The United Kingdom and the Death of Boris Johnson as we know it.

[badgerx16]

  On 19/01/2023 at 09:37, spyinthesky said:

It is interesting the comment you make on Corporation Tax.
I was initially in favour of increasing Corporation Tax as a way of ensuring profitable companies paid a fair share of tax to help pay for the  increasing demands on Govt spending.
However it is noticeable that the Irish economy has blossomed since their Govt drastically cut Corporation Tax and attracted a whole raft of new businesses.

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Also, Ireland have free movement of workers with the EU, and common trading arrangements. Just imagine if we had had something similar.............

[Lord Duckhunter]

Tamesaint.
 

The  public want other people to pay more tax for better services. 

Edited 19 January, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[Turkish]

  On 19/01/2023 at 12:54, Lord Duckhunter said:

Tamesaint.
 

The  public want other people to pay more tax for better services. 

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aintforever once boldy claimed he'd be quite happy to pay more tax. I'm sure there will be other likeminded people who will put themselves forward.

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 13:07, Turkish said:

aintforever once boldy claimed he'd be quite happy to pay more tax. I'm sure there will be other likeminded people who will put themselves forward.

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I'm an unashamed liberal democrat. Quite happy to pay a bit more for a fairer society with better public services. I have no time for self serving Tories wanting to pay a bit less with a "fuck the rest of them" mentality. 

[Turkish]

  On 19/01/2023 at 13:36, egg said:

I'm an unashamed liberal democrat. Quite happy to pay a bit more for a fairer society with better public services. I have no time for self serving Tories wanting to pay a bit less with a "fuck the rest of them" mentality. 

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Yet you as well as I have both been previously labelled on here as racist, right wing, Trump supporting Tommy Robinson fan boys?

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 14:00, Turkish said:

Yet you as well as I have both been previously labelled on here as racist, right wing, Trump supporting Tommy Robinson fan boys?

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Indeed!! 

[whelk]

  On 19/01/2023 at 13:36, egg said:

I'm an unashamed liberal democrat. Quite happy to pay a bit more for a fairer society with better public services. I have no time for self serving Tories wanting to pay a bit less with a "fuck the rest of them" mentality. 

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Exactly. Everyone wants to keep their money but if people who can afford don’t give up some of their wealth you make for a shitty society. 
I am not clamouring for tax cuts as there are clearly services that need that injection to get them back performing as they used to. 

Edited 19 January, 2023 by whelk

[Tamesaint]

  On 19/01/2023 at 12:54, Lord Duckhunter said:

Tamesaint.
 

The  public want other people to pay more tax for better services. 

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Let's see. I cannot see the Tories winning at the next election if they  come up with tax cuts but fail to solve the current NHS issues.

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 15:30, whelk said:

Exactly. Everyone wants to keep their money but if people who can afford don’t give up some of their wealth you make for a shitty society. 
I am not clamouring for tax cuts as there are clearly services that need that injection to get them back performing as they used to. 

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Absolutely. Tax cuts is the last thing the country needs. It's a mess out there. The fairies don't pay for services, and borrowing has to reduce rather than increase. 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 15:43, Tamesaint said:

Let's see. I cannot see the Tories winning at the next election if they  come up with tax cuts but fail to solve the current NHS issues.

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Trying to cut tax and solve the NHS crisis is like trying to reduce your calorie intake but bulk up. Ridiculous notion and anyone calling for it needs to give their heads a wobble. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 19/01/2023 at 15:51, egg said:

Trying to cut tax and solve the NHS crisis is like trying to reduce your calorie intake but bulk up. Ridiculous notion and anyone calling for it needs to give their heads a wobble. 

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Anyone who wants to put more money in the NHS without fundamental reform needs to give their head a wobble. 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 16:04, Lord Duckhunter said:

Anyone who wants to put more money in the NHS without fundamental reform needs to give their head a wobble. 

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I've never suggested it doesn't need reform Duck. It does. It's fucked. It also needs more cash, and tax revenue is needed to provide that cash. 

[Turkish]

  On 19/01/2023 at 16:31, egg said:

I've never suggested it doesn't need reform Duck. It does. It's fucked. It also needs more cash, and tax revenue is needed to provide that cash. 

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Sounds like social care is even more fucked. A friend of mine is fairly senior in the local NHS, he said of 300 beds in his hospital 100 of them are taken up by people who should be in social care. 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 16:56, Turkish said:

Sounds like social care is even more fucked. A friend of mine is fairly senior in the local NHS, he said of 300 beds in his hospital 100 of them are taken up by people who should be in social care. 

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Absolutely. It's a an absolute mess. Nobody on either side are willing, yet, to point to the brexit/lack of staff issue. 

[AlexLaw76]

  On 19/01/2023 at 16:31, egg said:

I've never suggested it doesn't need reform Duck. It does. It's fucked. It also needs more cash, and tax revenue is needed to provide that cash. 

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It also needs to fit the model that money it gets does fund.  Cant do that though, oh no

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 19/01/2023 at 16:56, Turkish said:

Sounds like social care is even more fucked. A friend of mine is fairly senior in the local NHS, he said of 300 beds in his hospital 100 of them are taken up by people who should be in social care. 

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Largely because social care / care at home is run by private companies trying to squeeze as much as they can out of the money they receive from local authorities, which means wages stay low and attraction / retention of workers is incredibly hard.

No carers, no patients in beds, so they have to stay in hospital which has the knock on effect of no one moving to beds within the hospitals and backlogs at A&E etc....

Sort out social care and many issues in the NHS get resolved....

[whelk]

  On 19/01/2023 at 17:08, egg said:

Absolutely. It's a an absolute mess. Nobody on either side are willing, yet, to point to the brexit/lack of staff issue. 

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Central Govt has starved Local Govt, who fund social care, since 2010. Some have made noises about need to solve but is fucked and getting worse.

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 17:20, AlexLaw76 said:

It also needs to fit the model that money it gets does fund.  Cant do that though, oh no

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Personally, I think it needs to have zero political allegiance and sit independently from both government and the public sector, something like how the BOE operates. Let them sort it out properly, and fund it accordingly. 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 17:37, whelk said:

Central Govt has starved Local Govt, who fund social care, since 2010. Some have made noises about need to solve but is fucked and getting worse.

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Multitude of issues Whelk. It's the amount of cash filtering down, then what's done with it. Housing benefit, social services (child side) is a huge burden, and social care seems to come low down in the priority stakes. Definitely getting worse sadly. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 19/01/2023 at 17:38, egg said:

Personally, I think it needs to have zero political allegiance and sit independently from both government and the public sector, something like how the BOE operates. Let them sort it out properly, and fund it accordingly. 

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The only way you’ll get politics out of the NHS is to privatise it. if there’s tax payers money involved, there’s politics in it. Thinking the opposition won’t blame the government for poor service or governments take the credit for great service, is for the birds.

There’s also the accountability question, who is a accountable for poor service, an unelected quango? If you don’t like the way the NHS is being run, vote the Government out. Don’t like the service your private company offers, move to another one. How do the public show their displeasure at the unelected independent quango’s running of the NHS. I presume they’ll pressure the Government to remove/change them. Hey presto, politics is back in it.

 

The only way it’ll work is mixture of private and public provision. The NHS offers a basic service, with people paying for additional services. We should encourage more people to go private. 
 

 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 18:05, Lord Duckhunter said:

The only way you’ll get politics out of the NHS is to privatise it. if there’s tax payers money involved, there’s politics in it. Thinking the opposition won’t blame the government for poor service or governments take the credit for great service, is for the birds.

There’s also the accountability question, who is a accountable for poor service, an unelected quango? If you don’t like the way the NHS is being run, vote the Government out. Don’t like the service your private company offers, move to another one. How do the public show their displeasure at the unelected independent quango’s running of the NHS. I presume they’ll pressure the Government to remove/change them. Hey presto, politics is back in it.

 

The only way it’ll work is mixture of private and public provision. The NHS offers a basic service, with people paying for additional services. We should encourage more people to go private. 
 

 

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You'll never get a successful hybrid system imo. Private or public, don't do a mash a la dentists. 

On the accountability point, the BOE works. It's decisions impact all of us. It makes it decisions as required. It will stand on the governments toes as required. There is no reason why something remote from the government and private sector can't work with health. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 19/01/2023 at 18:16, egg said:

You'll never get a successful hybrid system imo. Private or public, don't do a mash a la dentists. 

On the accountability point, the BOE works. It's decisions impact all of us. It makes it decisions as required. It will stand on the governments toes as required. There is no reason why something remote from the government and private sector can't work with health. 

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They have decent mixed systems in many  European countries. Why on Earth are we incapable of doing so in England? 

 BoE is owned  by the Government. The Government appoint all its senior policymakers & Parliament sets its goals and responsibilities. It what way has the BoE been taken out of politics? It’s like trying to claim the US Supreme Court is apolitical. 

[egg]

  On 19/01/2023 at 20:01, Lord Duckhunter said:

They have decent mixed systems in many  European countries. Why on Earth are we incapable of doing so in England? 

 BoE is owned  by the Government. The Government appoint all its senior policymakers & Parliament sets its goals and responsibilities. It what way has the BoE been taken out of politics? It’s like trying to claim the US Supreme Court is apolitical. 

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I'll rephrase. Why should we adopt a hybrid system if we can remodel the NHS and make it workable as a state operated model? The rail system is a hybrid system and it's appalling.

The BoE does operate autonomously. It sets rates which influence government policy, not vice versa. 

[rallyboy]

People voted for Johnson as one of his many promises to win their support was 40 new hospitals and 50,000 new nurses.

With all that pretty much sorted now these little backlog hiccups will reduce very quickly.

 

 

 

[Lord Duckhunter]

  On 19/01/2023 at 20:13, egg said:

  On 19/01/2023 at 20:13, egg said:

 

The BoE does operate autonomously. It sets rates which influence government policy, not vice versa. 

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The BoE does operate autonomously. It sets rates which influence government policy, not vice versa. 

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The Monetary Policy Committee sets interest rates based on the remit letter sent by the chancellor . Monetary policy is set by the bank (owned by the Government) in direct response to a remit set by the Government. If the Government changed the remit, interest rates would change. 

[revolution saint]

  On 19/01/2023 at 13:36, egg said:

I'm an unashamed liberal democrat. Quite happy to pay a bit more for a fairer society with better public services. I have no time for self serving Tories wanting to pay a bit less with a "fuck the rest of them" mentality. 

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I may have you confused with someone else but didn't you vote for Brexit?  Not many unashamed liberal democrat brexiteers around - you must have been a collectors item.  Apologies if it wasn't you and not really having a dig - just seemed a strange combination.

[egg]

  On 20/01/2023 at 15:20, revolution saint said:

I may have you confused with someone else but didn't you vote for Brexit?  Not many unashamed liberal democrat brexiteers around - you must have been a collectors item.  Apologies if it wasn't you and not really having a dig - just seemed a strange combination.

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Yes I did. And I'm ashamed of that! 

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 20/01/2023 at 15:41, egg said:

Yes I did. And I'm ashamed of that! 

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“I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.”
 

Bit late now, of course, but welcome.

[The Left Back]

  On 20/01/2023 at 15:41, egg said:

Yes I did. And I'm ashamed of that! 

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Fair play to you for owning that. There’s not enough of that sort of honesty on here (not just about Brexit).

[Sheaf Saint]

 

[Turkish]

  On 28/01/2023 at 14:23, Sheaf Saint said:

 

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This will Be comedy gold 🤣🤣

[Sheaf Saint]

  On 28/01/2023 at 22:08, Turkish said:

This will Be comedy gold 🤣🤣

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She should get Nathan Jones on as a guest at some point...

Mad Nad interviews Mad Nate 😉

[Turkish]

  On 28/01/2023 at 22:25, Sheaf Saint said:

She should get Nathan Jones on as a guest at some point...

Mad Nad interviews Mad Nate 😉

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Let’s hope whoever she asks her first question to as a presenter answers “why are you asking me that question” 🤣

 

 

[Tamesaint]

  On 28/01/2023 at 22:08, Turkish said:

This will Be comedy gold 🤣🤣

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  On 28/01/2023 at 14:23, Sheaf Saint said:

 

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Nadine and Boris together on the same show!! It will be Guided Missile's dream team. He will have it on catch up so that he can crack one out whilst watching again and again and again.....

Edited 28 January, 2023 by Tamesaint

[badgerx16]

Another one bites the dust.

Zahawi sacked as party Chair.

 

[rallyboy]

But he's done nothing wrong...was the official line, right up until yesterday.

And if Rishi was alarmed by Zahawi's tax affairs he's gonna freak if someone tells him about the PPE contracts.

 

 

[whelk]

I was speaking recently with a very senior tax inspector and they were adamant that the level of fine for Zahawi was very significant ie never ever applied to something just ‘careless’ and clearly been trying to defraud the govt he serves. Good riddance to the smarmy fucker

[sadoldgit]

  On 29/01/2023 at 09:28, badgerx16 said:

Another one bites the dust.

Zahawi sacked as party Chair.

 

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Finally, the right decision! But if he had any shred of decency he would have resigned. Yet another legacy of the Johnson era. Sadly we still have to wait a while before we can vote out this corrupt, self serving bunch of miscreants. 

[Tamesaint]

At least Tory MPs rejected Zahawi as a potential leader last summer when he stood for the leadership and only 25 MPs voted for him. Perhaps they knew he was a tax crook.

The mind boggles however at the thought of a tax cheat and liar thinking he can be Conservative leader and Prime Minister. That could never happen could it? 

[SotonianWill]

  On 29/01/2023 at 10:15, Tamesaint said:

At least Tory MPs rejected Zahawi as a potential leader last summer when he stood for the leadership and only 25 MPs voted for him. Perhaps they knew he was a tax crook.

The mind boggles however at the thought of a tax cheat and liar thinking he can be Conservative leader and Prime Minister. That could never happen could it? 

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whilst it has been known about his tax affairs for some time, i’m just confused about the decision to make him party chair without (if you believe sunak) him ever being challenge or told about the allegations. 

[Tamesaint]

  On 29/01/2023 at 10:22, SotonianWill said:

whilst it has been known about his tax affairs for some time, i’m just confused about the decision to make him party chair without (if you believe sunak) him ever being challenge or told about the allegations. 

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I agree. Making him Chancellor, in charge of HMRC amongst other things, when he was in dispute with HMRC about his taxes smacks of either sheer incompetence or plain corruption. 

[badgerx16]

  On 29/01/2023 at 10:30, Tamesaint said:

I agree. Making him Chancellor, in charge of HMRC amongst other things, when he was in dispute with HMRC about his taxes smacks of either sheer incompetence or plain corruption. 

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Probably both.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Another widely known about scandal, with a political party once again dragged kicking and screaming every step of the way to make the decision anyone with a shred of decency would have made from the outset. Corrupt and self serving to the last.

[Turkish]

Poor bloke makes an honest mistake and pays for it with his job. What a disgrace the Tories are even worse are the hyenas baying for blood 

Edited 29 January, 2023 by Turkish

[badgerx16]

  On 29/01/2023 at 12:17, Turkish said:

Poor bloke makes an honest mistake and pays for it with his job. What a disgrace the Tories are even worse are the hyenas baying for blood 

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It's not as if the multi, multi, millionaire would even notice the loss of his ministerial salary from his total annual income. He's probably dropped that much down the back of his sofa. Hardly 'losing his job'.

As the head of HMRC told the HoC committee, "We don't fine people for honest mistakes'.

Edited 29 January, 2023 by badgerx16

[ecuk268]

Just read his reply to Sunak.

Basically says how wonderful he's been, no admitting his "mistake", no apology, just has a moan about the press. 

[badgerx16]

  On 29/01/2023 at 16:01, ecuk268 said:

Just read his reply to Sunak.

Basically says how wonderful he's been, no admitting his "mistake", no apology, just has a moan about the press. 

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The press that he threatened with Legal action when they started to ask questions and prepared to publish.

[SotonianWill]

  On 29/01/2023 at 16:01, ecuk268 said:

Just read his reply to Sunak.

Basically says how wonderful he's been, no admitting his "mistake", no apology, just has a moan about the press. 

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he has done a good job politically thus far, but wasn’t the time to be talking about that. He should own up to what he did and frankly should have resigned from any ministerial position as soon as he was charged the penalty. 

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 29/01/2023 at 17:48, SotonianWill said:

he has done a good job politically thus far, but wasn’t the time to be talking about that. He should own up to what he did and frankly should have resigned from any ministerial position as soon as he was charged the penalty. 

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A good job?

Have you forgotten his train crash as the chancellor?

[SotonianWill]

  On 29/01/2023 at 17:58, Weston Super Saint said:

A good job?

Have you forgotten his train crash as the chancellor?

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in terms of the actual job (not the backstabbing) it has to be said you cannot overturn a long term cost of living crisis and inflation in 2 months as chancellor, many of which were in prime ministerial limbo, so in my view didn’t fully tarnish his political career.