Wes Hoedt - Loaned to Antwerp: Official

[Baird of the land]

I want to see vestergaard paired with Stephens personally.

Please just get rid of hoedt though.

[Chez]

Pick a pair from this horrible lot:

Hoedt - slow, doesn't dominate the attacker, error prone, half decent with the ball

Stephens - quick enough, lightweight in the air, doesn't dominate, error prone, decent on the ball

Yoshida - just about quick enough, doesn't dominate in the air, half decent on the ball

Bednerek - below average pace, average in the air, doesn't dominate, average on the ball

Vestegaard - very slow, good in the air, error prone, average on the ball

Never mind the average players at fullback supporting them and the midfield that leaves them exposed...

 

The focus has been so much on the ability to pass out from the back, the actual art of defending has been overlooked. We are in a dogfight. We don't have the players we need to win the ugly games against the other poor side around us. We are ****ed IMO.

[Forester]

Pick a pair from this horrible lot:

Hoedt - slow, doesn't dominate the attacker, error prone, half decent with the ball

Stephens - quick enough, lightweight in the air, doesn't dominate, error prone, decent on the ball

Yoshida - just about quick enough, doesn't dominate in the air, half decent on the ball

Bednerek - below average pace, average in the air, doesn't dominate, average on the ball

Vestegaard - very slow, good in the air, error prone, average on the ball

Never mind the average players at fullback supporting them and the midfield that leaves them exposed...

 

The focus has been so much on the ability to pass out from the back, the actual art of defending has been overlooked. We are in a dogfight. We don't have the players we need to win the ugly games against the other poor side around us. We are ****ed IMO.

Yep agree. For all the excitement that Mane, Pelle and others gave us success was built in my opinion on Fonte, Lovren, Toby and VVD with big Vic, Spider or an inform Romeu in front of them. Massive downgrade in that department is costing us dearly

[S-Clarke]

Fonte was huge for us, full stop. He was a proper leader first and foremost, he got the club and had a connection with the fans. You felt everything he did was in the interests of the team, not individually. He took new players under his wing and integrated them into the culture of the ‘team’.

 

The relationship obviously soured, but how much of that was a bit of clever club manipulation to make him look like the bad guy? At the end of the day, we sold him because we saw the £££. Then we didn't replace him.

 

That's where our major problems started and when we began to see the huge disconnect between the first team and the fans.

[DT]

Fonte was huge for us, full stop. He was a proper leader first and foremost, he got the club and had a connection with the fans. You felt everything he did was in the interests of the team, not individually. He took new players under his wing and integrated them into the culture of the ‘team’.

 

The relationship obviously soured, but how much of that was a bit of clever club manipulation to make him look like the bad guy? At the end of the day, we sold him because we saw the £££. Then we didn't replace him.

 

That's where our major problems started and when we began to see the huge disconnect between the first team and the fans.

 

Agreed. Shrewd post

 

 

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[Cabbage_Face]

Dropped, but still irritating he is on the bench. Get him in the u23's

[ALWAYS_SFC]

Dropped, but still irritating he is on the bench. Get him in the u23's

 

He is crap but you are unhealthily obsessed.

[Cabbage_Face]

He is crap but you are unhealthily obsessed.

 

You are unhealthily obsessed with me. Odd.

[labibs]

Fonte was huge for us, full stop. He was a proper leader first and foremost, he got the club and had a connection with the fans. You felt everything he did was in the interests of the team, not individually. He took new players under his wing and integrated them into the culture of the ‘team’.

 

The relationship obviously soured, but how much of that was a bit of clever club manipulation to make him look like the bad guy? At the end of the day, we sold him because we saw the £££. Then we didn't replace him.

 

That's where our major problems started and when we began to see the huge disconnect between the first team and the fans.

 

His legs had gone though. He was abysmal for West Ham and had to run off to China.

[waylander]

His legs had gone though. He was abysmal for West Ham and had to run off to China.

 

Still plays for Portugal though - funny that!

[S-Clarke]

His legs had gone though. He was abysmal for West Ham and had to run off to China.

 

Not talking about just the 'legs', it was his entire pressece around the club.

[Saint-Armstrong]

Completely left out of the squad again by Hasenhüttl.

[Cabbage_Face]

Good, rubbish player

 

 

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[Master Bates]

Completely left out of the squad again by Hasenhüttl.

 

Apparently Hoedt been given a time frame to improve or go. No idea how true.

 

I know it's happened to Ryan Seager before, he was given til the end of the season, can't remember which but within the last couple of seasons but then he got injured and was out for ages, so we gave him another chance.

 

Not saying Hoedt might get a 2nd chance.

 

I was Seager was here under Hasenhuttl, I'm clutching at straws but I still have hope for Seager.

[Dr. Kucho]

Apparently Hoedt been given a time frame to improve or go. No idea how true.

 

I know it's happened to Ryan Seager before, he was given til the end of the season, can't remember which but within the last couple of seasons but then he got injured and was out for ages, so we gave him another chance.

 

Not saying Hoedt might get a 2nd chance.

 

I was Seager was here under Hasenhuttl, I'm clutching at straws but I still have hope for Seager.

 

Seager rarely plays for Dutch second division side Telstar (who are 16th in a league that’s poorer then League 2). I don’t think Seager is going to play for us.

[Master Bates]

Seager rarely plays for Dutch second division side Telstar (who are 16th in a league that’s poorer then League 2). I don’t think Seager is going to play for us.

 

My last post for 24hrs (at the moment), but that is a shame. I guessed he may have gone quiet for a while as that poster person who normally gives updates on Seager had gone quiet.

 

Once dubbed the next Alan Sheared, I wonder what went wrong for him, do you think it could have been the long term injury he got?

 

I remember another goalscoring sensation youngster we had once, scored more goals than game a one season. I want to say Matthew Legg/Thompson or something? Going back a few years.

[Saint_clark]

My last post for 24hrs (at the moment), but that is a shame. I guessed he may have gone quiet for a while as that poster person who normally gives updates on Seager had gone quiet.

 

Once dubbed the next Alan Sheared, I wonder what went wrong for him, do you think it could have been the long term injury he got?

 

I remember another goalscoring sensation youngster we had once, scored more goals than game a one season. I want to say Matthew Legg/Thompson or something? Going back a few years.

Matt Paterson? Don't remember him doing that well.

David mcgoldrick however got something like 42 goals in 40 games for under 18s and reserves.

 

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[whelk]

On his way in Jan and don’t think many will be unhappy

[Batman]

Hoedt is a terrible defender... in the premier league anyway

[Shroppie]

On his way in Jan and don’t think many will be unhappy

Really? Who's going to want him?

 

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[S-Clarke]

I love the fact he's already figured him out. Joke defender.

[Dr. Kucho]

My last post for 24hrs (at the moment), but that is a shame. I guessed he may have gone quiet for a while as that poster person who normally gives updates on Seager had gone quiet.

 

Once dubbed the next Alan Sheared, I wonder what went wrong for him, do you think it could have been the long term injury he got?

 

I remember another goalscoring sensation youngster we had once, scored more goals than game a one season. I want to say Matthew Legg/Thompson or something? Going back a few years.

 

I used to give updates on Seager, but like you said, there wasn’t much to report with Seager being on the bench. At the start of this season he started most games, then he was used as a substitute and now he seems to play very little. Checking his stats, he has played 11 games and scored 2 goals (they have played 19 games). I cannot find a Telstar message board to see what the fans think of him.

 

If I was Seager, I would try to have the loan terminated and return to us and hope for a domestic loan with chance of a permanent contract.

[Lazlo78]

My last post for 24hrs (at the moment), but that is a shame. I guessed he may have gone quiet for a while as that poster person who normally gives updates on Seager had gone quiet.

 

Once dubbed the next Alan Sheared, I wonder what went wrong for him, do you think it could have been the long term injury he got?

 

I remember another goalscoring sensation youngster we had once, scored more goals than game a one season. I want to say Matthew Legg/Thompson or something? Going back a few years.

 

Mark Paul?

[St Lej]

Mark Paul?

 

Mark Paul was signed from Norwich’s academy or something I think and was dubbed as the new Michael Owen, but never made a senior appearance for us. The guy he may be thinking of was Mark Peters, who regularly scored 30-40 a season in the youth team but again didn’t make the grade for whatever reason (rumours were he had a poor attitude)

[Viking Saint]

On his way in Jan and don’t think many will be unhappy

 

Source or just wishful thinking??

[SuperSAINT]

On his way in Jan and don’t think many will be unhappy

 

Source or just wishful thinking??

 

Not exactly easy to shift.

[DT]

On his way in Jan and don’t think many will be unhappy

 

where to?

[Crab Lungs]

Not exactly easy to shift.

 

I’d imagine he’s still turning towards the exit door.

 

Give him time.

[Cabbage_Face]

So glad this muck has been removed from our team. Hopefully we can offload to some poor Dutch side in this window.

 

 

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[Sheaf Saint]

So glad this muck has been removed from our team. Hopefully we can offload to some poor Dutch side in this window.

 

 

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You have to assume that he has shown a real bad attitude in training or something, because RH seemingly wants to take a look at everyone in the squad but hasn't given him the slightest opportunity to prove himself in a competitive match yet, and he isn't completely devoid of talent.

 

There must be something gone on, or he already has a move away lined up. Either way, I won't miss him. We finally seem to have a settled defence without him, and Stephens is a better deputy than he is.

[Cabbage_Face]

You have to assume that he has shown a real bad attitude in training or something, because RH seemingly wants to take a look at everyone in the squad but hasn't given him the slightest opportunity to prove himself in a competitive match yet, and he isn't completely devoid of talent.

 

There must be something gone on, or he already has a move away lined up. Either way, I won't miss him. We finally seem to have a settled defence without him, and Stephens is a better deputy than he is.

 

His biggest problem is his own arrogance. Luckily we have a manager that can see through this and how bad he really is. He might get a run out vs Derby, which won’t end well.

 

 

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[Lallana's Left Peg]

He appears to have been frozen out but hardly mentioned in the media regarding potential moves or even discussed by Hasenhuttl. Anyone think there could be more to this than meets the eye?

[Cabbage_Face]

He appears to have been frozen out but hardly mentioned in the media regarding potential moves or even discussed by Hasenhuttl. Anyone think there could be more to this than meets the eye?

 

Not really. His utter arrogance has caught up with him.

 

 

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[darren2]

Got to be. We know he's a bit ****, but to have been frozen out when everyone else has been given a go.....

[SaintJackoInHurworth]

Personally, I have mixed feelings about this. When Hoedt first joined us he did ok considering what was being asked of him in the light of the whole Van Dijk debacle. He showed some potential and was beginning to get selected for the Dutch national squad.

 

Sadly, I think he has been badly coached and managed and that has resulted in him being put under the stress of over-inflated expectations of a kind that must be hard for a young player to cope with. This in turn has resulted in him losing concentration and, no doubt, confidence - even though that may demonstrate itself as arrogance to some.

 

I kind of feel it would be great if the club could undo the failings of his coaching, resulting in us seeing him achieving the potential that he seemed to have when he first joined. However, I recognise that is probably overly-idealistic and that in reality it is probably best both for him and for the club that he moves on now. Hopefully back in his native Holland he can restore some of his potential and begin again to develop into a great defender. I just hope that we don't come up against him in European competition some time in the future and discover him living up to that potential against us!

[Cabbage_Face]

Personally, I have mixed feelings about this. When Hoedt first joined us he did ok considering what was being asked of him in the light of the whole Van Dijk debacle. He showed some potential and was beginning to get selected for the Dutch national squad.

 

Sadly, I think he has been badly coached and managed and that has resulted in him being put under the stress of over-inflated expectations of a kind that must be hard for a young player to cope with. This in turn has resulted in him losing concentration and, no doubt, confidence - even though that may demonstrate itself as arrogance to some.

 

I kind of feel it would be great if the club could undo the failings of his coaching, resulting in us seeing him achieving the potential that he seemed to have when he first joined. However, I recognise that is probably overly-idealistic and that in reality it is probably best both for him and for the club that he moves on now. Hopefully back in his native Holland he can restore some of his potential and begin again to develop into a great defender. I just hope that we don't come up against him in European competition some time in the future and discover him living up to that potential against us!

 

He couldn’t do it at Lazio, so I wouldn’t worry

 

 

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[captainchris]

Personally, I have mixed feelings about this. When Hoedt first joined us he did ok considering what was being asked of him in the light of the whole Van Dijk debacle. He showed some potential and was beginning to get selected for the Dutch national squad.

 

Sadly, I think he has been badly coached and managed and that has resulted in him being put under the stress of over-inflated expectations of a kind that must be hard for a young player to cope with. This in turn has resulted in him losing concentration and, no doubt, confidence - even though that may demonstrate itself as arrogance to some.

 

I kind of feel it would be great if the club could undo the failings of his coaching, resulting in us seeing him achieving the potential that he seemed to have when he first joined. However, I recognise that is probably overly-idealistic and that in reality it is probably best both for him and for the club that he moves on now. Hopefully back in his native Holland he can restore some of his potential and begin again to develop into a great defender. I just hope that we don't come up against him in European competition some time in the future and discover him living up to that potential against us!

 

A very interesting scenario, however it would appear that he wasn’t wishing to get on the train.... This has been spelt out as Ralph’s priority when making team selection decisions and the future. Couple this scenario with some pretty poor performances and I think we can put two and two together on this.

If you want to be part of the journey you have to be on the train - it appears some - as promised were left behind.

[IOWSaintDaz]

Every interview he's done when playing for us, his arrogance has come across, deserves to be left out the match day squads and ultimately sold, we don't need another prima donna in the club.

[SuperSAINT]

Can't imagine there's a big queue for his signature.

 

We are RUBBISH at selling players we don't want.

[VectisSaint]

Mixed feelings, I've been one of his fiercest critics, has been so bad. But I still think that one day he will be very good. He just needs some help learning how to concentrate and to make sure he does the simple things when needed. He is a very good footballer but needs to learn a little humility. I hope we don't end up shipping him out and seeing a top defender playing for someone else 2 or 3 years down the line.

[angelman]

Every interview he's done when playing for us, his arrogance has come across, deserves to be left out the match day squads and ultimately sold, we don't need another prima donna in the club.

 

Is it arrogance, or is it "lost in translation"? The Dutch (and of course this is a gross generalisation) can often to me come across as being arrogant when in reality it is just the way they speak English. I'm not a linguistics expert, but maybe what is normal in Dutch comes across as arrogant in English.

[Bad Wolf]

Every interview he's done when playing for us, his arrogance has come across.

 

How exactly?

[JustMike]

How exactly?

 

At a guess I'd say by being arrogant

[Bad Wolf]

At a guess I'd say by being arrogant

 

I was actually wanting elaboration on this.

[JustMike]

I was actually wanting elaboration on this.

 

If you can find any of his interviews ( a couple he did with Blackmore on Solent were probably the worst) you'll see what he means. Absolute arse in the dressing room too apparently.

[GarrettIvo]

I'm not in the least bit troubled by players coming off as arrogant.

I'd just prefer they weren't absolutely ****ing useless at the same time.

We'll be well to be rid of him if we can get a deal done.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Is it arrogance, or is it "lost in translation"? The Dutch (and of course this is a gross generalisation) can often to me come across as being arrogant when in reality it is just the way they speak English. I'm not a linguistics expert, but maybe what is normal in Dutch comes across as arrogant in English.

 

Dutch footballers tend to speak their mind and they do come across as arrogant. There’s a fine line between confidence and arrogance, and you can’t make it at the top without unbelievable confidence in your own ability. I’m not that concerned about arrogant players, provided they back it up with performances. Maybe Ralph is installing a bit of humility into him, or maybe he just doesn’t rate him. There is a player in there somewhere and as Ralph has shown with Vestergaard, he will give second and third chances. Maybe he’s seen something in Vestergaard that he can work on, but personally I think he’s just as poor as Wes.

 

 

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[Super_Uwe]

Just hasn't worked out for him. Don't remember too many people complaining when we signed him though, in fact the general view was pretty positive as he was one of VVD's team-mates in the Dutch squad?

 

Be interesting to know when he signed whether he was told he was specifically coming in to replace VVD, or whether the plan was for them to play together? If it was the latter then clearly that didn't work out.

 

But if he doesn't want to be at the club then definitely best to for him to move on. We need to strengthen at the back big time, you'd imagine we could still get a reasonable fee for him which you would hope would be put into the kitty for Hasenhüttl to bring in some new players.

[tajjuk]

Unless he is injured, the manager does not seem to rate him so I would tend to just back the manager and make sure we have a squad he wants all pulling in the same direction.

[nta786]

Just hasn't worked out for him. Don't remember too many people complaining when we signed him though, in fact the general view was pretty positive as he was one of VVD's team-mates in the Dutch squad?

 

Be interesting to know when he signed whether he was told he was specifically coming in to replace VVD, or whether the plan was for them to play together? If it was the latter then clearly that didn't work out.

 

But if he doesn't want to be at the club then definitely best to for him to move on. We need to strengthen at the back big time, you'd imagine we could still get a reasonable fee for him which you would hope would be put into the kitty for Hasenhüttl to bring in some new players.

 

https://southamptonfc.com/news/2017-08-22/wesley-hoedt-signs-for-southampton

 

Vice Chairman (Football) Les Reed said: “Wesley is one of the most promising young defenders in Europe and represents a significant addition to our squad. Having procured a Champions League finalist from one Italian club we have now added an Italian Supercoppa winner from another.

 

“We believe he has all the qualities to play a big part in our future, and we have worked hard to bring him to Southampton, with a number of other high-profile clubs interested in him.

 

"Finding a top quality central defender is difficult in the current environment and now we have six internationals in this position, both young and experienced.

 

"Finding a naturally left-footed player is even more difficult. We have been tracking central defenders on our target list for the past 12 months and Wesley has always been at the top of that list, so it was important to act when the opportunity came.”

 

“Wesley has proven his talent through his performances for Lazio, as well as the Netherlands, and we believe he can develop even further here at Southampton, alongside his international teammate Virgil van Dijk, as well as the likes of Jack Stephens, Maya Yoshida, Jan Bednarek and Florin Gardos.

 

“With Wesley joining those players, we believe we have the right amount of quality, depth and flexibility at centre-back to help us achieve our aims this season.”

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hope that answered your question!