The United Kingdom and the Death of Boris Johnson as we know it.

[buctootim]

5 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

You vote to elect an MP and your MP is now voting to elect a leader. Seems fair to me, regardless of party allegiances.

They arent though. A self selecting unrepresentative 2% of the electorate are choosing our PM. The MPs are mostly just voting to put forward the candidate who promised them the best job. We don't have an elected Head of State so the minimum necessary is an elected PM. 

Edited 13 July, 2022 by buctootim

[whelk]

14 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

You vote to elect an MP and your MP is now voting to elect a leader. Seems fair to me, regardless of party allegiances.

Is it bollocks. Mordaunt and others now saying shrink the state etc. was absolutely none of that in the manifesto. These thick cunts in Stoke are getting even further away from whatever they thought foolishly the Tories would give them. Still 2 years should expose whatever inept candidate secures the vote. Just whether Starmer can convince he is a better alternative which shouldn’t be difficult if they just listen to Alastair Campbell and not get caught up in culture war shite

[Winnersaint]

Edited 13 July, 2022 by Winnersaint

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, buctootim said:

They arent though. A self selecting unrepresentative 2% of the electorate are choosing our PM. The MPs are mostly just voting to put forward the candidate who promised them the best job. We don't have an elected Head of State so the minimum necessary is an elected PM. 

As I asked a little earlier in the thread, if a PM has to give up due to ill health mid term, does that, or should that, require a GE ?

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

Is it bollocks. Mordaunt and others now saying shrink the state etc. was absolutely none of that in the manifesto.

1) "Shrink the State" is standard Tory mantra/dogma.

2) Most of what a Government does during it's term will not have been in it's manifesto. As it is, a manifesto is a combination of aspirations, smokescreens, and bald faced lies.

[moonraker]

1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

As I asked a little earlier in the thread, if a PM has to give up due to ill health mid term, does that, or should that, require a GE ?

A question, when was the last time PM entered and left Parliament via a general election?

 

[Saint in Paradise]

 

Being old and doddery with a bad memory I am not sure that I am correct but didn't that Maurdaunt person back

that Portsmouth team, who went under, against HMRC when HMRC was owed at least £30 million?

Didn't she also ignore the plight of some local businesses that went bust because they were also owed money by

the same Portsmouth team?

IF I am correct I wonder why no-one seems to mention that during the bun fight to become your next P.M. as surly it

doesn't put her in a good light IF I am correct?

[CB Fry]

5 hours ago, moonraker said:

A question, when was the last time PM entered and left Parliament via a general election?

 

I think Heath in the 1970s.

Never in my lifetime and I've been voting since 97.

[Whitey Grandad]

7 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

As I asked a little earlier in the thread, if a PM has to give up due to ill health mid term, does that, or should that, require a GE ?

It doesn’t but in my view it should.

[Whitey Grandad]

5 hours ago, moonraker said:

A question, when was the last time PM entered and left Parliament via a general election?

 

John Major didn’t become PM in 1990 via a General Election but he did win one in 1992 and then lost to Blair in 1997. He did resign as Party Leader temporarily in 1995.

[CB Fry]

Theresa May and Boris Johnson are creating an exciting new trend, which was pretty rare/non-existent until May did it.

They both came to power outside of an election, and lost power outside of an election, but still managed to lead their party to an election in the middle of it.

Never really happened before and now two in a row.

[badgerx16]

3 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

It doesn’t but in my view it should.

Why ? The governing Party's mandate remains valid, and the electorate do not elect the PM, he/she is appointed by the Monarch.

 

Edit: the scenario of a PM resigning on ill health grounds mid-term is exactly what happened in 1923 when Andrew Bonar Law got cancer and was replaced by Stanley Baldwin. Bonar Law himself had become PM the previous year without a GE when he replaced David Lloyd George, who had lost the confidence of his Conservative Party coalition allies.

There was also the resignation of Macmillan in 1963, replaced by Alec Douglas-Home without a GE. And of course, the most famous example:- Churchill replacing Chamberlain when he wasn't even leader of a party.

 

Edited 14 July, 2022 by badgerx16

[Lighthouse]

1 hour ago, CB Fry said:

Theresa May and Boris Johnson are creating an exciting new trend, which was pretty rare/non-existent until May did it.

They both came to power outside of an election, and lost power outside of an election, but still managed to lead their party to an election in the middle of it.

Never really happened before and now two in a row.

We’re basically the Watford of democracy.

[Lord Duckhunter]

12 hours ago, buctootim said:

Not right though is it> Not right when Brown became PM without one and not right now. 

 

12 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

You vote to elect an MP and your MP is now voting to elect a leader. Seems fair to me, regardless of party allegiances.

Correct. 
 

You don’t vote for a PM in a General election, so don’t understand why people think a change should result in one? 

[Whitey Grandad]

23 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

 

Correct. 
 

You don’t vote for a PM in a General election, so don’t understand why people think a change should result in one? 

The so-called election mandate is interpreted differently by the Prime Minister who when manoeuvred into position then choose a cabinet to suit their own ideas as to what the country should have forced upon them.

A different Prime Minister means a totally different government which is rarely the one that the country thought they were voting for.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The so-called election mandate is interpreted differently by the Prime Minister who when manoeuvred into position then choose a cabinet to suit their own ideas as to what the country should have forced upon them.

A different Prime Minister means a totally different government which is rarely the one that the country thought they were voting for.

Exactly.  People can be as pedandic as they want, but when people vote they do vote for a PM and a government.

[Lighthouse]

2 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Exactly.  People can be as pedandic as they want, but when people vote they do vote for a PM and a government.

No, that’s what they WANT to vote for but whether you like it or not, you’re voting to elect an MP. You aren’t choosing a cabinet or appointing any ministerial position, including the PM.

[trousers]

7 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

No, that’s what they WANT to vote for but whether you like it or not, you’re voting to elect an MP. You aren’t choosing a cabinet or appointing any ministerial position, including the PM.

You are, of course, technically correct (MLG would approve of your factual tenacity, for example  ) but others are also correct when they say that 'most' people ignore this when voting and are more influenced by the party figurehead rather than who their propsective local rep (MP) is.  So, let's all have a group hug and agree that everyone has a valid point  #makelovenotwar

Edited 14 July, 2022 by trousers

[Sheaf Saint]

4 minutes ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Exactly.  People can be as pedandic as they want, but when people vote they do vote for a PM and a government.

They love to play up on identity politics when it suits them. In a GE campaign, the leaders of both main parties will dress it up as a simple, US presidential style binary choice between me or him/her, as exemplified by David Cameron's infamous "chaos with Ed Miliband" tweet.

Then when situations like this arise, they fall back on the old "ah but you weren't technically voting for a PM" argument.

[Whitey Grandad]

12 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

No, that’s what they WANT to vote for but whether you like it or not, you’re voting to elect an MP. You aren’t choosing a cabinet or appointing any ministerial position, including the PM.

That is the situation of course but the question is,

Is this right?

[Whitey Grandad]

8 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

They love to play up on identity politics when it suits them. In a GE campaign, the leaders of both main parties will dress it up as a simple, US presidential style binary choice between me or him/her, as exemplified by David Cameron's infamous "chaos with Ed Miliband" tweet.

Then when situations like this arise, they fall back on the old "ah but you weren't technically voting for a PM" argument.

As in “Vote Labour, get Jeremy Corbyn”

[trousers]

20 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

That is the situation of course but the question is,

Is this right?

Who decides what's right and what isn't? Maybe there are simply different ways of doing stuff in life, each with their own pros and cons....?

[Lord Duckhunter]

48 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

 

Then when situations like this arise, they fall back on the old "ah but you weren't technically voting for a PM" argument.

“Technically “ 😂 Dear god. Perhaps that’s why Corbyn lost so many seats, leftie half wits couldn’t find his name on their ballot paper. Perhaps they should teach this stuff in school. 
 

 

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

That is the situation of course but the question is,

Is this right?

Once we have become a Republic and removed the Royal Prerogative on Prime Ministerial appointments, then perhaps we can introduce directly elected PMs.

[whelk]

Just now, badgerx16 said:

Once we have become a Republic and removed the Royal Prerogative on Prime Ministerial appointments, then perhaps we can introduce directly elected PMs.

They should change the constitution to tighten up on cunts like Johnson and JRM who will do anything to cling to power.

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

 

A different Prime Minister means a totally different government which is rarely the one that the country thought they were voting for.

Is this the point where that old chestnut gets rolled out; The majority of votes cast did not go to the party in power, so have we really got the Government people thought they were voting for ?

[badgerx16]

2 minutes ago, whelk said:

They should change the constitution to tighten up on cunts like Johnson and JRM who will do anything to cling to power.

We don't have a constitution.

[whelk]

4 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

We don't have a constitution.

What do you call it then?

Edited 14 July, 2022 by whelk

[badgerx16]

4 minutes ago, whelk said:

What do you call it then?

We have a collection of Laws, Statutes, historical precedents, and established behaviours and protocols. Some is written, some interpreted, and some inferred. There is no such thing as "The Constitution of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

[whelk]

13 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

We have a collection of Laws, Statutes, historical precedents, and established behaviours and protocols. Some is written, some interpreted, and some inferred. There is no such thing as "The Constitution of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

Thanks MLG

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_United_Kingdom

[Whitey Grandad]

29 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Is this the point where that old chestnut gets rolled out; The majority of votes cast did not go to the party in power, so have we really got the Government people thought they were voting for ?

That’s a different argument but as democracies go, ours is flawed.

[Warriorsaint]

4 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

 

Correct. 
 

You don’t vote for a PM in a General election, so don’t understand why people think a change should result in one? 

It speaks. If only Farage was a candidate eh Duckie?, probably Cruella Bravaman would have your vote to blast all those boats back into the ocean and rescue Brexit 😆

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

As in “Vote Labour, get Jeremy Corbyn”

Technically it was 'Vote Labour, get the leader of the Labour party', that didn't have to be Corbyn and they could have had someone else in charge, but decided he was their 'best bet'.

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Warriorsaint said:

It speaks. If only Farage was a candidate eh Duckie?, probably Cruella Bravaman would have your vote to blast all those boats back into the ocean and rescue Brexit 😆

Is it in danger of not happening ?

[ecuk268]

28 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Is it in danger of not happening ?

You have doubts?

What about all of the benefits that we were promised.

We've got blue passports (although there was nothing stopping us having them before) and and and other things.......

 

[badgerx16]

5 minutes ago, ecuk268 said:

You have doubts?

What about all of the benefits that we were promised.

We've got blue passports (although there was nothing stopping us having them before) and and and other things.......

 

I didn't know it needed rescuing. What I find amusing is the various "special interest groups", such as farmers and fishermen, effectively coming out with "this is not the Brexit we voted for", but each having different perspectives on what has gone wrong.

Edited 14 July, 2022 by badgerx16

[saint1977]

Mad Nads caught out on Channel 4 - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-62178278

If you spend enough time with Boris, this is the result

[Sheaf Saint]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62192527

"No evidence" the deportation agreement with Rwanda is deterring migrants from crossing the channel.

Who could possibly have predicted that I wonder? 

[badgerx16]

21 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62192527

"No evidence" the deportation agreement with Rwanda is deterring migrants from crossing the channel.

Who could possibly have predicted that I wonder? 

We haven't actually sent anybody yet. ( Don't think we ever will ).

[whelk]

Daily Mail finding very hard to let go

 

[spyinthesky]

44 minutes ago, whelk said:

Daily Mail finding very hard to let go

 

Was Boris able to fit or was that one of Mad Nad's paid actors?

[Sheaf Saint]

2 hours ago, whelk said:

Daily Mail finding very hard to let go

 

[buctootim]

59 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

He's too late for PR stunts. Someone already pressed the ejector seat  

[Sheaf Saint]

He's about to miss his 3rd COBRA meeting on the heatwave, and a spokesperson is unable to say what he will be doing instead.

Not even bothering to pretend to care anymore. Too busy spaffing time and money up the wall on pointless photo-ops, and squeezing every last perk out of his job while he still can.

Edited 18 July, 2022 by Sheaf Saint

[AlexLaw76]

4 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

He's about to miss his 3rd COBRA meeting on the heatwave, and a spokesperson is unable to say what he will be doing instead.

Not even bothering to pretend to care anymore. Too busy spaffing time and money up the wall on pointless photo-ops, and getting squeezing every last perk out of his job while he still can.

Will you forget to have a drink, unless COBRA reminds you?

[whelk]

37 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Will you forget to have a drink, unless COBRA reminds you?

Just noticed your avatar. Do you like to black up? 

Sweet you still seem to have strong feelings for Boris. FYI it is not reciprocated. 

[whelk]

43 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

He's about to miss his 3rd COBRA meeting on the heatwave, and a spokesperson is unable to say what he will be doing instead.

Not even bothering to pretend to care anymore. Too busy spaffing time and money up the wall on pointless photo-ops, and getting squeezing every last perk out of his job while he still can.

He is a total cunt. Always has been. So much protection from media barons as should be all over the papers about his meeting Lebvedev. Not a buffoon a nasty bit of work

[Lord Duckhunter]

"Hasta la vista, baby"

[badgerx16]

45 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

"Hasta la vista, baby"

As they would put it in The Sopranos: " So long you fat fuck".

[rallyboy]

Mr Johnson is clearly unwell and has presumably been removed from office for his own wellbeing.

His delusion, and his general confusion between facts and what he claims has happened is quite alarming, and if it wasn't some poor washed-up saddo having a very public breakdown, some might find it hilarious.

The polite thing to do is to let him slip quietly away spouting self-congratulatory nonsense all the way to a padded cell, where he can then be given the meds and counselling that he so obviously requires.

What a sad end to a career that never started.