Danny Röhl

[Faz]

This seems very odd. Very odd indeed.

 

 

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Why so? Perhaps he, or his family, couldn’t settle. Likely to be something as simple as that imo.

[LeBenali]

For me the strangest part is not wanting to replace him - off the top of my head I can’t think of any top flight manager who has, through choice, not had an officia assistant.

[trousers]

So, this new era of transparency that was trumpeted at the recent fan forum... Seems to be going well...

[Matthew Le God]

So, this new era of transparency that was trumpeted at the recent fan forum... Seems to be going well...

 

Should transparency extend to public disclosure of an employee's reasons for leaving a post? Perhaps Rohl doesn't want the reason publicly announced.

[Danbert]

Daily Echo article: https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/17804835.southampton-assistant-manager-danny-rohl-leaves-club/?ref=rss

[Lallana's Left Peg]

Should transparency extend to public disclosure of an employee's reasons for leaving a post? Perhaps Rohl doesn't want the reason publicly announced.

 

Not necessarily. But shouldn't we be finding out that the Assistant Manager has left from the club before the local newspaper? That would feel like a transparent thing to do.

[trousers]

Should transparency extend to public disclosure of an employee's reasons for leaving a post? Perhaps Rohl doesn't want the reason publicly announced.

Where did I say that a reason should be given?

 

I didn't have you down as a reading-between-the-lines and jumping-to-the-wrong-conclusion kinda guy...

[trousers]

Not necessarily. But shouldn't we be finding out that the Assistant Manager has left from the club before the local newspaper? That would feel like a transparent thing to do.

Indeed

[Saint_clark]

For me the strangest part is not wanting to replace him - off the top of my head I can’t think of any top flight manager who has, through choice, not had an officia assistant.

Is Kelvin not assistant manager?

 

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[Matthew Le God]

Is Kelvin not assistant manager?

 

No, he is 'first team assistant coach'. The same job title as Fleming and Watson.

 

Rohl was the assistant manager.

[Mr X]

Am a little worried now, could be easy explained but when the club say nothing what are you supposed to think? Seems lots of falling out going on at the moment with players & coaches..... Let's hope RH is getting rid of the people that aren't on the same page as him

 

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[saintoaks]

Am a little worried now, could be easy explained but when the club say nothing what are you supposed to think? Seems lots of falling out going on at the moment with players & coaches..... Let's hope RH is getting rid of the people that aren't on the same page as him

 

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Why are you a little worried ?

 

Its business as normal, move on.

[Faz]

Am a little worried now, could be easy explained but when the club say nothing what are you supposed to think? Seems lots of falling out going on at the moment with players & coaches..... Let's hope RH is getting rid of the people that aren't on the same page as him

 

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Really? Do name names.

[Fatboy40]

Well, I know I shouldn't be but I am a little worried by this.

 

The stories post them joining Saints of both staying up late analysing matches and players, when others would have long since been in bed, and being generally a tight duo was very positive to hear.

 

Yes, he may have left for perfectly normal reasons relating to a change of country and culture etc., but this is like cutting off Ralph's right hand and has got to have at least a short term negative impact.

[jamesfp1]

Obviously personal reasons hence no explanation. Ralph is happy so I'm happy.

[angelman]

Is Ralph happy? He may well be, but taking on even more of a work load is probably not the best idea, given that it seems to be pretty heavy already.

[Matthew Le God]

Is Ralph happy? He may well be, but taking on even more of a work load is probably not the best idea, given that it seems to be pretty heavy already.

 

What extra work load would he be taking on? Saints have 3 senior team coaches (Fleming, Davis, Watson) and senior team video analysts.

[Useful Idiot]

What extra work load would he be taking on? Saints have 3 senior team coaches (Fleming, Davis, Watson) and senior team video analysts.

 

But in Football Manager you need at least 9 first team coaches (13 including youth team staff) to get all the team training down to light workload and keep all your players happy!

 

He definitely needs an assistant manages as that doesn't count towards the coach limit, too...

 

How is a real life football manager supposed to cope with such a small number of staff on the coaching team???

 

Required Coaches = 9 (13 total including u23 staff)

 

Split of coaches:

 

2 x Fitness coaches,

 

2 x Goalkeeping coaches,

 

1 x Tactics,

 

1 x Ball Control,

 

1 x Defending,

 

1 x Attacking,

 

1 x Shooting

 

Extra categories:

 

1 x Assistant Manager specialisation (14th coach, does not count to staff limit)

 

1 x U21 Manager Specialisation (15th coach, does not count to staff limit)

 

1 x U21 Assistant Specialisation (16th coach, does not count to staff limit) *not sure on this one*

 

1 x Manager (you) (17th coach, does not count to staff limit)

[Mr Saints]

Should transparency extend to public disclosure of an employee's reasons for leaving a post? Perhaps Rohl doesn't want the reason publicly announced.

 

No but it's not unreasonable to expect them to let us know. Not surprised though, communication hasn't been a priority for this regime.

[Matthew Le God]

But in Football Manager you need at least 9 first team coaches (13 including youth team staff) to get all the team training down to light workload and keep all your players happy!

 

He definitely needs an assistant manages as that doesn't count towards the coach limit, too...

 

How is a real life football manager supposed to cope with such a small number of staff on the coaching team???

 

Required Coaches = 9 (13 total including u23 staff)

 

Split of coaches:

 

2 x Fitness coaches,

 

2 x Goalkeeping coaches,

 

1 x Tactics,

 

1 x Ball Control,

 

1 x Defending,

 

1 x Attacking,

 

1 x Shooting

 

Extra categories:

 

1 x Assistant Manager specialisation (14th coach, does not count to staff limit)

 

1 x U21 Manager Specialisation (15th coach, does not count to staff limit)

 

1 x U21 Assistant Specialisation (16th coach, does not count to staff limit) *not sure on this one*

 

1 x Manager (you) (17th coach, does not count to staff limit)

 

Why have you included youth team and goalkeeper coaches? Saints have youth team and goalkeeper coaches. Rohl leaving makes no difference to that.

[Useful Idiot]

Why have you included youth team and goalkeeper coaches? Saints have youth team and goalkeeper coaches. Rohl leaving makes no difference to that.

 

Because on FM you can use the u23 staff as part of the senior training team to help the quality of first team training.

[Matthew Le God]

Because on FM you can use the u23 staff as part of the senior training team to help the quality of first team training.

 

Again, not relevant as Saints have under 23 staff in real life. Rohl leaving does not alter that.

[trousers]

Obviously personal reasons hence no explanation

 

No-one is asking the club to give a reason or explanation per se. People are simply wondering why the club has chosen not to announce the departure of a key member of the management team. They deemed his appointment important enough to announce his arrival: https://www.southamptonfc.com/news/2018-12-12/danny-rohl-appointed-to-southampton-coaching-staff so why not his departure?

Edited 31 July, 2019 by trousers

[Useful Idiot]

Again, not relevant as Saints have under 23 staff in real life. Rohl leaving does not alter that.

 

Right, fair enough. Lets get back to the meat of the problem instead.

 

We currently have 3 first team coaches and no assistant manager.

 

In FM2019 you require 7 senior team coaches (including 2 fitness coaches) + manager + an assistant manager + (4 u23 coaches + the u23 assistant manager + an u23 manager) to get the full benefits of training.

 

Disregarding the u23 staff, we are currently 4 senior coaches + an assistant manager short of being able to complete optimal training with the current Saints staff on FM2019, yet you said that the current staff numbers were sufficient.

 

This seems to suggest that either FM2019 training is unrealistic or we are heavily understaffed.

[Matthew Le God]

yet you said that the current staff numbers were sufficient.

 

When did I say that?

 

(plus Saints do have a senior team keeper coach and fitness coaches)

[Cabbage_Face]

People using FM2019 as real life. Lol.

 

Other day I got shot dead and respawned at the hospital.

[Matthew Le God]

People using FM2019 as real life. Lol.

 

What exactly do you mean by saying they 'use it as real life'?

 

It is based on real life football. Multiple football clubs pay to use its database.

[Useful Idiot]

People using FM2019 as real life. Lol.

 

Other day I got shot dead and respawned at the hospital.

 

You've got that backwards, I was actually attempting to prove the FM is unrealistic by using our example staffing levels in real life to prove the point.

[Cabbage_Face]

What exactly do you mean by saying they 'use it as real life'?

 

It is based on real life football. Multiple football clubs pay to use its database.

 

Basing what coaches Saints have and don't have, how they are used. We all know it's a game, it's nothing like the real workings of Football and coaching set up's.

 

Clubs use it's database for the scouting side, but if they go on Stats in the game, Barcelona should sign Moi, Stephens and Hoedt.

[Cabbage_Face]

You've got that backwards, I was actually attempting to prove the FM is unrealistic by using our example staffing levels in real life to prove the point.

 

Fair one. Anyway, it is slightly odd Rohl has suddenly left and no real talk of it by the club.

[Useful Idiot]

When did I say that?

 

(plus Saints do have a senior team keeper coach and fitness coaches)

 

Even talking them out of the equation, we are still 2 first team coaches and an assistant manager short. That's still 3 sections of the training team short of perfect training and lots of players unhappy with their training workload.

 

What extra work load would he be taking on? Saints have 3 senior team coaches (Fleming, Davis, Watson) and senior team video analysts.

 

This implies that the loss of an assistant manager would not increase the training workload and that you are happy with the current staffing levels.

[Matthew Le God]

Basing what coaches Saints have and don't have, how they are used. We all know it's a game, it's nothing like the real workings of Football and coaching set up's.

 

It is made using input from real life professional club's CEOs, directors, managers, coaches, scouts etc etc so it is very much like the real workings of football.

 

if they go on Stats in the game, Barcelona should sign Moi, Stephens and Hoedt.

 

Well that is just nonsense. None of those players in the game are remotely rated high enough for Barcelona to want them.

[Cabbage_Face]

It is made using input from real life professional club's CEOs, directors, managers, coaches, scouts etc etc so it is very much like the real workings of football.

 

 

 

Well that is just nonsense. None of those players in the game are remotely rated high enough for Barcelona to want them.

 

Why is utter nonsense when Moi has scored 35 goals for me this season on said game? You claim the stats and game is based on scouting and input from Pro Clubs, CEO's etc. I think SI may need to have a chat.

 

It's a great game, but that's it, a game. All games based on any pro sport, real life thing have some level of input from Pro's in that field, doesn't make them like real life. They are games.....

[Matthew Le God]

Why is utter nonsense when Moi has scored 35 goals for me this season on said game?

 

I find that hard to believe.

[SaintsLoyal]

Umm a bit disappointing as he seemed to be his wing man with his success in germany and i dont have that much faith in two goalkeeping coaches.

[Useful Idiot]

It's a great game, but that's it, a game. All games based on any pro sport, real life thing have some level of input from Pro's in that field, doesn't make them like real life. They are games.....

 

For me it's Shane Long who massively over-performs, though. I've played the 2018-19 season three times and he's always my top scorer. He's managed 22, 17 and 20 goals.

 

Still a fun game, but I can't ever imagine Long ever scoring that many in a season, let alone reliably being able to do so.

 

Back on topic, I am slightly concerned about Rohl leaving and the increased workload that might lead to (not just in training, but also in the change in feedback Ralph would otherwise get from a trusted advisor).

 

I'll wait to see what happens before I pass comment, though. Maybe he's had a family emergency or something equally horrible. I hope not, though.

[SuperSAINT]

People using FM2019 as real life. Lol.

 

**He casts — Conditions are good**

 

What exactly do you mean by saying they 'use it as real life'?

 

[austsaint]

I find it strange that the Club website hasn't written about Rohl's departure. It's also a worry in my mind that the likes of Kelvin and Dave Watson are now Ralph's right hand men - mediocre coaches who lump pressure on Ralph as a result.

[Cabbage_Face]

I find that hard to believe.

 

Incoming screenshots.

 

Also Man City sitting 10th and Leicester bottom.

 

More points for Realism.

[trousers]

No money.

 

Hi LeG... Are you saying that he was released because we didn't have enough money to retain him or that we now don't have enough money to replace him after he decided to leave?* (even though one assumes we'd have continued to pay him if he hadn't decided to leave...?)

 

(*again, I'm not interested in any underlying personal/private reasons why Rohl had to leave, just the mechanics behind it)

[tajjuk]

Incoming screenshots.

 

Also Man City sitting 10th and Leicester bottom.

 

More points for Realism.

 

Leicester won the league in real life, if FM 16 had predicted that people would have ridiculed it.

 

There are thousands upon thousands of calculations going on for FM to simulate a football season plus the inputs of the user playing the game, its going to cause some weird results across millions of players simulating millions of seasons.

 

Doesn't mean the way the game is set up and the way players are scouted and given abilities in game is not based on real life.

 

As others have said football clubs in real life use it as a resource because essentially you are tapping into thousands and thousands of scouts from all over the world who painstakingly research their clubs and players to get them as accurate as they possibly can.

 

The vast majority of times I play out a season in FM19 Man City or Liverpool win the league and players like Moi don't do very well, just because you have some odd results does not mean its not based on real life and is trying to be as realistic as a game can be.

 

FM has over the years predicted many future stars pretty successfully and often before the footballing world even knew about them, of course it has got some wrong, like Cherno Samba and Freddy Adu, but then so do footballing pros as many IRL were predicting Adu for example to become a superstar.

[Cabbage_Face]

Leicester won the league in real life, if FM 16 had predicted that people would have ridiculed it.

 

There are thousands upon thousands of calculations going on for FM to simulate a football season plus the inputs of the user playing the game, its going to cause some weird results across millions of players simulating millions of seasons.

 

Doesn't mean the way the game is set up and the way players are scouted and given abilities in game is not based on real life.

 

As others have said football clubs in real life use it as a resource because essentially you are tapping into thousands and thousands of scouts from all over the world who painstakingly research their clubs and players to get them as accurate as they possibly can.

 

The vast majority of times I play out a season in FM19 Man City or Liverpool win the league and players like Moi don't do very well, just because you have some odd results does not mean its not based on real life and is trying to be as realistic as a game can be.

 

FM has over the years predicted many future stars pretty successfully and often before the footballing world even knew about them, of course it has got some wrong, like Cherno Samba and Freddy Adu, but then so do footballing pros as many IRL were predicting Adu for example to become a superstar.

 

That's great. So why are people using it "prove" footballing points?

 

Like me saying, I could run into a shop Akimbo Shotguns and wreck the place.

[Matthew Le God]

That's great. So why are people using it "prove" footballing points?

 

Can you provide some examples of people doing this?

[Cabbage_Face]

Can you provide some examples of people doing this?

 

No.

[Matthew Le God]

No.

 

Because it was BS

[shurlock]

Can you provide some examples of people doing this?

 

SkySports uses the FM database and sometimes features a washed up footballer running the rule over a player's attribute scores as if its somehow gospel.

Edited 31 July, 2019 by shurlock

[Cabbage_Face]

Because it was BS

 

Not at all, just don't see why i have to trawl the internet and this forum to answer a obvious question. Do it yourself and come back to me.

[Village Saint]

I find it strange that the Club website hasn't written about Rohl's departure. It's also a worry in my mind that the likes of Kelvin and Dave Watson are now Ralph's right hand men - mediocre coaches who lump pressure on Ralph as a result.

 

The club have written about his departure - that's ow we know about it. Very sensibly they have not intruded into Danny Rohl's privacy.

 

As for the coaches, Dave Watson is respected by all informed sources a very good coach - hence Ralph's keenness to keep him on board in the new set-up. I know nothing about Kelvin's ability as a coach - i.e. exactly as much as you - but have no particular reason for doubting his capabilities. This is a complete non-issue.

[jamesfp1]

No-one is asking the club to give a reason or explanation per se. People are simply wondering why the club has chosen not to announce the departure of a key member of the management team. They deemed his appointment important enough to announce his arrival: https://www.southamptonfc.com/news/2018-12-12/danny-rohl-appointed-to-southampton-coaching-staff so why not his departure?

Don't know and don't care. Don't see why anyone else does. Pre season seems to be going well enough.

 

Just need to sign a CB.

[trousers]

No it wasn't the reason for Danny going. Just that we wanted to save on the wages and promote the other guys. We are indeed skint and left with an eye wateringly huge wage bill. We do have a few CBs identified but time is running out, the club are in a v tight spot (Cheers Les) It is our hope that Chaz and Mario go first, but everyone knows our situation. Soon someone will have to blink first, but don't be surprised if we loan someone late on.

 

Cheers for the insights LeG - appreciated