Which of the youngsters do you/don't you rate?

[SNSUN]

It seems that each of our youngsters have posters on here that do or don't rate them, and I was wondering which youngster had the most/fewest supporters on here. (While we should support ALL our players, it does seem like we could be relying on the young players a lot for the rest of this season to cover the first teamers. (In Hasenhuttl we trust.))

 

So, the list of youngsters reads: Lewis, Valery, Ramsey, Jones, Slattery, Hesketh, Sims, Johnson, Barnes, Gallagher, Obafemi and if you want you can include McQueen and Reed in this for the purposes of argument, or others that I've omitted such as those even younger that could find a way in to first team recognition, or even more experienced players like Targett and Ward-Prowse.

 

I do think it's a hard question, as it depends on how much you have seen of each player. I've probably seen the most of Sims out of that lot, and I rate his pace and directness, although the loan to Reading perhaps could have been more successful. I do think he can be an asset for us, especially as beyond Redmond, Armstrong and the ineffectual Elyounoussi, we lack attacking midfield players. Valery is the player we will no doubt see the most of unless we bring in a right back - his red card worries me in terms of his attitude, but posters on this board were calling for him to play as early as the start of last season, so he must have something about him. Also I'd love to find out if Gallagher could do anything given a run of games.

 

Who do you rate/not rate amongst the youngsters?

[beatlesaint]

I must say I like the look of Johnson against Derby. Put in some decent crosses. Shame he got booked and taken off half time.

Valery will be good, would like to see Hesketh given a chance, same with Sims. Obafemi will be good if he works on his finishing and, going by what Ralph said, his fitness too.

 

I’m really not sure about Gallagher and Slattery. Admittedly only seen bits and pieces of them but if Ralph thinks they are good enough that will do me.

[iansums]

Cabbage Face, has plenty to say for himself but is really failing to deliver where it counts.

[Daft Kerplunk]

Out of those listed above, Jones, Slattery and Obafemi have a chance of having a premier league career but those are still touch and go.

[Saint Garrett]

Lewis - 21 - No idea really - think i've seen him once when we got dicked by Arsenal

Valery - 19 - Been chucked in at the deep end and I think he's been very impressive. Quick, strong, sometimes a bit rash, but seems to have a lot of confidence in himself, got no problem with that. Not worried by him playing for the rest of the season at all.

Ramsey - 18 - Probably the youngest on the list, again chucked into the deep end. Clearly got talent, but not ready yet IMO. A way behind Valery.

Jones - 21 - No idea, think I've seen him once in a pre-season game. CB is a difficult position to come into as a youngster.

Slattery - 19 - Very promising player, has slotted in when given a chance, and looks comfortable.

Hesketh - 22 - Not really a youngster anymore, probably has one more year with us and then if he doesn't make it he probably needs to move on and play regularly. Could play a part if part of the squad this season? Looked ok, good skills, but not sure he's good enough to play regularly in the premier league.

Sims - 21 - Obviously promising a few years ago, very disappointing loan spell, but could be an asset for us this season with our lack of options. Similar to Hesketh, I think that he needs to make it happen in the next year or so, or we'll be looking to move him on. Will need to be counted in 25 man squad.

Johnson - 20 - Thought he looked promising vs Derby, and might need him on Wednesday...Not quite sure where his position is, but might need a loan move to get some experience.

Barnes - 22 - Banging them in for the reserves, again part of the squad which needs to be named, promising, might need a loan move to see how he gets on.

Gallagher - 23 - Can't make my mind up with him. To me, he doesn't look good enough to be a premier league striker, always been quite gangly and possibly lacking the technical ability, but proved himself in the Championship. Might get a chance in coming months but at the age of 23, it's difficult to call him a youngster anymore.

Obafemi - 18 - Like him, works hard and is a nuisance. Again though, not sure he's got the technical ability to make it as a premier league player, reminds me a bit of Michael Antonio. Only 18 so got a few years to prove himself.

McQueen - 23 - Again, not a kid anymore, think he's alright, but he'll have missed a big chunk of his development with this injury. Wouldn't be surprised if we let him go in the summer if he's fit again.

Reed - 24 - Not a kid, promising performances in the Championship, just don't see where he fits next year. He's not better than Lemina, Pierre, JWP or Romeu. Can see him going to a Championship club permanently in the summer - possibly a newly promoted side.

[OldNick]

Ive seen very little of him, but Slattery looks a prospect

[Useful Idiot]

I slightly prefer Hesketh to Sims, although I enjoy watching both play.

 

I think Hesketh has slightly better technique and more of an eye for a pass, although he's not as quick or direct.

 

Valery is promising, as is Obafemi. Gallagher needs at least a few sub appearances to get his fitness back and see if he can fit into Ralph's system. Johnson might have something about him going forwards, although I don't know if he's good enough defensively to play as a wing back. Ramsey looks raw, and I've not seen enough of Barnes or Lewis to say anything about them whatsoever.

[Turkish]

Can only go on what I've seen and that doesn't include some of them.

 

Gallagher has huge potential. It's so frustrating to watch with most just going with the simplistic if he's good enough he'd be playing mantra. But he's been so badly mismanaged. Hope he gets more chances but genuinely think his best chance now is to move elsewhere.

 

Reed the same. Was a useful premier league midfielder, then treated badly and poor expensive players like Clasie pushed him aside. He's not currently as good as Romeu, Lemina, Hojbjerg, but if he'd actually been treated well and allowed to progress he could be by now.

 

Sims has played a stupidly low number of games in his career for his age. Needs time on the pitch for us or someone else. And not a really poor defensive side like he got at Reading.

 

Valery looks raw but there's no getting away from the fact he's coped well against some really good players. Looks rash sometimes but rarely fazed by it all.

 

Obafemi I find hard to rate. Mobile, good positioning but has missed a lot of chances. Honestly no idea if he'll end up being any good but we have the right manager to find out.

 

Whether they end up good or not, it's clear it's better to find out than spend fortunes on people like Clasie, Elyounoussi, Carrillo and so on.

 

You don't half come out with some nonsense.

 

You think Gallagher has "huge potential" despite scoring one goal in eighteen appearances for Saints in the premier league then hardly ripping it up the championship or league one on loan the last 3 season. Yet Obafemi you "find it hard to rate" despite scoring the same amount of goals as Gallagher in 6 games and already making his full international debut, you admit hes mobile with good position but don't rate him because in his first 6 games he missed a few chances. What exactly would a young player have to do in his first 6 games in the premier league for you to be able to rate them?

[SuperSAINT]

Can only go on what I've seen and that doesn't include some of them.

 

Gallagher has huge potential. It's so frustrating to watch with most just going with the simplistic if he's good enough he'd be playing mantra. But he's been so badly mismanaged. Hope he gets more chances but genuinely think his best chance now is to move elsewhere.

 

Reed the same. Was a useful premier league midfielder, then treated badly and poor expensive players like Clasie pushed him aside. He's not currently as good as Romeu, Lemina, Hojbjerg, but if he'd actually been treated well and allowed to progress he could be by now.

 

Sims has played a stupidly low number of games in his career for his age. Needs time on the pitch for us or someone else. And not a really poor defensive side like he got at Reading.

 

Valery looks raw but there's no getting away from the fact he's coped well against some really good players. Looks rash sometimes but rarely fazed by it all.

 

Obafemi I find hard to rate. Mobile, good positioning but has missed a lot of chances. Honestly no idea if he'll end up being any good but we have the right manager to find out.

Whether they end up good or not, it's clear it's better to find out than spend fortunes on people like Clasie, Elyounoussi, Carrillo and so on.

 

My answer the the OP is this bit (on all of them).

[Hatch]

I'm still to.be convinced about Valery and Ramsey.

[Dangermouth]

Lewis - 21 - No idea really - *Yes, I've copied the post and edited it.

Valery - 19 - Unsure. Wasn't too keen on him at U23 level but he's done ok when he's moved up.

Ramsey - 18 - Seen a little of him on the telly. Brought a ball under control nicely but can't say.

Jones - 21 - No idea, think I've seen him once in a pre-season game. CB is a difficult position to come into as a youngster.

Slattery - 19 - Wasn't impressed at the lower level, not impressed here. He just hasn't played or done enough and been steady.

Hesketh - 22 - Wasn't impressed previously because he didn't have the physique. He did well at Burton. I don't know if he's quite got the engine RH wants but I think a lot more of him now than I used to. Easily good enough to play at the level below ours and has youth on his side.

Sims - 21 - Nice feet, good football brain, needs to play and see how he gets on over the next 18 months - 2 years.

Johnson - 20 - Too early to say.

Barnes - 22 - Before his injury a couple of years ago I rated him. He might have gone backwards, but hope he goes forwards again.

Gallagher - 23 - **** loads of potential. Play him and keep playing him. Better than that lad from Brum we're meant to be intererested in.

Obafemi - 18 - Body shape wrong, positioning wrong, even his goal wasn't hit cleanly. Jury's out.

McQueen - 23 - Let's see how he gets on after he recovers from his injury.

Reed - 24 - Not sure. Would like to see what RH can do with him. Could be surprisingly good.

[sad saints fan]

I think Will Ferry, who is still not a regular with u23. could well make the step up very quickly . Looks to have pace,skill and an eye for goal.

[Chewy]

I think we have 4 players (reed, hesketh, sims and Gallagher) who's key formative years coincided with dull, safe managers and terrible football. This meant a lack of game time and opportunities when they most needed it and I feel for them, as I think their careers will suffer as a result.

For sims. I think tricky wingers peak quite young and I'd expect him to have made an impact by now if he was ever going to at this level. Hesketh looks tidy with a good brain, and had a decent spell at burton from what I can gather, but is fast running out of time. Gallagher has all the attributes you'd want for a cf, but hasn't been remotely prolific, and has had the additional injury concerns. Reed, although the oldest, probably has the best chance after two seemingly good loan spells at Norwich and especially Blackburn. I think his industry will suit Ralph, although with lemina, jwp, hoj and Romeu may struggle to break in. All are pretty much in last chance saloon for breaking through due to age, and the fact we need to trim the squad doesn't help their cause.

 

Most of the others have a bit more time on their side IMHO. Three who don't are McQueen, Barnes and flannigan. All have been unlucky with injuries. McQueen did kind of break through but has serious competition at left back, the other two have simply not played proper level football. I think they all might be ones to let go, though would like to give McQueen another season.

 

The one who intrigues me is Jones. A few years ago iirc he was touted as the next really big thing, and guan (who I think we all respect) keeps saying we will regret letting him go if we do. But his loan wasn't great and we're stacked for young centre backs so can't see where his pathway through is?

 

For the older ones it does seem a shame. So much raw talent, but with a squad our size I think we probably need to be ruthless not sentimental and move the majority on.

[Cabbage_Face]

Slattery and Valery are only ones that I’m bothered about

 

 

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[Guan 2.0]

I think Alfie Jones has the potential to our First Choice CB for the next ten years. Still a hell of a lot of work to do, but it is there.

[Lighthouse]

Like the look of Obafemi and Johnson.

Not really seen enough of Slattery of Ramsay but they aren’t ready yet.

Valery is still raw, I’m undecided.

Hesketh, Sims and Barnes are on their last chance to do something, wouldn’t say I rate them.

Never seen Jones or Lewis play, that I can recall.

 

Reed, Gallagher and McQ aren’t youngsters. Time to move on.

[Chewy]

I think Alfie Jones has the potential to our First Choice CB for the next ten years. Still a hell of a lot of work to do, but it is there.

 

I do hope you're right. What do you thinks best for him? I figure a loan in the championship might toughen him up against some proper centre forwards, but don't know if it's more coaching than game time he needs.

[Baird of the land]

Younger ones time will tell. Of the older ones..

 

Hesketh I like the look of a lot. If he doesn’t get a look into between now and end of season it may be time for him to get the right move elsewhere.

 

Gallagher has got all the attributes. Hoping he gets chances between now and end of season to see if he can make the most of those abilities. Should have been given chances before now especially last season (but for the idiot pellegrino)

 

Reed. A bit of a yo yoing in my opinion of him at times. Done very well on loan twice though and probably deserves a shot in first team squad next season to prove himself.

 

Sims i’ve Never been too sure on other than he has pace. Last chance saloon.

Mcqueen, thought he might develop into a bridge at left back but seems to have regressed. Recuperate and move on.

[John Boy Saint]

As was pointed out by Glen in the League 1 minus 10 blog, Valery does have a “I don’t give **** who you are” (probably spent too much time with Jack Stephens] watching the Chelsea and Leicester games, Hazard got minuscule change out of him all night, and respected the fact. Chilwell for Leicester was getting pretty hacked off with him, probably relived when immaturity saw Valery using up all the hot water in the showers first.

 

Unlike others I think Gallagher has got it, he just needs a spin in the team. Hopefully if we keep going as we have of late under Ralph the time will come for him to get a proper go.

 

Obsfemi, like I said elsewhere I think might he be getting a bit of intense conditioning, hence the Hamstring seemingly taking an age to mend.....Think he has got what it takes, with the right polishing he could be a devastating player in the new set up.

[norwaysaint]

So difficult for anyone to say much for sure. I never heard Valery mentioned here until he was in the team and now he is generally accepted as being good enough to play. JWP was slowly being written off by more and more fans, but now seems to have found a place in the team with RH's system. Slattery wasn't generally the player we were all expecting to see come through next, but that seems to be the case. Targett has also gone from being a player we should move on, to being a creditable alternative when Bertrand is out.

 

The threads about defenders on here had Bednarek way down the list and generally not seen as worthy of selection and Redmond was seen as possibly our worst player.

 

 

So I'm just going to wait to see whether Hesketh, Sims and Gallagher fit in with the team we are becoming and whether RH can find potential there or not.

[kwsaint]

Saw Slattery play at Derby. Looked OK. May develop. Obafemi is very raw but looks like he may have something. Like Valery's attitude. Think that he could do well. Not afraid to get stuck in.

 

Agree with the comments about some of the others. Especially the comment about the key development years of some of them coinciding with poor management. Especially Reed. Really rated him when he first played, but it looks a bit late for him now. Although he is clearly going to have a career in Championship/League 1.

[rooney]

I think Will Ferry, who is still not a regular with u23. could well make the step up very quickly . Looks to have pace,skill and an eye for goal.

 

This lad always seems to stand out when he plays. Agree he has good potential.

[angelman]

I'm not sure it's quite the question of who you rate and who you don't, but what chance they are given. British kids aren't any less able than those abroad, yet the PL seem not to give them the chance that they need to get to the top. Look at Eden Hazard - he left his Belgian club when he was 14 to go to Lille Youth. When he was 16 he moved in the Lille U19 and a year later, he moved into the Lille main side where he played for 4 years, before signing for Chelsea. The academy that came up to the PL flourished because it could afford to blood the players in as we progressed through the leagues. So when we got to the PL, they weren't raw and inexperienced, they hit the floor running and were picked up by bigger teams.

 

So the real question is, how can we get that experience for academy players? U23 isn't the same think. The Checkatrade Trophy is not great. Loans? Maybe. A tie up with another team in another league would make sense, although not sure if this generation would be happy living abroad. It is interesting to see that there seems to be a trickle of players going to the Bundesliga, which is hardly an uncompetitive league.

[Doctoroncall]

I think Alfie Jones has the potential to our First Choice CB for the next ten years. Still a hell of a lot of work to do, but it is there.

 

What makes you say that... is it the football intelligence - be able to see situations quicker and work it out, physicality, technique or a bit of each?

 

At least all the current youngsters have enough about them, should they move on, to make it as football league players.

[Brumsaint]

I trust Ralf and his team to get the most out of all of them. I'm surprised that Sims and Hesketh haven't been given a chance yet when others have. Considering the improvements we've seen in other players who'd been written off, I expect a few more to come good, but I think it'll take a while.

[Sheaf Saint]

I trust Ralf and his team to get the most out of all of them. I'm surprised that Sims and Hesketh haven't been given a chance yet when others have. Considering the improvements we've seen in other players who'd been written off, I expect a few more to come good, but I think it'll take a while.

 

Hesketh was injured when he returned from his loan at Burton and is still recovering.

 

Sims wasn't eligible to play in the Derby replay due to not being registered as part of the squad for the initial game, but I might have expected him to at least make the bench for Everton.

[Nordic Saint]

Stephens is turning into a good player. I used to think that Sims looked a brilliant prospect but his progress seems to have stalled lately. I've been impressed by what I've seen of Valery so far. Of those yet to appear in the first team, Christoph Klarer looks a good prospect.

[Dr. Kucho]

Will Smallbone is a name I often see mentioned in U23/19 match reports. One for the future?

[DrunkenSaint]

Reed- Very good player, a much better all-round player than Jwp (yes I will probably get flamed for saying that), would fit in the pressing system as he does that for Blackburn and he has some engine in him, the lad just keep going. Would play just behind the 2 strikers in RH preferred formation. Possibly not an every match starter but hes good enough to stand in or to come on to close out the game (pack the midfield) He's certainly better than Elyounoussi.

 

Sims- Again very good just needs a run of games, a good preseason under RH would do him good, probably not a starter but would bring something from the bench or a good option to bring in for injured/tired players.

 

Jones - A very good promising player, I would like to see him play cups games next year to see how he gets on and which would allow a defender valuable rest time.

 

Mcqueen - Better than Targett as a wingback but need to see what he is like after he returns from that bad injury.

 

 

Smallbone - Not on that list but a player that has very good quality and I think he could break through next season, one to watch!

 

Others either need more time being young or just not up for it, Gallagher seems ok not quite sure if he's premiership though, defo needs a run of games, Heskith, not sure if he's premiership either im afraid.

[Lighthouse]

I guess we've got our answer on Seager

 

https://southamptonfc.com/news/2019-01-29/ryan-seager-southampton-contract-released