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Cup win and relegation or PL Survival

SKD

By SKD,
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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

Posted
Posted
Cup win allday long. I then would sack the manager remove most of the board get in a young English manager with a bit of passion clear-out the overpaid deadwood. I would use players like Austin, Ward Prowse, Stephens, Hoijberg. Also bed in and play youth prospects like Mcqueen, Sims, Hesketh, Seager, Olomola, Sam G. I would spend a little bit of dosh and get in a few young prospects that will help push us out the championship but essentially would gut most of the team and would sell the following.

 

Long

Gabbadini

Soares

Bertrand

Fraser F

Hoedt

Tadic

Boufal

Redmond

Davis

 

I think that's the most optimistic post I've seen in a long time.

 

Firstly, who is this young, passionate, English, Premier League quality (I assume you don't intend to sack him when we get promoted) manager, willing to come to a relegated Saints with half a squad?

Secondly Austin will likely be injured (if he stays), JWP and Hojbjerg will almost certainly leave.

Thirdly, you're going to mix our youth team with a a bunch of other kids and somehow get promoted again?

 

I don't take issue with people wanting a trophy but let's not pretend the Championship will be some swashbuckling adventure straight back to the Premier League. I would chose survival, not because the Prem excites me in itself but because I'm worried about years of 2005-2009 era football if we do go down.

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted

I'd love us to win the cup but to be relegated whilst doing so would be a disgrace. I personally wouldn't want to win the cup and be relegated. I would be too ****ed off at manager and the team for being relegated whilst celebrating at winning the cup then leaving. If they get us relegated then they can leave with their tales between their legs.

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mrfahaji

mrfahaji

Posted
Posted
Lol, when people posted they wanted a decent cup run, these are the exact words you wrote in response.

 

“I can honestly say this is the first game I’ve ever attended where I wanted Saints to lose”.

 

No doubt you’ll quickly be rewriting that one when you’re at Wembley cheering us on. Loyal support through thick and thin.

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Was that not also to do with wanting Pellegrino to be sacked, as opposed to not wanting the distraction of the cup?

 

Some comments do end up looking silly in hindsight, but if SKD's view was "We will get relegated with Pellegrino in charge, I therefore want him out asap, therefore not only is the cup the next game, but also I'd rather sacrifice a cup game than a potentially vital 3 points", is that really such a disgraceful view?

 

I don't think I could ever want Saints to lose, but some defeats are easier to get over (and see the positives) than others.

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ericb

ericb

Posted
Posted

Cup win of course, our trophy haul is dismal for a club our size and any fan under 40 won't have seen us win anything other than the JPT. Also i'm sick to the back teeth of the Premier League "match day experience" and would actually enjoy the games and day out more in the Championship.

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SNSUN

SNSUN

Posted
Posted

We are more likely to achieve safety than win the cup IMO as Wigan aside, we will most likely have to beat two of the top 6 to win the cup, which I don't see us doing under Pellegrino. But it is for that reason, beating two top 6 teams to win the cup, that I choose the cup win. It'd go on record forever, and we have a decent enough set up that we can probably bounce back from relegation fairly quickly.

 

If we get safety, I think we'll have learned from the mistakes of the last few years, sell some deadwood, sack Pellegrino, bring in a decent manager and rebuild. Surely the cluster**** of mistakes can't continue...

 

I don't think we'll achieve either safety or the cup, though I still hold out a tiny bit of hope for both, but I choose the cup win.

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SKD

SKD

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Was that not also to do with wanting Pellegrino to be sacked, as opposed to not wanting the distraction of the cup?

 

Some comments do end up looking silly in hindsight, but if SKD's view was "We will get relegated with Pellegrino in charge, I therefore want him out asap, therefore not only is the cup the next game, but also I'd rather sacrifice a cup game than a potentially vital 3 points", is that really such a disgraceful view?

 

I don't think I could ever want Saints to lose, but some defeats are easier to get over (and see the positives) than others.

 

Exactly what it was, and the bell end knows that.... I actually clarified on the same thread it was probably a silly comment and that “I don’t care about the result” rather than actively wanting to lose.

 

Ultimately if we go on and win the cup it’ll be great, of course I’ll celebrate. However, there is still a very long way to go and if get knocked out and these FA cup games have kept MP in s job (who, IMO will take us down), then I stand by what I said. For the greater good it would have been better to go out early, replace MP and stay up.

 

Let’s hope we win the cup, win a few of the next couple of games and stay up as well.

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Dark Munster

Dark Munster

Posted
Posted

Survival. If Markus was in charge I'd say Cup, because we'd have an owner who'd probably bankroll us enough to bounce back fairly quickly. But with Mr. invisible in charge who doesn't appear to have a clue (or money to spend) I reckon it would be a long time before we come back. The chasm in wealth between the PL and the rest is only getting larger. I could see us doing a Coventry.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
Survival. If Markus was in charge I'd say Cup, because we'd have an owner who'd probably bankroll us enough to bounce back fairly quickly. But with Mr. invisible in charge who doesn't appear to have a clue (or money to spend) I reckon it would be a long time before we come back. The chasm in wealth between the PL and the rest is only getting larger. I could see us doing a Coventry.
Jesus wept.
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nta786

nta786

Posted
Posted
I love how when these hypothetical scenarios come up, people love to add all sorts of conditions and things. The question wasn't whether you would prefer us to stay up and win the Cup or what you would have liked five years ago.

 

well without certain conditions and assumptions then we would have all the same unanimously agreed decision

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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

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Posted
Cup win of course, our trophy haul is dismal for a club our size and any fan under 40 won't have seen us win anything other than the JPT. Also i'm sick to the back teeth of the Premier League "match day experience" and would actually enjoy the games and day out more in the Championship.

 

Recently though, we're not much different from most clubs our size. Taking the 'big six' aside for a second, Swansea, Boro, Blackburn, Leicester, Wigan and P*mpey have won a cup in the last 20 years and only 3 of those in the last decade.

 

Everton, Villa, Derby, Forest, Wolves, Newcastle, Sunderland, West Ham, Stoke, Brum, Bolton, Norwich, Fulham, Wednesday, Sheff Utd, Leeds, QPR, Reading... nothing in the last 2 decades.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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I love how when these hypothetical scenarios come up, people love to add all sorts of conditions and things. The question wasn't whether you would prefer us to stay up and win the Cup or what you would have liked five years ago.
Indeed.

 

The option isn't win the cup and be relegated into liquidation and becoming the next Coventry OR don't win the cup but stay in the Premier League for infinite seasons and never ever be relegated.

 

Win the cup and go down this season, don't win the cup and don't go down this season. This season. Just this season.

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LGTL

LGTL

Posted
Posted
Recently though, we're not much different from most clubs our size. Taking the 'big six' aside for a second, Swansea, Boro, Blackburn, Leicester, Wigan and P*mpey have won a cup in the last 20 years and only 3 of those in the last decade.

 

Everton, Villa, Derby, Forest, Wolves, Newcastle, Sunderland, West Ham, Stoke, Brum, Bolton, Norwich, Fulham, Wednesday, Sheff Utd, Leeds, QPR, Reading... nothing in the last 2 decades.

 

I take your point but we have nothing in the last 4 decades!! We are long overdue a cup win and 1 major trophy in our history is an embarrassment.

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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

Posted
Posted (edited)
Indeed.

 

The option isn't win the cup and be relegated into liquidation and becoming the next Coventry OR don't win the cup but stay in the Premier League for infinite seasons and never ever be relegated.

 

Win the cup and go down this season, don't win the cup and don't go down this season. This season. Just this season.

 

In which case relegation is of no consequence, so I'll say Cup win.

 

I take your point but we have nothing in the last 4 decades!! We are long overdue a cup win and 1 major trophy in our history is an embarrassment.

 

I agree, more trophies would be great but it's not really an embarrassment. When I meet fans of other clubs, be it at games or otherwise, I tend to chat about recent games, recently players, current form etc. The only fans I hear talking about stuff they won 20+ years ago are Scousers and they just bore me TBH.

Edited by Lighthouse
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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

Posted
Posted
Exactly what it was, and the bell end knows that.... I actually clarified on the same thread it was probably a silly comment and that “I don’t care about the result” rather than actively wanting to lose.

 

Talk about twisting things. It wasn't a "I don't care about the result" comment at all. You did actively want us to lose. Here's the exact quote copied from the thread

 

"I can honestly say this is the first game I have ever attended where I have wanted saints to lose" .

 

Have some honesty man, say that you did actively want Saints to lose. Admittedly it was only once you wanted our team to lose , but it's once more than a bell end like me has.

 

 

 

 

 

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SKD

SKD

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Talk about twisting things. It wasn't a "I don't care about the result" comment at all. You did actively want us to lose. Here's the exact quote copied from the thread

 

"I can honestly say this is the first game I have ever attended where I have wanted saints to lose" .

 

Have some honesty man, say that you did actively want Saints to lose. Admittedly it was only once you wanted our team to lose , but it's once more than a bell end like me has.

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote

 

Nothing twisted. My comment from same thread (one in which you replied to...):

 

Hoping to lose is probably a bit strong and silly wording, I’ll rephrase it to I actually couldn’t care less if we win or not.

 

Come on fella, if you’re going to try and argue at least get your facts right.

 

As explained (I’ll do it again as you seem to find it difficult to understand), if losing meant MP was sacked, that’s a price I was willing to pay.. As we now have a good chance of making the final, of course I want us to progress.

 

I don’t know what you’re trying to achieve here. If you want to go round d!ck waving “I’m a bigger saints fan than you are” (which seems like you do, to everyone), then we can compare ticket stubs if you like.

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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Cup win all day long, not even close.

 

If we did win the cup and get relegated, would Pellegrino still keep his job?? Hope not.

 

Agree 100%

 

And yes, he would absolutely keep his job. We got a stroke of fortune with Wigan beating City but chances are we'll have to beat 2 of Chelsea , Spurs or Utd, to win the cup. If he does that he deserves the bloody job.

 

Personally I don't think either will happen. We'll stay up, but won't win the cup

 

 

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mrfahaji

mrfahaji

Posted
Posted
FA Cup win every day of the week. Can't imagine I'll be telling the grandkids about that year we finished 17th...

 

Even though I agree with your conclusion, some of our best days actually came during the relegation fight. Wimbledon away and Everton home in 99 two examples that immediately spring to mind. Difference was, back then we were in a battle every year because we didn't have much money and had average/poor players. Whereas now it feels like we are woefully underperforming.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
Ah yes, CB Fry's childish put down for something he doesn't agree with. You obviously think winning the cup and going down is better than survival. I think the opposite. Guess what, neither of us are wrong. It's called an "opinion". Google it.
What's childish is conflating one relegation with spiralling into oblivion like Coventry, when it took even Coventry about a decade to get to there.

 

On that logic, we could stay up this season and then go down next and still become Coventry anyway. If you think do little of our prospects that we couldn't even weather one season in the Championship then I don't really understand how you think we have much chance in staying in the Premier League for much longer anyway. We're clearly doomed I tells ya, doomed.

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stu0x

stu0x

Posted
Posted
Recently though, we're not much different from most clubs our size. Taking the 'big six' aside for a second, Swansea, Boro, Blackburn, Leicester, Wigan and P*mpey have won a cup in the last 20 years and only 3 of those in the last decade.

 

Everton, Villa, Derby, Forest, Wolves, Newcastle, Sunderland, West Ham, Stoke, Brum, Bolton, Norwich, Fulham, Wednesday, Sheff Utd, Leeds, QPR, Reading... nothing in the last 2 decades.

 

Birmingham City won the League Cup 5ish years ago, beat Arsenal in the final.

 

Newcastle, Reading, Sunderland at least have all won the Championship relatively recently. Is it a big deal? No, not particularly (although you could argue it's more of a big deal than winning the JPT), but we didn't even manage to win that (or the League One title) on our way back up. Regardless of the 'value' of any silverware considered junior to the FA Cup, it's still *something*. We have arguably had a more eventful last few years than almost any of these clubs - for the 'right' reasons at least - but precious little to show for it.

 

We are so saturated by the relentless tide of football that it can quickly fade to the background. It's the moments that you remember. I was at Wembley for the JPT win and at San Siro for Inter. They are by far my two most memorable events of the post-admin era. The emotional value of the moment far outweighs the actual value (which is, in reality, almost nothing). Winning something is the punctuation mark.

 

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Bearsy

Bearsy

Posted
Posted

Cup Win is my end game definitely. That's all I want from in return for my Eternal Support tbh, to see us win a Proper Cup, at least fkn Once!

 

Premier League is nice I suppose. I mean, it's nice that people remember you still exist, and to read about your selfs in the papers, but I only really care about being in Premier League because, in theory, it gives you better chance of Winning a Fkn Cup.

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captainchris

captainchris

Posted
Posted

Survival

Relegation would set us back years...

There is a rash over confidence with many that first we could win the cup and second that we would bounce straight back up having lost a whole bunch of players again and with a completely useless Manager.

We simply have to stay in this division....

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mrfahaji

mrfahaji

Posted
Posted
Survival

Relegation would set us back years...

There is a rash over confidence with many that first we could win the cup and second that we would bounce straight back up having lost a whole bunch of players again and with a completely useless Manager.

We simply have to stay in this division....

 

Most people would choose winning the cup because we've won the cup once in our history. For anyone around at the time it was one of the best moments of their lives, the closest the rest of us have got is crying to Abide With Me. Even those who aren't so positive about our ability to bounce back still value that one off euphoria over having a (small) seat at the top table each year.

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Dark Munster

Dark Munster

Posted
Posted
What's childish is conflating one relegation with spiralling into oblivion like Coventry, when it took even Coventry about a decade to get to there.

 

On that logic, we could stay up this season and then go down next and still become Coventry anyway. If you think do little of our prospects that we couldn't even weather one season in the Championship then I don't really understand how you think we have much chance in staying in the Premier League for much longer anyway. We're clearly doomed I tells ya, doomed.

Jesus wept. :mcinnes:

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted
would Pellegrino still keep his job??

 

The only circumstance I can see him keeping his job is a cup win plus us finishing in the top half.

 

Anything else, even if we stay up, he has failed this year and not done a good enough job.

 

------------------------------

 

Cup win for me, EURO Cup in the Championship would be some funny memes and I'd be confident of us bouncing back up in the next year/two, financially we would be fine, we'd probably actually invest in some young English talent as well if that happened both from the lower leagues and are own academy.

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scotty

scotty

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Posted
The only circumstance I can see him keeping his job is a cup win plus us finishing in the top half.

 

Anything else, even if we stay up, he has failed this year and not done a good enough job.

 

------------------------------

 

Cup win for me, EURO Cup in the Championship would be some funny memes and I'd be confident of us bouncing back up in the next year/two, financially we would be fine, we'd probably actually invest in some young English talent as well if that happened both from the lower leagues and are own academy.

 

I certainly wouldn't. But I'd still take the cup win.

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nta786

nta786

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Posted
If we are relegated and then win the cup, would we technically be a championship side? The first in the modern era to win it twice outside the top flight.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

no we would be seen as a premier league team winning it- hence why they say Wigan's was the first time ever a Premier League team got relegated and won it.

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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no we would be seen as a premier league team winning it- hence why they say Wigan's was the first time ever a Premier League team got relegated and won it.

 

Pedant alert. When Wigan won it they hadn’t yet been relegated, they still had 2 league games to play which had they won they’d have been safe. So technically they won it and then got relegated, we’d be the first to get relegated then win it. Lol

 

When do clubs become championship teams, the day of relegation, the day the fixtures are released or the first day of the following season?

 

 

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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Pedant alert. When Wigan won it they hadn’t yet been relegated, they still had 2 league games to play which had they won they’d have been safe. So technically they won it and then got relegated, we’d be the first to get relegated then win it. Lol

 

When do clubs become championship teams, the day of relegation, the day the fixtures are released or the first day of the following season?

 

 

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The day the fixtures come out is the day they reset all the league tables.
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captainchris

captainchris

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Posted
Most people would choose winning the cup because we've won the cup once in our history. For anyone around at the time it was one of the best moments of their lives, the closest the rest of us have got is crying to Abide With Me. Even those who aren't so positive about our ability to bounce back still value that one off euphoria over having a (small) seat at the top table each year.

 

It was indeed a great moment winning the cup but definitely wouldn’t swap the Premier League for it.

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LGTL

LGTL

Posted
Posted
It was indeed a great moment winning the cup but definitely wouldn’t swap the Premier League for it.

 

Yes but you've seen it, experienced what all of us would do anything to witness.

 

I'm 30, been going week in, week out since I was some ridiculous age, and I've seen us win a poxy JPT.

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