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VAR - A useful reminder


Faz
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Watching VAR in recent action, I can't help but think that the ridiculous amount of time it takes in certain instances, that it will be bad for the spectator. Maybe it is just teething problems, but taking 2 or 3 minutes to make a decision is far too long.

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good read that thank you - weirdly pleased by reading that - seems largely sensible. Obviously wont be perfect and not everyone can be happy but they appear to have considered some of its flaws and how to keep some sort of game flow which has to be appreciated

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Feel a lot more positive about VAR after reading that, thanks for sharing.

 

I still think the “phases of play” thing is a worry. Like Salah not being flagged offside when we played Liverpool last season but Keita’s goal still standing because it was in the next “phase”. That just seems unfair on defenders who have executed a perfect defensive line in order to end an attack and win possession back for their team. Linesmen aren’t going to flag so it puts a LOT more pressure on defences.

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I'm still not convinced by the 22 second delay to a game. Some of the Women's WC was ridiculous - several minutes a half. But I guess we'll find out soon enough, and the principle of it all is of course positive.

The main issue with VAR under the FIFA and UEFA remit is that there is a pitchside monitor and the on-field referee is often encouraged to go and review incidents him/herself, and that's after the initial conversation over the comms system, so it naturally takes quite a long time to go through the whole process.

 

My understanding of the Premier League's implementation is that there is no pitchside monitor. If a decision is reviewable, the on-field referee stops play at a suitable moment and in conversation with the video referee, they make the decision between them, although in reality it's likely to be the video referee overruling the on-field referee as the latter won't have the pictures available, but it seems highly unlikely that any decision should take more than 30-40 seconds, depending on how quickly that 3D offside "line" can be calculated and drawn on-screen.

 

Even in cricket, where the DRS system works very well and is a pretty mature process now, the reason they go through the process in the order that they do for LBW decisions is because the Hawkeye system that does the projected path of the ball takes around a minute or more to calculate.

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The main issue with VAR under the FIFA and UEFA remit is that there is a pitchside monitor and the on-field referee is often encouraged to go and review incidents him/herself, and that's after the initial conversation over the comms system, so it naturally takes quite a long time to go through the whole process.

 

My understanding of the Premier League's implementation is that there is no pitchside monitor. If a decision is reviewable, the on-field referee stops play at a suitable moment and in conversation with the video referee, they make the decision between them, although in reality it's likely to be the video referee overruling the on-field referee as the latter won't have the pictures available, but it seems highly unlikely that any decision should take more than 30-40 seconds, depending on how quickly that 3D offside "line" can be calculated and drawn on-screen.

 

Even in cricket, where the DRS system works very well and is a pretty mature process now, the reason they go through the process in the order that they do for LBW decisions is because the Hawkeye system that does the projected path of the ball takes around a minute or more to calculate.

 

there is a pitch side monitor for var

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I think it will ruin the joy of scoring a goal which afterall is what football is all about.

 

When a team scores you will have to wait a minute or maybe more before you will know if it stands or not.

 

I thought when the idea of VAR was 1st thought about it was to change clear and obvious mistakes by the match officials, something that should be clear in 30 seconds. Now it seams that VAR will review a goal, penalty etc even if there has been no clear mistake.

 

You cant expect a referee to get something 100% correct if it takes VAR 1 or 2 minutes using varoius angles and slow motions to enventually get to a decision.

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I think it will ruin the joy of scoring a goal which afterall is what football is all about.

 

When a team scores you will have to wait a minute or maybe more before you will know if it stands or not.

 

I thought when the idea of VAR was 1st thought about it was to change clear and obvious mistakes by the match officials, something that should be clear in 30 seconds. Now it seams that VAR will review a goal, penalty etc even if there has been no clear mistake.

 

You cant expect a referee to get something 100% correct if it takes VAR 1 or 2 minutes using varoius angles and slow motions to enventually get to a decision.

 

I agree. It can ruin the whole tempo of the game. In my view if the teams are back and ready to kick off then the game should restart. It should never have to be held up for VAR.

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On screen clips at all grounds apart from Anfield and Old Trafford. That’s handy!

 

Exactly my reaction. Arguably the two highest profile stadiums in the league don't have "big screens" seems suspicious. Instead they'll use advertising hoardings and PA announcements lol. So much for transparency.

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Exactly my reaction. Arguably the two highest profile stadiums in the league don't have "big screens" seems suspicious. Instead they'll use advertising hoardings and PA announcements lol. So much for transparency.

 

OMG! I thought that was a joke.

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The main issue with VAR under the FIFA and UEFA remit is that there is a pitchside monitor and the on-field referee is often encouraged to go and review incidents him/herself, and that's after the initial conversation over the comms system, so it naturally takes quite a long time to go through the whole process.

 

My understanding of the Premier League's implementation is that there is no pitchside monitor. If a decision is reviewable, the on-field referee stops play at a suitable moment and in conversation with the video referee, they make the decision between them, although in reality it's likely to be the video referee overruling the on-field referee as the latter won't have the pictures available, but it seems highly unlikely that any decision should take more than 30-40 seconds, depending on how quickly that 3D offside "line" can be calculated and drawn on-screen.

 

Even in cricket, where the DRS system works very well and is a pretty mature process now, the reason they go through the process in the order that they do for LBW decisions is because the Hawkeye system that does the projected path of the ball takes around a minute or more to calculate.

 

Unless the video ref says "it's tight, come and have a look yourself" or the pitch ref says "let me see, I'll come up and have a look at it myself". This could be a 5 minute job.

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On a related note, The Economist put together a handy graph on the use of VAR in various leagues.

20180630_WOC940.png

 

Interesting to see that the number of penalties dropped slightly with VAR, in the European leagues at least. I would have assumed the opposite from what happened in the men's and women's World Cups.

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Look at any match thread on this forum and a ton of posts are complaints about ref decisions. VAR will be far from perfect too initially, but anything that in any way resolves the Fergy's ref issue is worth a try.

I'm looking forward to it. Especially after reading that article, thanks for posting it!

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agree with the sentiments, I am all for VAR but would not like to celebrate a goal 2 minutes after it has been scored.

 

perhaps we should leave a margin for error (like Cricket does with umpires call?), or in a way where any offside that isn't clear at first sight should just be accepted- when we start having conversations about whether the arm is offside/scenario where the head is offside by 2mm etc then i think it gets ridiculous...

 

when VAR should be used is when it is clear and obvious... e.g. Gabbiadini's goal against Utd in league cup final. So, the lino should always let play go on when offside becomes fractional- he should only flag when it is, perhaps 1 yard or more clearly offside.

 

after all we want goals right (scored by saints hehe)

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The was a really good discussion on The Debate on sky sports earlier this week.

 

Neil Swarbrick explained how identical incidents in different games could still lead to different outcomes. In the case of serious foul play VAR will ask the ref to explain what he saw and what colour card he is giving.If VAR could confirms what the ref saw they won’t ague with his interpretation of Red or Yellow offence.

 

There will still be controversy and debate, but fewer “hand of God goals”

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I'm quite happy to wait to celebrate a goal, though I'm dreading that moment when we score what looks like a good goal, and then you see the VAR call....

How long before we get one disallowed for some offence so minor it wouldn't even have been a foul last year?

All I hope for is balance - the problem will be when the 'big' clubs start getting a benefit, but that won't be VAR's fault, the system just delivers images, it will be the fault of the official.

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