Replacement for Hughes

[Topcat]

There are more than 3 teams worse than us, player for player. The disadvantage we have is we have the second worst manager in the league.

But if a couple of those teams get better or buy in better talent then we are f**ked.

[Nordic Saint]

The thing is we all know Hughes is going to be replaced at some stage this season. The exact timing of when it will happen will be influenced by how it will affect the club's image in the media as much as it will by results, which nobody really expects to improve much. Sacking several managers in a short space of time always gets a bad reaction from the media, unless it involves one of the big clubs, like Man Utd, Chelsea or Real Madrid, who are allowed to be ruthless in their pursuit of success. Clubs like Southampton are expected to suck it up and just live with the fact that they've got a cr@p manager.

[St Lej]

We keep buying in talent and we're fcked. If they get better through better management then yes, we are fcked.

 

We are fcked if Hughes stays. We know that. What makes it worse, is like WBA with Pardew and Stoke with Hughes, we will DESERVE to be fcked. We were a good club doing things the right way and playing decent football. Now we've got a big squad of underperforming and seemingly lost players, no tactics, no identity, no passion and no direction. There's no point staying up if that isn't changed anyway.

 

Clubs panic and make appointments to avoid relegation, but we got our success by thinking longer term than that and that's the only way we'll get it back. We need someone to come in and get us enjoying football again.

 

Once we look like we're getting the best out of the squad and players are reaching potential, THEN we can talk about transfers.

 

What would you say would be a par league position for us with a decent manager?

[tajjuk]

We keep buying in talent and we're fcked. If they get better through better management then yes, we are fcked.

 

We are fcked if Hughes stays. We know that. What makes it worse, is like WBA with Pardew and Stoke with Hughes, we will DESERVE to be fcked. We were a good club doing things the right way and playing decent football. Now we've got a big squad of underperforming and seemingly lost players, no tactics, no identity, no passion and no direction. There's no point staying up if that isn't changed anyway.

 

Clubs panic and make appointments to avoid relegation, but we got our success by thinking longer term than that and that's the only way we'll get it back. We need someone to come in and get us enjoying football again.

 

Once we look like we're getting the best out of the squad and players are reaching potential, THEN we can talk about transfers.

 

This.

 

Which is again why I find it weird people aren't talking about managers and focus so much on the players.

 

Our recruitment hasn't be great, that is no doubt, but we have still been buying young players who have played for good clubs, in Europe, are internationals etc.

 

Ok they might not be the same level of players we had under Koeman, but that was challenging for 5, 6, 7th, these players are not good enough for that level, some might be, but we don;t have the right balance in the team IMO to form a squad to punch that far above our weight (as others have identified strong defensive mid, target man type player and pace were all there under Koeman which we do not have).

 

But, these players would not have played for Juve, Lazio, Bayern, performed against Man City in the Champs League, won Euros, played for England, got oodles of u21 cap etc. if they were not decent premier league level players.

 

The squad is good enough for a comfortable mid table position, maybe top 10 if we got a bit wind under our sails, but they have more talent and ability than relegation fodder, but our last two managers have not done that because they have been bad.

 

Pellegrino was too negative, too restrictive on a team that was not used to playing like that (pretty much all of them throughout their playing careers have played in decent to good teams that would generally win more games than they lost, so that is 'old' us for the players still here, and the likes of Basel, Juve, Bayern, Celtic, Lazio etc.) and they were not used to it.

 

We were playing like West Brom without the work ethic and organisation, its how he played with Getafe and he had players there who bought into it because they were underdogs and mainly those sorts of lower league players punching above their weight.

 

He then applied this mentality and set up to a team that had finsihed top 8 or better for the last 3 years, had got to cup final, had played in Europe and had added players, who whilst they were squad players, were playing for some of Europes top clubs. It is why we were so damn awful against teams we should have beaten, because he set us up like we expected to lose to these teams, teams 1-2 years ago we'd generally control the game against and dominate.

 

Then we come to Hughes, who I have literally no idea what he is trying to do, what style of play he is trying to impose, we look loose, we look unstructured, the players look like they don't really know what their roles are.

 

Who the hell plays 4-4-2 in this modern game? Not many, and the most successful I can think of is Simeone's 4-4-2 at Atletico Madrid and that works because it has a very clear style of play and his players have very clear roles and instructions. We are not playing that verison of a 4-4-2, we seem to playing a generic 4-4-2 because Hughes can't think of better option.

 

Passages of good play seem to break out, but they seem to break out despite the tactics not because of it, like the players end up working it out on the pitch for themselves.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

This.

 

Which is again why I find it weird people aren't talking about managers and focus so much on the players.

 

Our recruitment hasn't be great, that is no doubt, but we have still been buying young players who have played for good clubs, in Europe, are internationals etc.

 

Ok they might not be the same level of players we had under Koeman, but that was challenging for 5, 6, 7th, these players are not good enough for that level, some might be, but we don;t have the right balance in the team IMO to form a squad to punch that far above our weight (as others have identified strong defensive mid, target man type player and pace were all there under Koeman which we do not have).

 

But, these players would not have played for Juve, Lazio, Bayern, performed against Man City in the Champs League, won Euros, played for England, got oodles of u21 cap etc. if they were not decent premier league level players.

 

The squad is good enough for a comfortable mid table position, maybe top 10 if we got a bit wind under our sails, but they have more talent and ability than relegation fodder, but our last two managers have not done that because they have been bad.

 

Pellegrino was too negative, too restrictive on a team that was not used to playing like that (pretty much all of them throughout their playing careers have played in decent to good teams that would generally win more games than they lost, so that is 'old' us for the players still here, and the likes of Basel, Juve, Bayern, Celtic, Lazio etc.) and they were not used to it.

 

We were playing like West Brom without the work ethic and organisation, its how he played with Getafe and he had players there who bought into it because they were underdogs and mainly those sorts of lower league players punching above their weight.

 

He then applied this mentality and set up to a team that had finsihed top 8 or better for the last 3 years, had got to cup final, had played in Europe and had added players, who whilst they were squad players, were playing for some of Europes top clubs. It is why we were so damn awful against teams we should have beaten, because he set us up like we expected to lose to these teams, teams 1-2 years ago we'd generally control the game against and dominate.

 

Then we come to Hughes, who I have literally no idea what he is trying to do, what style of play he is trying to impose, we look loose, we look unstructured, the players look like they don't really know what their roles are.

 

Who the hell plays 4-4-2 in this modern game? Not many, and the most successful I can think of is Simeone's 4-4-2 at Atletico Madrid and that works because it has a very clear style of play and his players have very clear roles and instructions. We are not playing that verison of a 4-4-2, we seem to playing a generic 4-4-2 because Hughes can't think of better option.

 

Passages of good play seem to break out, but they seem to break out despite the tactics not because of it, like the players end up working it out on the pitch for themselves.

 

Exactly this. Heads in sand.

 

It seems that a number of people on this forum can't take it that other people called the limitations of the Manager so early, and are now embarrassed to admit they're wrong.

[Pamplemousse]

Ha, we have a very expensive squad. I find it really odd that so many fans can't comprehend players performance and team results being so different under different managers. You'd have Burnley, Wolves, Bournemouth etc all saying our players are rubbish, our signings haven't worked out etc if they were managed by Hughes or Pellegrino last season.

 

This is what happens if you get a couple of appointments in a row wrong. For any club outside the top 6, however good you are, you'll be fighting relegation. Puel, fine, average, step backwards. But that was just a regular appointment, not a disaster, he might have turned it round he might not. But then comes 2 of the worst appointments we ever could have made.

 

If we get it wrong again, we're down. That includes not sacking Hughes until too late. Make no mistake, he will be sacked. Football fans have seen enough of Hughes to know how it goes. Every fan of other clubs I talk to feels sorry for us having Hughes. At best we'll scrape 1 or 2 more wins by new year, but he will not be here all season. So we really need to be thinking about new options.

 

There's so many poor sides and so much time left, we could still have a decent season with the right appointment in the next few weeks. Just have to hope we learned from the ridiculous time we let it drag on last season.

 

The player performances have been the one constant over this period - awful.

 

What will it take for you to realise that the problem is the poor quality of squad we have? The manager cannot be blamed for EVERYTHING and the poor players admonished of all blame. It's incredibly naive.

[ally_uk]

I would sack him now and look for the following:

 

Young manager with passion can organize a defense and plays attacking pressing football.

Can develop and bed in youth players

 

So basically we need another Poch.....

 

As for Hughes I have seen enough.... A dinosaur tactically....

[Bstokesaint]

I would sack him now and look for the following:

 

Young manager with passion can organize a defense and plays attacking pressing football.

Can develop and bed in youth players

 

So basically we need another Poch.....

 

As for Hughes I have seen enough.... A dinosaur tactically....

 

So even with an amazing manager where would this squad be in the table? 13th or 14th? Why would anyone good come here? Only for a season and then move on

[the saint in winchester]

The thing is we all know Hughes is going to be replaced at some stage this season. The exact timing of when it will happen will be influenced by how it will affect the club's image in the media as much as it will by results, which nobody really expects to improve much. Sacking several managers in a short space of time always gets a bad reaction from the media, unless it involves one of the big clubs, like Man Utd, Chelsea or Real Madrid, who are allowed to be ruthless in their pursuit of success. Clubs like Southampton are expected to suck it up and just live with the fact that they've got a cr@p manager.

 

OK, I'll bite. I don't think they will sack/replace/relieve (use whatever expression you prefer) Hughes at some stage this season. For the reason you state. We have already removed Puel and Pellegrino in successive seasons, and received adverse media attention for doing so. We can't be seen to do it again. We will be a laughing stock. And now the directors will have to conclude the players are at fault, and tell them to improve their performance. So I'm going to predict they won't fire Hughes while the season is in progress. Maybe after the season ends, but not during. If they do fire him, I will be surprised.

[Batman]

What adverse media reaction was there for getting rid of the clown?

[DT]

OK, I'll bite. I don't think they will sack/replace/relieve (use whatever expression you prefer) Hughes at some stage this season. For the reason you state. We have already removed Puel and Pellegrino in successive seasons, and received adverse media attention for doing so. We can't be seen to do it again. We will be a laughing stock. And now the directors will have to conclude the players are at fault, and tell them to improve their performance. So I'm going to predict they won't fire Hughes while the season is in progress. Maybe after the season ends, but not during. If they do fire him, I will be surprised.

 

Then we'll be bottom of the league by Christmas

[Micky]

What if we get rid of the players and sack the manager as well. Start afresh, brave new world.

 

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[Convict Colony]

Jorge Sampoli seems to be coming out of his break period and could do with a rebuild job of his reputation.

 

Good at universa'dad, Chile, Seville

 

Prima donna'd with Argentina

 

Bet he's earn more with us than he's ever earned and a couple of years he put himself in the shop window.

[danjosaint]

How about Ralph Hasenhuttl, done a great job at rb leipzig played high press attacking football

[austsaint]

Hughes is not the most dynamic Manager around, but a better thread title would be - Replacements for Austin, Long, Bednarek, Hoedt, Davis, Ward-Prowse, Stephens. And probably Vest, Yoshida, Armstrong, Moi and Redmond.

[doddisalegend]

How about Ralph Hasenhuttl, done a great job at rb leipzig played high press attacking football

 

Like our current bunch of players have the guts, fitness or ability to play high press. They used to get upset when Puel wouldn't tell them if they where in the matchday squad at least a week in advance. Double fitness training sessions would reduce them to tears and mass social media strops.

[Saint IQ]

Best formation for us has been 4-3-3 although it works more consistently with a big target man who can hold the ball up well.

 

Best formation for our somewhat average looking squad in all areas, though not terrible, would be 4-3-3 also.

 

Loads of options to sub players on in attacking areas

 

------------Gunn/McCarthy-----------

Cedric--Yoshida-Vestegaard-Bertrand

----------Romeu/Hojberg-----------------

----JWP/Armstrong Lemina/Davis---------------

Gabb/Redmond---------Moi/Targett

---------Ings/Austin/Gallagher----------

[Ultimatt]

Best formation for us has been 4-3-3 although it works more consistently with a big target man who can hold the ball up well.

 

Best formation for our somewhat average looking squad in all areas, though not terrible, would be 4-3-3 also.

 

Loads of options to sub players on in attacking areas

 

------------Gunn/McCarthy-----------

Cedric--Yoshida-Vestegaard-Bertrand

----------Romeu/Hojberg-----------------

----JWP/Armstrong Lemina/Davis---------------

Gabb/Redmond---------Moi/Targett

---------Ings/Austin/Gallagher----------

 

Our fans demanded 2 up top and more attacking football. Looks like the club/Hughes listened (at the expense of results).

[scotty]

What if we get rid of the players and sack the manager as well. Start afresh, brave new world.

 

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Keep it quiet, but I did hear references on the grapevine about something called "Contracts". My source implied that the mass sackings you suggest may involve some minor legal difficulties and possibly even expenditure of funds, but don't quote me on that.

[doddisalegend]

Keep it quiet, but I did hear references on the grapevine about something called "Contracts". My source implied that the mass sackings you suggest may involve some minor legal difficulties and possibly even expenditure of funds, but don't quote me on that.

 

 

Surely we can use a legal loop hole like those players in Portugal did claiming a breach of contract. Our lot signed contracts claiming they where footballers....

[Doctoroncall]

Best formation for us has been 4-3-3 although it works more consistently with a big target man who can hold the ball up well.

 

Best formation for our somewhat average looking squad in all areas, though not terrible, would be 4-3-3 also.

 

Loads of options to sub players on in attacking areas

 

------------Gunn/McCarthy-----------

Cedric--Yoshida-Vestegaard-Bertrand

----------Romeu/Hojberg-----------------

----JWP/Armstrong Lemina/Davis---------------

Gabb/Redmond---------Moi/Targett

---------Ings/Austin/Gallagher----------

 

Is that not the standard formation used at all levels in the club except the first team?

[whelk]

Leonardo Jardim?

[stevy777_x]

Leonardo Jardim?

 

That s what I suggested earlier.

Would be a fantastic appointed but probably above our level.

[mrfahaji]

I'm sceptical about these names - certainly as to whether they would join, but also whether we would even try to approach them in the first place.

 

Our stock was highest after Koeman, and we interviewed (apparently) the likes of Pellegrini and Rudi Garcia. Certainly a good calibre, but are/were they on the same level as Jardim or Sampaoli? We ended up going with Puel who definitely didn't have that level of profile.

 

When Puel left, we weren't at the heights we had been but we should still have been an attractive proposition. As well as Pellegrino, we were linked with de Boer, Stam and Vieira (who at the time had very little experience). These guys are another step down from Pellegrini and Garcia in terms of profile.

 

We are now in a much worse position than we were then, so why would the likes of Jardim and Sampaoli, who may have been a stretch after Koeman left, suddenly be viable now?

 

I'd love to be wrong, maybe the club will surprise me and pull out all the stops to get a great manager in, but based on what's happened before, I'm not getting my hopes up.

[benjii]

Helmut Kartoffelnsalad.

[ALWAYS_SFC]

Helmut Kartoffelnsalad.

 

Yep get him in, we need a big name

[Micky]

Helmut Kartoffelnsalad.

 

Prefer currywurst mit pommes, und mayo, naturliche!

[patred44]

Nigel Adkins would walk over hot coals for the job, he's as good those suggested, and he loves the club as much as the supporters.

[CB Fry]

Nigel Adkins would walk over hot coals for the job, he's as good those suggested, and he loves the club as much as the supporters.

And currently bottom of the Championship. This is after also failing in his previous job (in league one) and failing in his job before that.

 

Love the man, but his record makes Hughes look like Jock Stein.

[saint lard]

And currently bottom of the Championship. This is after also failing in his previous job (in league one) and failing in his job before that.

 

Love the man, but his record makes Hughes look like Jock Stein.

 

Hopefully the penny has dropped about Adkins and his failures at SFC and every job since.

He deserves a medal for how he’s pulled the wool over saints fans in believing he was so good.

Shame he didn’t get a winners medal with the incredible squad he had at his disposal.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CB Fry]

Hopefully the penny has dropped about Adkins and his failures at SFC and every job since.

He deserves a medal for how he’s pulled the wool over saints fans in believing he was so good.

Shame he didn’t get a winners medal with the incredible squad he had at his disposal.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

....and here he is.

 

It takes a particular kind of person to describe two straight promotions as "pulling the wool over people's eyes" but you really are a special little guy.

 

Don't ever change x x x

[Heisenberg]

 

his record makes Hughes look like Jock Stein.

 

 

It takes a particular kind of person to describe two straight promotions as "pulling the wool over people's eyes" but you really are a special little guy.

 

 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.health.com/health/gallery/0,,20436786,00.html

[austsaint]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.health.com/health/gallery/0,,20436786,00.html

 

There's a chapter in the DSM5 which describes you perfectly, Glasgow.

[ooh it's a corner]

I don't understand why we think we cannot attract a very high calibre manager.

 

I appreciate if you are a foreign manager, you may not want to move your home into the UK, but most football managers have to be accepting of the need to go where the work is, due to the very small number of local jobs.

 

I would expect Southampton to be in top 30 highest paid managers on the planet. Just think on that for a second. Little old Southampton should be able to attract one of the top 30 managers on the planet, assuming they would be happy to work in Hampshire.

 

Instead we end up with Mark effing Hughes.

 

I cannot see him turning the current squad into winners and I believe we will be relegated this year, if he remains in charge all year.

 

The squad isn't as high a quality as recent seasons, but it is better than bottom three.

Edited 13 October, 2018 by ooh it's a corner

[CB Fry]

I think Lawrie McMenemy did a brilliant job at Southampton Football Club.

 

I don't want Lawrie McMenemy to replace Mark Hughes in 2018.

 

#helpmeGlasgow

 

#helpmeHeisingberg

[doddisalegend]

I don't understand why we think we cannot attract a very high calibre manager.

 

I appreciate if you are a foreign manager, you may not want to move your home into the UK, but most football managers have to be accepting of the need to go where the work is, due to the very small number of local jobs.

 

I would expect Southampton to be in top 30 highest paid managers on the planet. Just think on that for a second. Little old Southampton should be able to attract one of the top 30 managers on the planet, assuming they would be happy to work in Hampshire.

 

Instead we end up with Mark effing Hughes.

 

I cannot see him turning the current squad into winners and I believe we will be relegated this year, if he remains in charge all year.

 

The squad isn't as high a quality as recent seasons, but it is better than bottom three.

 

Because they are lots of bigger, better clubs out there and a "very high calibre manager" would rather go to. In the same way we can't attract the highest calibre of players.

[Charlie Wayman]

The thing is we all know Hughes is going to be replaced at some stage this season. The exact timing of when it will happen will be influenced by how it will affect the club's image in the media as much as it will by results, which nobody really expects to improve much.

 

 

The thing we all really know is that Hughes will not be sacked. We are lumbered with him for the rest of our time in this league and in the next one down. There are too many cowards in our boardroom to take decisive action in the face of an inscrutable boss.

[Pamplemousse]

Hopefully the penny has dropped about Adkins and his failures at SFC and every job since.

He deserves a medal for how he’s pulled the wool over saints fans in believing he was so good.

Shame he didn’t get a winners medal with the incredible squad he had at his disposal.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Kingsbridge Saint]

Player ability and recruitment has been dubious, there's only so much you can do when some of your players just don't execute properly.

 

Not sure why Romeu is suddenly struggling when he looked good alongside Ward-Prowse under Puel, but he, Lemina and Hojbjerg were all a lot worse than they are now for much of December til April last season.

 

Tbh I've already spent far too much time trying to work out someone else's problem here, it's one of the reasons I'm not on here much any more.

 

That and the County going like a train.

[Kingsbridge Saint]

If Hughes has us out of the bottom 6 by Christmas, there is no chance of him going anywhere. The football is better than under the last 2 Managers as well. Need a win out of one of the next two though or the pressure will really start to ramp up.

[Saints foreva]

If Hughes has us out of the bottom 6 by Christmas, there is no chance of him going anywhere. The football is better than under the last 2 Managers as well. Need a win out of one of the next two though or the pressure will really start to ramp up.

 

The Football is better than under Pellegrino but not under Puel and I was Puel out....

[ally_uk]

How long has he been with us?

 

He doesn't even know a effective formation to play.....

 

What has he been doing with the lads playing scrabble and having tea cakes?

 

Get shot now and get a new manager in sharpish someone who is actually going somewhere.

[Mr X]

Some fantastic comments on here and I just wish sacking Hughes was the answer.

Puel, Pellegrino, Hughes.... The list of useless managers will go on because the foundations are all wrong.

IMHO We have some cracking young individual players coming through the youth ranks and we need to focus on getting them into the first team squad with a management team that will educate them further.

 

You have to question the whole recruitment process when you have had puel Pellegrino & Hughes all in a row! What an absolute shambles! have any club in recent times employed such a poor trio of managers consecutively? like others have said till we change our recruitment policy both for managers & players we are in a non stop loop..... When did the ambition die at the club?.... Get someone in that will excite both the players & fans!

 

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[Badger]

You have to question the whole recruitment process when you have had puel Pellegrino & Hughes all in a row! What an absolute shambles! have any club in recent times employed such a poor trio of managers consecutively? like others have said till we change our recruitment policy both for managers & players we are in a non stop loop..... When did the ambition die at the club?.... Get someone in that will excite both the players & fans!

 

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Sunderland spring to mind, and we all know how that ended.

[SaintZamboni]

A manager 4 months or so into a 3 year deal isn’t getting replaced.

Pellegrino had plenty of time so I’m sure Hughes will get it too. If we stay up then he’ll get next year to show what he can do.

From there we need to see the clubs vision.

[Dellman]

You have to question the whole recruitment process when you have had puel Pellegrino & Hughes all in a row! What an absolute shambles! have any club in recent times employed such a poor trio of managers consecutively? like others have said till we change our recruitment policy both for managers & players we are in a non stop loop..... When did the ambition die at the club?.... Get someone in that will excite both the players & fans!

 

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The ambition died with Macus and the loss of his executive. It is amazing that their foundations have survived as well as they have in that we are still in the top tier and they took over when we were penniless, pointless and in the third tier

[SKD]

Looks like Leicester are going to sack Puel.

 

If we are going to move on from Hughes, we need to do it quick as they’ll be looking at the same targets as us.

 

I’ve seen them linked with Rodgers and the old leipzig manager. I’d take either but doubt they’d chose us over Leicester...

[Nordic Saint]

Looks like Leicester are going to sack Puel.

 

If we are going to move on from Hughes, we need to do it quick as they’ll be looking at the same targets as us.

 

I’ve seen them linked with Rodgers and the old leipzig manager. I’d take either but doubt they’d chose us over Leicester...

 

""Claude Puel defends his record as Leicester City manager and calls for patience following fan unrest"

With only two wins in 12 Premier League games, Puel's position has come under scrutiny."

 

Yes, Leicester fans have wanted him out almost since the day he arrived. These comments in the Leicester Mercury sum up their feelings: " In this Puel tenure its hard to see improvement....games are boring and turgid at times and we create very little. I think people would believe in him more if there were some signs of improvement or an end game in site. The endless passing side to side and back is just painful to watch. He lacks inspiration, baffles everyone with his team selections and substitutions."

 

"It gives me no pleasure to say it but Puel needs to go. I don't think we can progress with him holding us back."

 

"Just get rid of him, the fans hate him, the players hate him, and he is the most DE MOTIVATIONAL MANAGER i have ever heard, CHEERIO.................."

[benjii]

Bring Puel back in to steady the ship?

 

It would require some people to swallow their pride but it's the smart move.

[Greenridge]

Bring Puel back in to steady the ship?

 

It would require some people to swallow their pride but it's the smart move.

 

It’s really not.