Saints 1-2 Liverpool - Reaction

[Heisenberg]

text ‘SFCReport’ to 60060

 

 

[Whitey Grandad]

So here you are accusing the refereeing corps of favouritism and partiality? They might even sue you if any of them notice this post.

 

I don’t know that it is a conscious bias but there must be some explanation for yesterday’s performance.

[Window Cleaner]

I don’t know that it is a conscious bias but there must be some explanation for yesterday’s performance.

 

I saw all of the game, didn't look to be any much bias to me. Romeu was booked for a professional foul as he should have been.

I think most of the reaction comes from a very disappointing result for Saints and the average fan's hatred of Liverpool.

Liverpool played poorly and Saints didn't take advantage of it. At the end of the day their quality players exploited mistakes by Bednarek and Bertrand. You see things on Canal + that you people in the ground just don't see.

Edited 18 August, 2019 by Window Cleaner

[Charlie Wayman]

Like a couple of others on here I was a referee. VA should have been a game changer but all that will happen is that referees will cheat in areas of the pitch where VAR is not in play, Romeu's booking yesterday, He was dominating the midfield and that had to stop, hence the bookings. The referees are well aware of the results the premier league require, the Premier league is sold around the world on the back of Liverpool Man, Utd and Chelsea etc. not Southampton Watford and Norwich. Referees income depend on the Premier league, they are not going to bite the hand that feeds them.

 

Rubbish! "You don't know what you're talking about"

[OttawaSaint]

I saw all of the game, didn't look to be any much bias to me. Romeu was booked for a professional foul as he should have been.

I think most of the reaction comes from a very disappointing result for Saints and the average fan's hatred of Liverpool.

Liverpool played poorly and Saints didn't take advantage of it. At the end of the day their quality players exploited mistakes by Bednarek and Bertrand. You see things on Canal + that you people in the ground just don't see.

 

Romeu won the ball cleanly. Mané and Milner both got away with nasty fouls that usually have a referee immediately reaching for a yellow. Heck Djenepo got a yellow for his first foul.

[Window Cleaner]

Rubbish! "You don't know what you're talking about"

 

It's just knee jerk stuff anyway, still if a manager said that it would probably cost him 30 or 40 K.

[whelk]

did we have more shots on goal that was not shown on the live stream?

 

XG was higher

[whelk]

Oh my, you really are an utter bell end. Do you really have nothing better to do that come on here and spit garbage to wind people up? People like you really are a waste of resources and frankly should be put down.

 

Watch it with the threats. His life has already been threatened and incredibly the mods dismissed it as no potential danger.

[Nordic Saint]

Interesting stats:

 

Vestergaard didn’t complete a single tackle and also made no blocks.

 

https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league/southampton/southampton-fans-slam-jannik-vestergaard-for-his-performance-against-liverpool

[Batman]

Interesting stats:

 

Vestergaard didn’t complete a single tackle and also made no blocks.

 

https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league/southampton/southampton-fans-slam-jannik-vestergaard-for-his-performance-against-liverpool

 

that is because he is shyte

[Give it to Ron]

that is because he is shyte

 

Of course he is he is playing in a bottom 3 lower premiership team what do you expect VVD?

 

 

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[Batman]

Of course he is he is playing in a bottom 3 lower premiership team what do you expect VVD?

 

 

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there many levels between Vestergaard and the best CB in the world

[Whitey Grandad]

Romeu won the ball cleanly. Mané and Milner both got away with nasty fouls that usually have a referee immediately reaching for a yellow. Heck Djenepo got a yellow for his first foul.

 

Romeu’s tackle looked clean to me and nowhere near a yellow no matter how long Atkinson had to think it over. Djenepo got sent three feet in the air by a late lunge but no punishment for the offender.

[Whitey Grandad]

I saw all of the game, didn't look to be any much bias to me. Romeu was booked for a professional foul as he should have been.

I think most of the reaction comes from a very disappointing result for Saints and the average fan's hatred of Liverpool.

Liverpool played poorly and Saints didn't take advantage of it. At the end of the day their quality players exploited mistakes by Bednarek and Bertrand. You see things on Canal + that you people in the ground just don't see.

 

I was at the game . Romeu's tackle could never be considered a professional foul because it was not far outside their penalty area. As has been said before, it looked clean to most of us.

 

You will well know that I will usually support the referee but there definitely seemed to me to be a bias. Not so much especially in the handing out of sanctions. We were only awarded six fouls in the whole game.

[Manuel]

I would rather have had a free kick for every "advantage" the ref played yesterday. Did us no favours.

[doddisalegend]

Interesting stats:

 

Vestergaard didn’t complete a single tackle and also made no blocks.

 

https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league/southampton/southampton-fans-slam-jannik-vestergaard-for-his-performance-against-liverpool

 

I'm not going to claim he is great or anything but as I watched him pull off a successful tackle, right in front of me, late in the game I have to question the accuracy of the stats.

[Pat from Poole]

Interesting stats:

 

Vestergaard didn’t complete a single tackle and also made no blocks.

 

https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league/southampton/southampton-fans-slam-jannik-vestergaard-for-his-performance-against-liverpool

 

He is shockingly bad.

[Saint Fan CaM]

Thought we played ok, but there are just too many Championship level players in the squad...mainly at the back and attack. You can get away with one or two, but we’re too weak. I thought Armstrong improved the team when he came on and should started the game instead of JWP who is less able to move the ball forward.

[alehouseboys]

It was something to build on, a point at least at Brighton would be handy looking at the next couple of fixtures after.

[doddisalegend]

Thought we played ok, but there are just too many Championship level players in the squad...mainly at the back and attack. You can get away with one or two, but we’re too weak. I thought Armstrong improved the team when he came on and should started the game instead of JWP who is less able to move the ball forward.

 

We looked more dangerous and direct with Armstrong and Mossua at the end of the game I'm not sure that's argument to have started the game with them though.

 

Ralph seems to have set up to be defensively solid ( or at least as much as he could with the options available to him but that's another story) and then planned a late attacking flurry towards the end of the game once pool tired on the back of a mid week game.

 

I quite like Armstrong but he has proved to be a bit of a liability in his defensive duties and tends to give the ball away in dangerous places starting with him probably wouldn't have been a good idea.

 

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[tajjuk]

Interesting stats:

 

Vestergaard didn’t complete a single tackle and also made no blocks.

 

https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league/southampton/southampton-fans-slam-jannik-vestergaard-for-his-performance-against-liverpool

 

What's funny though is when our centre-backs make blocks and last ditch tackles, people say its because they are out of position and are not reading the game.

 

He made no blocks or tackles according to whoscored, but he did make 2 interceptions and 7 clearances. Only Bednerak made one more interception and no one made more clearances.

 

Out of all 3 centre-backs they only made 2 tackles between them.

 

Also should be noted that Bertrand made no tackles, no interceptions, no blocks and no clearances.

 

Also Van Dijk made no tackles in the game either.

 

So looking in at a few stats in isolation without context makes for a stupid argument IMO, especially when you back it up with opinions of idiots on twitter.

 

At the end of the day, though we conceded two goals. 1 was from an amazing shot that was pretty much perfect (it was not only top corner, hit early, but it also evaded the attempts to block it) and another from a shot (which I think was outside the box) that was largely down to losing possession from a throw in, so was easily avoidable. (and wasn't Vestergaards fault)

 

Which meant against that Liverpool side with Mane, Salah and Firminho, the team/defence only allowed them to create ONE decent chance all game. (the one Firminho fluffed on the counter in 2nd half)

 

Seems a bit harsh to start calling people useless based on that IMO.

[Badger]

So looking in at a few stats in isolation without context makes for a stupid argument IMO, especially when you back it up with opinions of idiots on twitter.

 

At the end of the day, though we conceded two goals. 1 was from an amazing shot that was pretty much perfect (it was not only top corner, hit early, but it also evaded the attempts to block it) and another from a shot (which I think was outside the box) that was largely down to losing possession from a throw in, so was easily avoidable. (and wasn't Vestergaards fault)

 

Seems a bit harsh to start calling people useless based on that IMO.

 

Interesting analysis.

 

One point though re their second goal, it was Bednarek who lost possession but when watching the highlights later the 'challenge' from Vestergaard was pretty weak as Firmino skipped past him. I'd apportion the blame for that goal to be with Bednarek (had that been Stephens there would be uproar) but it did highlight how frail we are at the back.

[Wes Tender]

So here you are accusing the refereeing corps of favouritism and partiality? They might even sue you if any of them notice this post.

 

Perhaps they would also like to ask the club for video footage of the several thousand of our fans chanting "you don't know what you're doing" at Marriner, and sue them too.

[DT]

Vestergard looked like a lumbering giant with the mobility of a bucket of warm tar

[tajjuk]

Interesting analysis.

 

One point though re their second goal, it was Bednarek who lost possession but when watching the highlights later the 'challenge' from Vestergaard was pretty weak as Firmino skipped past him. I'd apportion the blame for that goal to be with Bednarek (had that been Stephens there would be uproar) but it did highlight how frail we are at the back.

 

Bednerak was given the 'error leading to goal' stat I am pretty sure, but yeh Vestegaard failed to block the shot (along with someone else IIRC) though generally blocking is something he does quite well.

 

I am not particularly saying he had a great game or is even that good, but I find it odd he is made out to be some sort of a scapegoat where the team played one of the best attacks in the league and actually limited them to very few chances.

 

The reality is for us to beat a team like Liverpool, we need to take our chances and need a little luck. A team like theirs will create chances against the best defences, so restricting them to what? One long shot, one shot from the edge of the box and one genuine chance on the break (when we were pushing for an equaliser) is not bad.

 

Fine margins, both goals were inches away from being blocked which could have prevented the goals. Mane's cut inside and shot managed to evade I think two block attempts, a little luck one of those connects and it could have prevented the goal.

 

A the other end we needed a bit more quality/luck with our finishes and we could have had 3 goals easy, excluding the one gifted to us.

 

But that is the quality difference, top players like Mane and Firminho find the corners top corners, whilst someone a little more raw like Adams puts his header over or one of our best chances, a free header 5 yards out falls to a centre back.

[John Boy Saint]

I think the fact that this thread has only reached 3 and a half pages of comment after the first game of a brand new season shows just how far, we as supporters, have been ground down over the past 3 seasons to not expect much else from 90 minutes of Saints playing Football.

First half we did indeed look to be at the races and had a few chances, but got stung right on half time by a shot that we know Mane has in his portfolio and in reality not many could have stopped that, having watched the footage PEH tried to close him down but that is the kind of shooting ability big money buys you.

Second half there was a spell where you just watched Liverpool players amusing themselves with the ball and we were just chasing shadows, that just pulled into focus the mire our recruitment in more recent years has put us in......... but

You can drill the players on the training pitch until the cows come home into pressing the ball playing "the Net" but that is a false scenario. On the training pitch you are up against players you know who will do things you expect them to do with less ferocity than a proper opposition. Having been at the game Saturday then watching the extended match choice highlights on Sky in the evening, something Liverpool have in bucket loads compared to us is anticipation. Most of our team had played together last season so were not strangers, Liverpool were a team made up mainly with players who had played together much of last season. Maybe it is a case of you get what you pay for, but for 2 teams who have played a lot of football together the fluidity of Liverpool was on a different level to ours, their players anticipated where the other was going to be, we were a bit more reactionary to where a team mate was especially in the second half. Until we suddenly got gifted a goal - then it was almost like "oh we could get something out of this game" and rather that thinking about what we were doing we started playing football with the sole purpose of getting a equaliser at least. With Footballers not being renowned for being the sharpest pencils in the box, all this technical attention to detail being applied is possibly clouding their basic thoughts to just play football.

As for the comment made by PEH about being "disgusting to play against" when Vestergaard flattened Salah, ref saw nowt in it, Jan must have known there was no head contact and we should not have put it out but carried on playing...... be disgusting.

Redmond needs to learn that when he has bust a lung getting up field chasing the ball beyond the oppos back line bust it some more to get back onside, the number of times he ambles back with the ball whistling back over his head from one of our players beggars belief - oh and when we are chasing the game and a ball to be thrown in is at your feet don't wait for the ball throwing team mate to amble up to take it, take it yourself and move - at some point this season we are going to surprise the crowd and the opposition by taking a throw in before either of us 2 are ready for it!

At one point in the second half I did wonder what I had done by signing up for another 19 days of wasted expectation, (and subsequently watching extended highlights of some of the other games over the weekend) it is only the second game of the season and my glass is still half full.

[Baird of the land]

What's funny though is when our centre-backs make blocks and last ditch tackles, people say its because they are out of position and are not reading the game.

 

He made no blocks or tackles according to whoscored, but he did make 2 interceptions and 7 clearances. Only Bednerak made one more interception and no one made more clearances.

 

Out of all 3 centre-backs they only made 2 tackles between them.

 

Also should be noted that Bertrand made no tackles, no interceptions, no blocks and no clearances.

 

Also Van Dijk made no tackles in the game either.

 

So looking in at a few stats in isolation without context makes for a stupid argument IMO, especially when you back it up with opinions of idiots on twitter.

 

At the end of the day, though we conceded two goals. 1 was from an amazing shot that was pretty much perfect (it was not only top corner, hit early, but it also evaded the attempts to block it) and another from a shot (which I think was outside the box) that was largely down to losing possession from a throw in, so was easily avoidable. (and wasn't Vestergaards fault)

 

Which meant against that Liverpool side with Mane, Salah and Firminho, the team/defence only allowed them to create ONE decent chance all game. (the one Firminho fluffed on the counter in 2nd half)

 

Seems a bit harsh to start calling people useless based on that IMO.

 

The changes to the laws in recent years have meant tackles have vastly reduced.

[Saint_clark]

I think the fact that this thread has only reached 3 and a half pages of comment after the first game of a brand new season shows just how far, we as supporters, have been ground down over the past 3 seasons to not expect much else from 90 minutes of Saints playing Football.

 

Yep, outside of the 90 minutes I don't really care anymore. I just can't get excited about aiming to finish above 17th and that being the limit of our ambition. If we went down again i'd be much more invested in a promotion push, even if we were slacking and ended up challenging for play-offs.

They've ruined football for the majority of fans in this country.

[Charlie Wayman]

I think the fact that this thread has only reached 3 and a half pages of comment after the first game of a brand new season shows just how far, we as supporters, have been ground down over the past 3 seasons to not expect much else from 90 minutes of Saints playing Football.

 

Perhaps most fans were fairly happy with our performance and did not see the need to come on here and join the usual nay-sayers in a melt down?

[doddisalegend]

Interestingly up beat from the guardian about our weekends performance.

 

Another game, another defeat for Southampton but all associated with the team should take encouragement from how they performed against Liverpool. The hosts more than matched their opponents during the first half and, while somewhat overwhelmed after the interval, they stayed in the contest and ultimately came within a firmer Danny Ings touch of snatching a draw. What generally impressed about Southampton’s display was their balance and organisation within a 3-5-2 formation. Everybody looked comfortable in their respective positions and there is a definite gameplan: stay compact, press at the right times and stretch the play whenever possible. In that regard Yan Valery looks as if he could be a particularly potent weapon for Ralph Hasenhüttl’s side. The 20-year-old was a consistently threatening presence on the right wing and it was from his excellent cross that Southampton could have, and should have, equalised. Sachin Nakrani

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2019/aug/19/premier-league-10-talking-points-weekend-action

 

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[tajjuk]

The changes to the laws in recent years have meant tackles have vastly reduced.

 

Well also to do a tackle really someone has to try and dribble past you, and that doesn't happen often, and modern footballers are so good that usually when they are in danger of being tackled they pass or they attempt to shoot (meaning you would then need a block, interception or a clearance)

 

Even the most prolific dribblers only attempt like 5-7 a game, which could be all over the pitch so anyone could tackle them. SO you are unlucky to see a player with multiple tackles per game, like 6-7 is going to be most you will see from one player.

 

Also DMs are the ones usually that have the most because if you have CBs having to do multiple tackles a game it means the opposition are constantly running at your centre-backs which is not good.

[John Boy Saint]

I'd rather ditch the back 3 now and just let Bednarek and Danso form a partnership. We've tried so many combinations, that one has the most pace and chance of improving. So stick with it, least it means we'd have extra in midfield and attack.

Pace - Have you actually seen Bednarek chasing back against an oppo player he gets buffeted about in their slipstream, you want Danso next to Yoshida primarily for educational purposes to start with. Until Danso is taken out of his box Yoshida remains the fastest centre back at the club.

[Nordic Saint]

I'd rather ditch the back 3 now and just let Bednarek and Danso form a partnership. We've tried so many combinations, that one has the most pace and chance of improving. So stick with it, least it means we'd have extra in midfield and attack.

 

I agree. The only reason we need a third central defender is to cover for Vestergaard. With two central defenders with pace, we wouldn't need one.