Russian nerve agent attack

[Sheaf Saint]

"completely untrue" - why do you persist with this silly hyperbole?

 

Silly hyperbole?

 

Let me re-iterate to you Benjii, because you don't seem to be getting it, that The CEO of Porton Down has come out publicly and totally contradicted BoJo's claim that he told him 'categorically' that there was 'no doubt' that the source of the nerve agent was Russia.

 

There is no ambiguity here - it's black and white. BoJo blatantly lied. Does that not concern you in the slightest when we are talking about a matter of national security that could have very serious consequences?

 

You say cui bono is relevant to identifying suspects then you wonder why Russia was quickly identified as a suspect in the attempted murder of a former Russian double agent.

 

|I agree, the circumstances surrounding the incident clearly and obviously point immediately to the possibility/likelihood of Russian state involvement. But this in itself actually leaves two possible explanations...

 

1) it was the Russian state, or

2) it was somebody who wanted it to look like it was the Russian state.

 

Why have we been so quick to discount the second possibility?

[Batman]

 

Like I said, I remain skeptical without evidence and that applies to both the government stance and to any other alternatives. I'm certainly not going to blindly throw my support behind the government line when they are proven to be a bunch of liars and can't be trusted to tell the truth about anything.

 

lets be honest, no matter what a tory govt did, you would never 'throw your support' behind it.

that is pretty clear.

 

i found it quite interesting this morning that Russia (about a year ago) made the 'removal' of 'traitors' actually legal in their system.

[Sheaf Saint]

lets be honest, no matter what a tory govt did, you would never 'throw your support' behind it.

that is pretty clear.

 

Experience has taught me to pay close attention to what they do and pretty much ignore what they say.

 

In principle, I am fully supportive of the initiatives in the 25-year environment plan recently announced by Theresa May. But until I see some evidence of these initiatives actually being implemented, I will remain skeptical about it.

[buctootim]

i found it quite interesting this morning that Russia (about a year ago) made the 'removal' of 'traitors' actually legal in their system.

 

and under the same law the executions must be authorised by the President.

[buctootim]

Yuliua Skripal makes a call to her cousin and a couple of hours later a recording is broadcast on Russian state media. That tells you a lot about the 'game' being played in Moscow

[benjii]

Silly hyperbole?

 

Let me re-iterate to you Benjii, because you don't seem to be getting it, that The CEO of Porton Down has come out publicly and totally contradicted BoJo's claim that he told him 'categorically' that there was 'no doubt' that the source of the nerve agent was Russia.

 

There is no ambiguity here - it's black and white. BoJo blatantly lied. Does that not concern you in the slightest when we are talking about a matter of national security that could have very serious consequences?

 

 

 

|I agree, the circumstances surrounding the incident clearly and obviously point immediately to the possibility/likelihood of Russian state involvement. But this in itself actually leaves two possible explanations...

 

1) it was the Russian state, or

2) it was somebody who wanted it to look like it was the Russian state.

 

Why have we been so quick to discount the second possibility?

 

Johnson got his words wrong. It's not a big conspiracy. He knows it was the Russians. Part of that knowledge is due to the Porton Down evidence. He said he knew because of the Porton Down evidence. That's a mistake, not a great big lie.

[Millbrook Saint]

Experience has taught me to pay close attention to what they do and pretty much ignore what they say.

 

In principle, I am fully supportive of the initiatives in the 25-year environment plan recently announced by Theresa May. But until I see some evidence of these initiatives actually being implemented, I will remain skeptical about it.

 

Thing is that can be pretty much said about any party, not just tory. Look at Blair with Iraq, telling Bush he was with him no matter what. That was a labour government. Look at Corbyn, always against the EU, but now he's getting a sniff of power he's suddenly a little more 'ambiguous' about his thoughts.

 

The thing with Russia is they play divide and conquer, which is what they're attempting now, Putin is a clever man and puts our politicians to shame, all of them, he's always 3 steps ahead of them, though on this he may have underestimated us.

 

We may or may not have the intelligence that backs up tory claims, in the real world we'd pull in the suspect, in this case Putin and question him, not likely to happen. So we have to rely on intelligence, there will never be definitive proof, and I can't imagine any Russian involved will speak out, look what happens to Putin's opponents.

 

Corbyn is playing the useful idiot in this scenario, he's a member of the privvy council, why hasn't he demanded to see the intelligence the government has, he has every right to as leader of the opposition. He could end all this speculation by looking at the intelligence and come out with confirmation one way or another, but he won't, he would rather put his dislike of the tories ahead of any national security, which is why he aint fit to be leader of the opposition, let alone prime minister.

 

I don't know what everyone is expecting, there aint going to be any smoking gun, it will be a collection of data from different sources which politicians have to make a judgement on. Problem is Corbyn will always find a way to disagree with what a tory says and he'll convince himself he's right, his default position is opposing whatever a tory says, he's too used to being in demo mode, than being a proper politician.

[buctootim]

 

We may or may not have the intelligence that backs up tory claims, in the real world we'd pull in the suspect, in this case Putin and question him, not likely to happen. So we have to rely on intelligence, there will never be definitive proof, and I can't imagine any Russian involved will speak out, look what happens to Putin's opponents.

 

Exactly, you have to go on balance of probabilities otherwise you'd do nothing and embolden him even more. Taking the Skripals in isolation the case probably isnt totally conclusive, but as part of a jigsaw of malign activities going back decades, absolutely Putin is guilty. If you only have 70% probability of guilt in one instance you cant judge. If you have 20 examples of similar activity all with 70% probability the evidence is overwhelming. Ask Verbal about the stats!

[Verbal]

Yes, I get that cui bono is a fallacy in scientific terms. But when you are trying to ascertain who carried out a particular crime, it is an essential question to ask when compiling a list of suspects who need to be investigated. However, what our government seem to have done in this case is to presume Russian guilt first before carrying out a thorough investigation, which itself is a very backwards way of beginning any investigation, unless you a) already have the concrete evidence you need (in which case there would surely have been no need for BoJo to lie about it), or b) know it wasn't them but are trying to frame them anyway.

 

How do you know that the government 'presumed Russian guilt first'? The 'presumption', as you call it, would have been made on a combination of evidence from Porton Down, the police investigation, electronic and human surveillance from the intelligence community, mixed in with Putin's and others' own direct threats prior to the attack.

 

And as for compiling a 'list of suspects', how's that going, exactly? Who do you have in the frame for this?

 

And when the only 'evidence' that the public has been given so far by our government - that we know it was the Russians because the guys at Porton Down told us so - is proven to be completely untrue, then is it really any wonder that people start looking for possible alternative explanations?

 

You know full well that's not true. The 'government' isn't BoJo. Many others have had their say about this. It's just that BoJo seems to have caught your attention because for some reason you've been taken by surprise that he's capable of saying utterly stupid things.

 

It is perfectly possible, you know, for Russia to have committed the attack and for BoJo to be talking ********. The two are not mutually exclusive.

 

Like I said, I remain skeptical without evidence and that applies to both the government stance and to any other alternatives. I'm certainly not going to blindly throw my support behind the government line when they are proven to be a bunch of liars and can't be trusted to tell the truth about anything.

 

Again, tell us what this evidence is that points to non-Russian chemical attackers. No one's asking you to throw your support 'blindly' anywhere, just to reflect on what is becoming a bit preposterous.

 

If you're like this with Salisbury, are you still open to the idea that the polonium attack on Litvinenko was carried out by anyone other than the Russians? Are you still open to the idea that the attack on Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 was carried out by anyone other than Russian separatist militias armed with Russian missiles? The evidence is overwhelming that Putin's Russia is responsible for both. No one but conspiro-loons thinks otherwise. Yet Putin and his apparatchiks continue to pump out the nonsense that in both cases they're victims of Western black ops.

 

My guess is that so long as Putin et al continue to try the muddy the waters, there'll be a willing pool of useful idiots prepared to dive in and swallow whole anything a rogue regime says that conflicts with the hated West. That's not 'skepticism'. Nor is it about keeping an open mind. It's about an adolescent desire - dressed up with fancy words like 'cui bono' - to revolt against the late-capitalist neo-liberal new world order from behind the safety barrier of the computer keyboard.

[Sheaf Saint]

Wow Verbal, that's a whole lot of leaps of faulty logic you've made in one post there.

 

I don't 'know' that the government presumed Russian guilt first, hence my use of the words "seem to have", which I based on how quick they were to point the finger of blame just a couple of days after the incident, well before any kind of proper investigation could have even begun, let alone finished.

 

Yes, I obviously recognise that just because Boris has been caught talking out of his ar$e again (no, that is no surprise to me whatsoever) doesn't prove that it wasn't Russia. I didn't make any such claim to the contrary. But when our foreign secretary is shown to have made made up claims about imaginary conversations with our chemical weapons experts, you do have to wonder about the validity of the case our government actually has, don't you?

 

I can't tell you what the evidence is that points to non-Russian attackers because, if you bothered to read my post correctly, you would have seen the bit where I said "I remain skeptical without evidence and that applies to both the government stance and to any other alternatives." I quite obviously don't have any evidence to prove it wasn't Russia and I never claimed I did.

 

Also, I'm not prepared to dive in and swallow whole anything a rogue regime says that conflicts with the hated west. I haven't at any point indicated that I believe the Russians any more than I believe our own government, so I have no idea how you have drawn that conclusion. I'm just not exactly ecstatic that we appear to be going in all guns blazing and escalating tensions on what seems to be the flimsiest of circumstantial evidence. The statement that Batman linked to earlier states that our 'assessment' that it was Russia is based on the fact that we know they developed novichoks and might still have some, and that they have got previous for this kind of thing. It doesn't prove a damn thing and I would hope/expect that our glorious leaders would be more prudent than to row in to a potential geopolitical sh!tstorm on something a bit more sturdy than a f*cking inflatable dinghy.

[whelk]

Wow Verbal, that's a whole lot of leaps of faulty logic you've made in one post there.

 

I don't 'know' that the government presumed Russian guilt first, hence my use of the words "seem to have", which I based on how quick they were to point the finger of blame just a couple of days after the incident, well before any kind of proper investigation could have even begun, let alone finished.

 

Yes, I obviously recognise that just because Boris has been caught talking out of his ar$e again (no, that is no surprise to me whatsoever) doesn't prove that it wasn't Russia. I didn't make any such claim to the contrary. But when our foreign secretary is shown to have made made up claims about imaginary conversations with our chemical weapons experts, you do have to wonder about the validity of the case our government actually has, don't you?

 

I can't tell you what the evidence is that points to non-Russian attackers because, if you bothered to read my post correctly, you would have seen the bit where I said "I remain skeptical without evidence and that applies to both the government stance and to any other alternatives." I quite obviously don't have any evidence to prove it wasn't Russia and I never claimed I did.

 

Also, I'm not prepared to dive in and swallow whole anything a rogue regime says that conflicts with the hated west. I haven't at any point indicated that I believe the Russians any more than I believe our own government, so I have no idea how you have drawn that conclusion. I'm just not exactly ecstatic that we appear to be going in all guns blazing and escalating tensions on what seems to be the flimsiest of circumstantial evidence. The statement that Batman linked to earlier states that our 'assessment' that it was Russia is based on the fact that we know they developed novichoks and might still have some, and that they have got previous for this kind of thing. It doesn't prove a damn thing and I would hope/expect that our glorious leaders would be more prudent than to row in to a potential geopolitical sh!tstorm on something a bit more sturdy than a f*cking inflatable dinghy.

 

Serious question. Did you think Bin Laden was behind 9/11?

He denied it you know.

[Window Cleaner]

Serious question. Did you think Bin Laden was behind 9/11?

He denied it you know.

 

Mandy Rice-Davies about summed it up for every situation in the then foreseeable future.

[Seaford Saint]

We will never know for certain...but more and more it looks like a false flag attack......Craig Murray has been on the money, the UK has known for weeks and weeks that there was no PROOF that the nerve agent could only have come from Russia. Why let the truth get in the way of anything.

[Verbal]

We will never know for certain...but more and more it looks like a false flag attack......Craig Murray has been on the money, the UK has known for weeks and weeks that there was no PROOF that the nerve agent could only have come from Russia. Why let the truth get in the way of anything.

 

Ok, so [deep breath] your contention is that the 'false flag' this 'more and more looks like' involves the British deep state intentionally launching a chemical weapons attack on its own soil. Those damned Brits then stupidly nurse one of the victims back to health. The British deep state also proves so omnipotent as to fool all of their allies into believing that this this was a Russian attack, and yet so incompetent that it lets Porton Down issue a 'we only do the science not lay blame' statement.

 

So your turn - lay out the 'false flag operation'. Tell us what do you think happened. And please do it with pictures that have lots of pointy arrows, like all the other false flag geniuses. We love those.

[buctootim]

Interesting. Because the evidence against Russia isnt absolutely watertight the only logical conclusion is the we did it ourselves. If you ever get hit by a car you better hope the judge in the drivers trial doesnt read Craig Murray

Edited 5 April, 2018 by buctootim

[aintforever]

Ok, so [deep breath] your contention is that the 'false flag' this 'more and more looks like' involves the British deep state intentionally launching a chemical weapons attack on its own soil. Those damned Brits then stupidly nurse one of the victims back to health. The British deep state also proves so omnipotent as to fool all of their allies into believing that this this was a Russian attack, and yet so incompetent that it lets Porton Down issue a 'we only do the science not lay blame' statement.

 

So your turn - lay out the 'false flag operation'. Tell us what do you think happened. And please do it with pictures that have lots of pointy arrows, like all the other false flag geniuses. We love those.

 

Or maybe we should all wait until the police investigation figures out what happened and they come up with timeline of what happened and a suspect. Like in the Alexander Litvinenko case where the murder investigation pointed to Andrey Lugovoy, a former member of Russia's Federal Protective Service.

 

From the information we have in the public domain there is nothing that rules out another country’s secret service as a potential suspect. It could be a rouge agent from any country that happened to get their hands on the poison, agree it’s most likely Russia but what exactly rules out another country’s involvement?

[buctootim]

Mandy Rice-Davies about summed it up for every situation in the then foreseeable future.

 

Can't see how "more lube butler" is relevant

[Jonnyboy]

Thing is that can be pretty much said about any party, not just tory. Look at Blair with Iraq, telling Bush he was with him no matter what. That was a labour government. Look at Corbyn, always against the EU, but now he's getting a sniff of power he's suddenly a little more 'ambiguous' about his thoughts.

 

The thing with Russia is they play divide and conquer, which is what they're attempting now, Putin is a clever man and puts our politicians to shame, all of them, he's always 3 steps ahead of them, though on this he may have underestimated us.

 

We may or may not have the intelligence that backs up tory claims, in the real world we'd pull in the suspect, in this case Putin and question him, not likely to happen. So we have to rely on intelligence, there will never be definitive proof, and I can't imagine any Russian involved will speak out, look what happens to Putin's opponents.

 

Corbyn is playing the useful idiot in this scenario, he's a member of the privvy council, why hasn't he demanded to see the intelligence the government has, he has every right to as leader of the opposition. He could end all this speculation by looking at the intelligence and come out with confirmation one way or another, but he won't, he would rather put his dislike of the tories ahead of any national security, which is why he aint fit to be leader of the opposition, let alone prime minister.

 

I don't know what everyone is expecting, there aint going to be any smoking gun, it will be a collection of data from different sources which politicians have to make a judgement on. Problem is Corbyn will always find a way to disagree with what a tory says and he'll convince himself he's right, his default position is opposing whatever a tory says, he's too used to being in demo mode, than being a proper politician.

 

Why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

 

The government has refused to share info with him

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/05/spy-poisoning-ben-wallace-jeremy-corbyn-intelligence?CMP=fb_gu

[Verbal]

Why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

 

The government has refused to share info with him

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/05/spy-poisoning-ben-wallace-jeremy-corbyn-intelligence?CMP=fb_gu

 

Millbrook is perfectly correct, fanboy. The government shared secret information with Corbyn. This is information he's entitled to as a privy councillor. What they didn't do is share top secret information with him, which they did with foreign leaders. This was in part to lure him into the mess he got himself into in the Commons recently, and which his loyal lemmings still happily repeat.

 

We're here for your education.

[benjii]

Or maybe we should all wait until the police investigation figures out what happened and they come up with timeline of what happened and a suspect. Like in the Alexander Litvinenko case where the murder investigation pointed to Andrey Lugovoy, a former member of Russia's Federal Protective Service.

 

From the information we have in the public domain there is nothing that rules out another country’s secret service as a potential suspect. It could be a rouge agent from any country that happened to get their hands on the poison, agree it’s most likely Russia but what exactly rules out another country’s involvement?

 

You're right. We need to commence "operation rule out every country apart from Russia", and quick-smart too.

 

Let's divvy it up. I'll take French Polynesia, the Cook Islands, Fiji, Oz, NZ and, to mix things up a bit, Burundi. You start on South America.

[Millbrook Saint]

Why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

 

The government has refused to share info with him

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/05/spy-poisoning-ben-wallace-jeremy-corbyn-intelligence?CMP=fb_gu

 

Urrm i think if you read that it clearly says the government has shared some information with him, where's his response, where's his opinion. Oh that's right he'd much prefer to sling mud at those nasty tories. You know what i wouldn't trust him with top secret information and the government is absolutely spot on with limiting his access.

 

He seems to have done a good job of deflecting from his anti Semitic, and anti monarchy views though.

[Jonnyboy]

Urrm i think if you read that it clearly says the government has shared some information with him, where's his response, where's his opinion. Oh that's right he'd much prefer to sling mud at those nasty tories. You know what i wouldn't trust him with top secret information and the government is absolutely spot on with limiting his access.

 

He seems to have done a good job of deflecting from his anti Semitic, and anti monarchy views though.

 

So why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

[whelk]

So why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

 

Lively thread eh Jonny

[buctootim]

For what its worth I think there is probably symbolism behind this attack. when the leader of the Orange revolution in Ukraine was poisoned Putin used Agent Orange. I wouldnt be surprised if Skripal provided intelligence to Britain on Russian nerve agents and Livinenko on their nuclear programme

[Sheaf Saint]

For what its worth I think there is probably symbolism behind this attack. when the leader of the Orange revolution in Ukraine was poisoned Putin used Agent Orange. I wouldnt be surprised if Skripal provided intelligence to Britain on Russian nerve agents and Livinenko on their nuclear programme

 

Vil Mirzayanov already did that in the early 90s.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vil_Mirzayanov

 

He even published a book about it, in which he essentially revealed the secret recipe for Novichoks. In fact, it's surprising that he hasn't already been targeted for assassination himself.

[Millbrook Saint]

So why do you keep going on about the privvy council?

 

Think you'll find I mentioned it in one post, then responded to your link stating the government refused to share info with him, which they didn't, they just didn't share the most top secret stuff with him.

 

Doesn't change the fact he hasn't said anything about it as far as I'm aware, surely as opposing leader he should have responded by now, after all I would imagine he's more concerned with the country's security and its citizens' safety, than Boris acting the goat. He could even do both if he wants, but not commenting on what info he's been privvy to is pretty damning considering the way the country's being divided on this, imagine if he's seen most of the evidence and it's pretty damning on Russia, but he still doesn't come out and say, 'you know what, I've not seen everything, but what I have does point to Russia', the whole country would get behind the government, but his hatred for the tories wouldn't ever let him agree with what they've said, he'd rather let the country eat itself. Scumbag is what he is.

[aintforever]

Think you'll find I mentioned it in one post, then responded to your link stating the government refused to share info with him, which they didn't, they just didn't share the most top secret stuff with him.

 

Doesn't change the fact he hasn't said anything about it as far as I'm aware, surely as opposing leader he should have responded by now, after all I would imagine he's more concerned with the country's security and its citizens' safety, than Boris acting the goat. He could even do both if he wants, but not commenting on what info he's been privvy to is pretty damning considering the way the country's being divided on this, imagine if he's seen most of the evidence and it's pretty damning on Russia, but he still doesn't come out and say, 'you know what, I've not seen everything, but what I have does point to Russia', the whole country would get behind the government, but his hatred for the tories wouldn't ever let him agree with what they've said, he'd rather let the country eat itself. Scumbag is what he is.

 

“The use of nerve agents on our streets is barbaric and beyond reckless.

 

The Russian authorities must be held to account. And the Government must do more to tackle the oligarchs and their ill-gotten cash.”

 

What exactly is wrong with that?

[Jonnyboy]

“The use of nerve agents on our streets is barbaric and beyond reckless.

 

The Russian authorities must be held to account. And the Government must do more to tackle the oligarchs and their ill-gotten cash.”

 

What exactly is wrong with that?

 

Bloke is another victim of The Sun, and the Mail, just like Gerbal.

[Millbrook Saint]

Bloke is another victim of The Sun, and the Mail, just like Gerbal.

 

Thanks for that, you've no idea what i read but i'm sure you're quite correct, i'm just a little old victim, not quite getting it like you superior beings. Enjoy patting each other on the back and as you revel in your magnificence

[Jonnyboy]

Thanks for that, you've no idea what i read but i'm sure you're quite correct, i'm just a little old victim, not quite getting it like you superior beings. Enjoy patting each other on the back and as you revel in your magnificence

 

Answer aintforever's question and stop wallowing in self pity.

[Verbal]

“The use of nerve agents on our streets is barbaric and beyond reckless.

 

The Russian authorities must be held to account. And the Government must do more to tackle the oligarchs and their ill-gotten cash.”

 

What exactly is wrong with that?

 

That's hardly all he said though, is it. There's also this: "I asked the Russians be given a sample so that they can say categorically one way or the other."

 

There's every chance Corbyn is actually as dim as some of his fans on here.

[Jonnyboy]

That's hardly all he said though, is it. There's also this: "I asked the Russians be given a sample so that they can say categorically one way or the other."

 

There's every chance Corbyn is actually as dim as some of his fans on here.

 

I've figured it out, you're Alan Sugar?

[aintforever]

That's hardly all he said though, is it. There's also this: "I asked the Russians be given a sample so that they can say categorically one way or the other."

 

There's every chance Corbyn is actually as dim as some of his fans on here.

 

It’s pretty clear he thinks Russia did it though, try reading.

[Seaford Saint]

Ok, so [deep breath] your contention is that the 'false flag' this 'more and more looks like' involves the British deep state intentionally launching a chemical weapons attack on its own soil. Those damned Brits then stupidly nurse one of the victims back to health. The British deep state also proves so omnipotent as to fool all of their allies into believing that this this was a Russian attack, and yet so incompetent that it lets Porton Down issue a 'we only do the science not lay blame' statement.

 

So your turn - lay out the 'false flag operation'. Tell us what do you think happened. And please do it with pictures that have lots of pointy arrows, like all the other false flag geniuses. We love those.

 

I suggest you go onto Craig Murray's website and listened to the 10 minute interview he did with Sky....me personally, I think it was false flag attack....by perpetrators unknown.

[Verbal]

I suggest you go onto Craig Murray's website and listened to the 10 minute interview he did with Sky....me personally, I think it was false flag attack....by perpetrators unknown.

 

False flag conspiracy theories are for simpletons. Such 'ideas' convince those who repeat them that their self-esteem can be restored by claiming they see something that's invisible to all the 'sheeple'.

[buctootim]

False flag conspiracy theories are for simpletons. Such 'ideas' convince those who repeat them that their self-esteem can be restored by claiming they see something that's invisible to all the 'sheeple'.

 

I worked for a Washington DC based organisation for 10 years. Three of my friends / colleagues witnessed the 9/11 plane fly into the Pentagon. They've had people tell them what they saw wasn't real, it was a hologram or that they are deep state agents. There are some real dip****s out there

[Seaford Saint]

I get it Verbal. Everything you say is right and anything I say is wrong.

 

As the drama unfolded – and early wild speculation unravelled – slowly but surely the forces of law and order upon which we all rely established the core truth behind the infernal Russian spin machine. All became clear as the authorities shared with us:

 

Top Secret Aerial photographs of Russian buildings whose sole purpose was, undeniably, the production of Novichok…a deadly nerve agent that kills people, and then cruelly brings them back to life…but murders house-pets indiscriminately

 

Reports of a raid upon a Russian passenger plane foiled by fiendish cabin staff loyal to the despot Putin

 

Expert forensic examination of a front-door handle so toxically deadly, two unprotected policemen were posted to guard it round the clock

 

Thorough examination of Mr Skripal’s BMW motor car which proved conclusively that the nerve agent had been pumped into the air-conditioning system

 

Exhaustive tests upon Ms Skripal’s attache case showing how Putin fanatics in Moscow had, without a shadow of a doubt, placed the nerve agent in it when she wasn’t looking

 

Comprehensive briefing of a Court of Protection judge enabling him to conclude that the Skripal’s Russian family were all fakes, whose evidence would thus be of no value

 

Condemnation of Russian espionage elements in Salisbury Hospital, the local police force and Porton Down, who stuck though thick and thin to the ludicrous story that nobody in Salisbury was ill at all as a result of the brutal Putin-inspired attack

 

The backing of those EU leaders who, throughout the Brexit negotiations, had shown themselves to be unstinting supporters of plucky Britain’s desire for self-determination as an alternative to life under the steel-tipped jackboot of the Red Army which pretends not to be Red any more but of course we know better.

 

German TV interviews where Mr Johnson was asked a lot of impertinently direct questions, and opinions offered by unrepresentative Porton Down spin doctors about whether the nerve agent Novichok was involved, and where it might not have been manufactured. But in a tolerant society, this is the price we must pay for our freedom: there will always be those Useful Idiots who prefer the word of our enemies to that of our protectors. With no evidence at all, they persist in ignoring the mountain of evidential proof that Russia is guilty of the most heinous Peace Crime in modern history.

 

And so, let us steel ourselves to our task. We shall fight them in the media, we shall fight them on the websites, but we will never surrender. For if the Special Relationship should last for a thousand years, later peoples will say, “This was its darkest hour”.

[Seaford Saint]

One more for you Verbal http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/the-best-explanation-for-the-skripal-drama-is-food-poisoning.html#more

[buctootim]

One more for you Verbal http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/the-best-explanation-for-the-skripal-drama-is-food-poisoning.html#more

 

It was really just food poisoning? Wow, just wow.

[HedgeEnder]

One more for you Verbal http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/the-best-explanation-for-the-skripal-drama-is-food-poisoning.html#more

 

You really are a special kind of stupid aren’t you.

[Seaford Saint]

You really are a special kind of stupid aren’t you.

 

Care to elaborate.....elaborate means to go into some detail?

[shurlock]

One more for you Verbal http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/the-best-explanation-for-the-skripal-drama-is-food-poisoning.html#more

 

Don't think even one of Jamie's reheated full English breakfasts could do that.

Edited 8 April, 2018 by shurlock

[buctootim]

So working on the bad fish or meal theory, the police officer who was taken ill probably had the same food as the Skripals then? Odd that no-one has thought to withdraw the Zizzi risotto, given the slight fuss its caused

https://www.zizzi.co.uk/food#meat-and-fish

Edited 8 April, 2018 by buctootim

[whelk]

Care to elaborate.....elaborate means to go into some detail?

 

Posting that up about food poisoning shows you are a truly special troll or mug. Has Pap found a way back onto Saintsweb?

[Verbal]

One more for you Verbal http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/the-best-explanation-for-the-skripal-drama-is-food-poisoning.html#more

 

The same old conspiro-loon guff, which shows you up as a gullible fool.

 

Did nothing in the following give you any pause for thought?

 

"It is unlikely that any targeted poisoning with a real 'military grade' nerve agent would have allowed for such an outcome."

 

"Russia never had a Novichok programme."

 

"Russia had no good motive."

 

"If there was something nefarious going on it seemed unlikely that Russia was involved."

 

"In my view all the stories we were told about 'Novichok', the 'doorknob' or a 'Russian attack' are fairy tales. They simply do not make sense."

 

And then the kicker about the author' qualifications:

 

I am no doctor, nor a specialist in chemistry - only a retired journalist working with open sources.

 

Oh and - just curious - what about the cop? Can you point to the bit in that link where we get to know how he was poisoned by the crab? Strangely, there's no mention of him.

 

Which all means you're right and I'm wrong because another keyboard warrior says so. No question about it. So let's alter the bet. My £500 (for the nerve agent) against your £250 (for the Russian state-TV originated claim that it was food poisoning). It's easy money for you, surely. When the OPCW rules, it'll be settled.

 

Deal?

[buctootim]

Bad outbreak of food poisoning in Gouta yesterday

[Verbal]

Bad outbreak of food poisoning in Gouta yesterday

 

Just give it time. Won't be long before the blunt tools on here will be saying some version of that.

 

Apply the following logic - "I don't understand, but I don't trust the government so the thing I imagine must be the truth, regardless of facts" - and you get somewhere close to this weird mindset.

 

So what's the news on my bet? Has he run away again?

[shurlock]

Bad outbreak of food poisoning in Gouta yesterday

 

#acidrain

[Batman]

Bad outbreak of food poisoning in Gouta yesterday

 

Crisis actors, innit

[Seaford Saint]

Yuliua Skripal makes a call to her cousin and a couple of hours later a recording is broadcast on Russian state media. That tells you a lot about the 'game' being played in Moscow

 

You don't think the Russian public should hear from her? What is the game?