aintforever Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Looks like Crouch fouled him but he was still stupid for sticking his hand in the air, ref was always going to give it, especially as Crouch’s tug wouldn’t have been seen. The first one was a stonewall penalty, we dodged a bullet there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 3 February, 2019 Author Share Posted 3 February, 2019 That's because he never got to point E. The downward tug of the shirt from Crouch prevented him from even getting to point D. I admire your persistence, but sometimes you just have to hold your hands up () and admit you're wrong. I could buy that if he actually looked like he was flinging his arms up to gain momentum but he wasn’t, he just had his arm up like some crap Freddy Mercury impression. I guess everyone sees things differently, I’ll stick with what I (and England’s 2 greatest ever strikers) saw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 You don't remember it that well because it was against Everton, not Aston Villa.Exactly. Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludwig Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 A moderator of this forum is saying that a shirt pull and a push against Stephens isn't a foul. Let that sink in. A forum moderator on a football forum doesn't understand the basic laws of the game, then suggests people are on a wind up for saying it was a clear foul. I didn't think moderators trolled but clearly they do. In all honesty, I can't get my head around it. I waited until replying to your post, hoping it would sink in but it's not. In most places and time periods trolling mods wouldn't be put up with, but this is life in 2019 Britain. We have to tolerate the intolerable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the saint in winchester Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Looks like Crouch fouled him but he was still stupid for sticking his hand in the air, ref was always going to give it, especially as Crouch’s tug wouldn’t have been seen. The first one was a stonewall penalty, we dodged a bullet there. I didn't see a foul, and wish Stephens had kept his hand down. Appreciate he was trying to get elevation, but don't leave it up there. Now, even taking off the saints colored glasses, I didn't think the first one was a foul. Macca's momentum took him into Barnes' path, yes, and Barnes tried to hurdle him, so losing his chance, agreed. But not a foul as such, and I can't see how he can get away with abusing the linesman like that. It was WORSE then Zaha's hand-clapping the ref. Could and should have been a double yellow for that. Or are we saying that although you can't ridicule the ref, you CAN abuse the linesman without any punishment? On balance, yes, a draw was fair as they had more of the game, but to get to 93 mins in front, I though we were there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 I could buy that if he actually looked like he was flinging his arms up to gain momentum but he wasn’t, he just had his arm up like some crap Freddy Mercury impression. I guess everyone sees things differently, I’ll stick with what I (and England’s 2 greatest ever strikers) saw. Even if you don't believe the shirt pull influenced the arm movement ( which it would). The shirt pull starts before the handball. The first incident of the shirt pull should be dealt with and a free kick awarded, meaning the handball is irrelevant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Neither were pens. I was at the game, I thought they were both pens. Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 3 February, 2019 Author Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Even if you don't believe the shirt pull influenced the arm movement ( which it would). The shirt pull starts before the handball. The first incident of the shirt pull should be dealt with and a free kick awarded, meaning the handball is irrelevant! I’ve already said I agree with that bit. The shirt pull is a foul and it should have been a free kick to us but it comes back to the old cliche of playing to the whistle. Shirts get pulled at every set piece and players know it goes unpunished 90% of the time. Until we get VAR we just have to accept that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hassan kachloul Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 A moderator of this forum is saying that a shirt pull and a push against Stephens isn't a foul. Let that sink in. A forum moderator on a football forum doesn't understand the basic laws of the game "Let that sink". Oh my **** no mate this is huge, I can barely comprehend what you are telling me it is so shocking. Not just a MODERATOR but a MODERATOR of a FOOTBALL FORUM. What the ****. It won't sink I just don't believe it. A MODERATOR on a FOOTBALL FORUM. **** me stop being so ****ing wet and just accept that someone has a different opinion to you on a very minor thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 (edited) Neither were pens. I was at the game, I thought they were both pens. Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk So what if you were at the game. I’ve done Turfmoor loads of times and it would have been near on impossible to see Crouch’s pull from the other end of the ground. Edited 3 February, 2019 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyinthesky Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Any idea how many brave supporters mad the long trip north? The away end looked relatively empty, a bit reminiscent of the days of yesteryear when numbers were scarce rather than more modern times when our away support has been quite good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Any idea how many brave supporters mad the long trip north? The away end looked relatively empty, a bit reminiscent of the days of yesteryear when numbers were scarce rather than more modern times when our away support has been quite goodI was there: not so far for me but a pain with the rail strike. Think I heard we had about 1700 there having been allocated about 2500? We made a good noise. A Burnley fan said we were the loudest "Southern" fans this season. Not sure if that's patronising, rude or a compliment! Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 I didn't see a foul, and wish Stephens had kept his hand down. Appreciate he was trying to get elevation, but don't leave it up there. Now, even taking off the saints colored glasses, I didn't think the first one was a foul. Macca's momentum took him into Barnes' path, yes, and Barnes tried to hurdle him, so losing his chance, agreed. But not a foul as such, and I can't see how he can get away with abusing the linesman like that. It was WORSE then Zaha's hand-clapping the ref. Could and should have been a double yellow for that. Or are we saying that although you can't ridicule the ref, you CAN abuse the linesman without any punishment? On balance, yes, a draw was fair as they had more of the game, but to get to 93 mins in front, I though we were there. So Macca missed the ball and crashed into him causing him to fall and it wasn’t a foul, not sure how you work that out?! Agree that he Barnes should have got sent off for the foul language but the penalty was clear cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alehouseboys Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Any idea how many brave supporters mad the long trip north? The away end looked relatively empty, a bit reminiscent of the days of yesteryear when numbers were scarce rather than more modern times when our away support has been quite good 1,700 is a decent effort for a long awkward trip up north considering the recent weather. But although Burnley give all clubs the full allocation they make them sell the seats at the back first other than the minimum ‘pitchside’ quota so unless you sell the full 2,500 it looks a bit naff. Don’t blame them, unlike us, they lessen the effect of the away support all they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verlaine1979 Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Barnes clearly should've had a penalty - absolutely bang on. He nicked it around McCarthy's dive, and his momentum would clearly have led to him catching up with the ball before it even skipped out of the penalty area. In all likelihood, if McC doesn't take him out, he has a chance to swipe it with his right foot into an empty net from a half-decent angle. Sure, he hasn't exactly got an elastic touch, but I find it hard to argue that knocking it to the right, in line with his own direction of travel, somehow constitutes him not having control of the ball - it happened on the edge of the box, not the touchline. Can anyone who is claiming it wasn't a foul explain where in the rules it says it's okay for a keeper to take out an opposition player in the penalty area without winning the ball? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 I find it hard to argue that knocking it to the right, in line with his own direction of travel, somehow constitutes him not having control of the ball If his natural 'direction of travel' was to the right, how come he veered to the left before falling over McCarthy? To try and ensure he got the penalty, I guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 I’ve already said I agree with that bit. The shirt pull is a foul and it should have been a free kick to us but it comes back to the old cliche of playing to the whistle. Shirts get pulled at every set piece and players know it goes unpunished 90% of the time. Until we get VAR we just have to accept that. 90% of shirt pulls by defenders (refs reluctant to give soft penalties) maybe. But shirt pulls and other minor infractions by attackers in the penalty box are usually penalized. In this case it's even worse, since Crouch's foul occurred just before the handball (whether deliberate or not). You can't ignore one and give the other. Yes the ref didn't see it (the assistant ref should've btw), but if either of them had the ref would've penalized the foul by Crouch. Anyway who cares, it was obviously a make up call for the first one. If the first penalty incident hadn't occurred I doubt the second one would've been given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macca155 Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 Good grief bit noisy on here. Why do people have to get personal, just opinions. I'm sure there a few of us on here who have refed a bit and trust me in real time you don't get the chance for that level of analysis. Neither do you look to equalise decisions, no ref wants to go down that road. There lies madness. If you make a mistake you just try to ensure there are no more. The first was a pen clear as day. I can only assume the ref felt the ball had been kicked further away than it actually was. Poor decision, it happens move on with the game. Barnes should be serving a 3 match ban for his outburst disgraceful. That really is something refs should stamp on. 2nd was obviously handball. Why wasn't Bendarek or Vestergaard on Crouch. He is known for those shenanigans. A bit daft from Stephens he needs to concentrate more and avoid these brain farts, rest of his game is improving. Ref should have blown for the shirt tug, however they let so many go these days it isn't surprising. His matcj report won 't make easy reading. I really hope VAR never arrives, it will kill debates like this. It is half the fun. Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 If his natural 'direction of travel' was to the right, how come he veered to the left before falling over McCarthy? To try and ensure he got the penalty, I guess? He also went down too slow, it looked artificial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrfahaji Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 If his natural 'direction of travel' was to the right, how come he veered to the left before falling over McCarthy? To try and ensure he got the penalty, I guess? I think mainly because McCarthy gave him nowhere to go, if he had continued to the right he would have been taken out from the side. Instead (if my memory serves me right, I'm not currently looking at the replay), Barnes seems to hesitate/stop before going over forwards/to the left. I'd love to think that it was simulation, but on this occasion I can't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint IQ Posted 3 February, 2019 Share Posted 3 February, 2019 If Stephens had just fallen over like a pansy like nearly every La Liga centre back would the ref probably would have blown for a freekick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 So what if you were at the game. I’ve done Turfmoor loads of times and it would have been near on impossible to see Crouch’s pull from the other end of the ground.Exactly. Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 If his natural 'direction of travel' was to the right, how come he veered to the left before falling over McCarthy? To try and ensure he got the penalty, I guess? That's how I saw it too, he made up his mind to fall over the keeper and went left to make sure McC couldn't pull out. 50:50 chance of fooling the ref, and we got lucky this time. I think if he'd have gone right (same as the ball) and gone down it would have been given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrfahaji Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 If Stephens had just fallen over like a pansy like nearly every La Liga centre back would the ref probably would have blown for a freekick. More to the point, if he had fallen over, he would have taken Crouch with him as Crouch was using him as leverage for his jump. However, I think it's unfair to judge Stephens for that, unlikely that you could make that sort of decision in real time. I think the reality is that Stephens went to jump for the ball, with his arms up the way any player does, then on feeling his shirt being pulled and his leap impeded, instinctively puts his arm up further to appeal for a foul. In hindsight it looks like a stupid thing to have done, but it is also something which is understandable in the heat of the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFC Forever Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 I could buy that if he actually looked like he was flinging his arms up to gain momentum but he wasn’t, he just had his arm up like some crap Freddy Mercury impression. I guess everyone sees things differently, I’ll stick with what I (and England’s 2 greatest ever strikers) saw. The two ex england strikers didn't have the images that we saw later. from the angles that were shown one showed Crouch holding but not to the degree that we were later able to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wild-saint Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 The two ex england strikers didn't have the images that we saw later. from the angles that were shown one showed Crouch holding but not to the degree that we were later able to see. Watched “goals on Sunday” on sky ans they showed the highlights. Interestingly they didn’t show ings effort but they did focus in the pen at the end and they had a camera angle that clearly showed it as a tug and talked about it being a foul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verlaine1979 Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 If his natural 'direction of travel' was to the right, how come he veered to the left before falling over McCarthy? To try and ensure he got the penalty, I guess? He didn't. I've watched the replay over and over and have no idea what you're talking about. He's a bit off balance from stretching to control the ball with his toe, but he's moving towards it when - and this is really the crux of the matters - McCarthy slides in at full throttle and wipes him out without touching the ball. There's no swerving or leaving a leg in - Barnes would've have had to stop running and leap straight up in order to avoid McCarthy, who was spreading his body as far as possible, and he has no obligation to do that. If the keeper wants to hare out and slide through the attacker, he has to make sure he touches the ball at the same time, otherwise 99 times out of 100 it'll be a penalty, as it should've been on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the saint in winchester Posted 4 February, 2019 Share Posted 4 February, 2019 He's 'one of us', so, by definition, has committed no foul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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