The United Kingdom and the Death of Boris Johnson as we know it.

[CB Fry]

There's been some absolute horseshit written on this thread but I take my hat off to the notion that "there is only a finite amount of money in the world at any one time".

Dear me.

[Turkish]

14 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

There's been some absolute horseshit written on this thread but I take my hat off to the notion that "there is only a finite amount of money in the world at any one time".

Dear me.

Even more reason not to support a public sector payrise, if they all get 3% who are they taking it from?

[whelk]

26 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Even more reason not to support a public sector payrise, if they all get 3% who are they taking it from?

They may use their new found wealth to buy your widgets. Btw Daily Mail championing the Tax Payers Alliance waste reports. They are like the US anti federalist lot - every penny we pay the public sector is money we waste. No comprehension of the multiplier effect but good to see they are spotting the ‘waste’. Get rid of the fcker who buys police truncheons and get police back on the beat. Sad thing is that many thick cunts lap this up.

Or even better let the private sector take it over. They hate wasting money cos they’re like efficient and all,  especially if it impacts their dividend.

Edited 23 November, 2020 by whelk

[aintforever]

53 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

There's been some absolute horseshit written on this thread but I take my hat off to the notion that "there is only a finite amount of money in the world at any one time".

Dear me.

How is that incorrect?

[Lord Duckhunter]

6 hours ago, aintforever said:

Of course you can to an extent, that's what tax has been doing for ages. At any one time there is only ever a finite amount of money - if a few people have most of it then most people will have less, that's simple maths.

 

You’ve been playing too much monopoly. 

[aintforever]

3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

You’ve been playing too much monopoly. 

Think you're confusing money with wealth.

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Turkish said:

Even more reason not to support a public sector payrise, if they all get 3% who are they taking it from?

Maybe it could come out of the payments made to the Government's pals who organise PPE contracts.

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, aintforever said:

How is that incorrect?

Quantitative easing is a simple answer.

You can learn more Here 

 

Edited 23 November, 2020 by Weston Super Saint

[aintforever]

54 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Quantitative easing is a simple answer.

You can learn more Here 

 

We can create more money every day but fact is at any one moment in time there is a finite amount in circulation. Anyway, my point was that if I build myself a website and make a Billion quid it is all money I have taken from other people, it’s just moved from their account to mine. By getting rich in itself I havn’t created any wealth.

[Turkish]

On 23/11/2020 at 13:36, whelk said:

They may use their new found wealth to buy your widgets. Btw Daily Mail championing the Tax Payers Alliance waste reports. They are like the US anti federalist lot - every penny we pay the public sector is money we waste. No comprehension of the multiplier effect but good to see they are spotting the ‘waste’. Get rid of the fcker who buys police truncheons and get police back on the beat. Sad thing is that many thick cunts lap this up.

Or even better let the private sector take it over. They hate wasting money cos they’re like efficient and all,  especially if it impacts their dividend.

NHS workers and low income workers to get payrises, not everyone else. That's fair. As Rishi points out whilst the private sector have been losing jobs public sector have mainly kept theirs. 

[whelk]

6 hours ago, Turkish said:

NHS workers and low income workers to get payrises, not everyone else. That's fair. As Rishi points out whilst the private sector have been losing jobs public sector have mainly kept theirs. 

I hate the fact that doctors are getting one. Seriously they earn a mint and far less deserving than guys working in social care and other areas with less profile. Who doesn’t love a doctor?

BS argument about private sector. We will get bonuses and pay rises soon. Many in there did fck all over the summer and still got paid. Imagine if they did that to the bin men?

[The Cat]

2 minutes ago, whelk said:

I hate the fact that doctors are getting one. Seriously they earn a mint and far less deserving than guys working in social care and other areas with less profile. Who doesn’t love a doctor?

BS argument about private sector. We will get bonuses and pay rises soon. Many in there did fck all over the summer and still got paid. Imagine if they did that to the bin men?

We got a clap one week I think as part of the other emergency services and could jump the queue into Costco with our ID Cards. We should just be grateful for that.

NHS pay award should be weighted. Crappy paid nurses and social carers get higher percentage. Don't forget that some GP's who already earn a fortune went and sat at home and did virtual consulting while their colleagues were in the thick of it. 

Spare a thought for cleaners who would have been knee deep in work at hospitals and are probably on zero hour contacts with no chance of a payrise. 

[Jonnyboy]

On 23/11/2020 at 14:05, Lord Duckhunter said:

You’ve been playing too much monopoly. 

Monopoly is Tory economic policy. 

[buctootim]

2 hours ago, whelk said:

I hate the fact that doctors are getting one. Seriously they earn a mint and far less deserving than guys working in social care and other areas with less profile. Who doesn’t love a doctor?

BS argument about private sector. We will get bonuses and pay rises soon. Many in there did fck all over the summer and still got paid. Imagine if they did that to the bin men?

Its an odd situation with medics. Basically we overwork them so retention is difficult, so we pay them more, so then they can afford to work part time instead of full time. Would be better to increase the numbers employed, reduce the pressure, improve quality of life and reduce pay imo.  Britain pays doctors 35% more than France and double what they earn in Spain. despite comparable levels of education and skills.  

[The Cat]

At this point they are just blatantly taking the piss out of the public.

It's impossible to buy anything vaguely expensive at our work without going through a convoluted procurement process while the Government hand out billions of pounds worth contracts to friends and associates without even blinking.

 

[Turkish]

13 hours ago, whelk said:

I hate the fact that doctors are getting one. Seriously they earn a mint and far less deserving than guys working in social care and other areas with less profile. Who doesn’t love a doctor?

BS argument about private sector. We will get bonuses and pay rises soon. Many in there did fck all over the summer and still got paid. Imagine if they did that to the bin men?

Not sure why it's a BS point about the private sector, whilst millions are or could lose their jobs in the public sector you've got relative security. My first job was actually a public sector one, back then it was generally accepted that whilst you got paid less than private sector you had the benefits of job security, a decent pension and decent working conditions with things like flexitime and a days extra holiday a month if you did 7 hours overtime a month more than your 37 hours a week contract, plus a pay rise every year. i've never seen anything like that in the private sector. If i get a pay rise early next year when we have our performance reviews it'll be because i've had to take on significantly more responsibility as we had to make a some redundancies from our management team this year. I'd also be doing that extra responsibility for almost a year for nothing as well as i mentioned before, no one in the company got a payrise in 2020.

[warsash saint]

1 hour ago, The Cat said:

At this point they are just blatantly taking the piss out of the public.

It's impossible to buy anything vaguely expensive at our work without going through a convoluted procurement process while the Government hand out billions of pounds worth contracts to friends and associates without even blinking.

 

Absolutely sickening the corruption in this Tory govt - the handing out of billions to Tory chums is a scandal & I can not believe that most of the country just sit back & accept it!

 

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, The Cat said:

At this point they are just blatantly taking the piss out of the public.

It's impossible to buy anything vaguely expensive at our work without going through a convoluted procurement process while the Government hand out billions of pounds worth contracts to friends and associates without even blinking.

 

You work with people you trust.

[Turkish]

2 minutes ago, warsash saint said:

Absolutely sickening the corruption in this Tory govt - the handing out of billions to Tory chums is a scandal & I can not believe that most of the country just sit back & accept it!

 

If you were going to give a multi million pound contract to someone, would you give it to someone you know and trust or someone you'd never heard of until a few weeks ago?

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Turkish said:

If you were going to give a multi million pound contract to someone, would you give it to someone you know and trust or someone you'd never heard of until a few weeks ago?

I would give it to somebody with experience in supplying the product.

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

I would give it to somebody with experience in supplying the product.

Weren't the government also slated earlier in all this because they wouldnt give contracts to companies who had never made ventilators before claiming they could make ones that worked perfectly? Guess they can do no right in some peoples eyes.

[rallyboy]

The marketing strategy has been pretty transparent for a few weeks now.

Monday is announce some vaccine progress day, start the week with some vague positivity. 👍

The other six days are about survival mode  - a new corruption or bullying scandal breaks every morning, just ignore the questions and try to make it through to Monday...all wrapped up in a shallow attack on Manchester to suggest that it's their own fault for answering back.

In the meantime the taxpayer cash is pouring out of the back door at an unprecedented rate.

Anyone want to defend the £22 billion?

[whelk]

4 hours ago, Turkish said:

Not sure why it's a BS point about the private sector, whilst millions are or could lose their jobs in the public sector you've got relative security. My first job was actually a public sector one, back then it was generally accepted that whilst you got paid less than private sector you had the benefits of job security, a decent pension and decent working conditions with things like flexitime and a days extra holiday a month if you did 7 hours overtime a month more than your 37 hours a week contract, plus a pay rise every year. i've never seen anything like that in the private sector. If i get a pay rise early next year when we have our performance reviews it'll be because i've had to take on significantly more responsibility as we had to make a some redundancies from our management team this year. I'd also be doing that extra responsibility for almost a year for nothing as well as i mentioned before, no one in the company got a payrise in 2020.

That’s just a comparison. I have worked for global oil giant and had all those sort of perks. They used to piss money away and overpay and give huge bonuses.

If the oil market contracts and pay rises etc are not as forthcoming I wouldnt have argued well the social workers better not get one either. 

Some truth in cliche that public sector has its share of lazy workers but equally they have some of the most dedicated staff not driven by remuneration like many of us. 

[warsash saint]

4 hours ago, Turkish said:

If you were going to give a multi million pound contract to someone, would you give it to someone you know and trust or someone you'd never heard of until a few weeks ago?

& they are the ONLY 2 options?? oh dear

[moonraker]

4 hours ago, Turkish said:

If you were going to give a multi million pound contract to someone, would you give it to someone you know and trust or someone you'd never heard of until a few weeks ago?

It’s called tendering, assessing the best value for money based on defined requirements and proven ability to deliver.  I know lots of people but I would not trust many of them to deliver multi million pound complex projects.  Just for clarity I have managed multi million pound projects in the private sector.

[Turkish]

5 minutes ago, moonraker said:

It’s called tendering, assessing the best value for money based on defined requirements and proven ability to deliver.  I know lots of people but I would not trust many of them to deliver multi million pound complex projects.  Just for clarity I have managed multi million pound projects in the private sector.

So have I, both as the buyer and seller. Which is why, like i said, you'd give them to people you can trust, "proven ability to deliver" i think you called it. Thanks for telling what a tender is though. 

Edited 26 November, 2020 by Turkish

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, warsash saint said:

& they are the ONLY 2 options?? oh dear

Maybe in your world pal, not in the real one. Point remains the same and moonraker pointed me out to be right whilst trying to prove me wrong.

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

That’s just a comparison. I have worked for global oil giant and had all those sort of perks. They used to piss money away and overpay and give huge bonuses.

If the oil market contracts and pay rises etc are not as forthcoming I wouldnt have argued well the social workers better not get one either. 

Some truth in cliche that public sector has its share of lazy workers but equally they have some of the most dedicated staff not driven by remuneration like many of us. 

I thought we were comparing the public sector with the private one? 

Not really very clever to use examples of wasting money in the private sector to prove a pro public sector point is it? How much has the public sector wasted in recent years? If there not driven by remuneration then not getting a payrise for once wont really upset them too much will it.

Edited 26 November, 2020 by Turkish

[moonraker]

31 minutes ago, Turkish said:

So have I, both as the buyer and seller. Which is why, like i said, you'd give them to people you can trust, "proven ability to deliver" i think you called it. Thanks for telling what a tender is though. 

Dont see any evidence of proven ability to deliver in the Tory sycophants who have been given contracts, nor any thing that resembles tendering.  Thanks for explaining corruption.

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, Turkish said:

Weren't the government also slated earlier in all this because they wouldnt give contracts to companies who had never made ventilators before claiming they could make ones that worked perfectly? Guess they can do no right in some peoples eyes.

Correct.

I guess a lot of people have forgotten that these contracts were given during a global pandemic when every man and his dog were scrabbling around trying to get their hands on PPE etc.  I guess these people don't understand the absolute rudimentaries of 'supply and demand' and the effect that has on price.  No doubt these are also the same people who were baying for blood back in March, shouting at whoever would listen that the same Government weren't doing enough to source PPE.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, moonraker said:

It’s called tendering, assessing the best value for money based on defined requirements and proven ability to deliver.  I know lots of people but I would not trust many of them to deliver multi million pound complex projects.  Just for clarity I have managed multi million pound projects in the private sector.

Yep, you're right, they should have undertaken a complete a thorough tender process during the global pandemic, it should be just about concluding by now and enabling us to place our first order for rubber gloves 

[moonraker]

26 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Yep, you're right, they should have undertaken a complete a thorough tender process during the global pandemic, it should be just about concluding by now and enabling us to place our first order for rubber gloves 

It is very easy to undertake rapid tendering in a week or two and demonstrate openness and fairness.  I find it amusing that your typical Tory moans about wasting taxpayers money until it’s the Elton Old Boys Club doing it, then everything is fine.  Transatlantic Trumpism. 
 

Edited 26 November, 2020 by moonraker

[Turkish]

39 minutes ago, moonraker said:

It is very easy to undertake rapid tendering in a week or two and demonstrate openness and fairness.  I find it amusing that your typical Tory moans about wasting taxpayers money until it’s the Elton Old Boys Club doing it, then everything is fine.  Transatlantic Trumpism. 
 

“Typical Tory” ✅

Eton old boys club ✅

mention trump ✅

moaning about others complaining about wasting tax payers money ✅

congratulations on a near faultless anti tory rant 

[Weston Super Saint]

45 minutes ago, moonraker said:

It is very easy to undertake rapid tendering in a week or two and demonstrate openness and fairness. 
 

It is, just not in the public sector and certainly not during a global pandemic. 

I wonder why the government felt it necessary to legislate against the lengthy procurement process in March?

https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-law/analysis/public-procurement-covid-19-pandemic

[whelk]

2 hours ago, Turkish said:

I thought we were comparing the public sector with the private one? 

Not really very clever to use examples of wasting money in the private sector to prove a pro public sector point is it? How much has the public sector wasted in recent years? If there not driven by remuneration then not getting a payrise for once wont really upset them too much will it.

You are using it as some justification that they shouldn’t have one that you might not get one. Private sector will reward accordingly as per the labour market and how much profits they are making. 
 

Yeah good point about remuneration, nurses aren’t in it for the money so let’s fck them over even more and let’s think about reducing their pay. 
 

 

 

[Turkish]

19 minutes ago, whelk said:

You are using it as some justification that they shouldn’t have one that you might not get one. Private sector will reward accordingly as per the labour market and how much profits they are making. 
 

Yeah good point about remuneration, nurses aren’t in it for the money so let’s fck them over even more and let’s think about reducing their pay. 
 

 

 

No, simply pointing out that the private sector isn't the promised land full of people getting double digit pay rises every year. I know a lot of people like to talk for other people but you can only speak from your own experience and in mine people dont get payrises just because they turn up to work everyday, they have to do something to earn them. 

Im not sure why you're ranting about nurses and on about reducing their pay, pretty strange response to it being pointed out that if asked the vast majority of nurses, coppers, firemen etc none of them would say they do those jobs for the money.

[The Cat]

2 hours ago, Turkish said:

No, simply pointing out that the private sector isn't the promised land full of people getting double digit pay rises every year. I know a lot of people like to talk for other people but you can only speak from your own experience and in mine people dont get payrises just because they turn up to work everyday, they have to do something to earn them. 

Im not sure why you're ranting about nurses and on about reducing their pay, pretty strange response to it being pointed out that if asked the vast majority of nurses, coppers, firemen etc none of them would say they do those jobs for the money.

Years ago a lot of people joined the Police for the pension. You could retire at 50 on a final salary pension with a decent lump sum payment and then walk back into a staff job. 

Now that's all gone, and unless you're pretty high up the ranks the pay isn't amazing. In fact a lot of people stop at Sgt now because with overtime they can earn more than their bosses who can't claim it for pay. 

The starting wage for a copper is so low now it's less then a PCSO earns. A lot of people take pay cuts because they are so desperate to join up. 

When I worked in the private sector the bonuses and pay rises were quite random. Some big, some non-existant. But one thing they all had over public sector was perks. Free stuff, jollies out, down the pub at lunchtime. Stick it on expenses? No problem. Half a day off to play golf? That's networking, off you go, have fun. 

People get overexcited in the Police if we get given a fucking pen that isn't one of the shit ones finance order us. Last year they gave everyone a water bottle and people were going nuts for them. It was like the crowd at St Mary's when they do that free pizza offer. 

[Turkish]

2 hours ago, The Cat said:

Years ago a lot of people joined the Police for the pension. You could retire at 50 on a final salary pension with a decent lump sum payment and then walk back into a staff job. 

Now that's all gone, and unless you're pretty high up the ranks the pay isn't amazing. In fact a lot of people stop at Sgt now because with overtime they can earn more than their bosses who can't claim it for pay. 

The starting wage for a copper is so low now it's less then a PCSO earns. A lot of people take pay cuts because they are so desperate to join up. 

When I worked in the private sector the bonuses and pay rises were quite random. Some big, some non-existant. But one thing they all had over public sector was perks. Free stuff, jollies out, down the pub at lunchtime. Stick it on expenses? No problem. Half a day off to play golf? That's networking, off you go, have fun. 

People get overexcited in the Police if we get given a fucking pen that isn't one of the shit ones finance order us. Last year they gave everyone a water bottle and people were going nuts for them. It was like the crowd at St Mary's when they do that free pizza offer. 

Like I said then people don’t do those sort of jobs for the money. All credit to them too. 

[whelk]

16 hours ago, The Cat said:

Years ago a lot of people joined the Police for the pension. You could retire at 50 on a final salary pension with a decent lump sum payment and then walk back into a staff job. 

Now that's all gone, and unless you're pretty high up the ranks the pay isn't amazing. In fact a lot of people stop at Sgt now because with overtime they can earn more than their bosses who can't claim it for pay. 

The starting wage for a copper is so low now it's less then a PCSO earns. A lot of people take pay cuts because they are so desperate to join up. 

When I worked in the private sector the bonuses and pay rises were quite random. Some big, some non-existant. But one thing they all had over public sector was perks. Free stuff, jollies out, down the pub at lunchtime. Stick it on expenses? No problem. Half a day off to play golf? That's networking, off you go, have fun. 

People get overexcited in the Police if we get given a fucking pen that isn't one of the shit ones finance order us. Last year they gave everyone a water bottle and people were going nuts for them. It was like the crowd at St Mary's when they do that free pizza offer. 

Indeed and FOIs make public sector execs even more scared. ‘They paid how much for team building’........and it was at a race course’?Put it on South Today for everyone to get frothed up about. I’d have more respect if the chief exec came out and said so fcking what everyone understands the benefits of team building days. Bones to the masses. Masses don’t get so animated about Capita execs with their mouths in the trough though. 
 

[buctootim]

2 hours ago, whelk said:

Indeed and FOIs make public sector execs even more scared. ‘They paid how much for team building’........and it was at a race course’?Put it on South Today for everyone to get frothed up about. I’d have more respect if the chief exec came out and said so fcking what everyone understands the benefits of team building days. Bones to the masses. Masses don’t get so animated about Capita execs with their mouths in the trough though. 
 

I used to work for a city council. My department of about 35 people had a Christmas party in the function room of a pub. Sit down dinner individually paid for in advance and a cash bar. The only thing the council paid for was the £75 room hire. Still made the front page of the local paper though 

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, buctootim said:

I used to work for a city council. 

No way!

[buctootim]

2 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

No way!

Predictable. I'm sure you think that shows something but my experience in contracting, purchasing and service commissioning was that the incompetence was in the highly paid employees of private companies. Many of them were earning two or three times what we were working for supposedly successful global players

Two of the 'highlights' of were Bouygues who were totally incapable of estimating how much it would cost to run a waste disposal contract for five years despite highly detailed specs. Their bid of £124m was less than a third of the next nearest tender and less than a quarter of the cost of running the service to spec. The team I worked in spent a couple of months drawing up a legally watertight contract they wouldnt be able to get out of when they realised after a few months they were losing money hand over fist. That saved the council about £375m. The second was in a hospital where McDonnell Douglas persuaded an idiot health minister to let them design a new patient administration system - which was going to be oh SO much better than the current public sector idiot designed system in place. Four years and a wasted £170m later they realised they couldnt even match the performance of what we already had.      

Edited 27 November, 2020 by buctootim

[Plastic]

This thread is living up to its title.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/22/worlds-media-ask-how-it-went-so-wrong-for-plague-island-britain-covid

[saint1977]

On 27/11/2020 at 20:08, buctootim said:

Predictable. I'm sure you think that shows something but my experience in contracting, purchasing and service commissioning was that the incompetence was in the highly paid employees of private companies. Many of them were earning two or three times what we were working for supposedly successful global players

Two of the 'highlights' of were Bouygues who were totally incapable of estimating how much it would cost to run a waste disposal contract for five years despite highly detailed specs. Their bid of £124m was less than a third of the next nearest tender and less than a quarter of the cost of running the service to spec. The team I worked in spent a couple of months drawing up a legally watertight contract they wouldnt be able to get out of when they realised after a few months they were losing money hand over fist. That saved the council about £375m. The second was in a hospital where McDonnell Douglas persuaded an idiot health minister to let them design a new patient administration system - which was going to be oh SO much better than the current public sector idiot designed system in place. Four years and a wasted £170m later they realised they couldnt even match the performance of what we already had.      

I’ve worked for both private and public sectors and good/bad in both. There is a strand in the private sector which I’ve been lucky enough to avoid to working for, but have come across the results of through commissioning and sub-contracting https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55349395

There’s a reason why hundreds of Conservative councils are taking services rapidly back in house https://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2013/08/nine-spectacular-council-outsourcing-failures

You will never convince posters like Weston as he like others on here - Alex Law - is ideologically wired automatically to believe one sector is better than the other despite the evidence. Fact is there are good employees and contractors, I try to do my bit when delivering on quality but there are always people who cut dangerous corners in all sectors and that includes civil society as well.

BTW, on topic for the thread, the firm that supplied the cladding for Grenfell and hundreds of private blocks where leaseholders face annual bills of £30k plus to protect death traps has been both a Boris and Tory donor, and his pick as chair was compromised https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/01/26/grenfell-inquiry-panellist-steps-link-cladding-firm/ and https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/dec/23/tory-donor-was-key-shareholder-in-grenfell-cladding-firm-arconic

I prefer a capitalist system, but not the current crony driven one. 

[whelk]

1 hour ago, saint1977 said:

I’ve worked for both private and public sectors and good/bad in both. There is a strand in the private sector which I’ve been lucky enough to avoid to working for, but have come across the results of through commissioning and sub-contracting https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55349395

There’s a reason why hundreds of Conservative councils are taking services rapidly back in house https://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2013/08/nine-spectacular-council-outsourcing-failures

You will never convince posters like Weston as he like others on here - Alex Law - is ideologically wired automatically to believe one sector is better than the other despite the evidence. Fact is there are good employees and contractors, I try to do my bit when delivering on quality but there are always people who cut dangerous corners in all sectors and that includes civil society as well.

BTW, on topic for the thread, the firm that supplied the cladding for Grenfell and hundreds of private blocks where leaseholders face annual bills of £30k plus to protect death traps has been both a Boris and Tory donor, and his pick as chair was compromised https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/01/26/grenfell-inquiry-panellist-steps-link-cladding-firm/ and https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/dec/23/tory-donor-was-key-shareholder-in-grenfell-cladding-firm-arconic

I prefer a capitalist system, but not the current crony driven one. 

Indeed. As you say hard wired anti public sector lot rarely have issues with cronyism and somehow feel they some how aligned to the entrepreneurial spirit but just inferior thinkers coveting a position they will never be in. 
Would never read reports on the monumental fuck up of the probation service.

As a Southampton Council Tax payer I assume, given that they have brought services back in-house that I wasn’t getting great value for money from Capita? Shouldn’t the Tax Payers Alliance be putting in their beloved FOI request and being suitably outraged? 

[The Cat]

 

 

[whelk]

Don’t know who was responsible for giving Capita this gig but there are consequences of such things.

Philippa Day: Benefit errors 'predominant factor' in mum's death https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-55826996

 

[badgerx16]

32 minutes ago, whelk said:

Don’t know who was responsible for giving Capita this gig but there are consequences of such things.

Philippa Day: Benefit errors 'predominant factor' in mum's death https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-55826996

 

The PIP process is grossly mismanaged, from the client perspective, but I am sure it makes Capita's bosses a lot of money. I was asked to sit in on one assesment in support of the claimant - when she got the written report back it included answers to questions that had not been asked, and answers she had given were not correctly reported. The appeal went to Court, and lasted less than 3 minutes, long enough for the DSS to admit their "errors" and the claimant's payments retored to the previous level. The main bone of contention was that the process is geared to physical impairments rather than mental health. Asking somebody with Bulimia or Anorexia whether they are able to prepare food misses the point as to whether they are capable of eating correctly. Asking somebody with a history of self harm as to whether they know how to handle a knife borders on sheer bloody lunacy !

 

Edited 27 January, 2021 by badgerx16

[egg]

29 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

The PIP process is grossly mismanaged, from the client perspective, but I am sure it makes Capita's bosses a lot of money. I was asked to sit in on one assesment in support of the claimant - when she got the written report back it included answers to questions that had not been asked, and answers she had given were not correctly reported. The appeal went to Court, and lasted less than 3 minutes, long enough for the DSS to admit their "errors" and the claimant's payments retored to the previous level. The main bone of contention was that the process is geared to physical impairments rather than mental health. Asking somebody with Bulimia or Anorexia whether they are able to prepare food misses the point as to whether they are capable of eating correctly. Asking somebody with a history of self harm as to whether they know how to handle a knife borders on sheer bloody lunacy !

 

Yep. I've sat in a couple with my daughter who has mental health issues. The reports were both a disgrace and completely misquoted her, and in some respects were pure fabrication. She lost The PiP on both occasions, but them back on appeal.

The distress and worry it caused her both times was massive and unnecessary. Sadly, many people don't have the courage or knowledge to challenge these decisions and there will be many cases where people have paid the ultimate price. 

I'm all for using the public sector to support public services where appropriate, but the way its used with PiP is a disgrace. Life impacting decisions should be left to people who aren't in it for profit, and actually understand the health issues of the people before them. 

[Guided Missile]

If ever there was a thread that was wrongly titled, it is this one. The success of the vaccine program in saving lives, in contrast to the EU, from whose grasp we escaped, shows that Boris continues to play a blinder. Even you leftie Remoaners have to give credit where credit is due, but I'm not holding my breath.

Now all he has to do is get shot of Princess Nut Nuts and her climate change cult and we may have an even better future to look forward to.