No Hunger In Paraside:

[Monk]

Based on the book by award-winning author Michael Calvin, 'No Hunger In Paradise' explores the academy system and the pressures and pitfalls that prevent young players from making it as a professional footballer.

 

You can watch it here - free: http://sport.bt.com/bt-sport-films-no-hunger-in-paradise-91364241852638

 

Would love to hear some of your opinions on the documentary, experiences with academies, development centres and more.

 

Thankfully, Saints are one of those clubs that conduct themselves with much better sense of grace and after care (I'm sure there's a few cases that haven't always felt like this.)

 

When I previously worked for a PL club, one of our satellite centres attending a termly fixture against the academy development side aged U11. In the fixture I was talking to the academy staff about players to consider and their traits to coach. I was then astonished at what I was told next.

"The number's x and x are twins from Sweden here for six weeks. We only wanted to trial one brother but parents wouldn't come unless the other could too." The boys both eleven at the time - had a house in Surrey paid for for six weeks, food paid for for the family, travel arranged etc" All the usual you'd associate with a Royal visit.

 

So roughly £20 - £30k spent on trialling two eleven year olds from Sweden, with neither particularly standing out in our evening and the fact they was released after five of the six weeks, suggests they 'wasn't up to the expected standard.'

Edited 9 January, 2018 by Monk

[DT]

Based on the book by award-winning author Michael Calvin, 'No Hunger In Paradise' explores the academy system and the pressures and pitfalls that prevent young players from making it as a professional footballer.

 

You can watch it here - free: http://sport.bt.com/bt-sport-films-no-hunger-in-paradise-91364241852638

 

Would love to hear some of your opinions on the documentary, experiences with academies, development centres and more.

 

Thankfully, Saints are one of those clubs that conduct themselves with much better sense of grace and after care (I'm sure there's a few cases that haven't always felt like this.)

 

When I previously worked for a PL club, one of our satellite centres attending a termly fixture against the academy development side aged U11. In the fixture I was talking to the academy staff about players to consider and their traits to coach. I was then astonished at what I was told next.

"The number's x and x are twins from Sweden here for six weeks. We only wanted to trial one brother but parents wouldn't come unless the other could too." The boys both eleven at the time - had a house in Surrey paid for for six weeks, food paid for for the family, travel arranged etc" All the usual you'd associate with a Royal visit.

 

So roughly £20 - £30k spent on trialling two eleven year olds from Sweden, with neither particularly standing out in our evening and the fact they was released after the five weeks, suggests they 'wasn't up to the expected standard.'

 

Mind you, going on to form Abba helped their finances too. (hilarious)

I saw the programme. Thought it was excellent and that we came out of it quite well. My 11 year old watched it too, really liked it, but then announced that he did not want to be a pro footballer. I must say it did also crystallise much that is wrong in the game at the top level. And watching Forest play Arsenal's prima donna second string the other night crystallised it more for me. It seems like there is a bit more honest football away from the bling the lower you go. And the spoilt ones in our squad right now are one of the key reasons why we are where we are. Where is the fight? The passion? Anyway, all of that popped into my mind after watching the doc, which was very well done and resourced. However, my football mad daughter, nine, said 'where are the girls?'. Perhaps another time...

[lickierambert]

Academies are looking for that 1 in a thousand diamond that can make it at a high level of the sport and will sell that dream to the parents and the player. The parents, unfortunately, get sucked in and expend a lot of money and emotional energy on their son to do well. I can't imagine the level of pressure of a child to succeed when the reality is they are very unlikely to make it.

 

If you are one of the 999 that don't make it in your late teens the chances are you don't have that level of education to fall back on. I'm not sure what the answer is but I enjoyed the documentary

[Monk]

Can someone please amend the title to paradise.

[once_bitterne]

Can someone please amend the title to paradise.

 

You should be able to?

[Monk]

Thanks.

[LGTL]

I was at Saints from 10 to 16. Released without a care in the world. This was back before the glory ''Elite" status or whatever it is now.

 

Luckily I had switched on parents and ended up with a 1st Class honours degree. Many I played with weren't so lucky.

[angelman]

Fully intend to watch it....From the discussions I have heard about it, the one bit that sticks out to me is the need to manage the expectations of the parents (as well as the kids).

[John Boy Saint]

What ever happened to that Lad from Stoke at the centre of Liverpool getting a ban from trading in youngsters at academy level? Last I heard there was a stink over the fact that when he "signed" for Liverpool his Dad was allegedly instructed not to date it, which he thought was odd seeing as it was such an integral and important part of the deal, as result he ignored them signed and added that days date of 1st September. As part of later evidence this contract came up and the date had been adjusted to the 20th or 21st September alledgedly by Liverpool. Obviously the whole thing went sour, and the lads parents were looking at a bill for the private school education that was part of the package to lure him away from Stoke. The Father said that there was no way he would sign a contract "dated" 2 weeks after this Lad had started his new school, especially as there was no way they had the kind of money to send him to that school.

With regard to the Lad, again the last I saw of it, he was stuck in limbo, because Liverpool didn't want him after all the hoo-haa (?). Stoke weren't letting him back in to the academy, but were holding his registration papers that they wanted payment of £68,000 for, I assume in return for the investment they had made in him. Certainly looked a bit messy all round.

[Lord Duckhunter]

My nephew is at AFC Bournemouth’s academy and they’re pretty good to him. Their philosophy that they drum into the parents is that being at the academy will make them better footballers, but not necessarily professional footballers. All the kids seem pretty grounded, but they’re the young intake, whether they change as they get older I don’t know.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[sandwichsaint]

My nipper was at Chelsea a few years ago now, and they had an excellent way of managing parental expectations. The younger age groups were overseen by a real old school hardened ex-pro, asked one day by a parent how long his 11 year old was likely to remain with them he replied, 'Until I find someone better!'. Probably a message that ought to go out to all parents on day one.

[Wadge]

We played a game against Liverpool under 15's at the start of this season. They had some massive lad over on trial from Poland, he was a monster, bloody good though. Got talking to the head coach down there, and he said that 90% of the under 15's had agents already. One of the lady stewards there told me that the club had bought a house for the centre forwards family. And to be honest he really was not all that, very like Sturridge didn't like passing. Houses may be cheap in Liverpool but he was not worth anywhere near it. All the lads seemed decent though, didn't appeal for anything just got on with the game.

[sandwichsaint]

Crazy stuff in that programme, the kid with 6 clubs in 6 years. The cage football stuff was new to me and interesting. Good to see that West Ham lad finding some peace in the US and looking at going into coaching, the programme really rammed home (if we didn't know it already) that those that make it are the tiny, tiny tip of a vast pyramid and there are '000's chewed up along the way.

[simo]

We played a game against Liverpool under 15's at the start of this season. They had some massive lad over on trial from Poland, he was a monster, bloody good though. Got talking to the head coach down there, and he said that 90% of the under 15's had agents already. One of the lady stewards there told me that the club had bought a house for the centre forwards family. And to be honest he really was not all that, very like Sturridge didn't like passing. Houses may be cheap in Liverpool but he was not worth anywhere near it. All the lads seemed decent though, didn't appeal for anything just got on with the game.

 

I've been to the dentist today and they gave me drugs , I came home and took 2 more different lots of drugs ! I read that 3 times before I noticed Horses was in fact Houses

[AR-10]

 

So roughly £20 - £30k spent on trialling two eleven year olds from Sweden, with neither particularly standing out in our evening and the fact they was released after five of the six weeks, suggests they 'wasn't up to the expected standard.'

 

^ this and also...

 

Also to add..

 

If they are good but the parents are still on the fence, that's when the money, house, bills paid etc..etc..comes into it because then clubs work on the parents when they know the kids head is already turned,

then if that doesn't work their favorite player at the club (whatever club that is) will be texting them asking how they got on, that player will then have it suggested to them by the club "we need this kid to sign, can you pick

him up for training tomorrow etc.." that by itself will usually do it, then if that doesn't work some fictitious agent will be on the blower asking to represent them and the best club for them to join will incidently be the

club they are traing at, kid gets bowled over, "agent" disappears (usually a club employee) commits his life to the club, club drops him..kids life in ruins cos they "said it would be forever"....and yadadayda

 

***gasps*** ran out of breath can't type anymore.

[John Boy Saint]

Crazy stuff in that programme, the kid with 6 clubs in 6 years. The cage football stuff was new to me and interesting. Good to see that West Ham lad finding some peace in the US and looking at going into coaching, the programme really rammed home (if we didn't know it already) that those that make it are the tiny, tiny tip of a vast pyramid and there are '000's chewed up along the way.

As mentioned before, probably on a thread where folks were slagging off someone like Matty Targett, these lads have gone through pretty much the toughest interview process in the world. Many of them starting at the age of Eight, like the Apprentice as they get older they see lads they have grown up with as best mates being ejected from the programme along the way.

In our case the day any academy lad steps out in front of 32,000 at St Mary's for their first team game, they have made it through the primary phase of the process. Now they have to work towards ensuring that they are out there every week.

To step out of our academy into the Premier League, when it comes to football, these boys are special, they are deemed to have what it takes to be a professional footballer, having survived the interview process that most of their detractors wouldn't have survived past their 9th Birthday!

[LeBizzier69]

Salary cap for the young players seems such an obvious way to change their attitudes. How difficult can it be to implement something like that?!

[angelman]

We played a game against Liverpool under 15's at the start of this season. They had some massive lad over on trial from Poland, he was a monster, bloody good though. Got talking to the head coach down there, and he said that 90% of the under 15's had agents already. One of the lady stewards there told me that the club had bought a house for the centre forwards family. And to be honest he really was not all that, very like Sturridge didn't like passing. Houses may be cheap in Liverpool but he was not worth anywhere near it. All the lads seemed decent though, didn't appeal for anything just got on with the game.

 

I thought it was against regs for sweetners for the parents. They had to be in situ off their own backs. So buying a house for them, unless they worked for the club, would be bang against what SHOULD happen. However, I am not so naive to think what should happen, is what actually happens.

[Saint Fan CaM]

As mentioned before, probably on a thread where folks were slagging off someone like Matty Targett, these lads have gone through pretty much the toughest interview process in the world. Many of them starting at the age of Eight, like the Apprentice as they get older they see lads they have grown up with as best mates being ejected from the programme along the way.

In our case the day any academy lad steps out in front of 32,000 at St Mary's for their first team game, they have made it through the primary phase of the process. Now they have to work towards ensuring that they are out there every week.

To step out of our academy into the Premier League, when it comes to football, these boys are special, they are deemed to have what it takes to be a professional footballer, having survived the interview process that most of their detractors wouldn't have survived past their 9th Birthday!

 

You have mentioned Targett, but could add a bunch of other names (e.g. JWP) to the list. It does make you realise the level at which these players need to reach/attain to see first team football...pretty remarkable. However, there are commercial differences within club strategy that determine whether they make it at Prem level or otherwise - at Saints the sell-on value would make a huge difference for example.

[Saint in Paradise]

I gave up after 3 minutes as the background noise ( music??? ) meant I couldn't hear what was being said.

[SonicBoom]

It's a murky world that's for sure. I've heard stories that clubs want to keep one kid but will also keep another player or two on because they are his friend and he'll be happier. Great for the player who is wanted but seems cruel to give false expectations to other lads who believe they are in with a shot.

 

From the clubs point of view they are looking for those nuggets. Find one and he could be worth tens of millions which will fund the academy for the next ten years.

 

The local kids are also the victims of the clubs success. The higher we go the better those kids have to be. That's why kids at Chelsea and City etc never get to the first team. They are just seen as a revenue stream. Local lads had a far greater chance of getting through when we were in League 1. We could afford to take a risk. Now they have to be ready for the PL

straight away. There's no development. I'd say to any kid that wherever you are , make sure you are playing games. You'll have more fun and if you are good enough then you'll always float to the top. Lots of excellent players never went through an academy system.

Then again those players today are getting stupid money. Witness the lad they discussed on the radio today. He's at City I think and he just bought a house for 2.2 million and he's 20. He's never played for the first team.

[shurlock]

Happier days when Uncle Les wasn't so camera-shy.

[Singapore Saint]

It's a murky world that's for sure. I've heard stories that clubs want to keep one kid but will also keep another player or two on because they are his friend and he'll be happier. Great for the player who is wanted but seems cruel to give false expectations to other lads who believe they are in with a shot.

 

Reminds me of the time we had Imants "Pants" Bleidelis on our books to keep his mate Marian "Supermarian" Pahars happy!