Racism In Football 2019

[sadoldgit]

As Lighthouse has had enough of the Danny Rose thread, perhaps we can have a wider debate about the issue here?

Those of us who used to attend football matches in the 70s and 80s will remember it only too well, and the fact that we are still discussing in 2019 shows how little we have progressed. John Barnes makes a valid point when it says that it is not racism in football that is the problem, it is racism in society. To pretend that this problem is now confined to a few people in football crowds completely misses the point. What it has done is to highlight the fact that we still have a problem. Since the Rose statement many more players are coming out with there own stories about racial abuse. It seems to be much wider spread than just a few idiots in the occasional match. The issues around the lack of diversity at the Oscars shows that we still have a problem. What more can we do to get rid of this cancer in society?

[Batman]

you make valid points

I kind of feel sorry for Brighton. If/When they dispense with the services of Chris Houghton, they will be in for a rough ride from certain elements of the media.

[hypochondriac]

Bit odd to pretend we have changed very little since the 80s. Racism is an issue in society in the same way loads of unacceptable abuse is and sadly you aren't ever going to eliminate it completely, but it's massively improved since the 80s.

 

And what on earth do the Oscars have to do with that? Just a bizarre stream of consciousness there.

[Lighthouse]

There will always be bigotry and hatred in society, it’s part of human nature. Pharaoh Rameses II treated the Israelites as second class humans 3,000 years ago, it’s nothing new and won’t go away any time soon. What we can do, and have done very well in Britain, is minimise that level of intolerance and at least contain it. To that extent, we have changed massively from the 70s, when ‘Love Thy Neighbour’ was considered acceptable television and fans were kept in cages to stop them kicking the sh*te out of each other.

 

The problem is 32,000 is a lot of people and there are bound to be a few racists in there. Statistically speaking, a couple of people at the game on Friday went home and looked at indecent images of children on their computer and somebody in their will (or already has) murder somebody. All it takes is one idiot to have a few too many white wine spritzers before the game and lose his inhibitions and there you go...

[Batman]

There will always be bigotry and hatred in society, it’s part of human nature. Pharaoh Rameses II treated the Israelites as second class humans 3,000 years ago, it’s nothing new and won’t go away any time soon. What we can do, and have done very well in Britain, is minimise that level of intolerance and at least contain it. To that extent, we have changed massively from the 70s, when ‘Love Thy Neighbour’ was considered acceptable television and fans were kept in cages to stop them kicking the sh*te out of each other.

 

The problem is 32,000 is a lot of people and there are bound to be a few racists in there. Statistically speaking, a couple of people at the game on Friday went home and looked at indecent images of children on their computer and somebody in their will (or already has) murder somebody. All it takes is one idiot to have a few too many white wine spritzers before the game and lose his inhibitions and there you go...

 

what are your thoughts on the Oscars though?

[LGTL]

Dinosaurs like Strachan don't help with the cause, comparing racism received by black players with the potential abuse Adam Johnson will receive if he plays again.

 

No surprise he's been sacked by Sky.

[whelk]

Dinosaurs like Strachan don't help with the cause, comparing racism received by black players with the potential abuse Adam Johnson will receive if he plays again.

 

No surprise he's been sacked by Sky.

 

Don’t think is a widely held view whatever generation you are from.

 

We can’t have pundits saying something stupid though and we must only keep the ones that are pure of heart.

Sacked Strachan but Carragher spits in face of fan and stays

[hypochondriac]

Dinosaurs like Strachan don't help with the cause, comparing racism received by black players with the potential abuse Adam Johnson will receive if he plays again.

 

No surprise he's been sacked by Sky.

In what sense was he comparing them? If he meant that some fans will look for something that they perceive to be a sensitive issue of a "weakness" and then chant about it then he's right. Obviously they aren't the same thing though.

[sadoldgit]

There will always be bigotry and hatred in society, it’s part of human nature. Pharaoh Rameses II treated the Israelites as second class humans 3,000 years ago, it’s nothing new and won’t go away any time soon. What we can do, and have done very well in Britain, is minimise that level of intolerance and at least contain it. To that extent, we have changed massively from the 70s, when ‘Love Thy Neighbour’ was considered acceptable television and fans were kept in cages to stop them kicking the sh*te out of each other.

 

The problem is 32,000 is a lot of people and there are bound to be a few racists in there. Statistically speaking, a couple of people at the game on Friday went home and looked at indecent images of children on their computer and somebody in their will (or already has) murder somebody. All it takes is one idiot to have a few too many white wine spritzers before the game and lose his inhibitions and there you go...

 

I agree about the hatred and bigotry. There are people here who clearly have issues still. The problem is that it doesn’t seem to be limited to a few idiots who have had too much to drink at a football match. John Barnes’s point that we need to make it unacceptable in society in general is very sad because you would like to think that it would be less of an issue in this day and age. That is why I raised the amount of media attention that the Oscars were getting over the lack of diversity also on the entertainment industry. It appears that the usual suspects struggle with that concept though. Still , as one of the usual suspects also struggles with the clear fact that women are still not getting parity with men as regards wages it isn’t surprising.

Back to racism in football. Perhaps it is time to start docking points? Clubs might do more then to identify and ban those idiots who are still rooted in the 70’s.

[Verbal]

There will always be bigotry and hatred in society, it’s part of human nature. Pharaoh Rameses II treated the Israelites as second class humans 3,000 years ago, it’s nothing new and won’t go away any time soon. What we can do, and have done very well in Britain, is minimise that level of intolerance and at least contain it. To that extent, we have changed massively from the 70s, when ‘Love Thy Neighbour’ was considered acceptable television and fans were kept in cages to stop them kicking the sh*te out of each other.

 

The problem is 32,000 is a lot of people and there are bound to be a few racists in there. Statistically speaking, a couple of people at the game on Friday went home and looked at indecent images of children on their computer and somebody in their will (or already has) murder somebody. All it takes is one idiot to have a few too many white wine spritzers before the game and lose his inhibitions and there you go...

 

This site must do more to combat racist postings. It contains far too many rants against Jews, Arabs, Muslims in general, and black men who dare to venture an opinion - all without the merest murmur of complaint from the site owners. Not a peep.

 

Please take responsibility for this content and act - because not doing so is making things worse. It's interesting when an old thread is resurrected to see how the diversity of opinion among posters has vastly narrowed down, particularly over the last three years. You've just lost another good poster in Bexy. There are many others who've dropped out without saying why, but the racist neanderthals roaming free on here are likely to be one very good reason.

[Lighthouse]

I agree about the hatred and bigotry. There are people here who clearly have issues still. The problem is that it doesn’t seem to be limited to a few idiots who have had too much to drink at a football match. John Barnes’s point that we need to make it unacceptable in society in general is very sad because you would like to think that it would be less of an issue in this day and age. That is why I raised the amount of media attention that the Oscars were getting over the lack of diversity also on the entertainment industry. It appears that the usual suspects struggle with that concept though. Still , as one of the usual suspects also struggles with the clear fact that women are still not getting parity with men as regards wages it isn’t surprising.

Back to racism in football. Perhaps it is time to start docking points? Clubs might do more then to identify and ban those idiots who are still rooted in the 70’s.

 

I agree with docking points if it was a widespread problem and something endemic within a certain fan base but I don't think it is. Most of the stories on the Rose thread were about 'this bloke I saw at Game X last year' etc. If it was a large block of 50 or so people, stood together, Nazi flags, salutes etc. then I'd say yes but in England I've never seen anything like that.

 

It was in the news a couple of days ago that someone had been arrested for sending a racist tweet to a Wigan player. If events that small scale and isolated are making national headlines, it suggests to me that it's not a common occurrence.

 

P.S. I worked for a company with one of the 'worst' reported gender pay gaps in Britain. Can't speak for every company but in that instance it was blatantly bullsh*t. Anyway, that's a different thread.

[hypochondriac]

I agree about the hatred and bigotry. There are people here who clearly have issues still. The problem is that it doesn’t seem to be limited to a few idiots who have had too much to drink at a football match. John Barnes’s point that we need to make it unacceptable in society in general is very sad because you would like to think that it would be less of an issue in this day and age. That is why I raised the amount of media attention that the Oscars were getting over the lack of diversity also on the entertainment industry. It appears that the usual suspects struggle with that concept though. Still , as one of the usual suspects also struggles with the clear fact that women are still not getting parity with men as regards wages it isn’t surprising.

Back to racism in football. Perhaps it is time to start docking points? Clubs might do more then to identify and ban those idiots who are still rooted in the 70’s.

 

It is less of an issue in this day and age. The Oscars is entirely irrelevant to a discussion about racist abuse in English football and the mythical wage gap has been debunked so many times now that you're just making yourself look foolish (again). Here is one such debunking from a female:

 

http://time.com/3222543/wage-pay-gap-myth-feminism/

 

Regarding your racism in football point, I absolutely do not think that clubs should be held personally responsible for isolated racist idiots within a crowd. All clubs in the UK as far as I am aware will most likely hand out life bans for anyone they discover chanting racist abuse at players which is an adequate response. If we had thousands of fans chanting racist abuse on a regular basis then we can talk about points deductions but as has already been pointed out to you, it's mostly the odd couple of people who decide to shout racist things at a player. To pretend otherwise is to create a false narrative which I know you like to do for some bizarre reason but as usual it's incorrect.

[hypochondriac]

Lighthouse- this website needs to do more to tackle pompous priggish posters like verbal above. Many good posters like Turkish have already reduced the amount they post and I've been told it's a direct result of posters like verbal and the hostile posting environment they have fostered. All that posters want is to be able to discuss issues with a range of opinions without being called a nazi or a racist for doing so. Additionally verbal promised his partner that he would stop posting on here but he continues to hang around. It may be worth thinking of her next time you're doing your moderating.

[whelk]

This site must do more to combat racist postings. It contains far too many rants against Jews, Arabs, Muslims in general, and black men who dare to venture an opinion - all without the merest murmur of complaint from the site owners. Not a peep.

 

Please take responsibility for this content and act - because not doing so is making things worse. It's interesting when an old thread is resurrected to see how the diversity of opinion among posters has vastly narrowed down, particularly over the last three years. You've just lost another good poster in Bexy. There are many others who've dropped out without saying why, but the racist neanderthals roaming free on here are likely to be one very good reason.

 

You really are quite pathetic. You are unable to debate. You used to seem normal. Has Brexit polarised your views now that everyone is an enemy?

 

Roaming Free? You soppy fcker

[whelk]

Sterling saying proud of being black is great.

Quite effective to openly mock the sad nasty racists rather than let them get to you.

Make the racists the ones that get the abuse

[Lighthouse]

TBH Verbs I only volunteered to moderate this place to try and keep the tedious sh*te off the main board, so we could all discuss Saints without having to read about how we should be aiming for 17th every season and why we're an embarrassment of a club because West Ham just signed somebody on June 1st and we haven't.

 

If any of you find something genuinely racist, i.e. not just naive and ignorant like some of the stuff on the Rose thread, then PM me.

 

I wouldn't want to lose Bexy as he seems informed and articulate, whether I agree with him on an issue or not. However I've got better things to do that sit refreshing the Brexit thread every 5 minutes. If the posters on there irritate you, then don't click on that thread. It's like clicking on an alpine thread, or watching literally anything staring Miranda - you can't say you weren't warned.

[The9]

you make valid points

I kind of feel sorry for Brighton. If/When they dispense with the services of Chris Houghton, they will be in for a rough ride from certain elements of the media.

 

This will be a first then, as I've never seen any club targeted for criticism for sacking a manager with a particular skin colour.

[The9]

Dinosaurs like Strachan don't help with the cause, comparing racism received by black players with the potential abuse Adam Johnson will receive if he plays again.

 

No surprise he's been sacked by Sky.

 

Two things here - one he wasn't "sacked" by Sky because he didn't have a contract anyway, they're just choosing not to use him, and two, his statement was (ham-fistedly, admittedly) merely asking a question about what is regarded as an acceptable level of abuse and for what subject. He didn't say anything of the subject of pretty much any of the things being accused of him. His point was just to say "what's acceptable and should everything be dealt with in the same way?".

[hypochondriac]

This will be a first then, as I've never seen any club targeted for criticism for sacking a manager with a particular skin colour.

Not an individual club but when I think it was Chris Powell was sacked a few years ago, the association of black lawyers bloke was all over it saying how racist football was because they had less black managers.

[hypochondriac]

Two things here - one he wasn't "sacked" by Sky because he didn't have a contract anyway, they're just choosing not to use him, and two, his statement was (ham-fistedly, admittedly) merely asking a question about what is regarded as an acceptable level of abuse and for what subject. He didn't say anything of the subject of pretty much any of the things being accused of him. His point was just to say "what's acceptable and should everything be dealt with in the same way?".

Thanks for the context, I did imagine there was more to the story than the headline.

[BoscombeScummer]

It’s a shame to have to have to come onto a forum for Saints and read the ignorant drivel on display in the Danny Rose thread. The fact that it was locked also speaks volumes. Oh dear. We really are going backwards. At least the racists and bigots are coming out of the woodwork though, emboldened by their Mickey Mouse politicians. I’d rather know who I’m fighting.

[aintforever]

I can only genuinely remember a handful of racist comments watching Saints, that doesn’t mean it is not a problem elsewhere tho, Chelsea clearly have a bigger problem than most. Even back in the Dell days when I heard racist comments it was generally shouted down by more reasonable fans. The only comment I can remember at St Mary’s was when a black opposition player went down injured and someone shouted “quick, someone get him some fried chicken”, there probably were others but I can definitely say I have heard way more and way worse outside of football.

 

You have to support the Kick it out campaigns because any racism is a bad thing. My only issue is that it paints football as being some sort of racist hell where in reality it is no different to anywhere else. In fact thinking about it, some of the worst racism I can remember hearing was at The Rose Bowl when a bunch of Asian cricket fans chanted “what’s the colour of your skin” to Monty Panasaar.

 

Football players come from all around the world, players of any race, religion or nationality are idolised by fans up and down the country. When I was a kid there were no black people at my school, racist jokes were the norm, my parents generation racism was generally tolerated yet my hero was Danny Wallace. Football is way more diverse than many other parts of our society.

Edited 9 April, 2019 by aintforever

[whelk]

It’s a shame to have to have to come onto a forum for Saints and read the ignorant drivel on display in the Danny Rose thread. The fact that it was locked also speaks volumes. Oh dear. We really are going backwards. At least the racists and bigots are coming out of the woodwork though, emboldened by their Mickey Mouse politicians. I’d rather know who I’m fighting.

 

Hey at least the sanctimonious can put their comments somewhere.

[sadoldgit]

I’d rather people were sanctimonious than racist.

[whelk]

Thought Klopp spoke well about the Chelsea and Salah song

[whelk]

I’d rather people were sanctimonious than racist.

 

EL Condor Pasa remix?

[Verbal]

It’s a shame to have to have to come onto a forum for Saints and read the ignorant drivel on display in the Danny Rose thread. The fact that it was locked also speaks volumes. Oh dear. We really are going backwards. At least the racists and bigots are coming out of the woodwork though, emboldened by their Mickey Mouse politicians. I’d rather know who I’m fighting.

 

Well said.

 

And since you've now been accused of being 'sanctimonious' by a poster on a forum that now waves through racist posts without a murmur, here's a sanctimonious article - no doubt all made up by a sanctimonious journalist, written for a sanctimonious newspaper.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/apr/12/racism-english-football-parks-premier-league-special-investigation

[whelk]

Well said.

 

And since you've now been accused of being 'sanctimonious' by a poster on a forum that now waves through racist posts without a murmur, here's a sanctimonious article - no doubt all made up by a sanctimonious journalist, written for a sanctimonious newspaper.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/apr/12/racism-english-football-parks-premier-league-special-investigation

 

Thankfully most see it as more complex than some partisan white middle class man who sees racists everywhere and everyone as an an enemy.

Do I get a nickname?

[whelk]

Well said.

 

And since you've now been accused of being 'sanctimonious' by a poster on a forum that now waves through racist posts without a murmur, here's a sanctimonious article - no doubt all made up by a sanctimonious journalist, written for a sanctimonious newspaper.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/apr/12/racism-english-football-parks-premier-league-special-investigation

 

Haven’t you got a placard to make to start piling on and protesting against a rugby player?

[hypochondriac]

Thankfully most see it as more complex than some partisan white middle class man who sees racists everywhere and everyone as an an enemy.

Do I get a nickname?

Well said.

[Verbal]

Well this never happened.

 

https://news.sky.com/story/west-ham-club-vow-to-ban-fans-who-engaged-in-antisemitic-chanting-in-manchester-11693403

 

This guy is black, so clearly lying.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47919248

 

And who cares about Salah? He's a Muslamic, so deserves it.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/04/12/football/mohamed-salah-chelsea-fans-racism-spt-inlt/index.html

[Lord Duckhunter]

I can only genuinely remember a handful of racist comments watching Saints, that doesn’t mean it is not a problem elsewhere tho, Chelsea clearly have a bigger problem than most. Even back in the Dell days when I heard racist comments it was generally shouted down by more reasonable fans.

 

There was a bloke in the Kingsland who shouted “get up you black ****” when Keïta dived in the box second half. I wasn’t 100% sure that was what I heard, and as it was behind me wasn’t really sure who shouted it. Later the same voice shouted “black bastard” at Mane. That one was clear, and I was pretty sure who shouted it as there’s a bloke with a big gob who mouths off every week (although that was the first time I’d heard him use that sort of stuff). He also shouted “cut his head off” when Salah had the ball (not sure if this is acceptable, but I felt uncomfortable). To my knowledge nobody confronted him (including myself). I think most people were like me, unsure of whether he actually said it, and then unwilling to speak out as he sits with a bunch of blokes.

All week I wrestled with it, wondering if I should have done something. Thursday I emailed the club asking what process they have if I witness this behaviour again. They advised pointing him out to steward. Fast forward to Saturday and the bloke wasn’t in his seat. Maybe a coincidence, but I can’t remember him missing a game previously.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Verbal]

Fake news. P*ki bashing is just a bit of fun, right?

 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/11675571/liverpool-fan-racially-abused-by-fellow-supporter-thanks-merseyside-police

[BoscombeScummer]

Lighthouse- this website needs to do more to tackle pompous priggish posters like verbal above. Many good posters like Turkish have already reduced the amount they post and I've been told it's a direct result of posters like verbal and the hostile posting environment they have fostered. All that posters want is to be able to discuss issues with a range of opinions without being called a nazi or a racist for doing so. Additionally verbal promised his partner that he would stop posting on here but he continues to hang around. It may be worth thinking of her next time you're doing your moderating.

 

https://www.adl.org/education/references/hate-symbols/pepe-the-frog

[BoscombeScummer]

Well said.

 

https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-pepe-the-frog-hate-symbol-20161011-snap-htmlstory.html

[hypochondriac]

https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-pepe-the-frog-hate-symbol-20161011-snap-htmlstory.html

Did you hear clowns are racist now? It must be true they said it in the paper. Edited 15 April, 2019 by hypochondriac

[Lighthouse]

Well this never happened.

 

https://news.sky.com/story/west-ham-club-vow-to-ban-fans-who-engaged-in-antisemitic-chanting-in-manchester-11693403

 

This guy is black, so clearly lying.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47919248

 

And who cares about Salah? He's a Muslamic, so deserves it.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/04/12/football/mohamed-salah-chelsea-fans-racism-spt-inlt/index.html

 

I've no idea what point this is supposed to be making. Again, these are isolated incidents; individuals or small groups of 3 or 4 in a crowd of 40,000. I could post a bunch of stories about Southampton as a city in order to paint it as a violent hell hole but it wouldn't be true either. 'Man hits wife in Eastleigh', 'Four men start fight in Yates', 'pensioner mugged in Shirely', etc.

 

You're using outliers to try and prove a hypothesis. This is the equivalent of those winners on the People's Postcode Lottery adverts. "£50,000!" "£12,000!" "Derek we're off to Benidorm!" As if that's somehow the norm.

[whelk]

I've no idea what point this is supposed to be making. Again, these are isolated incidents; individuals or small groups of 3 or 4 in a crowd of 40,000. I could post a bunch of stories about Southampton as a city in order to paint it as a violent hell hole but it wouldn't be true either. 'Man hits wife in Eastleigh', 'Four men start fight in Yates', 'pensioner mugged in Shirely', etc.

 

You're using outliers to try and prove a hypothesis. This is the equivalent of those winners on the People's Postcode Lottery adverts. "£50,000!" "£12,000!" "Derek we're off to Benidorm!" As if that's somehow the norm.

 

He has gone like SOG - no debating just accusing others as some self-righteous zealot highlighting sh1t things happening as if others deny it (which they don't). He'd probably be surprised to know that I actually know Jacob Steinberg, the author of his Guardian article.

[shurlock]

He has gone like SOG - no debating just accusing others as some self-righteous zealot highlighting sh1t things happening as if others deny it (which they don't). He'd probably be surprised to know that I actually know Jacob Steinberg, the author of his Guardian article.

 

Difficult to know where to draw the line. I made the rather innocuous comment on the Danny Rose thread that I have heard racist abuse on a number of occasions -despite categorically pointing out that they are isolated incidents (esp. bearing in mind that I've been to hundreds of saints games), that it's been a while since I've heard abuse and that others are more willing to call it out than in the past (see LD's refreshing post). At the time, I didn't think there was anything remotely controversial or self-righteous in saying this; yet it didn't stop triggering the usual suspects who were all over the post and my motives like flies on ****.

Edited 15 April, 2019 by shurlock

[aintforever]

There was a bloke in the Kingsland who shouted “get up you black ****” when Keïta dived in the box second half. I wasn’t 100% sure that was what I heard, and as it was behind me wasn’t really sure who shouted it. Later the same voice shouted “black bastard” at Mane. That one was clear, and I was pretty sure who shouted it as there’s a bloke with a big gob who mouths off every week (although that was the first time I’d heard him use that sort of stuff). He also shouted “cut his head off” when Salah had the ball (not sure if this is acceptable, but I felt uncomfortable). To my knowledge nobody confronted him (including myself). I think most people were like me, unsure of whether he actually said it, and then unwilling to speak out as he sits with a bunch of blokes.

All week I wrestled with it, wondering if I should have done something. Thursday I emailed the club asking what process they have if I witness this behaviour again. They advised pointing him out to steward. Fast forward to Saturday and the bloke wasn’t in his seat. Maybe a coincidence, but I can’t remember him missing a game previously.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Isn't there a number you can text to point out the idiots? I think there used to be one in the programme.

[Verbal]

I've no idea what point this is supposed to be making. Again, these are isolated incidents; individuals or small groups of 3 or 4 in a crowd of 40,000. I could post a bunch of stories about Southampton as a city in order to paint it as a violent hell hole but it wouldn't be true either. 'Man hits wife in Eastleigh', 'Four men start fight in Yates', 'pensioner mugged in Shirely', etc.

 

You're using outliers to try and prove a hypothesis. This is the equivalent of those winners on the People's Postcode Lottery adverts. "£50,000!" "£12,000!" "Derek we're off to Benidorm!" As if that's somehow the norm.

 

When black and ethnic minority players talk, have a little humility and at least listen. You only see a tiny portion of what they see. You just turn up to the ground on match days. There's so much more going on in the experience of black players that you don't see. READ the Guardian article, then come back and say this is all 'isolated'.

 

And for heaven's sake drop the one-bad-apple argument. It's self-serving and - without confronting the actual evidence being offered by people who've looked at this closer than you or have lived it - dishonest.

 

By the way, I applaud Lord Crap's honesty and concern - not a lot of times I'd say that, perhaps. But he's right.

[hypochondriac]

Listen and believe BAME people always right verbal? Like Jussie Smollett?

[hypochondriac]

Difficult to know where to draw the line. I made the rather innocuous comment on the Danny Rose thread that I have heard racist abuse on a number of occasions -despite categorically pointing out that they are isolated incidents (esp. bearing in mind that I've been to hundreds of saints games), that it's been a while since I've heard abuse and that others are more willing to call it out than in the past (see LD's refreshing post). At the time, I didn't think there was anything remotely controversial or self-righteous in saying this; yet it didn't stop triggering the usual suspects who were all over the post and my motives like flies on ****.

Yes seems fair comment. There are racist idiots in society and some go to the football and they need to be dealt with.

[Verbal]

Listen and believe BAME people always right verbal? Like Jussie Smollett?

 

So Lighthouse, here's a question. You have a poster making a false comparison between a single black man making a false claim with the complaints of numerous black players and others in the game that they are increasingly the targets of racism.

 

I've seen exactly this language used by National Action and BNP supporters. It is a blatant and nasty racial smear.

 

What are you going to do about it?

[hypochondriac]

So Lighthouse, here's a question. You have a poster making a false comparison between a single black man making a false claim with the complaints of numerous black players and others in the game that they are increasingly the targets of racism.

 

I've seen exactly this language used by National Action and BNP supporters. It is a blatant and nasty racial smear.

 

What are you going to do about it?

That's not the comparison I'm making at all. You're the one saying we have to listen and believe someone simply because of the colour of someone's skin. We shouldn't disbelieve any reports of racism but you're the one deliberately exaggerating the horrible scourge that is racism to push your specific political agenda.

 

Reports of racism should be investigated and the appropriate action taken where individuals can be identified. Pretending that the majority of people in a crowd are racist is unhelpful and a distortion of the truth.

Edited 15 April, 2019 by hypochondriac

[whelk]

There was a bloke in the Kingsland who shouted “get up you black ****” when Keïta dived in the box second half. I wasn’t 100% sure that was what I heard, and as it was behind me wasn’t really sure who shouted it. Later the same voice shouted “black bastard” at Mane. That one was clear, and I was pretty sure who shouted it as there’s a bloke with a big gob who mouths off every week (although that was the first time I’d heard him use that sort of stuff). He also shouted “cut his head off” when Salah had the ball (not sure if this is acceptable, but I felt uncomfortable). To my knowledge nobody confronted him (including myself). I think most people were like me, unsure of whether he actually said it, and then unwilling to speak out as he sits with a bunch of blokes.

All week I wrestled with it, wondering if I should have done something. Thursday I emailed the club asking what process they have if I witness this behaviour again. They advised pointing him out to steward. Fast forward to Saturday and the bloke wasn’t in his seat. Maybe a coincidence, but I can’t remember him missing a game previously.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

If you can’t recall him missing a game previously presumably he has made racist comments before?

 

Hard to believe in the relative civility of the Kingsland that someone would not be ashamed to shout that stuff.

Get your point about not pointing it out but what is the cnt going to do in the ground? One of those baking hot pukka pies can act as a decent weapon if he does come at you and will make him look a bigger cnt

[saint1977]

If you can’t recall him missing a game previously presumably he has made racist comments before?

 

Hard to believe in the relative civility of the Kingsland that someone would not be ashamed to shout that stuff.

Get your point about not pointing it out but what is the cnt going to do in the ground? One of those baking hot pukka pies can act as a decent weapon if he does come at you and will make him look a bigger cnt

 

On the contrary, I can well believe someone would shout it in any stand. In the L1 promotion season, Lee Peltier and Guly tussled for the ball in front of the Itchen in the opening minutes. The ball ran out and someone in the first couple of rows shouted ‘ you black c—-‘ at Peltier. Disgusting and quite a few people around us were as appalled as we were. Trouble is, we were a few rows up and weren’t 100per cent sure exactly which seat it came from, otherwise we’d have texted the number to report it. Clearly the lad so was thick that he hadn’t clocked that he was equally racially abusing Guly.

 

Tbf to Saints fans, in 35 years or so there aren’t many incidents, although one incident is too many. Compared at least to being at neutral games in with West Ham and Leeds fans, where the racist abuse directed at their own players let alone the opposition was terrible at both of those games. Remember the West Ham throwing bananas at Danny Wallace, one of my heroes, from the Archers End pen in the 1980s and thinking it was idiotic even as a kid.

[Lighthouse]

When black and ethnic minority players talk, have a little humility and at least listen. You only see a tiny portion of what they see. You just turn up to the ground on match days. There's so much more going on in the experience of black players that you don't see. READ the Guardian article, then come back and say this is all 'isolated'.

 

And for heaven's sake drop the one-bad-apple argument. It's self-serving and - without confronting the actual evidence being offered by people who've looked at this closer than you or have lived it - dishonest.

 

By the way, I applaud Lord Crap's honesty and concern - not a lot of times I'd say that, perhaps. But he's right.

 

I do listen and I don't doubt the credibility of any of those reports you listed. I'm not bringing Smollett into this, if Hypo wants to debate that topic I'll leave it to you two. In reply to your other post, that doesn't necessarily make him a NA/BNP supporter.

 

My opinions are based on maths more than anything. If there is someone shouting foul racist abuse in literally every block in St Mary's, that's still only 40 odd out of 32,000 or just over 0.1% of the crowd. If 99.9% of a crowd is absolutely fine, that's not indicative of a problem with racism in football, in England at least. Other countries are a different matter.

 

As a football fan I object to being constantly smeared with this brush by the media when in reality we are no worse than any other segment of society. I could take a group of young black men to Newark Antiques Fayre and there would be people muttering, "quick, hide your money tins with that lot around." It's never going to completely go away. I don't doubt any of the media stories you've shared, I'm just saying there is a threshold of unpleasantness you just have to live with.

[BoscombeScummer]

[ashnats]

Everyone's a little bit racist, sometimes. It doesn't mean we go around committing hate crimes. Look around and you will find no-one is really colour blind.

 

(Maybe it's a fact we all should face - everyone makes judgments based on race).

 

source; Disney