Kelvin Davis, Dave Watson

[9-3]

Would Mark Hughes take them on board?

[Nordic Saint]

Would Mark Hughes take them on board?

 

Let's hope not. We need a clearout of the dead wood. One ex-goalkeeper as a first team coach is enough.

[Dusic]

Of the two its clearly Davis who is more questionable...

[Norm]

Of the two its clearly Davis who is more questionable...

 

 

 

Really? Foresters coach Watson hasn’t covered himself in glory.

[beatlesaint]

If the club feels the need and/or loyalty to Davis maybe now is the time for him to return to that role they created for him where among other things he keeps tabs on those out on loan. Going by Targett’s comments about not hearing from Saints since he moved that job clearly is still vacant.

[VectisSaint]

Of the two its clearly Davis who is more questionable...

Disagree, of the two Watson is the problem. To be fair to Davis he is/was not employed as a GK coach, he just happens to have been a GK himself. Our GK coach Watson has proved himself to be useless in that role, viz the development of FF from a decent keeper. Whether we need a dedicated GK coach as we have Eddie (and Stuart Taylor who is "clearly" not employed as a player and SKD) is open to question, but if we do need one then we should employ one who can actually positively develop our keepers.

[Barry the Badger]

Disagree, of the two Watson is the problem. To be fair to Davis he is/was not employed as a GK coach, he just happens to have been a GK himself. Our GK coach Watson has proved himself to be useless in that role, viz the development of FF from a decent keeper. Whether we need a dedicated GK coach as we have Eddie (and Stuart Taylor who is "clearly" not employed as a player and SKD) is open to question, but if we do need one then we should employ one who can actually positively develop our keepers.

 

What about McCarthy? Has improved significantly.

[VectisSaint]

What about McCarthy? Has improved significantly.

He hasn't. He was a decent keeper when he signed and still is. Can't see any significant improvement that you could put down to coaching.

[Dusic]

Really? Foresters coach Watson hasn’t covered himself in glory.

What about Player of the Season Alex McCarthy's coach?

[Lord Duckhunter]

He hasn't. He was a decent keeper when he signed and still is. Can't see any significant improvement that you could put down to coaching.

 

From all accounts he was average in the reserves ( or what ever it’s called nowadays). He also has improved as the weeks went on, although how much of that is coaching and how much is confidence and regular games is debatable. You just can’t pin one keepers decline down to poor coaching, whilst ignoring the improvement in the other, unless you’ve got an agenda.

 

 

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[EkonOkereke]

Dave Watson is a mess

[VectisSaint]

From all accounts he was average in the reserves ( or what ever it’s called nowadays). He also has improved as the weeks went on, although how much of that is coaching and how much is confidence and regular games is debatable. You just can’t pin one keepers decline down to poor coaching, whilst ignoring the improvement in the other, unless you’ve got an agenda.

 

 

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Yes you can. Watson worked wonders with Gazza as well didn't he. McCarthy was a good keeper before he joined and as you suggest a few games and his confidence has gone up. He really hasn't done anything remarkable, just done what any good keepers do, one's that haven't been brainwashed by a poor coach. McCarthy is also a much more natural keeper while FF has to be coached, and it's that coaching that is the problem. Just because people have a different view to yours doesn't mean they have an agenda, just that they think logically about the issue and don't care about jobs for the boys. Watson is a problem, and we don't need him, so should get shot.

[CB Fry]

Yes you can. Watson worked wonders with Gazza as well didn't he. McCarthy was a good keeper before he joined and as you suggest a few games and his confidence has gone up. He really hasn't done anything remarkable, just done what any good keepers do, one's that haven't been brainwashed by a poor coach. McCarthy is also a much more natural keeper while FF has to be coached, and it's that coaching that is the problem. Just because people have a different view to yours doesn't mean they have an agenda, just that they think logically about the issue and don't care about jobs for the boys. Watson is a problem, and we don't need him, so should get shot.

Of course you don't have an agenda.

 

This is the first time McCarthy has held down a place in the top flight. He's been a perennial back up at this level, a nearly man.

 

He's taken his chance and all credit to him, the managers that have supported him and the goalkeeping coaches.

 

Brilliant stuff Dave Watson, he should be rightly proud of his excellent work.

[austsaint]

From all accounts he was average in the reserves ( or what ever it’s called nowadays). He also has improved as the weeks went on, although how much of that is coaching and how much is confidence and regular games is debatable. You just can’t pin one keepers decline down to poor coaching, whilst ignoring the improvement in the other, unless you’ve got an agenda.

 

 

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Your last sentence is telling. McCarthy surely didn't improve due to Watson and Davis' influence - he has always been a good keeper who belatedly got his opportunity and blossomed with it. Forster on the other hand appears to have gained a reputation from the SPL, one notable game v Barca and several games under Koeman when he had a top class defence and midfield in front of him. He didn't suffer a decline due to bad coaching; he just got found out as a keeper with serious flaws.

[Barry the Badger]

Oh right, McCarthy doesn’t need coaching, of course.

[Alain Perrin]

Yes you can. Watson worked wonders with Gazza as well didn't he. McCarthy was a good keeper before he joined and as you suggest a few games and his confidence has gone up. He really hasn't done anything remarkable, just done what any good keepers do, one's that haven't been brainwashed by a poor coach. McCarthy is also a much more natural keeper while FF has to be coached, and it's that coaching that is the problem. Just because people have a different view to yours doesn't mean they have an agenda, just that they think logically about the issue and don't care about jobs for the boys. Watson is a problem, and we don't need him, so should get shot.

 

I don't think either of you (or anyone on this forum) can reasonably say what impact Dave Watson is having or not. Yet in true forum style you declare he's $***. Forster suffered from a huge lack of confidence last season, compounded by a flaky defense (that exposed two of his weaknesses - communication and coming for crosses).

 

Does that make Dave Watson ****? No more so than Forster keeping clean sheets for 700+ minutes under Puel makes him great.

 

Let's just accept that those working with the players/coaches day in day out have a better judgement than people with a keyboard and, at best, a season ticket.

[VectisSaint]

I don't think either of you (or anyone on this forum) can reasonably say what impact Dave Watson is having or not. Yet in true forum style you declare he's $***. Forster suffered from a huge lack of confidence last season, compounded by a flaky defense (that exposed two of his weaknesses - communication and coming for crosses).

 

Does that make Dave Watson ****? No more so than Forster keeping clean sheets for 700+ minutes under Puel makes him great.

 

Let's just accept that those working with the players/coaches day in day out have a better judgement than people with a keyboard and, at best, a season ticket.

 

Nowhere did I declare him $****. I have to assume its something in your mind that makes you think that. If you think he is good then that's fine, your opinion is valid. Just want those that are responsible for the terrible last 2 seasons to be held responsible and for the club to replace dead wood with better people to improve the club. There are too many in positions that are protected by the club being too nice, some ruthlessness is needed. There are some obvious candidates who have not performed, and Watson seems to be one of them.

[Lord Duckhunter]

There are some obvious candidates who have not performed, and Watson seems to be one of them.

 

Obvious?

 

When was the last time a keeper was player of the season? Oh no, sorry I forgot, his coaching had nothing to do with it. He coached FF, but not McCarthy. Watson out

 

 

 

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[captainchris]

Obvious?

 

When was the last time a keeper was player of the season? Oh no, sorry I forgot, his coaching had nothing to do with it. He coached FF, but not McCarthy. Watson out

 

 

 

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Why are you so contrite and defensive of the staff at SFC?

FF has been terrible and certainly not coached on how to improve. That is a given.... Or he would have improved significantly.

Mc Carthy I would guess is doing his own thing as his movement and coming for crosses is entirely at odds with FF.

Most people can see an gulf between the two styles so who is the coach coaching - it is clearly no both of them...

[CB Fry]

 

Why are you so contrite and defensive of the staff at SFC?

FF has been terrible and certainly not coached on how to improve. That is a given.... Or he would have improved significantly.

Mc Carthy I would guess is doing his own thing as his movement and coming for crosses is entirely at odds with FF.

Most people can see an gulf between the two styles so who is the coach coaching - it is clearly no both of them...

 

So goalkeeping coaches produce goalkeepers that are exactly the same as each other now? Jesus wept.

 

Does it work the same for strikers? Because why don't Long, Gabbiadini, Austin all play in exactly the same way because they've all got the same coach?

 

I like the fact you have admitting you are guessing. You're right about that, you are.

[Huffton]

I love that there's so many people on this forum who are at Staplewood ever day and obviously have a coaching award list as long as your arm...

[Barry the Badger]

There are so many reasons that a player might have a downturn in form, and we just don’t know with Forster. Could be injuries, personal life issues, mental health, other health issues, who knows. If all of our keepers were that bad you would have a pattern and therefore a reasonable point looking at the coach, but given a keeper just won player of the year, you have no pattern and not really any kind of case.

[suewhistle]

That's a bit Captain Sensible, Barry!

[Lord Duckhunter]

 

Why are you so contrite and defensive of the staff at SFC?

FF has been terrible and certainly not coached on how to improve. That is a given.... Or he would have improved significantly.

Mc Carthy I would guess is doing his own thing as his movement and coming for crosses is entirely at odds with FF.

Most people can see an gulf between the two styles so who is the coach coaching - it is clearly no both of them...

 

Just re read what you've written and then think about it for a minute. You do realise that even under the best coaches, players go backwards or lose form , don't you. You're claiming FF listens to Watson, but McCarthy doesn't . You're just twisting things to justify your opinion. I could say FF doesn't listen to Watson, but McCarthy does, which is why McCarthy has improved and FF has gone backwards. I won't say that because I'm not a ****ing idiot, and like you I'm not close enough to the club to make that judgement. You can't however, blame him for FF without crediting him for McCarthy.

 

 

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[Alain Perrin]

Nowhere did I declare him $****. I have to assume its something in your mind that makes you think that. If you think he is good then that's fine, your opinion is valid. Just want those that are responsible for the terrible last 2 seasons to be held responsible and for the club to replace dead wood with better people to improve the club. There are too many in positions that are protected by the club being too nice, some ruthlessness is needed. There are some obvious candidates who have not performed, and Watson seems to be one of them.

 

To be fair that's a classic forum response. You said 'useless', I paraphrased to ****.

 

My argument was you don't know **** (or useless if you prefer) about the reasons for Forsters form. Personally I think changing Watson without improving the defence will make no difference.

 

That's not to say there aren't better coaches than him, I am sure there are, just that I don't believe pointing the finger with no real world experience of his coaching is naive.

 

He may well be **** / useless / good / great but none of us know.

[egg]

There are so many reasons that a player might have a downturn in form, and we just don’t know with Forster. Could be injuries, personal life issues, mental health, other health issues, who knows. If all of our keepers were that bad you would have a pattern and therefore a reasonable point looking at the coach, but given a keeper just won player of the year, you have no pattern and not really any kind of case.

 

Fraser personal life is fine.

 

I agree on the coaching. McCarthy had a serious long term injury after he joined us. He bounced back from that and was out best player last season. That doesn't suggest poor coaching to me.