What do we want and how do we achieve it?

[Mole]

It also needs a receptive audience. Unfortunately, while a lot of fans will agree with most of the voted-on policies of the Trust, most of them will also use the one policy - whatever it may be - they don't agree with to beat it with and refuse to join or get involved solely because of that.

 

It would be nigh-on impossible to have a series of policies that every single supporter agreed on, and for some reason there seems to be a complete lack of any willing on the part of anybody to compromise.

 

The share proxy from Wilde and the principle of a fan on the board is why the Trust failed.

 

Just imagine if Nick Illingsworth was currently sat on the board speaking on behalf of us.

[Frank's cousin]

Frank I don't want to escalate this - of course your opinion is welcome and legitimate, its just that there are times your posts do tend to lecture, sermonise or whatever the correct word is. I am sure we all do it to a degree because it is a way of persuading others to come round to our viewpoints but if you could read your some of your posts as an outsider you would probably see what I am saying.

 

You have no idea of Crouch's precise motives in offering the £2m and yet you are prepared to criticise from what appears to be your chosen moral highground.

 

 

I would suggest though Duncan that its more to do with current over sensitivities that you call it surmonising and whatever, when its just one opinion.

 

The Crouch criticism I stand by. I know you probably feel that its disingenuousand I can certainly see how it might be misread, but the it does not take a leap of faith to see that it was Never likely to be called upon... thats not moral high ground but cynicism! Which I freely admit, no different had Lowe made such a claim. NOW I am sure that Crouch would honour it wre Wilde and LOwe suddenly overcome with generosity or they won the lottery, but its the kind of thing I just really hate - claims that are so very easy to make, that we kind know will never be substantiated and yet gives good PR.... no different from Wilde's 'investment waiting in the wings' - and you might recall how musch stick h got for that one.

 

I just wish these guys would avoid this sort of thing.

[Mole]

Interesting analysis of why the Trust did not work, Steve. Were there other reasons and do you know the current status or position of the Trust? Is it now just NI's mouthpiece or something more? Its presence imo now is a hindrance just at a time where it is needed the most.

 

Correct. Mistakes were made early doors but that's all in the past now, what we are left with now though is just a SISAesque shell that does more harm than good. If Nick stood down and one of the boardmembers took the chairmanship and respresented the fans, as oposed to himself, i suppose it could be salvaged, but they'd need to act fast - too fast i think to keep up with current events.

[stevegrant]

Interesting analysis of why the Trust did not work, Steve. Were there other reasons and do you know the current status or position of the Trust?

Haven't a clue about the "position" of it, to be honest. I speak to Nick and a few of the other board members occasionally, but I'm not aware of anything major in the pipeline, although I have vague recollections of them being quite happy with the membership recruitment drive they did before Christmas. I would expect them to be formulating some sort of plan or statement on the current situation, but I really don't know.

 

Is it now just NI's mouthpiece or something more?

I don't think it's ever been that, to be honest, although I can see why that may be the perception. Nick is probably the only "recognised" name on the board now, so I guess it's inevitable that it all leads back to him, but he's been chairman for quite a while now.

 

Its presence imo now is a hindrance just at a time where it is needed the most.

It's only a hindrance if people want to make it one. The Trust is the perfect vehicle for supporters who want their voice to be heard within the club, its structure ensures that the majority viewpoint is always taken, so any policies will always be reflective of the majority of the membership. Of course, unless every supporter joined, it won't be entirely reflective of the fanbase, but given a bit of support it could easily represent a significant cross-section.

 

I think a lot more was made of the "fan on the board" stuff than was necessary - it certainly wasn't the single policy that many people seemed to think it was, and the original idea was a 5-year plan to get to that stage. Unfortunately those in control at the club at the time decided that they'd try to rush it through before the Trust had gained the kudos and reputation it required in order to make it work, and I made my reservations (particularly surrounding the idea of combining the Trust's membership figures with those of the regional supporters groups to get to the "magical" 1600 figure) known at the time, but others felt it was too good an opportunity to turn down (for the Trust, not for them personally - I don't think any of those on the board at the time would have actually been the fan who got voted onto the SFC board) and one the Trust might not get again, which was their choice and one that I accepted on the democratic basis.

 

It's still there, and the board has decent people working on it, but in order for it to do anything it requires people to support it and to buy into the idea. I'd like to think that having Nick as chairman wouldn't put people off, but I can also appreciate that he's not everyone's cup of tea. I think his experience of supporter initiatives could prove very useful in these troubled times, though. Whether people are willing to give him and the others a chance is another matter.

 

Edit to add: of course, if Nick isn't leading it or acting as spokesman, as I said in the other thread it still requires somebody to step up to the plate and be ready to assist the media at no notice. I don't envisage many people being willing or able to do so.

[Frank's cousin]

Haven't a clue about the "position" of it, to be honest. I speak to Nick and a few of the other board members occasionally, but I'm not aware of anything major in the pipeline, although I have vague recollections of them being quite happy with the membership recruitment drive they did before Christmas. I would expect them to be formulating some sort of plan or statement on the current situation, but I really don't know.

 

 

I don't think it's ever been that, to be honest, although I can see why that may be the perception. Nick is probably the only "recognised" name on the board now, so I guess it's inevitable that it all leads back to him, but he's been chairman for quite a while now.

 

 

It's only a hindrance if people want to make it one. The Trust is the perfect vehicle for supporters who want their voice to be heard within the club, its structure ensures that the majority viewpoint is always taken, so any policies will always be reflective of the majority of the membership. Of course, unless every supporter joined, it won't be entirely reflective of the fanbase, but given a bit of support it could easily represent a significant cross-section.

 

I think a lot more was made of the "fan on the board" stuff than was necessary - it certainly wasn't the single policy that many people seemed to think it was, and the original idea was a 5-year plan to get to that stage. Unfortunately those in control at the club at the time decided that they'd try to rush it through before the Trust had gained the kudos and reputation it required in order to make it work, and I made my reservations (particularly surrounding the idea of combining the Trust's membership figures with those of the regional supporters groups to get to the "magical" 1600 figure) known at the time, but others felt it was too good an opportunity to turn down (for the Trust, not for them personally - I don't think any of those on the board at the time would have actually been the fan who got voted onto the SFC board) and one the Trust might not get again, which was their choice and one that I accepted on the democratic basis.

 

It's still there, and the board has decent people working on it, but in order for it to do anything it requires people to support it and to buy into the idea. I'd like to think that having Nick as chairman wouldn't put people off, but I can also appreciate that he's not everyone's cup of tea. I think his experience of supporter initiatives could prove very useful in these troubled times, though. Whether people are willing to give him and the others a chance is another matter.

 

Edit to add: of course, if Nick isn't leading it or acting as spokesman, as I said in the other thread it still requires somebody to step up to the plate and be ready to assist the media at no notice. I don't envisage many people being willing or able to do so.

 

Its funny... The thought of having Nick represent me previously horrified me, I thought he was a hot head - but although i dont agree with everything he says, after having met him, i can honestly say he is as passionate a fan as there is. He clearly cares about the club, way more than I do and I do think his post does demonstrate a balanced and fair perspective - however, its clear that this is now in a minority so unlikely to be popular. If NIck had come out with a statement that supported Crouch 100%, and slagged Lowe and Wilde, would the rsponse to his 'representation' be different? too right it would.

[Big Bad Bob]

Ron, I happen to know someone who is working behind the scenes to organise something very akin to your outline above. But like someone has said, it takes time and money which I know he is prepared to put in. When he launches his plan it will be up to all of us to help as much as we can. Work on the website etc etc is being done as we speak/shout.

 

Duncan (and for SaintRobbie too), I'm sorry but I don't believe that we (as fans) can go out and sell the club without the support of the shareholders.

 

Surely a large enough tranch of shareholders have to agree to sell their shares to be able to force a compulosry purchase of the rest. Even if they manage to 'only' get 30% they need to offer to buy the rest of the shares at that price and then THE CURRENT BOARD HAVE TO APPROVE IT!!

 

The only way I can see this being done if someone comes in with a bid WAAAAY over the odds, say 70p a share!! Can you see that happening??

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Duncan (and for SaintRobbie too), I'm sorry but I don't believe that we (as fans) can go out and sell the club without the support of the shareholders.

 

Surely a large enough tranch of shareholders have to agree to sell their shares to be able to force a compulosry purchase of the rest. Even if they manage to 'only' get 30% they need to offer to buy the rest of the shares at that price and then THE CURRENT BOARD HAVE TO APPROVE IT!!

 

The only way I can see this being done if someone comes in with a bid WAAAAY over the odds, say 70p a share!! Can you see that happening??

 

Hi BBB, No I can't.

 

Let's just wait and see what this person comes up with - he has given the matter a lot of thought and effort. If its unworkable so be it but I do feel slightly less helpless knowing someone is actually doing something other than fishing for salmon or beating each other up.

[um pahars]

Interesting analysis of why the Trust did not work, Steve. Were there other reasons and do you know the current status or position of the Trust? Is it now just NI's mouthpiece or something more? Its presence imo now is a hindrance just at a time where it is needed the most.

 

The Trust is a perfect vehicle for fans to rally behind.

 

One member/one vote, a rock solid constitution, Supporters Direct advice and support, etc etc etc.

 

It is very much up to what supporters and the membership want out of it.

 

If people think Nick is out of touch (and I think he is and have told him this personally) then it is fairly simple to do something about it as after all he has to represent his members view. It's not Nick's Trust, it's the members trust and if you want to change things then you have to roll up your sleeves and do something about it.

 

However, that would mean getting involved which is sadly something people down here can't be ar55ed to do until things either come to a head or are too late.

 

It could be a very powerful tool if used correctly.

[Window Cleaner]

The Trust is a perfect vehicle for fans to rally behind.

 

One member/one vote, a rock solid constitution, Supporters Direct advice and support, etc etc etc.

 

It is very much up to what supporters and the membership want out of it.

 

If people think Nick is out of touch (and I think he is and have told him this personally) then it is fairly simple to do something about it as after all he has to represent his members view. It's not Nick's Trust, it's the members trust and if you want to change things then you have to roll up your sleeves and do something about it.

 

However, that would mean getting involved which is sadly something people down here can't be ar55ed to do until things either come to a head or are too late.

 

 

 

It could be a very powerful tool if used correctly.

 

 

the Trust is a good idea, trouble is the piffling tenner it costs to join.

Jack it up to serious money and you may get further,just my opinion of course.

[derry]

Haven't a clue about the "position" of it, to be honest. I speak to Nick and a few of the other board members occasionally, but I'm not aware of anything major in the pipeline, although I have vague recollections of them being quite happy with the membership recruitment drive they did before Christmas. I would expect them to be formulating some sort of plan or statement on the current situation, but I really don't know.

 

I don't think it's ever been that, to be honest, although I can see why that may be the perception. Nick is probably the only "recognised" name on the board now, so I guess it's inevitable that it all leads back to him, but he's been chairman for quite a while now.etc.etc.

 

 

 

Steve, I understand what you are saying but the trust to people like me on the outside, is seen as a busted flush.

 

It needs something new and unconnected. Originally it was a good idea but it has just withered on the vine.

[Amesbury Saint]

Frank the person I am alluding to is not a mysterious player waiting in the wings or a maker of empty promises, he posts on here and is fed up listening to all the posturing and sermonising (most of it coming from you recently) and he has got off his arse to do something. He also hates Lowe. I will help him to the best of my abilities - no doubt you will too.

 

how and when can we help?

 

keen to get started!

 

Andrew

[trousers]

Ah ha from your last sentences - seems like you are already getting ready to write this bloke and his ideas off already. This guy is not mounting a takeover ffs just coming up with an idea that regains control of our club, lets wait and see what he has to offer before criticising him.

 

Any news on when this chap is aiming to go public with his idea Duncan?

 

Cheers

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Any news on when this chap is aiming to go public with his idea Duncan?

 

Cheers

 

As soon as work on the website is concluded - work started this week Trousers - so not too long.

[trousers]

As soon as work on the website is concluded - work started this week Trousers - so not too long.

 

Cheers! Apologies for my impatience