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Central Midfield Depth

Dusic

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Dusic

Dusic

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Anyone else feel this has gone from our strongest looking position to weakest, depth wise, within about 6 months?

 

We essentially have two proper centre mids in the first team squad, plus JWP who can only play in a midfield three.

 

Hard to see any situation where Romeu and Hojbjerg wouldn't start every single game this season in all comps when fit as the quality drop is too great to ever leave them out unless we get a lower league side in the FA Cup.

 

 

However the injuries and suspensions inevitably hit (probably during our winnable run in December) who will come in? Presume the likes of Slattery, who has been marginalised? Stephens? Danso? Not really PL quality options...

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Gordon Mockles

Gordon Mockles

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Anyone else feel this has gone from our strongest looking position to weakest, depth wise, within about 6 months?

 

We essentially have two proper centre mids in the first team squad, plus JWP who can only play in a midfield three.

 

Hard to see any situation where Romeu and Hojbjerg wouldn't start every single game this season in all comps when fit as the quality drop is too great to ever leave them out unless we get a lower league side in the FA Cup.

 

 

However the injuries and suspensions inevitably hit (probably during our winnable run in December) who will come in? Presume the likes of Slattery, who has been marginalised? Stephens? Danso? Not really PL quality options...

 

Yes. Totally. Aside from Ings, Romeu, Djenepo, Bertrand & possibly Boufal, we don’t really have many PL calibre players. Commented similar on the Hojbjerg thread (who I think is poor). I think it is as simple as selling off players and loaning our flops & totally neglecting your squad development. In fact, our squad development & transfer policy seems to be based entirely on the academy and crossed fingers. Simple, basic, neglect. I am totally in the CB Fry camp (if memory serves me right) on the idiocy & the utterly incomprehensible stupidity of our management leaving the Danso transfer to the last min and not addressing full backs after selling Targett and not having back up for Bertrand, an arrogant tw*t of a player (but decent defender) whom we have had constant temper mental issues with. Hence the ludicrous staring line which lost us the Bournemouth match.

 

I’m really pleased with Tuesday’s result but I genuinely fear the remaining season when injuries happen because we will really suffer the effects of our negligence. Whims and hopes are not ideal match winners.

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TWar

TWar

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Aside from Ings, Romeu, Djenepo, Bertrand & possibly Boufal, we don’t really have many PL calibre players. Commented similar on the Hojbjerg thread (who I think is poor).

 

The ability of some of our fans to appraise the quality of our players (and that of other teams in the league) is laughable sometimes. We don't have a single player in our first 11 who isn't capable of starting for atleast one other prem team. Most of our team would start for most of the bottom half of the table comfortably. That means it is PL calibre. Also what is this list, it includes Djenepo and Ings who have had 2 good games this season each and misses out our best players. Redmond is an excellent player and would start for anyone outside the top 6 (and probably united nowadays, definitely better than Lingard), as is Bednarek. JWP too is comfortably prem quality. Gotta assume from that list that you have been a fan for all of 5 games, judging by how ridiculously short term that list is, and if so, welcome!

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

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Will Smallbone played a lot in pre season, so Ralph was clearly having a look at him. We also have Slattery who can play there on the odd occasion and Stephens / Danso if desperate. Problem is the massive drop off in quality rom Hojbjerg, Romeu, and JWP to the likes of Slattery/Danso/Stephens/Smallbone.

 

We could probably cope for the odd game, but if Romeu or Hojbjerg got injured for a few months it would be a real concern.

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Saint Troy

Saint Troy

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Will Smallbone played a lot in pre season, so Ralph was clearly having a look at him. We also have Slattery who can play there on the odd occasion and Stephens / Danso if desperate. Problem is the massive drop off in quality rom Hojbjerg, Romeu, and JWP to the likes of Slattery/Danso/Stephens/Smallbone.

 

We could probably cope for the odd game, but if Romeu or Hojbjerg got injured for a few months it would be a real concern.

 

or maybe ralph feels slattery/smallbone could do a job like valery did last year, surprise us all. Not sure thats the thinking - probably more money/getting players out related - but ralph may be more comfortable with it than we are

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Baird of the land

Baird of the land

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I feel JWP has shown he's capable of filling in for the odd game.

I'd be worried though if it was anything more than that currently.

Slattery has huge potential and between now and Jan i'd hope the club would decide whether he can fill the void or whether they have to go into the transfer market (permanent/or loan) to fill the void left by Lemina's ugly departure.

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Gordon Mockles

Gordon Mockles

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The ability of some of our fans to appraise the quality of our players (and that of other teams in the league) is laughable sometimes. We don't have a single player in our first 11 who isn't capable of starting for at least one other prem team. Most of our team would start for most of the bottom half of the table comfortably. That means it is PL calibre. Also what is this list, it includes Djenepo and Ings who have had 2 good games this season each and misses out our best players. Redmond is an excellent player and would start for anyone outside the top 6 (and probably united nowadays, definitely better than Lingard), as is Bednarek. JWP too is comfortably prem quality. Gotta assume from that list that you have been a fan for all of 5 games, judging by how ridiculously short term that list is, and if so, welcome!

 

The ability of our fans to recognise a point (or miss) is laughable at times. I was talking about the midfield. We have done the defence to death and this was a new topic which is valid. The low levels of expectation, realism and bewildering inability to accept contrary opinions on this message board is also laughable at times.

 

I forgot Redmond so relax a little. Bednarek is a decent blocker but, in case you missed the point, I was talking about the midfield. Gotta assume you're about 5 by your level of comprehension but well done. Could do better. ;o)

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10i

10i

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Unfortunately it is just like that - and with Romeu and Hojbjerg we know the suspensions will come...

Lemina made himself unkeepable and Slattery didn't yet know/understand what it means to be in a RH-Team. He will get the Chance to come back, if, but only if, RH feels there has been a Change in his attitude. Maybe Smallbone will get a look instead, but yeah, noone knows how he will cope.

JWP is totally out of his depth if asked to Play as one of two DM.

Though Hojbjerg doesn't impress right now, there seems to be no alternative...

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TWar

TWar

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Posted
The ability of our fans to recognise a point (or miss) is laughable at times. I was talking about the midfield. We have done the defence to death and this was a new topic which is valid. The low levels of expectation, realism and bewildering inability to accept contrary opinions on this message board is also laughable at times.

 

I forgot Redmond so relax a little. Bednarek is a decent blocker but, in case you missed the point, I was talking about the midfield. Gotta assume you're about 5 by your level of comprehension but well done. Could do better. ;o)

You literally mentioned Ings and bertrand in your comment. In fact in your list you only mentioned one midfielder as well as three forwards and a defender. This is one of the most embarrassing back peddles I have ever seen.

 

Sent from my G3311 using Tapatalk

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pimpin4rizeal

pimpin4rizeal

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Still think Armstrong is very underrated and could do a job there he’s always been played in more attacking positions for us but with Celtic box to box mf was his strongest position and he has a decent engine decent pace can beat players and also is good at arriving in the box late and scoring.. me personally I actually think he would be a upgrade on jwp but don’t seem like Ralph agrees

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egg

egg

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or maybe ralph feels slattery/smallbone could do a job like valery did last year, surprise us all. Not sure thats the thinking - probably more money/getting players out related - but ralph may be more comfortable with it than we are

Smallbone hasn't been in the 1st team or u23 squads. Not sure if he's injured.

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Dusic

Dusic

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Still think Armstrong is very underrated and could do a job there he’s always been played in more attacking positions for us but with Celtic box to box mf was his strongest position and he has a decent engine decent pace can beat players and also is good at arriving in the box late and scoring.. me personally I actually think he would be a upgrade on jwp but don’t seem like Ralph agrees
Not sure he could replace Romeu. He is too lightweight and not secure enough in possession.

 

Would imagine Slattery is next in line. Anyway, sure we will find out soon enough.

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pimpin4rizeal

pimpin4rizeal

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Not sure he could replace Romeu. He is too lightweight and not secure enough in possession.

 

Would imagine Slattery is next in line. Anyway, sure we will find out soon enough.

 

Yeah agree on him not being a direct romeau replacement, probably more our lemina replacement in a way that can make runs and be box to box and creative.. in his last sun appearance he made a lung bursting sprint run to get in a good position and he’s pretty rapid too.. I like Armstrong a lot and think like boufal he’s better then some of the players in front of him.. just needs a run in the team imo,

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Suhari

Suhari

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My understanding was we had someone lined up, so long as we shifted Lemina before the UK deadline, but we didn't.

 

Would make sense.

 

There was a seemingly out of the blue link no to a French (I think) DM, who seemed to fit our criteria, about 3 weeks before the window shut. Can't remember her s name.

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saint si

saint si

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Posted
The ability of some of our fans to appraise the quality of our players (and that of other teams in the league) is laughable sometimes. We don't have a single player in our first 11 who isn't capable of starting for atleast one other prem team. Most of our team would start for most of the bottom half of the table comfortably. That means it is PL calibre. Also what is this list, it includes Djenepo and Ings who have had 2 good games this season each and misses out our best players. Redmond is an excellent player and would start for anyone outside the top 6 (and probably united nowadays, definitely better than Lingard), as is Bednarek. JWP too is comfortably prem quality. Gotta assume from that list that you have been a fan for all of 5 games, judging by how ridiculously short term that list is, and if so, welcome!

 

200 (almost) premier league appearances at 24 pretty much makes JWP the definition of a premier league quality player. People have tendency to look at the best players as the benchmark of what is "PL calibre", instead of looking at the mediocre/worst players.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

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And yet we’re happy to spend 30m on two rubbish ones.....

 

A sound point.

Look at the money we HAVE spent on Lemina, Carillo, Elyounoussi...we could be buying a £50million player for that! Not saying we should, but if £15million is what £7-8million was a few years ago, then £30million is what we should be looking to spend on those players we believe can take us up a level.

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Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Posted
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Fulham

Bournemouth

Palace

Newcastle

West ham

Everton

Leicester

Wolves

 

These are all the big power house boys out spending us on a single player. Once they all "do a Pompey" we (Shef United, Brighton, Watford with 20m players) can be in the top 10

 

Until clubs below us show more ambition again of course.

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Gordon Mockles

Gordon Mockles

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200 (almost) premier league appearances at 24 pretty much makes JWP the definition of a premier league quality player. People have tendency to look at the best players as the benchmark of what is "PL calibre", instead of looking at the mediocre/worst players.

 

Not really. You just don’t agree. I class him as a good championship player. Some of the lower rated PL clubs may be happy with a signing like JWP as Villa were with Targett but everyone has different aspirations. I never thought JWP was bad and he’s a good set piece taker & has a decent engine but I think he lacks the attacking prowess (I won’t say shooting ability because that’s obviously a form thing) & forward, threaded attacking balls to have him first choice but, as the initial post intimated, we are thing in depth & quality.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

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Not really. You just don’t agree. I class him as a good championship player. Some of the lower rated PL clubs may be happy with a signing like JWP as Villa were with Targett but everyone has different aspirations. I never thought JWP was bad and he’s a good set piece taker & has a decent engine but I think he lacks the attacking prowess (I won’t say shooting ability because that’s obviously a form thing) & forward, threaded attacking balls to have him first choice but, as the initial post intimated, we are thing in depth & quality.

 

JWP would be a contender for player of the season in the Championship if he played there at this stage in his career. He is a good midtable player right now, on a good day he performs like a top 6 midfielder.

With a couple of years left to go before he hits the traditional "peak" of a players career, I think we could yet see him be a standout player for us.

 

Oakley was revered on here but he was never better than a midtable player, fyi. JWP is only 2 years away from his 10 year mark in the first team, with potentially another 7 or 8 years after that still able to play (or longer, as his game doesn't revolve around pace).

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Red

Red

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JWP would be a contender for player of the season in the Championship if he played there at this stage in his career. He is a good midtable player right now, on a good day he performs like a top 6 midfielder.

With a couple of years left to go before he hits the traditional "peak" of a players career, I think we could yet see him be a standout player for us.

 

Oakley was revered on here but he was never better than a midtable player, fyi. JWP is only 2 years away from his 10 year mark in the first team, with potentially another 7 or 8 years after that still able to play (or longer, as his game doesn't revolve around pace).

 

Personally think JWP is ok - not great but ok. Trouble is can we afford to upgrade him? Very much doubt we can/will spend 30 to 40M which is what it will take and even then it's a risk. Ralph clearly does not want any one older than 24 at most, so that limits the options, and as far as I can see there is no one emerging from the youngsters (Slattery?? seems Ralph has gone off him). Sad reality of poor/average kids playing in a rich man's play ground I guess.

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qwertyell

qwertyell

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It's a bleak situation. We've only got three senior central midfielders in a team that usually plays three central midfielders. There's no wiggle room for the manager - if they're fit, they play.

 

But Romeu, Hojbjerg and Ward-Prowse don't compliment each other at all. None of them can pass the ball forwards, so we have no creativity from the midfield at all. And none of them can run - they're consistently five yards behind the play in both boxes; can't supplement the attack with late runs into dangerous positions, can't track back when the opposition counters.

 

They just plod around in no man's land as the game goes on around them.

 

It's a big problem, and it's only going to get worse as injuries and suspensions come along. Imagine having to play Slattery, Smallbone and Armstrong as a three! I can't see how the club won't move for someone in January - there was no point getting Lemina and Reed off the wage bill if it was going to leave us with only the bare bones of a barely functional midfield.

 

Sent from my F3311 using Tapatalk

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Gordon Mockles

Gordon Mockles

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JWP would be a contender for player of the season in the Championship if he played there at this stage in his career. He is a good midtable player right now, on a good day he performs like a top 6 midfielder.

With a couple of years left to go before he hits the traditional "peak" of a players career, I think we could yet see him be a standout player for us.

 

Oakley was revered on here but he was never better than a midtable player, fyi. JWP is only 2 years away from his 10 year mark in the first team, with potentially another 7 or 8 years after that still able to play (or longer, as his game doesn't revolve around pace).

 

Good point and perhaps I was a trifle harsh as Ralph has him playing great earlier on but I just felt he lacked that attacking impetus for me. I take back the premier league comment as in retrospect, that was ill thought as he’s clearly a staple PL player but I’d have been better served saying not my first choice of PL midfielder in my squad. More a squad player. I’d have preferred more of an attacking, box to box threat such as Lemina was at his best for us.

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Mosin

Mosin

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It's a bleak situation. We've only got three senior central midfielders in a team that usually plays three central midfielders. There's no wiggle room for the manager - if they're fit, they play.

 

But Romeu, Hojbjerg and Ward-Prowse don't compliment each other at all. None of them can pass the ball forwards, so we have no creativity from the midfield at all. And none of them can run - they're consistently five yards behind the play in both boxes; can't supplement the attack with late runs into dangerous positions, can't track back when the opposition counters.

 

They just plod around in no man's land as the game goes on around them.by

 

It's a big problem, and it's only going to get worse as injuries and suspensions come along. Imagine having to play Slattery, Smallbone and Armstrong as a three! I can't see how the club won't move for someone in January - there was no point getting Lemina and Reed off the wage bill if it was going to leave us with only the bare bones of a barely functional midfield.

 

Sent from my F3311 using Tapatalk

 

 

https://www.southamptonfc.com/first-team#season-stats

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norwaysaint

norwaysaint

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When we had Schneiderlin, Wanyama and Cork, with the competence of Davis thrown in, I remember thinking we had a midfield equal to any in the PL, they were that good. For me it was the reason we were a real PL force for a while. Whatever happened to those players after they left, we were passing, winning the ball and creating like no other time I have ever watched Saints, including the early eighties. It's sad that just a few seasons later we are back to having a midfield that just barely scrapes average, but a strong midfield is that thing that most clubs are constantly chasing and only four or five ever really have. We were lucky while it lasted.

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Gordon Mockles

Gordon Mockles

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I can't see how the club won't move for someone in January - there was no point getting Lemina and Reed off the wage bill if it was going to leave us with only the bare bones of a barely functional midfield.

 

Sent from my F3311 using Tapatalk

 

I can. The club have blagged their way through 3 transfer windows, changing the parameters & dangling the carrot to to the fans to maintain ticket sales. The Echo club mouthpiece now saying that we used up our budgets last season (on one freakingly negligent & risky last minute loan with Danso) which is absolutely laughable. Gao is in charge and he will lead us to relegation. The squad is thread bear in quality & depth.

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