Things That are Racist

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

Aren't you pleased fhat it was properly dealt with and he resigned in disgrace before he was fired? Is this an example. Of a systemically racist and sexist society? 

To me Soggy seems a little bit too desperate about all this. Makes me think if there is some history he’s trying to make up for. 

[East Kent Saint]

53 minutes ago, Turkish said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEM4F6VrRf4

 

Yep, the leader of the BLM with her little band of followers chanting "f*ck the police" What does this have to do with the unfair treatment of black people? Also plenty of people chanting that during the summer protests too. The sooner the political element of BLM is outed for what they really are the better, unfortunately there are still a lot of people so desperate not to appear racist they wont have  bad word said about them

The protest against the police is about black people being killed by the police in America in various circumstances that would not usually happen if they were white. Police racism in the UK is not usually fatal but exists . It is quite in order to criticise elements of the BLM movement for undue violence or arson etc rather than condemn the whole of the BLM movement. 

 

 

[Weston Super Saint]

4 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Completely unacceptable behaviour. Reassuring that those in charge put steps in place to catch them and then sack them. Yet more good news that racism in the UK will not be tolerated in polite society and the workplace. Racists losing their jobs and having clear consequences for their actions will do far more for tackling this sort of thing than taking a knee at the football ever will. 

They've not been sacked...

They find out next month whether they will be sacked or not...

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

You seem more bothered by this than the behaviour against her? Why is that?

Have you ever heard the phrase 'it takes two to tango'?

I suspect 2,000 text messages can be considered as a tango don't you - unless you think he sent 2,000 text messages without getting one single response, in which case he should probably be put in a secure unit.

[Fan The Flames]

2 hours ago, Turkish said:

You seem more bothered about westies comments than the fact that this incident proves that there is zero tolerance of racism. Why is that? 

You say zero tolerance but that's not quiet true, in the Basingstoke incident it took a whilstle blower to get the force to look into a widely known out of control team. I know where I work I couldnt say any of those things with out a reprimand, that's zero tolerance. Maybe if they had more black people, gay people or women in higher positions this would not have got so far out of hand.

[Turkish]

21 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

You say zero tolerance but that's not quiet true, in the Basingstoke incident it took a whilstle blower to get the force to look into a widely known out of control team. I know where I work I couldnt say any of those things with out a reprimand, that's zero tolerance. Maybe if they had more black people, gay people or women in higher positions this would not have got so far out of hand.

However you spin it they’ve been investigated and dealt with. That article doesn’t say anything about it being widely know they were an out of control unit but a complaint was made and it was dealt with. Not really sure what more you can ask for.

[hypochondriac]

On 19/12/2020 at 13:42, Fan The Flames said:

You say zero tolerance but that's not quiet true, in the Basingstoke incident it took a whilstle blower to get the force to look into a widely known out of control team. I know where I work I couldnt say any of those things with out a reprimand, that's zero tolerance. Maybe if they had more black people, gay people or women in higher positions this would not have got so far out of hand.

Are you suggesting that the behaviour was widely known about prior to this complaint and was ignored? Seems like as soon as a complaint was made then the process was followed and they were dealt with. Surely that's a good thing? 

[sadoldgit]

On 19/12/2020 at 13:03, Weston Super Saint said:

Have you ever heard the phrase 'it takes two to tango'?

I suspect 2,000 text messages can be considered as a tango don't you - unless you think he sent 2,000 text messages without getting one single response, in which case he should probably be put in a secure unit.

Are you suggesting that the victim was encouraging the abuse? 

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

Are you suggesting that the victim was encouraging the abuse? 

What skeletons do you have hiding away soggy? There’s something a little bit too desperate about you

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

Are you suggesting that the victim was encouraging the abuse? 

Are you suggesting he sent over 2,000 text messages completely unsolicited and without any kind of response?

Reading between the lines I suspect, given that the 'relationship' lasted for over two years, that things were all rosy in the garden at the beginning, but then something happened to turn things 'sour' - probably her husband found out about the 'relationship'.  I imagine, at that point, she filed the complaint, after all, there is no mention of her reporting the issues in the previous two years.  But, that's just my guess and although highly unlikely, it could be wrong.

There are always two sides to every story, Soggy, but just like the Ched Evans case, you always seem very reluctant to consider that to be the case.

[whelk]

40 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Are you suggesting he sent over 2,000 text messages completely unsolicited and without any kind of response?

Reading between the lines I suspect, given that the 'relationship' lasted for over two years, that things were all rosy in the garden at the beginning, but then something happened to turn things 'sour' - probably her husband found out about the 'relationship'.  I imagine, at that point, she filed the complaint, after all, there is no mention of her reporting the issues in the previous two years.  But, that's just my guess and although highly unlikely, it could be wrong.

There are always two sides to every story, Soggy, but just like the Ched Evans case, you always seem very reluctant to consider that to be the case.

 

40 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Are you suggesting he sent over 2,000 text messages completely unsolicited and without any kind of response?

Reading between the lines I suspect, given that the 'relationship' lasted for over two years, that things were all rosy in the garden at the beginning, but then something happened to turn things 'sour' - probably her husband found out about the 'relationship'.  I imagine, at that point, she filed the complaint, after all, there is no mention of her reporting the issues in the previous two years.  But, that's just my guess and although highly unlikely, it could be wrong.

There are always two sides to every story, Soggy, but just like the Ched Evans case, you always seem very reluctant to consider that to be the case.

I suspect Tommy Robinson and Katie Hopkins were involved in some way

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Are you suggesting he sent over 2,000 text messages completely unsolicited and without any kind of response?

Reading between the lines I suspect, given that the 'relationship' lasted for over two years, that things were all rosy in the garden at the beginning, but then something happened to turn things 'sour' - probably her husband found out about the 'relationship'.  I imagine, at that point, she filed the complaint, after all, there is no mention of her reporting the issues in the previous two years.  But, that's just my guess and although highly unlikely, it could be wrong.

There are always two sides to every story, Soggy, but just like the Ched Evans case, you always seem very reluctant to consider that to be the case.

I’m seem to remember there was a case much closer to home which soggy is very animated about when it comes to not always believing what’s in the public domain. I’m surprised he’s so quick to be judge and jury on this incident given the history......

[skintsaint]

On 19/12/2020 at 20:50, East Kent Saint said:

The protest against the police is about black people being killed by the police in America in various circumstances that would not usually happen if they were white

Thought this was debunked months ago as statistically there are not?

Anyway, feel with this kneeling thing that everyone is a bit over it. Can't the mascot kids bring out a massive banner with 'kick racism out' or something similar when the teams come out/or warm up - which I'm sure no one would boo and would still get the same message out?

Out here the AFL has an indigenous round where all the teams put the message out and I've never heard an Aussie say anything bad about it. Considering Australia is at least 25 years behind in dealing with racism imo (some on here would be shocked if they think the UK is a racist society), would a round of fixtures showing solidarity of all races/religions work?

https://www.afl.com.au/news/486994/every-club-the-most-amazing-indigenous-jumpers-you-will-ever-see

 

[East Kent Saint]

5 hours ago, skintsaint said:

Thought this was debunked months ago as statistically there are not?

 

 

I never heard that , although my point was that was what their protest was about. If that was the case I would have thought the Trump regime would have been shouting it out loud and clear , although proberly not a thing to boast about !!

Here I said earlier , why did the players not do this under the Kick it out banner ??

[Turkish]

Strictly come dancing

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/dec/16/black-strictly-come-dancing

[Weston Super Saint]

Policing Black Lives Matter protests in Northern Ireland

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55399659

[AlexLaw76]

3 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Policing Black Lives Matter protests in Northern Ireland

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55399659

Bizarre

Edited 22 December, 2020 by AlexLaw76

[Fan The Flames]

On 20/12/2020 at 14:57, hypochondriac said:

Are you suggesting that the behaviour was widely known about prior to this complaint and was ignored? Seems like as soon as a complaint was made then the process was followed and they were dealt with. Surely that's a good thing? 

Yes it is a good thing. But from my experience they would have only gone to the effort of a covert investigation if a. the unit was way out of control or b. they were looking for something else.

I think you can read between the lines of what the intelligence office was saying. That sort of behaviour doesn't get that bad that quickly and it wouldn't have gone unnoticed.

Hampshire police can spin and if this sends out a signal then it's good. But I think it's naive to think that this was prompted by one complaint. My monies on they were looking for something else, but each to their own.

[whelk]

What did Cavani’s tweet say?

[Turkish]

20 minutes ago, whelk said:

What did Cavani’s tweet say?

It was a disgrace. He used the Spanish word for black, which is apparently not offensive in his native tongue but highly offensive in England. Having lived here for a month at the time he should have know this, the vile racist. 

[wadesmith]

If you’re coming over here...then you need to understand our culture...well that’s what the gammons having been telling me for years. Oh except if you use the word Negrito...then it can’t be helped..& how’s he supposed to know that’s racist? Gammon flakes in a nutshell.

[Turkish]

37 minutes ago, wadesmith said:

If you’re coming over here...then you need to understand our culture...well that’s what the gammons having been telling me for years. Oh except if you use the word Negrito...then it can’t be helped..& how’s he supposed to know that’s racist? Gammon flakes in a nutshell.

In the great, inclusive, multi-cultural society we have in Britain, surely if a word is not offensive, indeed in south American it's considered a friendly greeting, in another culture, why do we demand that non native English speakers who have only been here a matter of months have to immediately conform to what is acceptable in the English language? Not very inclusive or multi cultural is it. Surely it's actually a bit racist itself. 
 

so are you saying the gammons are right? He should know our lingo and culture before coming here?

Edited 1 January, 2021 by Turkish

[wadesmith]

11 minutes ago, Turkish said:

In the great, inclusive, multi-cultural society we have in Britain, surely if a word is not offensive, indeed in south American it's considered a friendly greeting, in another culture, why do we demand that non native English speakers who have only been here a matter of months have to immediately conform to what is acceptable in the English language? Not very inclusive or multi cultural is it. Surely it's actually a bit racist itself. 

You misunderstand. I think you've been brilliant! A foreigner has come over to this country..failed to engage or understand an aspect of our culture..and you've shown nothing but empathy, and understanding Salute to you my friend! F#cking hell we'll be calling you snowflake next! Great start to 2021! Keep it going!

[Turkish]

Just now, wadesmith said:

You misunderstand. I think you've been brilliant! A foreigner has come over to this country..failed to engage or understand an aspect of our culture..and you've shown nothing but empathy, and understanding Salute to you my friend! F#cking hell we'll be calling you snowflake next! Great start to 2021! Keep it going!

So you agree the FA were wrong to ban him? It was wrong for him to be labelled a racist? He didn’t do anything wrong?

[wadesmith]

1 minute ago, Turkish said:

So you agree the FA were wrong to ban him? It was wrong for him to be labelled a racist? He didn’t do anything wrong?

No I wanted him banned..but I'm still learning every day. Your previous post has given me much to consider.

[Turkish]

3 minutes ago, wadesmith said:

No I wanted him banned..but I'm still learning every day. Your previous post has given me much to consider.

great glad i was able to help, maybe next time you won’t be so hasty to judge. None of us are perfect but we can all try to be a better version of ourselves, pleased I can support you on that even in small way 

Edited 1 January, 2021 by Turkish

[AlexLaw76]

7 minutes ago, wadesmith said:

No I wanted him banned..

Oh  you are one of "those", aren't you 

[Turkish]

19 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Oh  you are one of "those", aren't you 

The problem for a lot of people who always want to appear to be on the right side of the argument is that, pardon the pun, it’s not black and white. The Cavani case is a classic example. On the face of it in English, it could be seen as racist, indeed if that tweet had been from an English player then he should rightly be banned and vilified. But it came from a non native English speaker, new to this country where in his culture it’s a perfectly innocent comment. 
 

so does that mean that the “gammons” were right and they should learn the lingo and our culture? That appears to be what is being implied here. Of course, they wont admit that so it’s now a really difficult position to be in. How can you criticise a foreign national for not knowing something acceptable in their culture isn’t acceptable in English culture yet still demand multi culturalism? 
If you believe in multi culturalism and acceptance you have to also accept that some cultures view things differently to ours, how ever much they won’t like it whilst also being quick to point out racism every chance you get. It’s a difficult tightrope to walk, no wonder they’re so angry all the time. 

Edited 1 January, 2021 by Turkish

[sadoldgit]

On 20/12/2020 at 19:07, Weston Super Saint said:

Are you suggesting he sent over 2,000 text messages completely unsolicited and without any kind of response?

Reading between the lines I suspect, given that the 'relationship' lasted for over two years, that things were all rosy in the garden at the beginning, but then something happened to turn things 'sour' - probably her husband found out about the 'relationship'.  I imagine, at that point, she filed the complaint, after all, there is no mention of her reporting the issues in the previous two years.  But, that's just my guess and although highly unlikely, it could be wrong.

There are always two sides to every story, Soggy, but just like the Ched Evans case, you always seem very reluctant to consider that to be the case.

I appreciate that there are two sides to every case Weston and look at them when forming an opinion as, I assume, most people do. People will also form different opinions.

As you brought the Evans case up again, the prosecution clearly have a duty to look carefully at what the defence are saying when making there case, so by definition look at both sides of the story. I agreed with the prosecution’s definition of what happened that night so I made that case here.

You will remember that Evans agreed that he performed a sex act on the victim, that he never met her before or after the incident and that he had no communication with her before during or after the sex act took place. 
 

The law is there to protect vulnerable people from those who would take advantage of them. The prosecution demonstrated that the women was intoxicated by drink/drugs, was barely able to walk, had no recollection of what happened that night and lost her handbag.

The law says that if you are incapacitated by drink/drugs you are not in a position to consent to sex.

Evans was found guilty of rape and served his sentence. His attempts at an appeal failed, one assumes because those looking at the appeals felt the conviction to be safe.

Adam’s partners family subsequently put up a large reward for people to come forward and provide “new evidence”. Two men came forward and provided evidence for money. The prosecution argued that the “new evidence” had no bearing on what happened in the hotel room that night (it is accepted that a persons sexual history should have no bearing on any current case). The judge overruled the prosecution and allowed the evidence of the two men to stand. One assumes their evidence tipped the balance in Evans favour as he was acquitted in the second trial.

The prosecution believed that Evans was guilty of rape because he had non consensual sex with this women. He says he believes it was consensual. Girls under 16 cannot consent to sex. People off their heads cannot consent to sex (and before we get into the argument about drunk married couples, these are two complete strangers who met briefly for this sex act).

So then, the prosecution looked at both sides of the story and went ahead with the case because they believed that she was in no position to consent. I agreed with their position having looked at the evidence available (which includes the evidence presented by Ched Evans of course).

Very experienced legal minds have pored over this case. You may not agree, but you can’t say that both sides of the story have not been considered by those who think that he was guilty.

Hopefully we can bury this subject finally now?

 

This one is for you Wes as I am about to use up my three posts. Are you going to start calling the virus the UK Variant now that is has mutated and you are fond of giving in a national label?

 

 

 

 

[Weston Super Saint]

Just a shame you didn't consider both sides of the story so vigorously during the second trial.  But, why would you, you'd already made your mind up.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Ched Evans was the victim of a gross miscarriage of justice.

 

I just hope Soggys new year resolution is to stfu about the case. 

[whelk]

If I was a footballer I would see absolutely no point in opening up my social media to anyone but friends and family.

I imagine Cavani regularly gets called a cunt by Scousers, Leeds Neanderthals and others so what do they get from it? Not lie they need to market their product like other celebs.

 

Edited 1 January, 2021 by whelk

[whelk]

If there was a derailing poster of the year it would have to go to SOG.

 

[Fan The Flames]

10 minutes ago, whelk said:

If there was a derailing poster of the year it would have to go to SOG.

 

and it's only the 1st Jan

[Lighthouse]

23 minutes ago, whelk said:

If I was a footballer I would see absolutely no point in opening up my social media to anyone but friends and family.

I imagine Cavani regularly gets called a cunt by Scousers, Leeds Neanderthals and others so what do they get from it? Not lie they need to market their product like other celebs.

 

I believe a lot of them have two, one public for generic PR and marketing stuff and the other personal, like the whole Rooney/Vardy saga.

 

Wasn’t it Darren Bent who’s publicist tweeted, "please tweet something like ‘great win today for the team, so proud of the lads, on to the next game!’" And didn’t bother to edit it?

[whelk]

25 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

and it's only the 1st Jan

Good point lots of derailment still to be done. Katie Hopkins blah blah blah

[whelk]

So 3 game ban for questionable tweet and Grealish drink drives like a cunt and not deemed to be related to football so no ban. 
 

[hypochondriac]

2 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Just a shame you didn't consider both sides of the story so vigorously during the second trial.  But, why would you, you'd already made your mind up.

Oh. My. God. Soggy is STILL prattling on about Ched Evans many years after he was acquitted and many years after he disgracefully threw out venemous slurs at those who believed his original conviction was dodgy like rape apologist. Not only has he never apologised for these things, he continues to make up things like suggesting that the process was dodgy with no evidence of that claim and all because he doesn't want to admit that he was entirely wrong. 

What a weirdo. 

[buctootim]

I struggle with the idea that obsessively stalking someone you consider to be a weirdo is somehow higher moral ground. Or even interesting for the rest of us 

[Lighthouse]

47 minutes ago, whelk said:

So 3 game ban for questionable tweet and Grealish drink drives like a cunt and not deemed to be related to football so no ban. 
 

The irony of the FA showing complete ignorance and intolerance of other cultures, so that they can slap a fine and a ban on Cavani is peak ‘wokeness’. There’s a wilful and deliberate ignoring of context which makes them look nothing short of incompetent. 

[Picard]

51 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

The irony of the FA showing complete ignorance and intolerance of other cultures, so that they can slap a fine and a ban on Cavani is peak ‘wokeness’. There’s a wilful and deliberate ignoring of context which makes them look nothing short of incompetent. 

Perhaps a player's home FA should judge such cases ,which would understand the context.

[Manuel]

6 minutes ago, Picard said:

Perhaps a player's home FA should judge such cases ,which would understand the context.

Good idea.  Or at least contact the home FA to get their view on the matter.  

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Lighthouse said:

The irony of the FA showing complete ignorance and intolerance of other cultures, so that they can slap a fine and a ban on Cavani is peak ‘wokeness’. There’s a wilful and deliberate ignoring of context which makes them look nothing short of incompetent. 

So let this be a lesson for all foreign players coming to England. We welcome all cultures but Make sure you have a in depth knowledge of English and language culture and don’t you dare behave in accordance with the culture in your own countries, even when speaking to people in your native language. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

Talking about it on sky now. Andy Cole saying that if you move to another country you have to embrace that culture & not your own. Funny that, because quite rightly Caribbean & Indian  immigrants assimilated into our society by the white brits adopting  aspects of their culture. Had they taken the Andy Cole advice music & food would be totally different now. I don’t believe Andy Cole would say the same about a Muslim moving to this country, no chance .
 

Both the black pundits said he’s not racist, so a 3 game ban seems rather excessive. 

Edited 1 January, 2021 by Lord Duckhunter

[Turkish]

12 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Talking about it on sky now. Andy Cole saying that if you move to another country you have to embrace that culture & not your own. Funny that, because quite rightly Caribbean & Indian  immigrants assimilated into our society by the white brits adopting  aspects of their culture. Had they taken the Andy Cole advice music & food would be totally different now. I don’t believe Andy Cole would say the same about a Muslim moving to this country, no chance .
 

Both the black pundits said he’s not racist, so a 3 game ban seems rather excessive. 

So the gammons/racists who say all foreigners should learn the lingo and adopt our culture were right all along? That’s not going to go down very well with those championing an inclusive multi cultural society. 

[hypochondriac]

2 hours ago, buctootim said:

I struggle with the idea that obsessively stalking someone you consider to be a weirdo is somehow higher moral ground. Or even interesting for the rest of us 

You have an odd definition of obsessively stalking as this is the first time I've mentioned or reacted to anything he's said in ages. Personally I'd consider your reply about my reply to be infinitely less interesting than anything I've written but each to their own. 

If soggy wants to drag up the time he embarrassed himself over ched Evans then ill be there to remind him of it. 

Edited 1 January, 2021 by hypochondriac

[Lighthouse]

2 hours ago, Turkish said:

So let this be a lesson for all foreign players coming to England. We welcome all cultures but Make sure you have a in depth knowledge of English and language culture and don’t you dare behave in accordance with the culture in your own countries, even when speaking to people in your native language. 

I just can’t fathom what they’re thinking. A couple of old fables spring to mind.

1. The emperors new clothes - It’s as if everyone on the FA disciplinary committee is ignoring the blatantly obvious; it wasn’t in any way a racist remark.
2. The boy who cried wolf - slowly fatigue and boredom will wear in and people will lose interest in the issues that really need tackling.

[whelk]

I would love to see the statistics of number black pundits on Sky before and after George Floyd.

Trying too hard IMO and the way Sky sensationalise this guff in social media is nauseating. Find SSN appalling these days anyway although of course with so little to discussed something on Instagram is huge breaking news to them.

Like Ole’s rebuff of the question too. Actually loving that Ole seems to be confounding the football intelligentsia who love to mock him while getting a hard on for Quique Snachez Flores and other good looking foreign coaches.

 

[hypochondriac]

11 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

I just can’t fathom what they’re thinking. A couple of old fables spring to mind.

1. The emperors new clothes - It’s as if everyone on the FA disciplinary committee is ignoring the blatantly obvious; it wasn’t in any way a racist remark.
2. The boy who cried wolf - slowly fatigue and boredom will wear in and people will lose interest in the issues that really need tackling.

They are just scared of not doing anything and then being called racist old white men. At least if they do something here they can point to that action as an example of when they acted.

[Weston Super Saint]

11 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

They are just scared of not doing anything and then being called racist old white men. At least if they do something here they can point to that action as an example of when they acted.

That's a bit harsh!  Four of them are women!