Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 I want to beleive as many true things and as few false things as possible. If someone thinks something I believe is false and has a good reason to think that then it benefits me from hearing a challenge to my belief. To want to go unchallenege is doing a version of this... If a belief someone holds can't hold up-to scrutiny then it is pretty flimsy belief. Religions brainwash people into not accepting criticism in order to protect themselves. Which is why the Bible has passages to protect itself from criticism. Unfortunately mr wrong what you completely fail to comprehend is you won’t find the answers to a belief system in a computer algorithm or a spreadsheet formula. You don’t understand the difference between a fact and a belief do you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 I have a right to challenge it because we live in a free country. Are they praying for god to change his mind? Under an all knowing god by definition we don't have free will and god already knows what will happen, so prayer is flawed and pointless even if god did exist. Why don’t you go down your local mosque on a Friday afternoon and ask them what the f*ck they are doing? It’s you’re right to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Stop trying to backtrack after being caught out posting anti Semitic memes. Classic Turkish, ignoring the post and going back to an old post. At no point did I say Passover was solely a celebration of Egyptian babies dying. But the name Passover is due to the baby killing god passing over the Jewish houses and is celebrating their babies not being killed by the baby killing god. Saying that the Jews worship a baby killing god is not anti-Semitic. Do you deny the Torah says god killed babies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 I have a right to challenge it because we live in a free country. Are they praying for god to change his mind? Under an all knowing god by definition we don't have free will and god already knows what will happen, so prayer is flawed and pointless even if god did exist. Mate, you are full of assumptions and your challenges are based largely on those. You assume that people pray for themselves. Most people pray only for others. My neighbour, praying only for peace of others, does not impact on you or anyone. If I'm wrong, explain, and tell me why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Why don’t you go down your local mosque on a Friday afternoon and ask them what the f*ck they are doing? It’s you’re right to do so. Mosques are closed Turkish... we are in a lockdown! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Mate, you are full of assumptions and your challenges are based largely on those. You assume that people pray for themselves. Most people pray only for others. My neighbour, praying only for peace of others, does not impact on you or anyone. If I'm wrong, explain, and tell me why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer. You didn't answer my question... Are they praying for god to change his mind? Under an all knowing god by definition we don't have free will and god already knows what will happen, so prayer is flawed and pointless even if god did exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Also... what assumptions are you claiming I've made? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 You didn't answer my question... Are they praying for god to change his mind? Under an all knowing god by definition we don't have free will and god already knows what will happen, so prayer is flawed and pointless even if god did exist. You're completely swerving this, again. Answer a really, really simple and direct question. Answer it with an answer, not a deflecting question. Q. How does my neighbour, praying only for peace of others (not asking for God to change anyone's mind), impact on you or anyone? When you have the grace to accept that it doesn't, then please explain why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Mosques are closed Turkish... we are in a lockdown! What a knobbish reply. Have you ever done it? Why not do it after lockdown? Classic Turkish, ignoring the post and going back to an old post. At no point did I say Passover was solely a celebration of Egyptian babies dying. But the name Passover is due to the baby killing god passing over the Jewish houses and is celebrating their babies not being killed by the baby killing god. Saying that the Jews worship a baby killing god is not anti-Semitic. Do you deny the Torah says god killed babies? You posted a meme which said “Passover, god killing babies but not Jewish ones” Then repeated those words yourself in your own typing. What you’ve made blatantly obvious the last few days, despite boasting about having a masters degree you don’t understand very basic things. You don’t either know what that Passover is, you’re either ignorant or anti Semitic and you don’t know the different between a fact and a belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Also... what assumptions are you claiming I've made? Many. The assumptions are based on your posts. And no, don't ask me to quote them, I have better things to do. But briefly, your comments appear to show that you assume that people pray for themselves, for god to change people's minds, that they pray to one particular god, that people who pray subscribe to religion etc etc. If you don't have those assumptions, then I have no idea why you're like a dog with a bone on this subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Many. The assumptions are based on your posts. And no, don't ask me to quote them, I have better things to do. Don't make a claim and fail to back it up. But briefly, your comments appear to show that you assume that people pray for themselves, for god to change people's minds, that they pray to one particular god, that people who pray subscribe to religion etc etc. 1) At no point did I say people solely pray for themselves 2) At no point did I say they subscribe to religion (by this I guess you mean organised religion) 3) If they aren't praying for god to change his mind... what are they praying for? If you don't have those assumptions, then I have no idea why you're like a dog with a bone on this subject. Well you've assumed I said they only pray for themselves... when I did not say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 What a knobbish reply. Have you ever done it? Why not do it after lockdown? I have had conversations with Muslims who were happy to chat about it about belief before. Don't need to go to Friday prayers at a mosque to do that. You posted a meme which said “Passover, god killing babies but not Jewish ones” Then repeated those words yourself in your own typing. You don’t either know what that Passover is, you’re either ignorant or anti Semitic and you don’t know the different between a fact and a belief. Yet again you refuse to answer a question. I'll try... again... Saying that the Jews worship a baby killing god is not anti-Semitic. Do you deny the Torah says god killed babies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 MLG, for about the 5th time : Q. How does my neighbour, praying only for peace of others (not asking for God to change anyone's mind), impact on you or anyone? When you have the grace to accept that it doesn't, then please explain why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Don't make a claim and fail to back it up. 1) At no point did I say people solely pray for themselves 2) At no point did I say they subscribe to religion (by this I guess you mean organised religion) 3) If they aren't praying for god to change his mind... what are they praying for? [/color]Well you've assumed I said they only pray for themselves... when I did not say that. Deary me. Just read back at your various comments / questions on this thread, and then re read what you've just written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 MLG, for about the 5th time : Q. How does my neighbour, praying only for peace of others (not asking for God to change anyone's mind), impact on you or anyone? When you have the grace to accept that it doesn't, then please explain why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer I didn't say for god to change someone's mind... I said for god to change his mind. Praying for peace is asking for god to change his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Deary me. Just read back at your various comments / questions on this thread, and then re read what you've just written. I'm aware what I've said, none of it contradicts the post you just highlighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 I didn't say for god to change someone's mind... I said for god to change his mind. Praying for peace is asking for god to change his mind. Just focus on the prayer being for peace for others. No mind changing. Just peace. 6th time : Q. How does my neighbour, praying only for peace of others (not asking for God to change anyone's mind), impact on you or anyone? When you have the grace to accept that it doesn't, then please explain why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Just focus on the prayer being for peace for others. No mind changing. Just peace. 6th time : Q. How does my neighbour, praying only for peace of others (not asking for God to change anyone's mind), impact on you or anyone? When you have the grace to accept that it doesn't, then please explain why you have any right to challenge or police what she believes and her private right to prayer Again.... I said it would require god to change his mind... not God changing someone else's mind. How can a prayer to god result in peace unless he acts on it? For him to act on it he would need to change his mind... yet if he is all knowing he already knows what he will do. So prayer is pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Again.... I said it would require god to change his mind... not God changing someone else's mind. How can a prayer to god result in peace unless he acts on it? For him to act on it he would need to change his mind... yet if he is all knowing he already knows what he will do. So prayer is pointless. I won't ask for a 7th time. I'll drawer an inference from your persistent refusal to answer as an acknowledgement that someones prayer for someone else to have peace, does not impact upon you. When you an argument to the contrary, come and explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 I won't ask for a 7th time. I'll drawer an inference from your persistent refusal to answer as an acknowledgement that someones prayer for someone else to have peace, does not impact upon you. When you an argument to the contrary, come and explain. People believing in things that aren't true is not helpful to society. If you are willing to accept prayer can bring peace then you are more likely to not think humans are the reason why peace happens and won't work towards that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 People believing in things that aren't true is not helpful to society. If you are willing to accept prayer can bring peace then you are more likely to not think humans are the reason why peace happens and won't work towards that. Says the person that devotes his life to a computer game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 People believing in things that aren't true is not helpful to society. If you are willing to accept prayer can bring peace then you are more likely to not think humans are the reason why peace happens and won't work towards that. If you want to debate mate, you have be willing to answer questions even when the answer fecks your argument. If prayer by person a for peace for person b gives comfort / peace to person a, you know full well that it causes you no harm. Sure, it may well be misguided in your opinion, but it has feck all to do with you and/or causes you know no prejudice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 If you want to debate mate, you have be willing to answer questions even when the answer fecks your argument. If prayer by person a for peace for person b gives comfort / peace to person a, you know full well that it causes you no harm. Sure, it may well be misguided in your opinion, but it has feck all to do with you and/or causes you know no prejudice. False comfort is not helpful, it stunts human development to actual answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Says the person that devotes his life to a computer game It is not my job or my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 False comfort is not helpful, it stunts human development to actual answers. What stunted your development? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 What stunted your development? Trying to get you to answer questions! Do you believe in god, if so... why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Trying to get you to answer questions! Oh the irony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Trying to get you to answer questions! Do you believe in god, if so... why? Why is that relevant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Oh the irony. His tactic is to answer every question with a question, accuse others of not answering his, then when its gets a bit on top for him, like the other day when he was outed as an anti Semite he’ll disappear for a few days, ignoring everything that’s gone before and if anyone else mentions it he’ll accuse them of not answering his latest point. It’s quite tragic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Why is that relevant? Apparently it impacts him if you do. He can't explain why though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 (edited) False comfort is not helpful, it stunts human development to actual answers.Lol. What's false comfort? You either feel comfort and all the potential benefits that can have both physically and emotionally or you don't. Would you rather that the person praying derived no comfort from it at all just to make you feel better about how false the comfort they felt was? I know you have real trouble with the concept of emotions but most people can work it out. Edited 12 April, 2020 by hypochondriac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Lots of people have religious experiences at Easter and also an increase in psychotic episodes. Heightened time for MLG as the lord is tapping him on the shoulder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Lots of people have religious experiences at Easter and also an increase in psychotic episodes. Heightened time for MLG as the lord is tapping him on the shoulderWe've got to be careful. We can't have people feeling a false sense of peace and love. We need to expose those falsehoods and make sure they feel very real feelings of disquiet and shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Lol. What's false comfort? Comfort in something that doesn't manifest in reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Oh the irony. Not ironic, I didn't answer your question because it was based on a misquoting of my posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Comfort in something that doesn't manifest in reality.My cousin loves santa Claus. It comforts him to believe in santa and the presents he might get at Christmas. I'm going to make sure he knows that santa isn't real and he's a fool for deriving false comfort from somethibg that doesn't manifest in reality. How dare he. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 My cousin loves santa Claus. It comforts him to believe in santa and the presents he might get at Christmas. I'm going to make sure he knows that santa isn't real and he's a fool for deriving false comfort from somethibg that doesn't manifest in reality. How dare he. It potentially sets people up for being gullible in later life and believing a whole host of things without evidence. From fairies to gods and messiahs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Comfort in something that doesn't manifest in reality. If people get comfort from praying than the reality is they have real comfort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 It potentially sets people up for being gullible in later life and believing a whole host of things without evidence. From fairies to gods and messiahs. are you suggesting that anyone who believe is religion is gullible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 If people get comfort from praying than the reality is they have real comfort. My point is that it is built on something without foundation. I'd rather believe as many true things and as few false things as possible... wouldn't you? Why do you always refuse to answer what you believe and why regarding god? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 My point is that it is built on something without foundation. I'd rather believe as many true things and as few false things as possible... wouldn't you? Why do you always refuse to answer what you believe and why regarding god? Because my personal beliefs are or no relevance to this discussion, or any of your business. You said it’s a false comfort and doesn’t manifest itself in reality, but if someone prays and finds comfort from prayer, then it is a reality for them, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 are you suggesting that anyone who believe is religion is gullible? Not suggesting... I am saying it. It is gullible to believe any religion full of contradictions and riddled with plot holes. Christianity isn't alone in contradictions and plot holes. If you have some evidence of a religion without plot holes, has supporting evidence and doesn't contradict itself I'd love to hear about it! So... do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 My point is that it is built on something without foundation. I'd rather believe as many true things and as few false things as possible... wouldn't you? Why do you always refuse to answer what you believe and why regarding god?So should we be doing away with the Easter bunny and santa Claus? After all we wouldn't want people potentially being guillable in later life would we? Perish the thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Not suggesting... I am saying it. It is gullible to believe any religion full of contradictions and riddled with plot holes. Christianity isn't alone in contradictions and plot holes. If you have some evidence of a religion without plot holes, has supporting evidence and doesn't contradict itself I'd love to hear about it! So... do you? So just to be clear, you think every single one of the 1.5m Muslims in the role are gullible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Because my personal beliefs are or no relevance to this discussion, or any of your business. It is very relevant to a discussion about beliefs to know the position of someone. My position is... I don't believe any god claim has met it's burden of proof. That is not the same as saying there is no god. You said it’s a false comfort and doesn’t manifest itself in reality, but if someone prays and finds comfort from prayer, then it is a reality for them, I'd rather live believing in things that correspond to reality. Making up comforting things is asking for disaster as it limits your motivation to actually do something yourself to iprove your situation as you think there is a chance god will sort it out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 It is very relevant to a discussion about beliefs to know the position of someone. My position is... I don't believe any god claim has met it's burden of proof. That is not the same as saying there is no god. I'd rather live believing in things that correspond to reality. Making up comforting things is asking for disaster as it limits your motivation to actually do something yourself to iprove your situation as you think there is a chance god will sort it out for you. You would, but why does mean to someone who takes comfort in prayer that comfort is not reality? It’s reality to them, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 So just to be clear, you think every single one of the 1.5m Muslims in the role are gullible? Yes, things like believing Mohammed flew to heaven on a winged horse is gullible. They are more than welcome to show me otherwise. Same with Christians, Hindus etc etc with the claims in their holy books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 You would, but why does mean to someone who takes comfort in prayer that comfort is not reality? It’s reality to them, There is no 'my reality', reality is the same for all of us. In reality there is no credible evidence that prayer works. In fact the counter is true, it has been shown under scientific conditions prayer has a negative impact on medical conditions, perhaps through performance anxiety having a negative impact if people know they are being prayed for. People claim prayer heals cancer, but we know that cancer can go into remission on its own. Why has prayer never grown a limb back for an amputee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Comfort in something that doesn't manifest in reality. Comfort is a subjective feeling. Literally nobody other than me knows if I feel it. The deeper you dig, the more moronic you become. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 12 April, 2020 Share Posted 12 April, 2020 Comfort is a subjective feeling. Literally nobody other than me knows if I feel it. The deeper you dig, the more moronic you become. We are just playing around with words here. What do you believe and why concerning god...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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