Ralph Hasenhuttl

[TWar]

2 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Well,I don’t believe that’s true in the slightest. Bednarek played for all Poland youth levels 16-21 before making his debut full international appearance shortly after joining us. We paid £5m for a young prospect. Like Salisu, he want expected togo straight into the first team. And, surely any saints fan who watched Hoedt play would have preferred Bednarek there instead, no matter how young he was! I don’t think we can look at the selection policies of our two previous managers as a benchmark of anything good at all! 
 

Bednarek’s career growth has happened under Ralph because he is now 25, and has grown into his role. Ralph has played a part, of course, but it would have been a significant failure if Bednarek had not have improved from where he was when Ralph took him under his wing. It’s not black and white, its not either or, but it’s very much a bit of both.

Salisu had started a full season in La Liga. He was a tonne more well thought of than Bednarek who had only ever played in the polish league. And to be honest I don't think the Polish U21s is much of a sign of quality.

[TWar]

2 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Why was Ralph unable to improve him when he first joined, before his loan spell?

Answered this earlier.

[Chez]

15 hours ago, TWar said:

Might be the new owners have already paid it off and that's why the deal was so cheap.

the deal was cheap because the business carried that sizeable £90m  debt. If the debt was zero, the asking price could have been, say, £90m more.

The new owners wont have paid it off. The business will pay it off over time. I guess the owners could loan the business the £90m needed to pay it off in full, but they have indicated the business will operate self-sufficiently, so that (a cash injection in the form or an owner loan) would seem unlikely.

Going back to your original post - I don't think we will have a huge amount to play with this summer. We will all hope that funds will be made available from the sales of `unwanted' players like Djenepo and Redmond, but far more likely people enquire about KWP, JWP or Salisu. That's how it usually goes, sadly.

[Dman]

1 minute ago, Chez said:

the deal was cheap because the business carried that sizeable £90m  debt. If the debt was zero, the asking price could have been, say, £90m more.

The new owners wont have paid it off. The business will pay it off over time. I guess the owners could loan the business the £90m needed to pay it off in full, but they have indicated the business will operate self-sufficiently, so that (a cash injection in the form or an owner loan) would seem unlikely.

Going back to your original post - I don't think we will have a huge amount to play with this summer. We will all hope that funds will be made available from the sales of `unwanted' players like Djenepo and Redmond, but far more likely people enquire about KWP, JWP or Salisu. That's how it usually goes, sadly.

Agreed. If players like Djenepo and Redmond aren’t good enough for us, who is going to want (and pay decent money) for them? 

[Sarisbury Saint]

2 minutes ago, TWar said:

This is your defence, nothing. After claiming he played at a high level because of games against KR Reykjavík and Ferencváros

So they only became good after they left Celtic, mmmmm I’m sure everyone must have been like you and thought that Van Dyck fellas not that good.

[TWar]

25 minutes ago, Sarisbury Saint said:

So they only became good after they left Celtic, mmmmm I’m sure everyone must have been like you and thought that Van Dyck fellas not that good.

If vvd was rated anywhere near the quality he was after we improved him we wouldn't have had a sniff at signing him.

[Sarisbury Saint]

2 minutes ago, TWar said:

If vvd was rated anywhere near the quality he was after we improved him we wouldn't have had a sniff at signing him.

Classic Twar, divert what you said.

No one’s talking about how they proved themselves in the Premiership.

They we’re good when we bought them, anyone except you can see that.

[Dman]

13 minutes ago, TWar said:

If vvd was rated anywhere near the quality he was after we improved him we wouldn't have had a sniff at signing him.

Did we improve him or was that just his natural development from game time in a top league. Equally as important as his development at Celtic (and the same can be said for Elyounossi and Wanyama). 

Without knowing the ins and outs of their individual training schedule, it’s pretty impossible to say. 

From memory, both he and Wanyama came to us as pretty rounded players though. Naturally, playing at the next level up does give you exposure to the bigger clubs that you might not get in the Scottish league. 

[TWar]

24 minutes ago, Sarisbury Saint said:

Classic Twar, divert what you said.

No one’s talking about how they proved themselves in the Premiership.

They we’re good when we bought them, anyone except you can see that.

So you think VvD was a £70m when we bought him and all he needed was to prove himself? I think that's nonsense. We made him into the £70m player.

[TWar]

17 minutes ago, Dman said:

Did we improve him or was that just his natural development from game time in a top league. Equally as important as his development at Celtic (and the same can be said for Elyounossi and Wanyama). 

Without knowing the ins and outs of their individual training schedule, it’s pretty impossible to say. 

From memory, both he and Wanyama came to us as pretty rounded players though. Naturally, playing at the next level up does give you exposure to the bigger clubs that you might not get in the Scottish league. 

We improved him, like we do lots of players. It's not a coincidence so many players in the last 7 years have left saints so much more highly rated than when they joined. Sure we have misses but improving players if definitely our strength.

[Dman]

8 minutes ago, TWar said:

We improved him, like we do lots of players. It's not a coincidence so many players in the last 7 years have left saints so much more highly rated than when they joined. Sure we have misses but improving players if definitely our strength.

Naturally, you’re going to get more exposure and become more highly regarded, putting in performances in the PL each week than you would be in Scottish league or Austrian league, in Mane case. It’s less of a risk for clubs to sign a proven PL player than one who’s never played on this country before. 
 

Personally, I don’t buy the we improve players propaganda that comes out of the club. 
 

We give them a platform to express their talent in a high profile league, yes, but you’ve either got the ability or you haven’t. 
 

You could argue that given game time is improving them, which I would agree with, but I think in terms of Wanyama, VVD, Mane etc. They would have improved if they played for us or someone like West Ham. They were naturally really gifted players, hence why we brought them. 

For every player that comes in and succeeds, we probably have 2 who don’t. 

[Diabolus Ex Machina]

3 minutes ago, TWar said:

We improved him, like we do lots of players. It's not a coincidence so many players in the last 7 years have left saints so much more highly rated than when they joined. Sure we have misses but improving players if definitely our strength.

Which one's that have left since Ralph joined would you suggest have been improved out of interest? As a club we have a good history of it but there's not been as much proof recently. It's telling that out of the first teamers that have left during his tenure it was either because their contract expired (Bertrand) or they were going into their last year and not looking to re-sign and so we had to recoup what we could (Hojbjerg, Vestergaard, Ings). Part of it is the drop in quality in the academy but I don't think the inconsistent performances under Ralph are helping put some of these players in the shop window.

We've not really had anyone knocking down our door for a player since VvD left with the exception of Villa coming in for JWP recently but we don't seem to have any interest in selling him, just as no other players have been sold from under Ralph during his time here - unless you include those whose contracts would be run down to let them go on a free, which from a purely financial viewpoint would be ridiculous to allow. He's not had a lot to spend but i'd say he's been given whatever we could afford and have tried to keep our best players for him.

[TWar]

1 minute ago, Dman said:

Naturally, you’re going to get more exposure and become more highly regarded, putting in performances in the PL each week than you would be in Scottish league or Austrian league, in Mane case. It’s less of a risk for clubs to sign a proven PL player than one who’s never played on this country before. 
 

Personally, I don’t buy the we improve players propaganda that comes out of the club. 
 

We give them a platform to express their talent in a high profile league, yes, but you’ve either got the ability or you haven’t. 
 

You could argue that given game time is improving them, which I would agree with, but I think in terms of Wanyama, VVD, Mane etc. They would have improved if they played for us or someone like West Ham. They were naturally really gifted players, hence why we brought them. 

For every player that comes in and succeeds, we probably have 2 who don’t. 

If its just that we give them prem exposure than how come we have so many elite level talents - VvD, Mane, Tadic, Lallana, JWP, Shaw, Wanyama, Fonte etc. go through this club. Have a look at another midtable side like Palace or Brighton, even a rich team like West Ham or Everton and see if you can assemble such a list. Our reputation of improving players is well earned imo.

[TWar]

13 minutes ago, Diabolus Ex Machina said:

Which one's that have left since Ralph joined would you suggest have been improved out of interest? As a club we have a good history of it but there's not been as much proof recently. It's telling that out of the first teamers that have left during his tenure it was either because their contract expired (Bertrand) or they were going into their last year and not looking to re-sign and so we had to recoup what we could (Hojbjerg, Vestergaard, Ings). Part of it is the drop in quality in the academy but I don't think the inconsistent performances under Ralph are helping put some of these players in the shop window.

We've not really had anyone knocking down our door for a player since VvD left with the exception of Villa coming in for JWP recently but we don't seem to have any interest in selling him, just as no other players have been sold from under Ralph during his time here - unless you include those whose contracts would be run down to let them go on a free, which from a purely financial viewpoint would be ridiculous to allow. He's not had a lot to spend but i'd say he's been given whatever we could afford and have tried to keep our best players for him.

I think Ings had a big step up in quality, he just moved to a bang average team who don't use him properly and also is plagued by injury. To be honest I think we are getting better at retaining our good players now. JWP is just as good as some of those players who left for big things a few years ago, we just have managed to keep hold.

[Dman]

19 minutes ago, TWar said:

If its just that we give them prem exposure than how come we have so many elite level talents - VvD, Mane, Tadic, Lallana, JWP, Shaw, Wanyama, Fonte etc. go through this club. Have a look at another midtable side like Palace or Brighton, even a rich team like West Ham or Everton and see if you can assemble such a list. Our reputation of improving players is well earned imo.

fairly simple, Recruitment. We were fantastic at identifying talent and we have them the platform to perform in the top league to gain a reputation. 

It’s why it’s dropped off in recent years and our rate of ‘improvement’ has drastically slowed. 

Historically (recent history anyway), West Ham and Everton have spent big, but that doesn’t guarantee success if it’s not spend wisely. Thier approach has been scatter gun to say the very least, but you could probably name 5 West Ham players (off the top of my head), who’ve ‘improved’ there. 4 who are still in their squad. 

 

[Dman]

25 minutes ago, TWar said:

I think Ings had a big step up in quality, he just moved to a bang average team who don't use him properly and also is plagued by injury. To be honest I think we are getting better at retaining our good players now. JWP is just as good as some of those players who left for big things a few years ago, we just have managed to keep hold.

Ings went from Burnley to Liverpool and had it not been for injuries, may have been a success there. To say we improved him is a bit of a reach. He was a top player before he came, we gave him game time to demonstrate that. 
 

JWP stayed because his choice was Villa. Had a top 6 side come in for him, the result wouldn’t have been the same. 

[TWar]

21 minutes ago, Dman said:

Ings went from Burnley to Liverpool and had it not been for injuries, may have been a success there. To say we improved him is a bit of a reach. He was a top player before he came, we gave him game time to demonstrate that. 
 

JWP stayed because his choice was Villa. Had a top 6 side come in for him, the result wouldn’t have been the same. 

He got 11 goals for Burnley in his best season, for us he got 23. The season after he got 11 and we considered that a bit of a down year. We definitely took him up a level.

Regarding JWP who knows? We shall see this summer I imagine as a big club will probably be interested. Last summer apparently spurs enquired and we said no.

[TWar]

25 minutes ago, Dman said:

fairly simple, Recruitment. We were fantastic at identifying talent and we have them the platform to perform in the top league to gain a reputation. 

It’s why it’s dropped off in recent years and our rate of ‘improvement’ has drastically slowed. 

Historically (recent history anyway), West Ham and Everton have spent big, but that doesn’t guarantee success if it’s not spend wisely. Thier approach has been scatter gun to say the very least, but you could probably name 5 West Ham players (off the top of my head), who’ve ‘improved’ there. 4 who are still in their squad. 

 

Not sure I buy recruitment, how come we have so many youth players come through and do really well Shaw, Lallana, JWP, etc. all top top players at their peak. We improve our own products - JWP, Shaw, Lallana, we improve previously unproven players - Mane, Tadic, VvD, we improve players who have previously not done well and need their career reviving - Ings and Bertrand. I think we just make players better. 

[Sarisbury Saint]

2 hours ago, TWar said:

So you think VvD was a £70m when we bought him and all he needed was to prove himself? I think that's nonsense. We made him into the £70m player.

Again your diverting the subject. 

[Saint86]

22 hours ago, Chez said:

the deal was cheap because the business carried that sizeable £90m  debt. If the debt was zero, the asking price could have been, say, £90m more.

The new owners wont have paid it off. The business will pay it off over time. I guess the owners could loan the business the £90m needed to pay it off in full, but they have indicated the business will operate self-sufficiently, so that (a cash injection in the form or an owner loan) would seem unlikely.

Going back to your original post - I don't think we will have a huge amount to play with this summer. We will all hope that funds will be made available from the sales of `unwanted' players like Djenepo and Redmond, but far more likely people enquire about KWP, JWP or Salisu. That's how it usually goes, sadly.

Sounds like Bednarek's days are numbered, which is backed up by his attitude/performances recently, as well as Ralph's comments?

Salisu i think is the player we might sell. He hasn't signed a new deal so his transfer value will only drop, he's ultimately replaceable (i'd argue JWP nad KWP aren't) and he's rumoured to be in demand.

So could well be 2 new CB's required - but equally with money available to get them.

Similarly, Djenpo and Redmond seemingly being moved on. And I still do not understand what is going on with Forster and Macca. Seems to me that we should be keeping Forster. But if we aren't doing that we need a solid #1 keeper.

And finally, we'll be signing another CF this summer as Broja is clearly on his way.

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

22 hours ago, TWar said:

So you think VvD was a £70m when we bought him and all he needed was to prove himself? I think that's nonsense. We made him into the £70m player.

I'll grant you it can't have harmed VVD to have RK managing at the time - one of the best defenders to play the game. Highly debatable to say the current clown would have helped him much - he would probably start playing him at LB 🙂

He was already immensely talented and was a £70m player in all but PL experience. We gave him the platform to prove his credentials and he took that opportunity and never looked back.

[The Kraken]

1 hour ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

I'll grant you it can't have harmed VVD to have RK managing at the time - one of the best defenders to play the game. Highly debatable to say the current clown would have helped him much - he would probably start playing him at LB 🙂

He was already immensely talented and was a £70m player in all but PL experience. We gave him the platform to prove his credentials and he took that opportunity and never looked back.

One of my dads closest and oldest friends is a Celtic fan.  I see him reasonably regularly, and whenever we spoke about football he’d mention this lad called van Dijk that they had. He always said he was a superstar in the making, no doubt about it, and reiterated it to me when we signed him. Van Dijk was a Rolls Royce of a player when he arrived at St Mary’s. We knew it, the club knew it, VvD knew it (he said himself we were just a stepping stone for him).

It was a mutually beneficial deal. We gave him a place to get accustomed to life in a Premier League top ten side. He gave a some staggeringly good. performances, and got himself in the shop window. And he improved himself while with us, as a centre back gaining experience at the top of level will do.

Van Dijk was simply a phenomenon from start to finish with us. 

[Sarisbury Saint]

1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

One of my dads closest and oldest friends is a Celtic fan.  I see him reasonably regularly, and whenever we spoke about football he’d mention this lad called van Dijk that they had. He always said he was a superstar in the making, no doubt about it, and reiterated it to me when we signed him. Van Dijk was a Rolls Royce of a player when he arrived at St Mary’s. We knew it, the club knew it, VvD knew it (he said himself we were just a stepping stone for him).

It was a mutually beneficial deal. We gave him a place to get accustomed to life in a Premier League top ten side. He gave a some staggeringly good. performances, and got himself in the shop window. And he improved himself while with us, as a centre back gaining experience at the top of level will do.

Van Dijk was simply a phenomenon from start to finish with us. 

Exactly this. Doesn’t matter if he was playing in the Scottish league, it was clear he was very talented before he arrived at Saints.

How anyone can say he only became good once at Saints is ludicrous.

Like you say, we gave him the platform to display that talent.

[Dark Munster]

8 hours ago, The Kraken said:

One of my dads closest and oldest friends is a Celtic fan.  I see him reasonably regularly, and whenever we spoke about football he’d mention this lad called van Dijk that they had. He always said he was a superstar in the making, no doubt about it, and reiterated it to me when we signed him. Van Dijk was a Rolls Royce of a player when he arrived at St Mary’s. We knew it, the club knew it, VvD knew it (he said himself we were just a stepping stone for him).

It was a mutually beneficial deal. We gave him a place to get accustomed to life in a Premier League top ten side. He gave a some staggeringly good. performances, and got himself in the shop window. And he improved himself while with us, as a centre back gaining experience at the top of level will do.

Van Dijk was simply a phenomenon from start to finish with us. 

Not during the last months he played for us, when he was playing half heartedly waiting for his Liverpool move.

[DT]

Sean Dyche reportedly parting ways with Burnley. He’d toughen us up…

[The Kraken]

2 hours ago, DT said:

Sean Dyche reportedly parting ways with Burnley. He’d toughen us up…

Dyche is going to be an interesting choice for a number of a premier league teams. He’ll definitely get a job somewhere, just how high up remains to be seen. He’s done a great job at Burnley over the years given the absolute lack of finance he’s had at his disposal.  Would be interesting to see what he can do given a ‘fair’ roll of the dice.

[The Kraken]

13 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

Not during the last months he played for us, when he was playing half heartedly waiting for his Liverpool move.

It’s a fair point. Though even that level was well ahead of some of the CB options we’ve got now…

[Dman]

Done exactly what was needed today. Credit where it’s due. 
 

Please just find some consistency. 

[Sunglasses Ron]

So do we love him again this week?

[TWar]

Last week was fuming about the lack of motivation. Ralph did exactly what he needed, dropped some underperformers, brought in some lads with something to prove and it paid off. You love to see it.

[AlexLaw76]

2 minutes ago, TWar said:

Last week was fuming about the lack of motivation. Ralph did exactly what he needed, dropped some underperformers, brought in some lads with something to prove and it paid off. You love to see it.

Agree with you.

made changes, in both personnel and shape. Well done

[Lighthouse]

If Burnley are mental to get rid of Dyche, 15 points below us in the relegation zone, then we'd be two pencils up your nose and shout, "wibble!" To get rid of Ralph.

[Sarisbury Saint]

That is when Ralph is good, much better shape and formation.

[Saint86]

On 15/04/2022 at 13:08, The Kraken said:

Dyche is going to be an interesting choice for a number of a premier league teams. He’ll definitely get a job somewhere, just how high up remains to be seen. He’s done a great job at Burnley over the years given the absolute lack of finance he’s had at his disposal.  Would be interesting to see what he can do given a ‘fair’ roll of the dice.

When you consider villa and Everton signed Gerrard and lampard respectively, you have to think surely they'd have been better off with the proven quality that is dyche? 

[Lord Duckhunter]

18 hours ago, Dman said:

Done exactly what was needed today. Credit where it’s due. 
 

Please just find some consistency. 

Night and day from last week. 

 

I’ve said from the start of the season, Broja is the key. He lets us play with more flexibility and therefore can fill the midfield gaps  better. With Armstrong up front that would have been a bloody disaster again. The big fella unsettles defenders, something Xg & other pony stats can’t measure. Also better balance having Perraud instead of KWP on his “wrong” side. Personally,  I still can’t see what Mo does that Tino couldn’t, given a run in that position. Shift Tino into Mo’s spot, and bring Salisu back in and he’s got the making of a half decent defensive set up when we play the top 6. 

[Wade Garrett]

41 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Night and day from last week. 

 

I’ve said from the start of the season, Broja is the key. He lets us play with more flexibility and therefore can fill the midfield gaps  better. With Armstrong up front that would have been a bloody disaster again. The big fella unsettles defenders, something Xg & other pony stats can’t measure. Also better balance having Perraud instead of KWP on his “wrong” side. Personally,  I still can’t see what Mo does that Tino couldn’t, given a run in that position. Shift Tino into Mo’s spot, and bring Salisu back in and he’s got the making of a half decent defensive set up when we play the top 6. 

Apart from one run in the first half, I thought Broja was pretty average and really struggled up there on his own.

[stevy777_x]

9 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

Apart from one run in the first half, I thought Broja was pretty average and really struggled up there on his own.

Good, it will die down the hype around him a little. The way we was going a few months back, we had no chance of keeping him.

I wish him a crap end to the season so we can buy him in the summer

[TWar]

58 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

Apart from one run in the first half, I thought Broja was pretty average and really struggled up there on his own.

He's been not just not scoring but not really involved for a while. Quite surprised anyone would call a 6 goal forward our big difference maker.

For me the biggest difference was the swing in form of Romeu and JWP between the two games, night and day imo.

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, TWar said:

He's been not just not scoring but not really involved for a while. Quite surprised anyone would call a 6 goal forward our big difference maker.

For me the biggest difference was the swing in form of Romeu and JWP between the two games, night and day imo.

He makes a difference to how we’re able to set up tactically. The reason JWP & Romeu played better was partly down to the defensive structure we are able to use when you don’t play 2 up top. Had Armstrong started, he’d have played Adams or somebody else further up, leaving little pockets in the final third for them to find, like Chelsea did last week. I realise you have a problem with the guy, but surely even you can see the flexibility he brings to our tactics. If we’d set up the same way we did last week, we’d have lost imo.

It may not necessarily be Broja, but we’ll need somebody capable of playing  like that next season, without that option we sometimes become too easy to play against. 

[TWar]

9 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

He makes a difference to how we’re able to set up tactically. The reason JWP & Romeu played better was partly down to the defensive structure we are able to use when you don’t play 2 up top. Had Armstrong started, he’d have played Adams or somebody else further up, leaving little pockets in the final third for them to find, like Chelsea did last week. I realise you have a problem with the guy, but surely even you can see the flexibility he brings to our tactics. If we’d set up the same way we did last week, we’d have lost imo.

It may not necessarily be Broja, but we’ll need somebody capable of playing  like that next season, without that option we sometimes become too easy to play against. 

I don't disagree with this actually. You are completely right that having someone who can play alone up top unlocks a tonne more formations and that gives us much more room to counter the opposition. I don't think Broja has been that great personally for a good while but he was definitely the right choice over AA in this instance.

I do think the 4222 is our best formation most of the time but having an option to play a 343/541 is invaluable.

[Lord Duckhunter]

41 minutes ago, TWar said:

I don't disagree with this actually. You are completely right that having someone who can play alone up top unlocks a tonne more formations and that gives us much more room to counter the opposition. I don't think Broja has been that great personally for a good while but he was definitely the right choice over AA in this instance.

I do think the 4222 is our best formation most of the time but having an option to play a 343/541 is invaluable.

Spot on. 
 

 

[Dman]

5 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Night and day from last week. 

 

I’ve said from the start of the season, Broja is the key. He lets us play with more flexibility and therefore can fill the midfield gaps  better. With Armstrong up front that would have been a bloody disaster again. The big fella unsettles defenders, something Xg & other pony stats can’t measure. Also better balance having Perraud instead of KWP on his “wrong” side. Personally,  I still can’t see what Mo does that Tino couldn’t, given a run in that position. Shift Tino into Mo’s spot, and bring Salisu back in and he’s got the making of a half decent defensive set up when we play the top 6. 

I think Ralph is his own worse enemy. As Dan sheldon said on TSP a few weeks back, when he has time to think (I.e international break) we need to worry, as he starts to tinker and over think. 

Ive always said he’s a good training ground manager and a decent ‘coach’, but tactically not great. 

Yesterday, we went back to basics and like magic, it worked. That being said, Arsenal weren’t great and on another coulda/shoulda won.. but you need to ride your luck against the better teams. 

Re Broja, I think most can see what influence he has on us. He’s a top quality player and even when not scoring, he’s still contributing to style and giving us a genuine threat in behind. 

He struggles when teams sit deep and prevent any space for him to run in to. If we had the quality in midfield, this wouldn’t matter so much, but we don’t. 

 

[Toussaint]

On 16/04/2022 at 16:56, Sunglasses Ron said:

So do we love him again this week?

I don’t feel different, as it happens

[Sunglasses Ron]

15 hours ago, Toussaint said:

I don’t feel different, as it happens

And that's fine.  I don't feel any different either, which is an ongoing sense of apathy.

Seems to be a pendulum effect with a lot of people though, who seem to love him or hate him depending on what week it is.

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, Sunglasses Ron said:

And that's fine.  I don't feel any different either, which is an ongoing sense of apathy.

Seems to be a pendulum effect with a lot of people though, who seem to love him or hate him depending on what week it is.

Complete and utter pony. When we win there’s more posts from his supporters and when we lose there are  more from his distracters. The claim that there’s people who swing from one side to the other depending on results , is just made up pony. 

[Sunglasses Ron]

3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Complete and utter pony. When we win there’s more posts from his supporters and when we lose there are  more from his distracters. The claim that there’s people who swing from one side to the other depending on results , is just made up pony. 

Yes, because the majority of football fans are always such cogent thinkers aren't they 🙂

[ozzmeister]

A very generic, unresearched observation but....

We play well against teams who like to play football. We struggle against teams who put men behind the ball / play defensively. Until we can work out how to grind out results and play dirty we will keep getting frustrating losses against lower level teams. 

[Diabolus Ex Machina]

23 minutes ago, ozzmeister said:

A very generic, unresearched observation but....

We play well against teams who like to play football. We struggle against teams who put men behind the ball / play defensively. Until we can work out how to grind out results and play dirty we will keep getting frustrating losses against lower level teams. 

I'd argue it's more than that - it's simply taking advantage of the flaws of the high press system. The defensive teams can sit back and look for a quick / direct counter where even with just one or two up top they can be left with only the centre backs to deal with if Romeu / JWP are too high (this also happens a lot with us on our offensive corners). Better teams like Chelsea don't even need to sit back to do this as they have players capable of passing it through the midfield cutting them out that way.

The reason we've got points off the likes of Man City is because Ralph has shown them more respect and set us up more defensively so they have to break us down more rather than relying on the centre backs to do all the defensive work at the back. If you've got the likes of Van Dijk at the back it can work. With a Jan Bednarek not so much.

Don't get me wrong the press works for us quite well a lot of the time, he just needs to be careful of when we go all out with it and when we need to sit back more (which includes after conceding where the chasing of a equalizer / leading goal often leads to us conceding another).

[The Left Back]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Complete and utter pony. When we win there’s more posts from his supporters and when we lose there are  more from his distracters. The claim that there’s people who swing from one side to the other depending on results , is just made up pony. 

100% this.  Ralph, like other topics on this forum, brings out strong views that are largely entrenched.  When we do well we hear from one lot, when. we do badly we hear from another lot - both driven by confirmation bias.  And there is a third group that I think you and I are members of @Lord Duckhunter. We don't agree on much but I think we both said early on that we need to judge him at the end of the season (unless he got poached or we were bottom 3 in March if I remember).  I think you would have replaced him last summer whereas I wanted too see how things went this year. I'm guessing I'm more positive about him than you but mid-May is the time for that conversation.

1 hour ago, ozzmeister said:

A very generic, unresearched observation but....

We play well against teams who like to play football. We struggle against teams who put men behind the ball / play defensively. Until we can work out how to grind out results and play dirty we will keep getting frustrating losses against lower level teams. 

It was noticeable to me Saturday that we did to Arsenal what some teams often do to us.  Arsenal got the ball at the back and we retreated to the halfway line and refused to engage; they struggled to work out what to do.  In fact they looked at their most dangerous when we had numbers forward in attack - which wasn't very often.  And when we had the ball at the back we went long/direct/lumped it 95% of the time, minimising the opportunity for them to win the ball back in our half. It wasn't pretty, but effective.  I'll be interested to see if we try it more often next season when we player teams like Man City or whether Ralph still thinks our best chance of a result is or normal approach. 

[Sarisbury Saint]

37 minutes ago, The Left Back said:

100% this.  Ralph, like other topics on this forum, brings out strong views that are largely entrenched.  When we do well we hear from one lot, when. we do badly we hear from another lot - both driven by confirmation bias.  And there is a third group that I think you and I are members of @Lord Duckhunter. We don't agree on much but I think we both said early on that we need to judge him at the end of the season (unless he got poached or we were bottom 3 in March if I remember).  I think you would have replaced him last summer whereas I wanted too see how things went this year. I'm guessing I'm more positive about him than you but mid-May is the time for that conversation.

It was noticeable to me Saturday that we did to Arsenal what some teams often do to us.  Arsenal got the ball at the back and we retreated to the halfway line and refused to engage; they struggled to work out what to do.  In fact they looked at their most dangerous when we had numbers forward in attack - which wasn't very often.  And when we had the ball at the back we went long/direct/lumped it 95% of the time, minimising the opportunity for them to win the ball back in our half. It wasn't pretty, but effective.  I'll be interested to see if we try it more often next season when we player teams like Man City or whether Ralph still thinks our best chance of a result is or normal approach. 

Play it against Liverpool and stop them winning the league and I couldn’t care less if we lost all our other games.