccinated, it wouldn't matter about transmission as the virus will eventually die out if it can't infect anyone...

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:34, The Cat said:

Some sort of normality would return in the spring anyway as that's when the virus would start dying out again. Add in the vaccine and we should be ok to get back to St Mary's for the last few games to see Saints lift the Premier League trophy.

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Not sure it's ever 'died out'.  Infection rates were controlled when everyone was locked up, but that's no where near the same as the virus dying out....

[Jimmy_D]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:46, Weston Super Saint said:

Not really.

If it prevents infection, then if enough people have been vaccinated, it wouldn't matter about transmission as the virus will eventually die out if it can't infect anyone...

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At this point it's not known whether it's preventing infection entirely, or making asymptomatic cases that would otherwise have been symptomatic.

The entire point of the vaccine is to produce antibodies that would act against the virus, so everyone appears as if they've been infected, and it's not possible to tell the difference at the moment, hence this being an interim result.

Don't get me wrong, it's very VERY promising, but it's not absolutely certain that this is 'it' just yet.

[Kingsland Codger]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:34, The Cat said:

Some sort of normality would return in the spring anyway as that's when the virus would start dying out again. Add in the vaccine and we should be ok to get back to St Mary's for the last few games to see Saints lift the Premier League trophy.

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That’s the spirit!

[Turkish]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:34, The Cat said:

Some sort of normality would return in the spring anyway as that's when the virus would start dying out again. Add in the vaccine and we should be ok to get back to St Mary's for the last few games to see Saints lift the Premier League trophy.

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You mean to see Saints bottle it/put in a great performance and miss out due to a dodgy decision.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:55, Jimmy_D said:

At this point it's not known whether it's preventing infection entirely, or making asymptomatic cases that would otherwise have been symptomatic.

The entire point of the vaccine is to produce antibodies that would act against the virus, so everyone appears as if they've been infected, and it's not possible to tell the difference at the moment, hence this being an interim result.

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Not sure I understand your point and it seems to be semantics....

There is a good diagram on the BBC site that shows how the vaccine works (when someone who is vaccinated subsequently encounters the virus).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54873105

[Jimmy_D]

  On 09/11/2020 at 18:28, Weston Super Saint said:

Not sure I understand your point and it seems to be semantics....

There is a good diagram on the BBC site that shows how the vaccine works (when someone who is vaccinated subsequently encounters the virus).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54873105

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Basically it comes down to us still not knowing enough about COVID-19. Or rather, what we do know meaning we can't make assumptions about what the vaccine is doing.

We know there's evidence that COVID-19 can infect asymptomatically, and be transmitted by those it's infected asymptomatically. We also know it's possible for COVID-19 to reinfect people who have been infected before. However, we don't know what causes the difference in severity of symptoms.

At this point, we're not certain, because it's not possible to be certain, whether the vaccine is actually preventing infection completely, or is simply causing a difference in severity of symptoms.

[Weston Super Saint]

Ah, I see where you're coming from now.

My understanding of a vaccine is something that provides 'immunity' to / from a particular infection.  They've definitely got a cheek to call this a 'vaccine' if it isn't providing immunity, maybe more of a 'treatment'...

[Jimmy_D]

  On 09/11/2020 at 18:48, Weston Super Saint said:

Ah, I see where you're coming from now.

My understanding of a vaccine is something that provides 'immunity' to / from a particular infection.  They've definitely got a cheek to call this a 'vaccine' if it isn't providing immunity, maybe more of a 'treatment'...

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It's definitely a vaccine, and intended to be one, but it's still a little too early to tell for certain if it's completely having the intended effect.

It really does look promising so far, but unfortunately, there's nothing we can do except wait for more data to come through, and hope that news about it provides all the context of exactly what's been found so far and where it is.

[The Cat]

  On 09/11/2020 at 17:47, Weston Super Saint said:

Not sure it's ever 'died out'.  Infection rates were controlled when everyone was locked up, but that's no where near the same as the virus dying out....

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Infections massively dropped during the summer even when every man and their dog was packed into a 40 mile radius in Cornwall!

[bpsaint]

News of the vaccine is definitely a glimmer of hope for many, if this initial RNA vaccine is 90% effective then at least the goal remains to create one that is 100%. Personally I feel that Covid-19 will still be around for a few more years yet, whilst scientists study the virus and learn its workings to create a true cure. Normally these things take years of testing and trials before they are approved for mass production so I do feel a slight bit of trepidation about it.

How do you go about rolling out that many vaccines to that many people though, I would assume the government I’ll want it done PDQ to return the country back to some kind of normality? 

 

 

 

 

[Barry the Badger]

  On 09/11/2020 at 20:49, bpsaint said:

News of the vaccine is definitely a glimmer of hope for many, if this initial RNA vaccine is 90% effective then at least the goal remains to create one that is 100%. Personally I feel that Covid-19 will still be around for a few more years yet, whilst scientists study the virus and learn its workings to create a true cure. Normally these things take years of testing and trials before they are approved for mass production so I do feel a slight bit of trepidation about it.

How do you go about rolling out that many vaccines to that many people though, I would assume the government I’ll want it done PDQ to return the country back to some kind of normality? 

 

 

 

 

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I'm fairly sure that no vaccine is 100% and if this is actually 90% effective that's a pretty high success rate already.

[The Cat]

They'll surely do a mass rollout in care homes first. 

After that it has to be the oldest people or those who are shielding due to being extremely clinically vulnerable.

The UK has 20 million to dish out from the batch we've bought so it will obviously take time. 

[hypochondriac]

  On 09/11/2020 at 20:49, bpsaint said:

News of the vaccine is definitely a glimmer of hope for many, if this initial RNA vaccine is 90% effective then at least the goal remains to create one that is 100%. Personally I feel that Covid-19 will still be around for a few more years yet, whilst scientists study the virus and learn its workings to create a true cure. Normally these things take years of testing and trials before they are approved for mass production so I do feel a slight bit of trepidation about it.

How do you go about rolling out that many vaccines to that many people though, I would assume the government I’ll want it done PDQ to return the country back to some kind of normality? 

 

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If this vaccine works at a long term effectiveness of 90% then there will be no need to have a vaccine with a higher percentage. 

 

[Lighthouse]

  On 09/11/2020 at 20:49, bpsaint said:

News of the vaccine is definitely a glimmer of hope for many, if this initial RNA vaccine is 90% effective then at least the goal remains to create one that is 100%. Personally I feel that Covid-19 will still be around for a few more years yet, whilst scientists study the virus and learn its workings to create a true cure. Normally these things take years of testing and trials before they are approved for mass production so I do feel a slight bit of trepidation about it.

How do you go about rolling out that many vaccines to that many people though, I would assume the government I’ll want it done PDQ to return the country back to some kind of normality? 

 

 

 

 

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Surely 90% will be enough to generate herd immunity IF the vaccine prevents people from being asymptomatic carriers. If not and the virus continues to spread at the same rate, then the NHS should be able to cope with the 10% who do suffer symptoms.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 09/11/2020 at 21:25, The Cat said:

They'll surely do a mass rollout in care homes first. 

After that it has to be the oldest people or those who are shielding due to being extremely clinically vulnerable.

The UK has 20 million to dish out from the batch we've bought so it will obviously take time. 

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So you wouldn't roll it out to NHS staff?

Given that 20% of the 'new hospital cases' were actually caught whilst people were in hospital, wouldn't that be a pretty good place to start?

[The Cat]

  On 09/11/2020 at 21:51, Weston Super Saint said:

So you wouldn't roll it out to NHS staff?

Given that 20% of the 'new hospital cases' were actually caught whilst people were in hospital, wouldn't that be a pretty good place to start?

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They'd be high on my list, just after Southampton FC players and staff.

[Barry the Badger]

Erm I think you're all forgetting something in terms of the priorities. 

MPs

MPs cleaners

MPs nannys

MPs chaufers

Bar staff at the houses of parliment bar

People who run golf clubs that MPs like to go to

People who run hunting clubs

Billionaire political donators

Old people

Shielding people

NHS Staff

Edited 10 November, 2020 by Barry the Badger

[Tamesaint]

  On 10/11/2020 at 10:02, Barry the Badger said:

Erm I think you're all forgetting something in terms of the priorities. 

MPs

MPs cleaners

MPs nannys

MPs chaufers

Bar staff at the houses of parliment bar

People who run golf clubs that MPs like to go to

People who run hunting clubs

Billionaire political donators

Old people

Shielding people

NHS Staff

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Presumably you include grouse shoot staff with the people who run hunting clubs.

[ecuk268]

It may  be satire but has  a ring of truth when you think of the head of the track and trace farce Dido Harding ( married to a Tory MP) and vaccine Tsar Kate Bingham (married to a Tory MP) who has spent £500000 on PR consultants instead of using the in-house ones.

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/health/government-to-ignore-breakthrough-vaccine-for-one-designed-by-old-oxford-chum-that-doesnt-work-20201110202393

 

[whelk]

Wales scrapping GCSEs and A levels. I’d have been fucked. Always did very good in exams despite teacher’s low expectations. Bright kids will be surpassed by those who have dedicated parents happy to plagiarise. 

[Barry the Badger]

  On 10/11/2020 at 12:04, whelk said:

Wales scrapping GCSEs and A levels. I’d have been fucked. Always did very good in exams despite teacher’s low expectations. Bright kids will be surpassed by those who have dedicated parents happy to plagiarise. 

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Well maybe but they've got advance notice. If they're that bright they'll presumably work out that they have to put the effort in during lessons and not rely on exams which aren't going to happen.

[buctootim]

  On 10/11/2020 at 12:16, Barry the Badger said:

Well maybe but they've got advance notice. If they're that bright they'll presumably work out that they have to put the effort in during lessons and not rely on exams which aren't going to happen.

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They measure two different things. Thick but conscientious is very different to clever but bored. I was more like Whelk.   

Edited 10 November, 2020 by buctootim

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 10/11/2020 at 12:20, buctootim said:

They measure two different things. Thick but conscientious is very different to clever but bored. I was more like Whelk.   

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What happened?

[buctootim]

Seems like PHE might be starting to get on top of track and trace. Two cases in my daughters year at school but apparently unconnected so school stays open. 

[badgerx16]

Just a note of warning chaps;

If you want to quote any of my posts in the next few days ensure you follow the correct protective measures - I have just been informed that I have tested positive.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 10/11/2020 at 18:12, badgerx16 said:

Just a note of warning chaps;

If you want to quote any of my posts in the next few days ensure you follow the correct protective measures - I have just been informed that I have tested positive.

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For what