Saints vs Spurs - Match Thread

[OttawaSaint]

29 minutes ago, Hawkswood said:

Thats exactly it for me also. Im so tired of my club being run like a mickey mouse outfit. Ive had nearly 40 years of it. When I was younger I would become irate. These days I just shrug, feel completely apathetic Ive got more important things in my life to get more upset about ( altho it takes many years of frustration to get to that point). Im not asking or expecting my club to get out and blow billions, but like others have said, we knew our cm was leaving, surely any business/club run properly would think, yeah, we might need to strengthen there. How could something so blindingly obvious to everyone not be seized upon. And it happens time after time after time. Its honestly a bit embarrassing.

Yep. We just love to help other teams. As soon as a commentator says “player x hasn’t scored for 3 years” or “team y, still without an away win...” you just know we’ll bend over and lube up for them. 

[saint1977]

27 minutes ago, Hawkswood said:

Thats exactly it for me also. Im so tired of my club being run like a mickey mouse outfit. Ive had nearly 40 years of it. When I was younger I would become irate. These days I just shrug, feel completely apathetic Ive got more important things in my life to get more upset about ( altho it takes many years of frustration to get to that point). Im not asking or expecting my club to get out and blow billions, but like others have said, we knew our cm was leaving, surely any business/club run properly would think, yeah, we might need to strengthen there. How could something so blindingly obvious to everyone not be seized upon. And it happens time after time after time. Its honestly a bit embarrassing.

Yep, similar to me. There’s so many things I really want to do again when COVID is more manageable but I’m afraid going to back to pay £40 for more tripe isn’t one of them. Pellegrino season was the final straw, £125 at least to attend from the SW and far better and more enjoyable things I can be doing instead. The people that run and own the club couldn’t give a stuff about today’s result as long the club finishes 17th at the end of the season. Ralph clearly hurting but has to look at himself as he did v Leicester, plan for the tools you do have, shit as they mostly are. High line has to go.

[IronCitySaint]

Glad I didn't bother waking up at 7am for that. And congratulations to our clubs hierarchy for winning the new season bumbling incompetence award again this year - five years in a row now I think. Great job by all.

[Hawkswood]

17 minutes ago, OttawaSaint said:

Yep. We just love to help other teams. As soon as a commentator says “player x hasn’t scored for 3 years” or “team y, still without an away win...” you just know we’ll bend over and lube up for them. 

Yup, absolutely. Youre just waiting for it to happen.

[saint1977]

21 minutes ago, IronCitySaint said:

Glad I didn't bother waking up at 7am for that. And congratulations to our clubs hierarchy for winning the new season bumbling incompetence award again this year - five years in a row now I think. Great job by all.

Yeah, hopefully that plank that ‘owned’ Bordeaux doesnt takeover but someone else more capable urgently does. They need to make savings on posts at Exec and scouting levels, clearer decision-making lines. Keep the non-playing side leaner. People keep on praising Semmens but he’s overseen an appalling and complacent close season so he can go. 

[Whitey Grandad]

One crumb of comfort for me. Having paid for two season tickets and being prevented from attending this game I assume that I will get a refund for it. Could this be the first time that I get my money back after watching a crap performance?

[Wes Tender]

As we can't watch the match live in the stadium, there really is no point in playing attractive to watch, gung-ho attacking football. What is needed is boring, reliable solid defence, hard to beat, win by a single goal football. We have an attack that looks effective, but a defence that is easy to beat, who don't play well together, don't have an understanding of each other, backed by a keeper who doesn't inspire confidence. If Salisu is any good when he is ready, who would he replace? Stephens and Bednarek look equally incompetent. Vestergaard is no better.

When Son proved himself to be the main outlet for Spurs, why on earth didn't we put somebody to mark him out of gaining possession?

Until we get the defence drilled to be more leak resistant, why not revert to a back three? Somebody in between Stephens and Bednarek, where Son had acres of space, might have actually dispossessed him once or twice. With three in the middle, we can push up the full backs when in possession to give a five man midfield, and withdraw them to block the flanks when we are under attack.

If we play a high line, that is all well and good if you can win the ball high up the pitch and then make good use of it. If you lack the players with pace in the midfield to get back into good defensive positions if you are hit on the break, then you are going to get punished. When we had our run of great results at the tail end of last season, we achieved it by winning the balls in midfield and high up the pitch, and then closing down the passes out of defence.  We have stopped doing it.

Armstrong made a good contribution with Djenepo giving service to Ings and Adams, who also did well. I don't think that Redmond was particularly missed and that he would have changed much had he played. We lost some bite when we took off Romeu, and Smallbone isn't a suitable replacement IMO. Nor does Tella add anything significant. Long would have added the midfield bite for Romeu, and also the pace that might have helped the defence too, but it seems that Hasenhuttl wants to give the youngsters a run out in preference to shoring up the scoreline.

[northam soul]

I thought it was the mayor’s responsibility to give people the freedom of the city.

[Whitey Grandad]

One crumb of comfort for me. Having paid for two season tickets and being prevented from attending this game I assume that I will get a refund for it. Could this be the first time that I get my money back after watching a crap performance?

[captainchris]

5 hours ago, stknowle said:

He fucked about with or line ups and formations like this at the start of last season. We all know where that led us. Quite why the fuck he’s experimenting again is totally beyond me. Oh, and our options off the bench are fucking embarrassing. I don’t ever expect to see Will Smallbone come on to the pitch and change a game for us.

Ralph is just a bit cocky at times and thinks it’s all about his whims... 

Beginning to think he just doesn’t see the whole picture tactically during a game otherwise he WOULD have made adjustments after 20 mins or at least at half time.

To play a third game after the first two high line games were so poor is madness, what exactly did Ralph expect! 

Ralph not filling people with confidence at the moment or I fear the players too.... 
 

 

[Archers Road Stand]

That 2nd half was on par with the Leicester game. Ralph can take full responsibility for it. 

We struggled with the high line last weekend against Crystal Palace and today we had a massive let off with the disallowed goal inside the opening 5 minutes. Ralph did not react to this and the 5 goals we conceded were an utter embarrassment. Spurs won't have an easier win all season. 

We'll be down there this season because we have two very poor CBs, a piss poor CM in Romeu and a goalkeeper who is not a sweeper keeper. We are going to be on the end of a fair few hidings unless we make some decent signings for the system or Ralph ditches it. 

 

Thus far, another failed transfer window from this club. We knew PEH was off months before it happened but here we are with Romeu as our first choice CM with Smallbone as backup. We basically had 10 men on the pitch with Smallbone playing, he is nowhere near Premier League level at the moment. 

[Toussaint]

5 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

That maybe the case, but the centre halves need to manage the game properly and think for themselves. Proper players won’t just accept that, they’ll dig into the midfield, giving them clog till they do their fucking jobs, and they’ll also think for themselves and drop when there’s no pressure on the ball. They’ll also challenge the manager, winners like Roy Keane & VvD wouldn’t have put up with that. What are they doing, just blindly following the managers instructions to the letter, even if it costs us time and time again. I hope senior players got into Ralph afterwards, but I doubt they’ve got the balls. Sums up our lot, bunch of son in laws. 

I get the impression that standing up to Ralph isn’t an option,  he strikes me as the “my way or the highway” type.

[st alex]

1 hour ago, captainchris said:

Ralph is just a bit cocky at times and thinks it’s all about his whims... 

Beginning to think he just doesn’t see the whole picture tactically during a game otherwise he WOULD have made adjustments after 20 mins or at least at half time.

To play a third game after the first two high line games were so poor is madness, what exactly did Ralph expect! 

Ralph not filling people with confidence at the moment or I fear the players too.... 
 

 

Didn't we dominate the first half? Spurs hadn't had a touch in our box until first half stoppage time.

[doggface]

Playing a line that high is a suicide mission with McCarthy and that defence.  
If RH couldn’t see it against palace then that’s a worry, if he couldn’t see it vs brentford reserves that is a huge worry, if he couldn’t see it for a 3rd time vs a slightly struggling spurs side then he needs his head checked.
This team have proved more than capable if they are ultra fit and play to their strengths.  Just like the start of last season, RH stubbornness will be his downfall.  
Unless he gives up trying to make McCarthy Xavi and a defence pushed up to the halfway line soon, we will be going down this time.

[Jeremy]

I hope management reads this thread as there's a ton of genuine, and legitimate, criticism and disappointment on here from loyal and reasonable supporters (not whinging idiots) who are just the tip of the iceberg. What I'm reading between the lines is that there's an infinite difference between losing but trying to do your best on the day (acceptable) and putting in a performance that disrespects the proud history of the club, its supporters and the wider city that hosts the Club.

The Club doesn't have to be a world beater, but it has to have demonstrable guts.

That's what any supporter of any team wants to see.

Edited 20 September, 2020 by Jeremy

[Roo1976]

 

Seems like were useless until the point of no return every season .Was expecting (and still time for) a decent season considering what happened just over 8 weeks ago.

Palace game was so frustrating considering they had a makeshift back 4 and seemingly lacking firepower infront of goal,but we somehow manage to find a way to pull of

a woeful display that lacked intensity and purpose. Now on another day Che Adams would have already scored 2 in 2 but for some sublime saves and or bad luck infront of goal,

if this was last season hed be benched for the next few games and given a cameo roll for about 5-6 minutes including added time to try and prove his worth. Is there truly no 

funds left for the owner to give to the club this time round. Fuck me Les and that hockey supporting twat did us no favours buying bang average tripe and giving them extortionate wages,

which is a stumbling block on further team improvements. Its exasperating at times supporting Saints ,they can somehow fuck your whole weekend up in just 90 mins or less.Our bench has no game changers that are worth  a 1st team tryout.Whats happened to Simms, Slattery, Ferry?............they should be at best challenging for a  first team regular spot or as i susspect they already make avery very good living just doing what they do right now,NOTHING. AH WELL  until next time rant overish.

[CylonKing]

HOW ARE CRYSTAL PALACE DOING SO SHITTIN WELL WITH WOY! Shirley it is not THAT simple? I Love Saints but it is the same every new season. The last time I remember a good start to the season was under WGS, as we won a game.

[skintsaint]

Get big Sam in. Would rather win ugly than suffer this shit all season. I haven't seen a beating like that since someone stuffed bananas down my trousers and set a Monkey loose.

[CylonKing]

Woy: Stick it to Wilfred, he'll do the rest! We've never heard of that sort of tactic before. 

[Scully]

Stick it to Ings?

[CylonKing]

Bluegh and feeling sick, apologies folks.

[Turkish]

10 hours ago, st alex said:

Didn't we dominate the first half? Spurs hadn't had a touch in our box until first half stoppage time.

Apart from the two occasions they cut through us like a knife through butter and had the ball in the net but disallowed due to marginal offsides you mean? Not like the warning signs were there was it. 

[Convict Colony]

A good article on this in the atheletic this morning by Dan Sheldon.

A brief snippet from it from Ralph before our game on Sun.

“I think it was a way of defending which we want to do in the future,” Southampton’s manager explained. “In the first two games, I didn’t think we gave too many chances away. It looked more critical than it was.

“You can be sure that we will always find the right balance of defending high and the position we need to adapt to every opponent. That’s the reason we have to be flexible in this part. Against some opponents, it can be helpful if we are a little bit higher.”

Edited 21 September, 2020 by Convict Colony

[S-Clarke]

1 hour ago, Convict Colony said:

A good article on this in the atheletic this morning by Dan Sheldon.

A brief snippet from it from Ralph before our game on Sun.

“I think it was a way of defending which we want to do in the future,” Southampton’s manager explained. “In the first two games, I didn’t think we gave too many chances away. It looked more critical than it was.

“You can be sure that we will always find the right balance of defending high and the position we need to adapt to every opponent. That’s the reason we have to be flexible in this part. Against some opponents, it can be helpful if we are a little bit higher.”

You can't play that way of defending with the players and midfielders we have! Do it when we have better players in those positions (who are quicker/more mobile) but not when we're relying on Romeu, Stephens and Bedernak to provide the last line of defence. It really is suicide and he must see something in training from the existing players to suggest they can play that way, as I can't understand it otherwise.

[Mr Saints]

1 hour ago, Convict Colony said:

A good article on this in the atheletic this morning by Dan Sheldon.

A brief snippet from it from Ralph before our game on Sun.

“I think it was a way of defending which we want to do in the future,” Southampton’s manager explained. “In the first two games, I didn’t think we gave too many chances away. It looked more critical than it was.

“You can be sure that we will always find the right balance of defending high and the position we need to adapt to every opponent. That’s the reason we have to be flexible in this part. Against some opponents, it can be helpful if we are a little bit higher.”

Jesus wept

[Turkish]

2 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

A good article on this in the atheletic this morning by Dan Sheldon.

A brief snippet from it from Ralph before our game on Sun.

“I think it was a way of defending which we want to do in the future,” Southampton’s manager explained. “In the first two games, I didn’t think we gave too many chances away. It looked more critical than it was.

“You can be sure that we will always find the right balance of defending high and the position we need to adapt to every opponent. That’s the reason we have to be flexible in this part. Against some opponents, it can be helpful if we are a little bit higher.”

Lets hope this Salisu fella is good because all playing this way does is how how sh*t the others are.

[Convict Colony]

Short term pain for long term gain.

Like all tactics, learning requires failure and we have learnt a lot from yesterday, both in our pressing and tactical application.

If we get a ready made pressing midfielder, slot in Salisu and the other players learn the movements better then I expect more goals for and less against.

[Teddeer]

This situation reminds me of the film Moneyball so here's hoping a run of defeats is followed by a record breaking run of victories.

[Donatello]

Question: was the high-line in any way responsible for how good we looked attacking during the first half? 

[badgerx16]

52 minutes ago, Donatello said:

Question: was the high-line in any way responsible for how good we looked attacking during the first half? 

Probably, but Spurs were poor yet still managed 2 "goals", and at half time Jose corrected their midfield and set them up to exploit our lack of awareness snd mobility at CB. Other teams can now look at that second half and start matches playing in that way if we persist with the high line.

[sadoldgit]

10 hours ago, skintsaint said:

Get big Sam in. Would rather win ugly than suffer this shit all season. I haven't seen a beating like that since someone stuffed bananas down my trousers and set a Monkey loose.

Two games in and the Get Big Sam in card has been played already. Must be a record?

[BallBoy]

I have learned to live with defeat. It's the humiliation that really hurts.

[Forester]

Firstly the game.  As many others have mentioned we looked set up to fail given high line and Spurs’ strength which Mourinho ruthlessly exploited in half time talk.  It seems that Ralph is trying to adapt, but without a proper pre-season to practice and you have to question why you would want to change much from what was top four form after lockdown.  Yesterday was identical team to that successful period bar Redmond for Djenepro, who I actually thought had a good attacking game but did not work as hard defensively as Redmond usually does.
 

The big positive is that we created much more than the first two games and on another day could have scored five goals.  So other than finishing not too much to tweak there.  The irony is that if there is one team in the league where a high line makes clear sense it is Burnley, as you don’t want to be defending long  balls at edge of your box.  So let’s hope with a full uninterrupted weak of training Ralph sorts it out.

 

If you look at the Ralph era as a whole it’s either been feast or famine, but with an overall trend of improvement so he has deserved backing and time to sort things out in my view.  

[East Kent Saint]

Kane said he didn't even have to look up to see where Son was he just put the ball past our high line .

[Sarnia Cherie]

22 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

That maybe the case, but the centre halves need to manage the game properly and think for themselves. Proper players won’t just accept that, they’ll dig into the midfield, giving them clog till they do their fucking jobs, and they’ll also think for themselves and drop when there’s no pressure on the ball. They’ll also challenge the manager, winners like Roy Keane & VvD wouldn’t have put up with that. What are they doing, just blindly following the managers instructions to the letter, even if it costs us time and time again. I hope senior players got into Ralph afterwards, but I doubt they’ve got the balls. Sums up our lot, bunch of son in laws. 

Think for themselves. That's it in a nutshell. Ralph may have told them to play like this, who knows, because he doesn't seem to be owning up to it. Son & Kane sussed out our tactics very early on and took full advantage of it. There was no time in those 90+ minutes when our players thought for themselves and changed things to try to stop the rot. Why is that? Is Ralph's law sacred?  Are they scared of his reaction if they don't play his way? Think they will be dropped if they disagree with him? Because if that's the case and Ralph sticks to this suicidal method of play we are in deep, deep trouble. 

[Harry_SFC]

32 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

Think for themselves. That's it in a nutshell. Ralph may have told them to play like this, who knows, because he doesn't seem to be owning up to it. Son & Kane sussed out our tactics very early on and took full advantage of it. There was no time in those 90+ minutes when our players thought for themselves and changed things to try to stop the rot. Why is that? Is Ralph's law sacred?  Are they scared of his reaction if they don't play his way? Think they will be dropped if they disagree with him? Because if that's the case and Ralph sticks to this suicidal method of play we are in deep, deep trouble. 

Plenty of teams play with a high line, but they have practiced it and have the quality of player for it. I actually think these tactics are the way forward (against most teams in the league) and will help us with our home form, IF we sign a defensive midfielder, a goalkeeper and Salisu lives up to expectations. Admittedly there are a lot of if's there.

I think this is why Ralph was so annoyed about the international break just before the start of the season. The players haven't learnt the system properly. 

[Saint Keef]

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

[Hawkswood]

1 hour ago, Saint Keef said:

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

No shooting down here. All fair points for me.

[UpweySaint]

1 hour ago, Saint Keef said:

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

Fair points well made. I do understand a lot of the pessimism but you do wonder how some on here get out of bed in the mornings!

 

If we're still struggling for points seven or eight games in I'll panic/resign myself to this being our year (we can't say it's not been coming with the drift post Koeman/Poch/Nige). Ralph being able to get one or two new faces in would hopefully lift the mood for all concerned. We all now we're short, particularly in CM.

[bangkoksaint]

1 hour ago, Saint Keef said:

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

Absolutely ..........fair points made. Out of interest however did you cut and paste from a comment made probably every season for as long as I can remember? It’s just that every season it’s like bloody Groundhog Day!!

[Shroppie]

1 hour ago, Saint Keef said:

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

I'm with you.

And I'll accept that now is the time for Ralph to look at new ideas, like the high line. I think he's close to saying we don't have the personnel to do it yet (hint re incoming players?) and the players have to know when to push up and when not to.

[derry]

That was a bit of historical deja-vu. Pochetinno had a good start with his high press and we were going well. Then Villa turned up and put Benteke up front hitting balls up and over the top so we conceded and lost easily. 

Its no good having weak players (Smallbone) in a pressing game. It was a gift to Spurs pushing both full backs upfield and two slow square dithering center backs without the wit to realise they had to get goal side of Son if he stayed onside. Even the equaliser in the 48th minute was a clusterfuck. We knew there were only seconds left how incompetent can you get then repeat it all the second half . More than one person needs a kick up the backside.

[Charlie Wayman]

3 hours ago, Saint Keef said:

I may be swimming against the tide of opinion here, but let's see where we are after 10 games before we panic, wet the bed and slit our wrists. Forget the Brentford game.

So far in the premiership we lost by an odd goal away to Crystal Palace. That could have been a draw but for their MoM - the goalkeeper. And remember, in their second game this weekend they pretty much demolished Man U at Old Trafford 1-3. Whether we like it or not, Palace are a well organised decent team. Against a team like that, we win some we lose some.

In our second game, we play Tottenham, a team who are (I don't know the figures) probably 10 times richer than us, Champions League finalists 2 years ago, who can afford £42m for two full backs (Doherty &  Regulon), £42m in midfield (Le Celso and, don't ask me why... Hojbjerg) who can afford to bring in Gareth Bale, and have two of the most potent strikers in Europe (Kane & Son) and love him or hate him managed by one of the most successful managers in the modern era.  By comparison we are struggling to raise something like £4m for Boufal and looking to offload the likes of Carrillo and Hoedt.  Whether we like it or not, we bought "duds". We can't change that now. In short, Spurs are in a different league to us financially. We beat Spurs last year, but that isn't going to happen very often. So enjoy it when it happens but don't get too hung up about it when we get beaten by them. We'll never be in their financial ball park unless some incredible take over occurs. We have to accept that. Yes, Ralph may need to look at the tactics but seeing someone calling for Big Sam on here......please.....after 2 games.....really?

So let's see where we are when we've played the teams nearer to us in terms of finances, ambition, size of club, etc etc. Let's see where we are when we've played the likes of Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Burnley, Fulham, West Ham,  Newcastle, Brighton.....etc.  We'll win some, draw some and lose some, that's where we are. Some of those teams have started brightly but as always, some will fade. I think Everton and Palace may have moved up a gear. I think once we've settled we'll nick the odd points from other teams as well.

No doubt I'll get shot down in flames on here, but just saying.....no need to panic yet.  If we're in the bottom three after playing that lot....shoot me then!

Not completely swimming against the tide. Even Ralph Hasenhuttl is not a complete idiot and will soon ditch this new plan A when he has to face more unpalatable evidence that it is not working, like a few more 5-0 hidings. The worse thing that could happen next is that we beat Burnley 1-0 using this system, a result that will reinforce RH's self-belief that he is barking up the right tree and so should press on.

At times in the first half against Spurs when pressing forward we seemed to be regaining some of the "automatism" that he was so passionate about last season and it was a joy to watch so there are grounds for optimism that we can recover from the recent setbacks quite quickly. What our new tinkerman needs to learn is if it ain't broke then don't try to fix it.

[skintsaint]

13 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

Two games in and the Get Big Sam in card has been played already. Must be a record?

Tbf its been three games...and was more tongue in cheek 😁

[Vancouver Saint]

On 20/09/2020 at 16:52, skintsaint said:

Get big Sam in. Would rather win ugly than suffer this shit all season. I haven't seen a beating like that since someone stuffed bananas down my trousers and set a Monkey loose.

Never. I'd rather get relegated.

[Vancouver Saint]

The game turned on a huge defensive error from McCarthy not coming out to block or clear the ball - he had already shown his indecisiveness earlier - surely he MUST have been briefed to play sweeper-keeper to support the high line?!

Instead of deservedly going in at half-time 1-0 up after a good display, we went in completely deflated and back to square one after shooting ourselves in the foot (again).

McCarthy and our defensive back line is simply not good enough. I like Walker-Peters but he is better going forward than defending. We cannot defend corners, or even get a head on the ball. 

That said, Ralph's inability / unwillingness to drop the high line...was he sacrificing this game to send a message to the board about players or what?...was unforgivable.

Son is a brilliant player and it was fish in a barrel for him.

Embarrassing.

Any opposing Manager vs Saints..'forget the high press...punt a long ball over the back four to run onto to (if you have fast attackers)...or punt a ball into the box (if you've got no speed but big muscle) - easy. 

[Charlie Wayman]

4 hours ago, Vancouver Saint said:

 

McCarthy and our defensive back line is simply not good enough. I like Walker-Peters but he is better going forward than defending. We cannot defend corners, or even get a head on the ball. 

 

Didn't this same useless defence keep a clean sheet against Man City a few weeks ago?