Saints 2-3 Wolves - Sigh...

[Vancouver Saint]

How it goes sometimes. If we'd got the draw we deserved the whole tenor on here would have been different. Just watched Newcastle absolutely steal a win against Chelsea...only one team looked like winning that for 93+ minutes. Newcastle defended heroically but all the creation was Chelsea...outshot Newcastle 3 to 1 and 70% possession...lost to a 'punt it in there' hail Mary. Just how it goes sometimes.

[Morse]

 

Anyone else think we are giving away teams a big advantage having their supporters behind our goal...especially when they attack that end in the second half?

Yes. We should be shooting towards the Northam second half. And the away support should be put into the corner.

[LVSaint]

Thought we played ok against a much better team. We were weirdly clinical in the first half and 2-0 flattered us a bit.

 

Gave away 3 avoidable goals in the second half but we weren't completely outplayed or anything.

 

Wolves have some very good players. No disgrace to lose to them at all.

 

This. At 2-0 up I didn't expect the end result, both teams playing well, but wolves always capable of scoring as they're a better team. I still don't think we need panic buys in this window, if that's what they're going to be. See the season out, finish respectably and hopefully by then we have an effective recruitment plan in place and try to shed the deadwood.

[Nordic Saint]

Yes. We should be shooting towards the Northam second half. And the away support should be put into the corner.

 

Yes, Wolves fans won a few decisions for their team today. Foe example, the ref wasn't going to give Ward-Prowse a yellow card but then you could see him change his mind after the Wolves fans roared for it. Sadly, we don't have any noisy fans behind the goal at either end who can influence the referee.

[Trout-Tickler]

According to the beeb, since the start of last season we've dropped 42 points from leading positions in the Premier League, 13 more than any other side.

[Nordic Saint]

Had a sneaky feeling this was going to be 2-3. Wish I'd put money on it. When we were 2 up at half time a colleague said "You're 2 up, that's your prediction out of the window". I laughed and said "Saints are the masters of throwing away a lead. They'll probably lose 2-3".

 

I was busy and didn't get chance to check how the 2nd half was going. At full time I saw the score, showed it to my work mate and he just stared at the screen, open mouthed. I told him to go home and look at how many times Saints have lost from a leading position this season.

 

What were the odds at half-time against Wolves winning? 500/1? 1000/1? It is incredibly rare for a team winning 2-0 at home to lose a game.

[SNSUN]

What were the odds at half-time against Wolves winning? 500/1? 1000/1? It is incredibly rare for a team winning 2-0 at home to lose a game.

 

I checked, Wolves were 28-1 to win at half time on Ladbrokes

[Ed Rooney]

You do talk a load of tosh mate. Cedric was by far our best player today. One bad result and off you go...

 

apart from being at fault for all 3 goals from ball watching and not recognising where the danger was, yeah he was ace

[Shroppie]

What were the odds at half-time against Wolves winning? 500/1? 1000/1? It is incredibly rare for a team winning 2-0 at home to lose a game.

Not that rare.

 

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[Shroppie]

I'd agree with Ralph's assessment that the pen should have been reviewed by the ref and the third goall probably came after handball by Traore

 

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[Shroppie]

apart from being at fault for all 3 goals from ball watching and not recognising where the danger was, yeah he was ace

A bizarre, ridiculous and utterly wrong analysis.

 

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[davefizzy14]

I'd agree with Ralph's assessment that the pen should have been reviewed by the ref and the third goall probably came after handball by Traore

 

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Yeah absolutely this. The ref was rubbish today and we were left hard done by. We deserved at least a draw today. Hit the woodwork twice too. If Shane's header goes in we win 3-0, fine margins. Onwards and Upwards

[trousers]

Just got back in from a long day out, well away from football!

 

Meh... Had a hunch that we'd lose a game the moment expectations were raised. Hey ho.

 

Why is football so annoying? How can a side go from being one of the best teams in the land over the last 10 games to back to being poor again (if the assessment of our performance today from the Saintsweb Intelligentsia is anything to be relied upon).

 

Still... most, if not all, other results seem to have been kind to us, so no major damage done. I guess it remains to be seen if this is just a blip or a longer term return to our form during the first quarter of the season.

 

Football, eh?

Edited 18 January, 2020 by trousers

[Ed Rooney]

A bizarre, ridiculous and utterly wrong analysis.

 

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suggest you watch the goals again

1. The danger was the nearest person to him which he went to but then stopped and then didn’t close the shot down quick enough

2. Again the danger was the player he was actually covering until he decided to move away to an area redmond had covered

3. Completely ball watching and unaware of his surroundings, basically just ran as fast as he could back without even checking his shoulder

[derry]

I'd noticed previously that we got our best results with our possession in the forties because we played less passes and more direct. In the first half we had 49% possession/passes and two goals up. In the second half we played more passing, slowed our game down and were fairly easily held by Wolves. The interesting thing to me was that in the second half we had 57% of the possession and conceded three goals. Wolves played more direct pulled us onto them as we passed our way forward and hit their frontmen missing out our midfield and exposed our centre backs and the full backs struggling to get back. We were playing short and relatively short from the back and lost to the Wolves press up front.

 

In the second half we were back into the old problems playing at home. We paid the price of a high line and Kamikaze defending. Just before Wolves goal Stephens pretty much summed it up, under no pressure he had the ball, instead of hitting deep into the Wolves back line he chipped it into midfield where it was gobbled up by Wolves, a quick counter attack and it's in our net completely changing the game. There was no leadership or awareness on the field and none from the management. We don't need possession to win matches. the more we have the more vulnerable we are. Wolves held tight and hit us directly. If we had continued to put the ball up front quickly the defence wouldn't have been exposed. It was trying to play passing football that exposed us. We have to cut this out and stay direct.

[Shroppie]

suggest you watch the goals again

1. The danger was the nearest person to him which he went to but then stopped and then didn’t close the shot down quick enough

2. Again the danger was the player he was actually covering until he decided to move away to an area redmond had covered

3. Completely ball watching and unaware of his surroundings, basically just ran as fast as he could back without even checking his shoulder

I was actually at the game and won't have the option of rewatching goals until tomorrow, since I won't be home until midnight.

 

No point in arguing anyway since you've made up your mind. Overall Cedric played well.

 

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[Whitey Grandad]

That's largely rubbish. Neither Stephens nor Hojbjerg had bad games. It would be good to get something at Palace but not critical.

 

But I am annoyed that some slack defending cost us.

 

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I’ve just seen the highlights (thanks Wes) and there was nothing wrong with any of their three goals but what the hell was Stephens doing for that penalty? That decision alone cost us the game and Cedric had the ball covered.

 

He was ball watching for their goals and was back to the Tephens we all know, sad to say.

[JRM]

We aren’t going to win every game whether on a good run or not. The way we lost was the most annoying part, but as a few more realistic posters have said, no shame in losing to that Wolves team.

 

Pretty much every other result went our way which was a bit of luck. We won’t be getting relegated but a few need to calm down about top half finishes.

 

Agree.

 

Reality check, reminds us defensively we're shaky, home form still poor, hopefully we don't go on a run of bad results now.

[sammysaint93]

Great day out for the Wolves fans. You shouldn’t give up a 2 goal lead against any team at home. I think Wolves are a very good team and I’d have taken a point from today all day long, I hope this doesn’t dent their confidence in any way.

[Heisenberg]

I checked, Wolves were 28-1 to win at half time on Ladbrokes

 

30-1 on Bet365 and went to 33-1 before they made it 2-1

 

I went with X2

[Chez]

Not that rare.

 

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I've never seen us do it. The only game I can recall was Preston away back in the McGoldrick days, and that was one of the only flipping away games I missed that season.

[Heisenberg]

Chelsea did it to us couple seasons back. We went 2-0 up around 60 Mins and I remember chucking a cheeky 100 on Chelsea. They smashed in 3 in 7 minutes and could have won 2-8 by full time

[John Boy Saint]

Made a change not to walk out of St Mary's after a loss looking for the cat to kick.

Hope it is just a reality check, other results made ours a hiccup. Weirdly I thought when JWP got his yellow we lost a little in midfield.

[sammysaint93]

Chelsea did it to us couple seasons back. We went 2-0 up around 60 Mins and I remember chucking a cheeky 100 on Chelsea. They smashed in 3 in 7 minutes and could have won 2-8 by full time

 

You must be buzzing every time we lose, because every time we do lose you post about your insurance bet you’ve put on, very weird behaviour betting against your own team and never actually proving it

[stevy777_x]

You must be buzzing every time we lose, because every time we do lose you post about your insurance bet you’ve put on, very weird behaviour betting against your own team and never actually proving it

 

Thing is he doesn't gloat about it when he loses a bet. And i m sure he s lost more through bets than winning overall.

[VectisSaint]

I’ve just seen the highlights (thanks Wes) and there was nothing wrong with any of their three goals but what the hell was Stephens doing for that penalty? That decision alone cost us the game and Cedric had the ball covered.

 

He was ball watching for their goals and was back to the Tephens we all know, sad to say.

Nothing wrong with any of the goals, you are kidding. What the hell was PEH doing strolling back into the pen area arm in the air for their 3rd. He could easily have cut out the cut back. As usual our midfield (usually PEH) cost us. The 2nd goal wasn't even a pen according to the ref. When we lose it is usually because the midfield go missing, and so it was again today. Do wish we had someone to replace PEH, he is a complete liability.

Still, Wolves are a good side, a point today would have been very good.

[cloggy saint]

Thing is he doesn't gloat about it when he loses a bet. And i m sure he s lost more through bets than winning overall.

 

What I don't understand is his need to share details of his gambling problem. Is anyone even vaguely interested?

[Saint Billy]

Ings doesn't score we lose, we are reliant on one player.

 

Lots of space given by us at the back not helped by midfield not covering. It's fekin obvious we need a couple of players in the window but if rumours are to believed our hierarchy disagree......... Idiots.

[Shroppie]

Ings doesn't score we lose, we are reliant on one player.

 

Lots of space given by us at the back not helped by midfield not covering. It's fekin obvious we need a couple of players in the window but if rumours are to believed our hierarchy disagree......... Idiots.

How do you work that out? Bednarek and Long score: should have been enough.

 

Agreed the defence was sloppy today. Just needs to be a wake up call.

 

 

 

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[Nordic Saint]

Ings doesn't score we lose, we are reliant on one player.

 

 

 

I watched Kelvin Davis conducting the pre-match shooting practice. The best, surprisingly, was Bertrand; the worst by far was Che Adams. He really looked as though he doesn't know how to shoot. His shots were weak and off target. If Kelvin himself had been shooting, he couldn't have done any worse.

[Dusic]

Suprised by a lot of the over reactions here, given our recent form.

 

For me we were quite fortunate to be 2-0 up at HT. Wolves were the only team in the game until our first goal and were pretty comfortable for most of the first half without creating a lot.

 

Second half, Jimenez and Traore killed us with their physicality, which they have done to better teams than us, whilst we know our defenders have a weakness against powerful forward one ve one. Good tactical shift by Nuno to get Traore further up the pitch - he is unplayable at times.

 

We have had a great run, but are far from a great team, which we all know.

 

Need to get something against Palace otherwise our good run will likely become 3 league defeats in a row post Liverpool.

[Nordic Saint]

Suprised by a lot of the over reactions here, given our recent form.

 

For me we were quite fortunate to be 2-0 up at HT. Wolves were the only team in the game until our first goal and were pretty comfortable for most of the first half without creating a lot.

 

Second half, Jimenez and Traore killed us with their physicality, which they have done to better teams than us, whilst we know our defenders have a weakness against powerful forward one ve one. Good tactical shift by Nuno to get Traore further up the pitch - he is unplayable at times.

 

We have had a great run, but are far from a great team, which we all know.

 

Need to get something against Palace otherwise our good run will likely become 3 league defeats in a row post Liverpool.

 

It was our collapsing midfield which let us down after half-time. All attempts at pressing were abandoned and the initiative was handed to Wolves, who couldn't believe their luck. It was almost like our midfielders had turned into traffic cones. We didn't have an effective midfield again until the subs came on. I guess they had been told to stay back and defend the lead and not let Wolves score early in the 2nd half but what it did was take all pressure off the Wolves defence and midfield and left them free to pour forward.

[woodsaint]

I’ve just seen the highlights (thanks Wes) and there was nothing wrong with any of their three goals but what the hell was Stephens doing for that penalty? That decision alone cost us the game and Cedric had the ball covered.

 

He was ball watching for their goals and was back to the Tephens we all know, sad to say.

 

Shouldnt come as a surprise. Stephens has been excellent recently but is always prone to his usual lapse of concentration. Who knows how he'll follow it up vs Palace. Still think we need a quality CB to play beside him or Bednarek. Unlikely to identify anybody in January but should be a must in the summer when Yoshida and possibly Vestergaard are moved on

[DT]

I checked, Wolves were 28-1 to win at half time on Ladbrokes

 

They were 35-1 on betfair.

 

 

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[Shroppie]

We were decent enough in the first half but I never felt we were in control of the game. They put Traore up top 2nd half and that is why made the difference. Our Centre backs could not cope with his pace and power. Stephens had a very poor game - there was absolutely no need to give away that penalty, Cedric was round on the cover and would have got to the ball before the wolves player.

 

There can't be any other Central Midfield players in the league that pass as badly as Hojbjerg surely? He must have given the ball away about 20 times today.

 

I thought Long and Cedric were decent but Ings didn't get much of a sniff at all. We need to get something from the Palace game with Liverpool away in a couple of weeks.

Needed to get Romeu on to shore up the midfield and do a job on Traore.

 

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[woodsaint]

All three goals contained defensive errors

 

1. Bednarek dives in out wide when he didnt need to and then Cedric lets their player do a full 180 and get the shot off. Yes hes worrying about the other attacker but needs to be tighter and Stephens with a poor attempt at a recovering tackle.

2. Stonewall pen if you ever see one. Poor lunging effort from Stephens.

3. The worst of the lot. Stephens trying the offside didnt work but least we recovered and got three defenders back behind the ball....all for them to just ball watch and be attracted to Traore. Neither Stephens or Cedric have a look or try and cover the movement of Jimenez who is wide open for the cutback.

 

We've been spoilt the last number of weeks but the poor defensive decisions returned today. Ralph wont be pleased. Lets hope we can return to being more solid during the week.

 

We cant complain about VAR for either the pen or the Traore handball as its been our best friend this season.

[Kingsland Red]

Needed to get Romeu on to shore up the midfield and do a job on Traore.

 

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Exactly this. I thought Romeu would come on when Armstrong went off, to sit in front of the defence once Traore moved to the middle

[Dusic]

What job would Romeu have done on Traore (who by then was playing up front)?

 

Traore would have just bypassed him with ease, as he does most PL players when given any space.

[wild-saint]

You must be buzzing every time we lose, because every time we do lose you post about your insurance bet you’ve put on, very weird behaviour betting against your own team and never actually proving it

 

To be fair my mate always bets against saints, he just calls it’s his happiness tax.

[wild-saint]

What job would Romeu have done on Traore (who by then was playing up front)?

 

Traore would have just bypassed him with ease, as he does most PL players when given any space.

 

Space, this was the key difference IMO. First half we closed him down quickly and stopped him turning, second half he moved centrally and 2-3 times we gave him space on the ball to turn and run.

 

It seemed to me we came out second half thinking the game was already won and didn’t show the same level of graft that has made us decent in recent games. Lets just hope it’s complacency that we learn from quickly.

[SaveloyMush]

Whoa, Nelly.

 

Very much a game of 3/4 quarters (Ok, the first quarter belonged to Wolves).

 

Wolves got out of the blocks very quickly, but, after the first 15 minutes without reward, were a little lost.

 

Southampton blew them away in the remaining minutes up to half-time; no weak links.

 

In the second half, Wolves were fired up to be at their very best; big and strong in defence, fast and dangerous in attack (in the case of Traore, all of the above). Pound-for-pound, Wolves are simply far better than Saints. If Traore develops a football brain, he will play for the best team in the world.

 

I don't believe Saints had a particularly bad game; Redmond was mild-gash, as usual. Ings had a bad day at the office. Otherwise all good, including JWP and PEH.

 

What could RH have done, in reality? There was no-one with pace on the bench to annul Traore (sorry, Romeu!), and substituting offensive threat risked defeat by more.

 

Sometimes one has to accept that the better man won; Wolves are an excellent proposition.

(

[maysie]

I've never seen us do it. The only game I can recall was Preston away back in the McGoldrick days, and that was one of the only flipping away games I missed that season.

 

Liverpool under Koeman

[Sheaf Saint]

Liverpool under Koeman

 

That wasn't away though.

[Jonnyboy]

suggest you watch the goals again

1. The danger was the nearest person to him which he went to but then stopped and then didn’t close the shot down quick enough

2. Again the danger was the player he was actually covering until he decided to move away to an area redmond had covered

3. Completely ball watching and unaware of his surroundings, basically just ran as fast as he could back without even checking his shoulder

 

And where were the other three defenders?

[maysie]

That wasn't away though.

 

You make a good point

[austsaint]

Why in the hell is Hojbjerg in the team?

 

Hojbjerg had a very good first half. Both midfielders fell away in the second half as Traore and co dominated. Even though our recent form has been good, always worried our two man midfield could be exposed, and they were. I think Ralph has erred in discarding Romeu.

[Heisenberg]

To be fair my mate always bets against saints, he just calls it’s his happiness tax.

 

Jealousy, that green-eyed monster of emotions, is a powerful force. People get precious about insurance bets. They are happy to predict and say "knew we wouldn't win" but get angry and upset when others do something about it and benefit.

 

I've been "insurance betting" since Koeman left us in 2016.

 

Since he left we have played c140 league games and won just 36 of them. I therefore "win" financially c75% of the time and on days like today I win big.

 

Rather than being upset people should be pleased that someone is beating the bookies and get involved and not cry about it.

 

If you can't beat 'em, join 'em

[austsaint]

Re: Those comments about the kid running on to the pitch.

 

Was it the kids parent that got into that almighty scrap with the stewards down towards the family section? Looked like a pretty violent episode.

 

I thought Boufal handled the situation well. Probably the best thing he did for the afternoon!

[austsaint]

Jealousy, that green-eyed monster of emotions, is a powerful force. People get precious about insurance bets. They are happy to predict and say "knew we wouldn't win" but get angry and upset when others do something about it and benefit.

 

I've been "insurance betting" since Koeman left us in 2016.

 

Since he left we have played c140 league games and won just 36 of them. I therefore "win" financially c75% of the time and on days like today I win big.

 

Rather than being upset people should be pleased that someone is beating the bookies and get involved and not cry about it.

 

If you can't beat 'em, join 'em

 

Listen up Glasgow. It's not jealousy when people react negatively to your betting triumphalism. It's the cringe of someone trumpeting their proclaimed wins on the punt after the let down of a loss. Keep it to yourself, no one is interested!

[Shroppie]

Hojbjerg had a very good first half. Both midfielders fell away in the second half as Traore and co dominated. Even though our recent form has been good, always worried our two man midfield could be exposed, and they were. I think Ralph has erred in discarding Romeu.

There are times, like when they scored their first today, when we need Romeu to put a bit of solidity into midfield.

 

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