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Summer Transfer Window 2021

Dusic

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

If he does get backed with say 3-4 players in then I think next season will be the true test of Ralph and how good he actually is, I know he has his critics but I think some of our worst performances have stemmed from a lack of depth and him not having a squad that is truly his and having to 'make do and med' with a squad that had seen years of decline and poor signings.

But with 3-4 players coming in that I presume he would sing off on and no significant players leaving there will be no excuses. 

 

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SKD

SKD

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2 minutes ago, tajjuk said:

If he does get backed with say 3-4 players in then I think next season will be the true test of Ralph and how good he actually is, I know he has his critics but I think some of our worst performances have stemmed from a lack of depth and him not having a squad that is truly his and having to 'make do and med' with a squad that had seen years of decline and poor signings.

But with 3-4 players coming in that I presume he would sing off on and no significant players leaving there will be no excuses. 

 

Agree with this. Although, Ralph did specifically say he wanted a smaller squad. And injuries are partially down to him and his reluctance to change style. 
 

As you said, 3/4 players (optimistic imo) no excuses, although he’ll always have the ‘I lost our top scorer’ card. 

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Ok all very interesting stuff.

So if we are looking a multiple entries around the 10 price point and work permit issues mean we need to look elsewhere where do we think we will be shopping ?

Uk - No unless good deal

EU - Unlikely unless recruit can satisfy WP application.

Asia/Africa/US/South America/Australia?

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Useful Idiot

Useful Idiot

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Posted

WP qualification is difficult from Africa, Asia and the US. Not sure about Australia. I think most of these require that the player gets regular international football (70% of games over the past 12 months).

South America is a bit easier. Playing any Copa Libertadores matches offer a big boost to WP qualification, as does playing matches in either the Argentinian or Brazilian top divisions.

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Dusic

Dusic

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12 minutes ago, Convict Colony said:

Ok all very interesting stuff.

So if we are looking a multiple entries around the 10 price point and work permit issues mean we need to look elsewhere where do we think we will be shopping ?

Uk - No unless good deal

EU - Unlikely unless recruit can satisfy WP application.

Asia/Africa/US/South America/Australia?

Ralph seemed to suggest South America might be a future option but that at the moment we don't have a good scouting presence there, so I don't expect anything soon.

UK market below PL will surely be a focus area.

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SKD

SKD

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10 minutes ago, Dusic said:

Ralph seemed to suggest South America might be a future option but that at the moment we don't have a good scouting presence there, so I don't expect anything soon.

UK market below PL will surely be a focus area.

Here in lies the issue of limiting a budget to 10-15m. It’s very difficult to find value in that price bracket that are good enough to make an impact. 

Id rather we went 15-20m and looked at leagues such as Belgium, french, Austria, Holland and pick from clubs who’ve played in the CL (Mane type). There are some fantastic players in these leagues, who are a little more expensive, but have ability to impact straight away. 

Unless you have someone who is shortly out of contract, you’ll struggle to find any value for 10m£

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stevy777_x

stevy777_x

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50 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said:

WP qualification is difficult from Africa, Asia and the US. Not sure about Australia. I think most of these require that the player gets regular international football (70% of games over the past 12 months).

South America is a bit easier. Playing any Copa Libertadores matches offer a big boost to WP qualification, as does playing matches in either the Argentinian or Brazilian top divisions.

Ralph saos yesterday in his presser that brexit rules it opened new markets such as South America but that we don t have the scouting network.

Well why did they not anticipate those changes and set it up before? They knew this was gonna happen since the start of the season.

Great strategy again!

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Sideways Jim

Sideways Jim

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2 hours ago, Useful Idiot said:

South America is a bit easier. Playing any Copa Libertadores matches offer a big boost to WP qualification, as does playing matches in either the Argentinian or Brazilian top divisions.

Maybe we could convince a former manager to sell us Thiago Almada 😉

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TWar

TWar

Posted
Posted (edited)

I imagine the championship will be raided heavily this summer, a lot of championship sides are suffering a lot with comparable sized stadiums to lower down prem sides so comparable loss in ticket earnings but a much smaller amount of money from TV deals and sponsorships. I think that any club that narrowly avoids promotion will be raided heavily and lower down sides will lose their top players too. We are already linked with Danjuma, Henry, and a couple of lads from Bristol.

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SuperSAINT

SuperSAINT

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7 minutes ago, TWar said:

I imagine the championship will be raided heavily this summer, a lot of championship sides are suffering a lot with comparable sized stadiums to lower down prem sides so comparable loss in ticket earnings but a much smaller amount of money from TV deals and sponsorships. I think that any club that narrowly avoids promotion will be raided heavily and lower down sides will lose their top players too. We are already linked with Danjuma, Henry, and a couple of lads from Bristol.

I think we will see the 14-15 age groups raided nationwide now, too.

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le_tiss

le_tiss

Posted
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So Saw the link to Harry Winks last night -

Decent player, keeps things ticking over / possession like a Michael Carrick or a better version of Jack Cork if you like.

Seeing as we have JWP, Romeu, Diallo, (Tella, Amstrong, Theo, Redmond, Djenpo - Attacking Mids) Smallbone, & Jankewitz

do we actually need him - would it be an upgrade?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=harry+winks+southampton&rlz=1C1CHBD_en-GBGB790GB790&oq=harry+winks+southampton&aqs=chrome..69i57j33i160.7490j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

Is it just agent talk? or Levy trying to get us involved in a deal (ala KWP)

 

on a different note - Ryan Sessengon - could we not try and get him? either on loan, loan to buy or but outright?

he is on loan to Hoffenheim at the moment - 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Sessegnon

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Turkish

Turkish

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Posted
5 minutes ago, le_tiss said:

So Saw the link to Harry Winks last night -

Decent player, keeps things ticking over / possession like a Michael Carrick or a better version of Jack Cork if you like.

Seeing as we have JWP, Romeu, Diallo, (Tella, Amstrong, Theo, Redmond, Djenpo - Attacking Mids) Smallbone, & Jankewitz

do we actually need him - would it be an upgrade?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=harry+winks+southampton&rlz=1C1CHBD_en-GBGB790GB790&oq=harry+winks+southampton&aqs=chrome..69i57j33i160.7490j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

Is it just agent talk? or Levy trying to get us involved in a deal (ala KWP)

 

on a different note - Ryan Sessengon - could we not try and get him? either on loan, loan to buy or but outright?

he is on loan to Hoffenheim at the moment - 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Sessegnon

Weren’t he links to Harry Winks in football insider which is basically a comic? Good player but don’t need him and given the source it’s probably utter bollocks anhwwy

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qwertyell

qwertyell

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19 minutes ago, le_tiss said:

on a different note - Ryan Sessengon - could we not try and get him? either on loan, loan to buy or but outright?

he is on loan to Hoffenheim at the moment - 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Sessegnon

He's sort of lost in no man's land as a player. Too weak defensively to be a permanent left back; too basic and uncreative to be a winger. What is he? Nothing, really.

When he's played for Spurs he's looked like a guy who knows he shouldn't be out there. So timid.

I can't see what he'd bring to us other than the potential of youth (that we no longer seem to develop very well).

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The Curse of St Mary's

The Curse of St Mary's

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Posted

https://www.hampshirelive.news/sport/football/transfer-news/southampton-tottenham-manchester-city-transfer-5285390

 

We are looking at sub £10m players. This would normally raise concerns in normal times but I think it will be a buyer's market with lots of bargains to be had in Europe if we can get past work permit criteria. French league is the obvious one as the pandemic has crippled there league. I seem to recall they don't even have a TV deal. 

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

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22 minutes ago, The Curse of St Mary's said:

We are looking at sub £10m players. This would normally raise concerns in normal times but I think it will be a buyer's market with lots of bargains to be had in Europe if we can get past work permit criteria. French league is the obvious one as the pandemic has crippled there league. I seem to recall they don't even have a TV deal. 

Brexit has made it easier than it was for us to buy non EU players and harder to buy EU players. We just don't have the scouting networks in place yet. It is now potentially easier for us to sign Brazilians or Argentines.

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Teddeer

Teddeer

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23 hours ago, le_tiss said:

So Saw the link to Harry Winks last night -

Decent player, keeps things ticking over / possession like a Michael Carrick or a better version of Jack Cork if you like.

Seeing as we have JWP, Romeu, Diallo, (Tella, Amstrong, Theo, Redmond, Djenpo - Attacking Mids) Smallbone, & Jankewitz

do we actually need him - would it be an upgrade?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=harry+winks+southampton&rlz=1C1CHBD_en-GBGB790GB790&oq=harry+winks+southampton&aqs=chrome..69i57j33i160.7490j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

Is it just agent talk? or Levy trying to get us involved in a deal (ala KWP)

 

on a different note - Ryan Sessengon - could we not try and get him? either on loan, loan to buy or but outright?

he is on loan to Hoffenheim at the moment - 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Sessegnon

Wouldn't want Harry Winks - he's a very average player who loves to pass backwards and sideways. Spurs fans don't rate him.

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ErwinK1961

ErwinK1961

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21 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Brexit has made it easier than it was for us to buy non EU players and harder to buy EU players. We just don't have the scouting networks in place yet. It is now potentially easier for us to sign Brazilians or Argentines.

Pretty poor if we haven’t got scouting networks in place already in South America. This has only been in the pipeline for 5 years.

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egg

egg

Posted
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, ErwinK1961 said:

 

 

37 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Brexit has made it easier than it was for us to buy non EU players and harder to buy EU players. We just don't have the scouting networks in place yet. It is now potentially easier for us to sign Brazilians or Argentines.

Yep, but that South America is quite a big place, and for the reason you highlight more British clubs will now be looking there for talent.

We seem to be losing talent from Surrey to Chelsea, from the New Forest to Bournemouth, from West Sussex to Brighton, from North Hampshire to Reading, etc. Thus, I'm not sure that because of Brexit that we've now get a better chance of signing players from Buenos Aries or Manaus. 

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, The Curse of St Mary's said:

https://www.hampshirelive.news/sport/football/transfer-news/southampton-tottenham-manchester-city-transfer-5285390

 

We are looking at sub £10m players. This would normally raise concerns in normal times but I think it will be a buyer's market with lots of bargains to be had in Europe if we can get past work permit criteria. French league is the obvious one as the pandemic has crippled there league. I seem to recall they don't even have a TV deal. 

Like you said, my worry is that we'll be hand tied with the work permit stuff. <£10m players will probably be deemed 'not important enough' to meet the criteria from EU countries, which could cause a huge problem for us.

South America could be an option. I don't believe we have no scouting networks in place, the club will be fully aware of South America players I'm pretty sure. Those sorts obviously come with their own pitfalls though!

Attractiveness and wage offerings will be the big thing this year, as I'm sure other clubs in our 'arena' will be shopping with the same mindset

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ErwinK1961

ErwinK1961

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33 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Like you said, my worry is that we'll be hand tied with the work permit stuff. <£10m players will probably be deemed 'not important enough' to meet the criteria from EU countries, which could cause a huge problem for us.

South America could be an option. I don't believe we have no scouting networks in place, the club will be fully aware of South America players I'm pretty sure. Those sorts obviously come with their own pitfalls though!

Attractiveness and wage offerings will be the big thing this year, as I'm sure other clubs in our 'arena' will be shopping with the same mindset

Wasn’t that the issue with Sangare summer just gone?

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igsey

igsey

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Posted
On 10/04/2021 at 10:15, le_tiss said:

So Saw the link to Harry Winks last night -

Decent player, keeps things ticking over / possession like a Michael Carrick or a better version of Jack Cork if you like.

Seeing as we have JWP, Romeu, Diallo, (Tella, Amstrong, Theo, Redmond, Djenpo - Attacking Mids) Smallbone, & Jankewitz

do we actually need him - would it be an upgrade?

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=harry+winks+southampton&rlz=1C1CHBD_en-GBGB790GB790&oq=harry+winks+southampton&aqs=chrome..69i57j33i160.7490j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

Is it just agent talk? or Levy trying to get us involved in a deal (ala KWP)

 

Main problem with this is that Winks is shit.

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Turkish

Turkish

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On 10/04/2021 at 10:39, qwertyell said:

He's sort of lost in no man's land as a player. Too weak defensively to be a permanent left back; too basic and uncreative to be a winger. What is he? Nothing, really.

When he's played for Spurs he's looked like a guy who knows he shouldn't be out there. So timid.

I can't see what he'd bring to us other than the potential of youth (that we no longer seem to develop very well).

I think Spurs thought they were getting the new Gareth Bale when they got him. I never been that impressed despite the huge hype around him a couple of years ago. He is only 20 though so still could be a good player in there to come out. He wont get that chance with Mourhino though so will need a move or another loan to develop. 

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stevy777_x

stevy777_x

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21 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Like you said, my worry is that we'll be hand tied with the work permit stuff. <£10m players will probably be deemed 'not important enough' to meet the criteria from EU countries, which could cause a huge problem for us.

South America could be an option. I don't believe we have no scouting networks in place, the club will be fully aware of South America players I'm pretty sure. Those sorts obviously come with their own pitfalls though!

Attractiveness and wage offerings will be the big thing this year, as I'm sure other clubs in our 'arena' will be shopping with the same mindset

We don t have a scouting network in South America Ralph pretty much said it in his presser.

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skintsaint

skintsaint

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Posted
42 minutes ago, stevy777_x said:

We don t have a scouting network in South America Ralph pretty much said it in his presser.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/fifa-world-cup-qualifying-conmebol/story/4343684/wonderkids-of-south-america-alvarezveronkaio-jorge-lead-all-star-list

 

Send him this link for starters....trouble is with this area is the big Spanish & Portugeeeezer clubs already dug down deep in South America which wouldn't make players too cheap.

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BARCELONASAINT

BARCELONASAINT

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 11/04/2021 at 09:50, S-Clarke said:

Like you said, my worry is that we'll be hand tied with the work permit stuff. <£10m players will probably be deemed 'not important enough' to meet the criteria from EU countries, which could cause a huge problem for us.

South America could be an option. I don't believe we have no scouting networks in place, the club will be fully aware of South America players I'm pretty sure. Those sorts obviously come with their own pitfalls though!

Attractiveness and wage offerings will be the big thing this year, as I'm sure other clubs in our 'arena' will be shopping with the same mindset

I've been speaking to someone who is Southampton born and bred and bleeds red and white. He is also on top of other things he does acting as an intermediary for football agents. I asked him if he had approached Saints because of his vast knowledge of players in South America (particularly Venezuela) and his response was "I wanted to suggest an 18 year old LB/RB with a Spanish passport signed to the Griezmann agency and they out of hand said they are not interested in that part of the world"

He stated they have no money to invest in the extra scouting and have already targeted scouting areas they believe in!

 

Edited by BARCELONASAINT
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SKD

SKD

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23 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

I've been speaking to someone who is Southampton born and bred and bleeds red and white. He is also on top of other things he does acting as an intermediary for football agents. I asked him if he had approached Saints because of his vast knowledge of players in South America (particularly Venezuela) and his response was "I wanted to suggest an 18 year old LB/RB with a Spanish passport signed to the Griezmann agency and they out of hand said they are not interested in that part of the world"

He stated they have no money to invest in the extra scouting and have already targeted scouting areas they believe in!

 

I kind of don’t blame them. Some very talented people in that part of the world, but also a very different style of football. 
 

I’d want to see how they fair in Europe first, personally. But obviously that then adds a premium to the price tag. 

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skintsaint

skintsaint

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Maybe we should judge them on their own merits, rather than writing off 420 million people because of Osvaldo, Delgado etc.

yep - still don't detract we haven't had the best track record with South American players though.

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Sheaf Saint

Sheaf Saint

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Maybe we should judge them on their own merits, rather than writing off 420 million people because of Osvaldo, Delgado etc.

This is true, of course, but you need to factor in the fact that they are taught to play a very different style of football to the EPL as they develop at youth level. Obviously there are some very talented players to have come out of South America over the years, but very few of them have ever been successful in the PL. 

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Mr Saints

Mr Saints

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Maybe we should judge them on their own merits, rather than writing off 420 million people because of Osvaldo, Delgado etc.

Agreed, there are millions of Marcelo Tejera’s just waiting to be lured to St Mary’s.

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Turkish

Turkish

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Posted
58 minutes ago, skintsaint said:

We don't have a great track record with South American players.

Have we ever even had a good one? Ramirez and Osvaldo were both obviously good players but not one wasn't suited to the league the other wanted to be in the Rolling Stones. I cant think of any that made the right impact.

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skintsaint

skintsaint

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Have we ever even had a good one? Ramirez and Osvaldo were both obviously good players but not one wasn't suited to the league the other wanted to be in the Rolling Stones. I cant think of any that made the right impact.

Delgado was another one with great hope with some sort of reputation...😄 Decent money for us at the time.

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sambosa75

sambosa75

Posted
Posted
On 11/04/2021 at 09:11, Matthew Le God said:

Brexit has made it easier than it was for us to buy non EU players and harder to buy EU players. We just don't have the scouting networks in place yet. It is now potentially easier for us to sign Brazilians or Argentines.

Just because you can sign a random kid from Gremio who turns out to be perfectly cut out for the Premier League at age 18 and is valued at £80m within 2 years on Football Manager, doesn't mean you can do it in real life.

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Ivan Katalinic's 'tache

Ivan Katalinic's 'tache

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We seem to do better with Scandanavian players, IMO, many of whom these days are now hoovered up by German and other continental European sides. Bringing them in from their own countries before they move to those leagues surely has to be a better bet than scouring South America where we don't know if the player will transition well to a very different style of football. I accept we've had the odd Stig Johansen or Vegard Forren but they didn't really break the bank in terms of transfer fee. I'm thinking Lundekvam, the two Svenssons, Ostenstad, Vestergaard, Hojbjerg, Ostlund and Stensgaard (ok, I'm joking about the last one) but I think you get my point.

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JustinSFC

JustinSFC

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Posted
51 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Maybe we should judge them on their own merits, rather than writing off 420 million people because of Osvaldo, Delgado etc.

Osvaldo didn't get a bad rap because he was shit as in Carillo shit, he got a bad rap because he was a nutter.

Given the straight choice between £19M on Carillo or £19M on Osvaldo, I'd take mature Osvaldo every single day of the week.

NB: This isn't a literal example and I wouldn't ordinarily spend that amount on either, but if a gun was pointed at my head and I had to pick one, it'd be Osvaldo. Personally.

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Toadhall Saint

Toadhall Saint

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Posted
45 minutes ago, JustinSFC said:

Osvaldo didn't get a bad rap because he was shit as in Carillo shit, he got a bad rap because he was a nutter.

Given the straight choice between £19M on Carillo or £19M on Osvaldo, I'd take mature Osvaldo every single day of the week.

NB: This isn't a literal example and I wouldn't ordinarily spend that amount on either, but if a gun was pointed at my head and I had to pick one, it'd be Osvaldo. Personally.

That’s cos it’s Osvaldo holding the gun. 😉

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