Mauricio Pellegrino: In or Out?

[Cartman]

Leslie wouldn’t want anyone treading on his toes, either.

 

You mean Les would want the coach to focus on doing the job he was hired to do instead of wanting to do his boss' job?

[OttawaSaint]

Clueless **** still here? Damn!

[aintforever]

You would maybe give Pellegrino a bit of time if he had a half decent track record but his CV is just poor.

 

Sacked after 7 months at Valencia

Sacked after two years at some Argie club

1 season at another Argie club

1 season at Alavés

 

His only achievement was getting to a cup final at Alavés - that involved winning just 4 games, two against lower league opposition and one of the others on penalties. So he basically won one game against La Liga opposition.

 

I guess he has a good agent or is good in interviews or something because that CV would struggle to get a job managing a championship side.

[Badger]

The club won't sack him, they don't have the balls.

 

Championship football, here we come.

 

I expect that at some stage Gao will realise that his £200m is going down the toilet and act. Hope it's sooner rather than later.

[Suhari]

You would maybe give Pellegrino a bit of time if he had a half decent track record but his CV is just poor.

 

Sacked after 7 months at Valencia

Sacked after two years at some Argie club

1 season at another Argie club

1 season at Alavés

 

His only achievement was getting to a cup final at Alavés - that involved winning just 4 games, two against lower league opposition and one of the others on penalties. So he basically won one game against La Liga opposition.

 

I guess he has a good agent or is good in interviews or something because that CV would struggle to get a job managing a championship side.

 

And yet the Black Box and our extensive recruitment process decided he is the best possible manager for us.

 

Christ.

[Cartman]

You would maybe give Pellegrino a bit of time if he had a half decent track record but his CV is just poor.

 

Sacked after 7 months at Valencia

Sacked after two years at some Argie club

1 season at another Argie club

1 season at Alavés

 

His only achievement was getting to a cup final at Alavés - that involved winning just 4 games, two against lower league opposition and one of the others on penalties. So he basically won one game against La Liga opposition.

 

I guess he has a good agent or is good in interviews or something because that CV would struggle to get a job managing a championship side.

 

Or maybe you are just selective with the facts. No mention of the fact that Alavés were a newly promoted side and finished 9th on 55 points (and are now in the relegation zone having already sacked Pellegrino's replacement AND the replacement's replacement). Or that he got Valencia through their Champions League group beating eventual champions Bayern 4-1 along the way and that the fans weren't particularly happy about his sacking and wanted the president's head instead. And that he would have gone to Sevilla to replace Sampaoli if they hadn't been able to get Berizzo, which is strange for a guy who would apparently would struggle to get a job in the championship.

 

None of this is to say he is the right man for this particular job, but to write him off as some random unknown who wasn't qualified for it says more about this forum's general ignorance of what goes on in football outside this country than it does about Pellegrino, indeed I mentioned him as an option before he had even left Alavés and I wasn't even the first poster to do so. None of the coaches we have hired since sacking Adkins were unknown, only to those for whom football played beyond the channel is an entirely different sport. In fact, of the four coaches since Adkins the one with the weakest coaching cv was Koeman, and his hiring was the one received the most positive reaction entirely because of his playing career.

 

For what it's worth, I only see one viable candidate available, Vicenzo Montella. The rest are either not good enough, unavailable (even if we were to try and get someone in a job, they would probably want to finish the season first) or won't be interested.

[Sour Mash]

I expect that at some stage Gao will realise that his £200m is going down the toilet and act. Hope it's sooner rather than later.

 

We'll do worse than that, we're dull and ****.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Or maybe you are just selective with the facts. No mention of the fact that Alavés were a newly promoted side and finished 9th on 55 points (and are now in the relegation zone having already sacked Pellegrino's replacement AND the replacement's replacement). Or that he got Valencia through their Champions League group beating eventual champions Bayern 4-1 along the way and that the fans weren't particularly happy about his sacking and wanted the president's head instead. And that he would have gone to Sevilla to replace Sampaoli if they hadn't been able to get Berizzo, which is strange for a guy who would apparently would struggle to get a job in the championship.

 

None of this is to say he is the right man for this particular job, but to write him off as some random unknown who wasn't qualified for it says more about this forum's general ignorance of what goes on in football outside this country than it does about Pellegrino, indeed I mentioned him as an option before he had even left Alavés and I wasn't even the first poster to do so.

 

He also learnt his trade under Rafa. On paper he looked ok, it may not work out & he might not be the right fit, but to criticise his CV is just ignorant.

 

 

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[danjosaint]

So how did Black get his job with his CV

[Heisenberg]

So how did Black get his job with his CV

 

Leslie likes em submissive?

[OldNick]

I’m no fan of MP bit to blame him for a player’s weak tackles and poor control is just silly.

when Lemina first came he was a terrier and strong in the tackle and good with the ball. He looks a shadow of that, and sometimes that is down to the coach.I notice elsewhere Lemina is said to be complaining about his ankle not right and so that might be some of it

[LGTL]

We've beaten West Ham, Palace, West Brom and Everton. A team that lost their first 7 games without scoring a goal are only 1 point behind us. He should have gone weeks ago.

[beatlesaint]

We've beaten West Ham, Palace, West Brom and Everton. A team that lost their first 7 games without scoring a goal are only 1 point behind us. He should have gone weeks ago.

 

Agree, in a way that 4-1 against Everton was the worst thing that could have happened.

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

We've beaten West Ham, Palace, West Brom and Everton. A team that lost their first 7 games without scoring a goal are only 1 point behind us. He should have gone weeks ago.

 

Are you reading this, Les Reed? You useless ****ing ****!

[Lord Duckhunter]

So how did Black get his job with his CV

 

He was a friend/ colleague of Puel, who wanted an English speaker & someone who knew English football assisting him. Why he didn’t leave with Claude , I’ve no idea. According to the echo the club wanted him to stay on because he was popular with the players.

 

 

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[SaintRobbie]

I am not entirely convinced this is all Pellegrino’s fault.

 

The manager needs a season at least to work out what’s he has to work with.

 

We have an 11th-15th place squad of players. Our model over the past few years has been to sell anyone with any talent admittedly for high prices. But it has continually undermined the squad and has led to the exit of three potentially excellent managers.

 

So our model has produced a mediocre squad - a model that sooner or later was going to collapse as soon as we failed to replace great players with new talent. We got lucky during two summer transfer seasons of implosions.

Then, Les started to buy players like Redmond.

 

Bottom line for me is that our squad is poor. Our keeper needs replacing, our defence rebuilding (when our only decent quality player goes) our midfield needs someone who can score from range, and.... whilst I love Charlie Austin’s honesty and commitment we need clinical strikers.

 

So - for me the major problem is a result of a poor boardroom strategy that has undermined the quality of our team.

 

Our new owner needs to seriously invest or we will finally do a Swansea.

 

Probably time to sack Les Reid rather than Pellegrino. His strategy kept us in the PL but slides us out over time. New ambitious leadership needed.

 

Pellegrino is not the problem.

 

 

 

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[Katalinic]

I am not entirely convinced this is all Pellegrino’s fault.

 

The manager needs a season at least to work out what’s he has to work with.

 

We have an 11th-15th place squad of players. Our model over the past few years has been to sell anyone with any talent admittedly for high prices. But it has continually undermined the squad and has led to the exit of three potentially excellent managers.

 

So our model has produced a mediocre squad - a model that sooner or later was going to collapse as soon as we failed to replace great players with new talent. We got lucky during two summer transfer seasons of implosions.

Then, Les started to buy players like Redmond.

 

Bottom line for me is that our squad is poor. Our keeper needs replacing, our defence rebuilding (when our only decent quality player goes) our midfield needs someone who can score from range, and.... whilst I love Charlie Austin’s honesty and commitment we need clinical strikers.

 

So - for me the major problem is a result of a poor boardroom strategy that has undermined the quality of our team.

 

Our new owner needs to seriously invest or we will finally do a Swansea.

 

Probably time to sack Les Reid rather than Pellegrino. His strategy kept us in the PL but slides us out over time. New ambitious leadership needed.

 

Pellegrino is not the problem.

 

 

 

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You have massively changed your tune since your Puel Out campaign.

[CB Fry]

I am not entirely convinced this is all Pellegrino’s fault.

 

The manager needs a season at least to work out what’s he has to work with.

 

We have an 11th-15th place squad of players. Our model over the past few years has been to sell anyone with any talent admittedly for high prices. But it has continually undermined the squad and has led to the exit of three potentially excellent managers.

 

So our model has produced a mediocre squad - a model that sooner or later was going to collapse as soon as we failed to replace great players with new talent. We got lucky during two summer transfer seasons of implosions.

Then, Les started to buy players like Redmond.

 

Bottom line for me is that our squad is poor. Our keeper needs replacing, our defence rebuilding (when our only decent quality player goes) our midfield needs someone who can score from range, and.... whilst I love Charlie Austin’s honesty and commitment we need clinical strikers.

 

So - for me the major problem is a result of a poor boardroom strategy that has undermined the quality of our team.

 

Our new owner needs to seriously invest or we will finally do a Swansea.

 

Probably time to sack Les Reid rather than Pellegrino. His strategy kept us in the PL but slides us out over time. New ambitious leadership needed.

 

Pellegrino is not the problem.

 

 

 

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The idea that a new director of football would come in and not start looking to replace the first team manager within a very short timeframe is laughable.

 

It goes on like this Reed will sack Pellegrino.

 

If it goes on like this and Gao sacks Reed, his replacement will sack Pellegrino.

[Convict Colony]

Or maybe you are just selective with the facts. No mention of the fact that Alavés were a newly promoted side and finished 9th on 55 points (and are now in the relegation zone having already sacked Pellegrino's replacement AND the replacement's replacement). Or that he got Valencia through their Champions League group beating eventual champions Bayern 4-1 along the way and that the fans weren't particularly happy about his sacking and wanted the president's head instead. And that he would have gone to Sevilla to replace Sampaoli if they hadn't been able to get Berizzo, which is strange for a guy who would apparently would struggle to get a job in the championship.

 

None of this is to say he is the right man for this particular job, but to write him off as some random unknown who wasn't qualified for it says more about this forum's general ignorance of what goes on in football outside this country than it does about Pellegrino, indeed I mentioned him as an option before he had even left Alavés and I wasn't even the first poster to do so. None of the coaches we have hired since sacking Adkins were unknown, only to those for whom football played beyond the channel is an entirely different sport. In fact, of the four coaches since Adkins the one with the weakest coaching cv was Koeman, and his hiring was the one received the most positive reaction entirely because of his playing career.

 

For what it's worth, I only see one viable candidate available, Vicenzo Montella. The rest are either not good enough, unavailable (even if we were to try and get someone in a job, they would probably want to finish the season first) or won't be interested.

 

I'm with you.

 

"After becoming a coach just at the age of 37, Montella has showed regular increase in gradation of his management and understanding to the game. He is the kind of manager who could do wonders with a small budget team. Milan made an astute decision in signing him as we could see the great results he has produced so far. His work in developing the youth has been amazing and he certainly is one of the best managers in the league at the moment. Having won his first silverware just before the end of the calendar year, he is definitely on the verge on adding more to his trophy cabinet. Vincenzo Montella is one manager to watch out for in the future."

 

http://outsideoftheboot.com/2017/01/02/tactical-philosophy-vincenzo-montella/

[Suhari]

**** me, is he still here?

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

**** me, is he still here?

 

You beat me to it.

[kyle04]

 

We have an 11th-15th place squad of players. Our model over the past few years has been to sell anyone with any talent admittedly for high prices. But it has continually undermined the squad and has led to the exit of three potentially excellent managers.

 

So our model has produced a mediocre squad - a model that sooner or later was going to collapse as soon as we failed to replace great players with new talent. We got lucky during two summer transfer seasons of implosions.

 

Can't really argue with that, instead of a "middle 8" club we now look like a "bottom 6" one, but we've been here before. Generally we sell any good players that come our way sooner or later but that's football now. Managers coming and going every season or so dosen't help either. MP inherited most of the squad from last season and we are a worse team so he has to bear responsibility for that. He dosen't seem to know how he wants us to play. Pochettino had a clear vision of what he wanted from the team and worked towards that goal. We were playing as poorly under Koeman for a while but turned it around. SFC have two choices here, either get rid now and bank on the new manager syndrome, or stick with him and hope we scrape survival and look to improve next season.

[derry]

Does he know what he is doing or is he just shuffling the pack on a weekly basis? For me he hasn't a clue. We have hired a talker who has been found out.

[Dark Munster]

He was a friend/ colleague of Puel, who wanted an English speaker & someone who knew English football assisting him. Why he didn’t leave with Claude , I’ve no idea. According to the echo the club wanted him to stay on because he was popular with the players.

And Puel was sacked because he was unpopular with the players. I think the moral to be learned is that we need a quality manager who won't take shit from the players (RK certainly had that) and not be their best mates.

 

And get rid of Black.

[SaintTex]

to my eyes, it seemed Pellegrino's strategy in the 2nd half was to defend and protect our 1 goal deficit.

 

Success, I guess.

[aintforever]

Or maybe you are just selective with the facts. No mention of the fact that Alavés were a newly promoted side and finished 9th on 55 points (and are now in the relegation zone having already sacked Pellegrino's replacement AND the replacement's replacement). Or that he got Valencia through their Champions League group beating eventual champions Bayern 4-1 along the way and that the fans weren't particularly happy about his sacking and wanted the president's head instead. And that he would have gone to Sevilla to replace Sampaoli if they hadn't been able to get Berizzo, which is strange for a guy who would apparently would struggle to get a job in the championship.

 

None of this is to say he is the right man for this particular job, but to write him off as some random unknown who wasn't qualified for it says more about this forum's general ignorance of what goes on in football outside this country than it does about Pellegrino, indeed I mentioned him as an option before he had even left Alavés and I wasn't even the first poster to do so. None of the coaches we have hired since sacking Adkins were unknown, only to those for whom football played beyond the channel is an entirely different sport. In fact, of the four coaches since Adkins the one with the weakest coaching cv was Koeman, and his hiring was the one received the most positive reaction entirely because of his playing career.

 

For what it's worth, I only see one viable candidate available, Vicenzo Montella. The rest are either not good enough, unavailable (even if we were to try and get someone in a job, they would probably want to finish the season first) or won't be interested.

 

Still don’t think it’s a great CV. Yeah he got Alavés to 9th, but he left València 12th and no one gets sacked after 7 months if they are doing a great job. He’s got 5 years experience, sacked twice, won nothing, no promotions, no experience of managing in the Prem. If you don't think that’s a bit of a gamble then you have rocks in your head.

[VectisSaint]

Sacked after two years at some Argie club

1 season at another Argie club

"Some Argie club" and "another Argie club". You mean Estudiantes and Independiente, two of the biggest clubs in South America, let alone Argentina.

[John Boy Saint]

to my eyes, it seemed Pellegrino's strategy in the 2nd half was to defend and protect our 1 goal deficit.

 

Success, I guess.

Leaving Redmond on and taking off PEH certainly achieved that!

 

Its hard to get enthused, such a continuation of the latter part of last season, you see a little spark but it just fades so many times, you just want to see something else being tried.

I know you can't go gung-ho all the time there is just never any snappy play when the opportunity presents itself. We missed a big chance not getting a Gary Rowatt in the summer, he was as big a risk as taking MP in reality.

[Saint Albert]

All I remember about Pellegrino’s CV before the announcement is that it took some effort to get excited about it at the time. He was more of a left field appointment than Puel.

 

If the board fired Puel because of his negative style, I wonder what they are thinking now?

[aintforever]

"Some Argie club" and "another Argie club". You mean Estudiantes and Independiente, two of the biggest clubs in South America, let alone Argentina.

 

Yeah, because getting sacked by a big South American club in your second season is a sure sign that you will be a success in the Prem.

[Cartman]

Yeah, because getting sacked by a big South American club in your second season is a sure sign that you will be a success in the Prem.

 

From wikipedia:

 

On 7 November 2008, Simeone announced his resignation as coach of River Plate after their elimination in the quarter-finals of the 2008 Copa Sudamericana by Mexican side Chivas and a poor run of form of 11 domestic matches without a win, which left them bottom of the Primera División Argentina with only six matches remaining. On 15 April 2009, Simeone joined San Lorenzo to replace Miguel Ángel Russo following the club's exit in the first round of the 2009 Copa Libertadores. On 3 April 2010, Simeone resigned from San Lorenzo due to poor results and mounting criticism.

 

We can rule out Simeone then. Not good enough.

[CB Fry]

From wikipedia:

 

 

 

We can rule out Simeone then. Not good enough.

Pellegrino is as good as Diego Simeone now? Bold statement.

 

Just for context Simeone won the Europa League in his first season at Atletico. In his most recent La Liga season Pellegrino trundled to ninth place scoring barely any goals.

 

But you go girl, Pellegrino is the next Simeone.

[Whitey Grandad]

All I remember about Pellegrino’s CV before the announcement is that it took some effort to get excited about it at the time. He was more of a left field appointment than Puel.

 

If the board fired Puel because of his negative style, I wonder what they are thinking now?

 

I must admit that I had never heard of Pellegrino before his appointment but now that I have seen his record it does give cause for concern.

 

This from today's Times:

 

 

A look at Pellegrino’s previous record makes you wonder where Southampton saw those qualities in him. At Alavés, his previous club, they averaged 1.15 goals a game, and although the team finished ninth in La Liga, no side in the top 16 scored fewer. At Estudiantes, where he spent two years in Argentina, the club averaged 1.04 goals a game. In Pellegrino’s first managerial job, at Valencia, he lasted 14 league games, during which time the team netted 18 goals; in the remaining 24 games of that season, they racked up 49. All of which does not make Pellegrino an obvious choice for a club seeking a manager to take the handbrake off.

 

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/pressure-grows-on-southamptons-mauricio-pellegrino-in-pursuit-of-exciting-brand-zdmtsdt86 (paywall)

[brett24]

Get him out and get Brendan Rogers ASAP.

[SKD]

Pretty much the only reason Pellegrino got the job was because he was the only option left.

 

Les panicked when palace showed an interest in Pellegrino and wanted to get him before he was left with no other option than De Boer (who he ruled out the season before).

 

Tuchel was Les' no1 choice, he had talks, he turned us down. We spend all our time and effort getting him (thus, rightly or wrongly, letting Silva, who also had talks, go to Watford).

 

Don't buy the PR nonsense that we have a list of potential managers and that MP topped that (like Puel before him, who was behind Emery and probably a few other), he wasn't our first choice.

[SuperSAINT]

Pretty much the only reason Pellegrino got the job was because he was the only option left.

 

Les panicked when palace showed an interest in Pellegrino and wanted to get him before he was left with no other option than De Boer (who he ruled out the season before).

 

Tuchel was Les' no1 choice, he had talks, he turned us down. We spend all our time and effort getting him (thus, rightly or wrongly, letting Silva, who also had talks, go to Watford).

 

Don't buy the PR nonsense that we have a list of potential managers and that MP topped that (like Puel before him, who was behind Emery and probably a few other), he wasn't our first choice.

 

To be honest, I could pretty much believe this entirely.

[Cartman]

Or maybe you are just selective with the facts. No mention of the fact that Alavés were a newly promoted side and finished 9th on 55 points (and are now in the relegation zone having already sacked Pellegrino's replacement AND the replacement's replacement). Or that he got Valencia through their Champions League group beating eventual champions Bayern 4-1 along the way and that the fans weren't particularly happy about his sacking and wanted the president's head instead. And that he would have gone to Sevilla to replace Sampaoli if they hadn't been able to get Berizzo, which is strange for a guy who would apparently would struggle to get a job in the championship.

 

None of this is to say he is the right man for this particular job, but to write him off as some random unknown who wasn't qualified for it says more about this forum's general ignorance of what goes on in football outside this country than it does about Pellegrino, indeed I mentioned him as an option before he had even left Alavés and I wasn't even the first poster to do so. None of the coaches we have hired since sacking Adkins were unknown, only to those for whom football played beyond the channel is an entirely different sport. In fact, of the four coaches since Adkins the one with the weakest coaching cv was Koeman, and his hiring was the one received the most positive reaction entirely because of his playing career.

 

For what it's worth, I only see one viable candidate available, Vicenzo Montella. The rest are either not good enough, unavailable (even if we were to try and get someone in a job, they would probably want to finish the season first) or won't be interested.

 

Sacked by Sevilla. Montella has some company on my shortlist now.

[mrfahaji]

Get him out asap. Horrific again. Huddersfield really weren't very good (unlike at their place, when they actually played quite well and a point wasn't a bad result for us).

 

Yes you could point to Austin's miss and Yoshida's header, but that would have disguised an all round poor display with no cohesion whatsoever.

[qwertyell]

20 games (12 at home), 4 wins.

 

Are we going to wait for his win percentage to drop into the teens (Boxing Day) before something is done, or are single figures the cut off point?

 

It hasn't worked. There's been no signs that it will work. He should be out of work.

 

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[Matthew Le God]

Time for change, it really isn't working!

 

[supersonic]

As everyone's favourite cockney comedian says, he needs to be out out

[Bridge]

SACK HIM RIGHT NOW!!!! Way out of his depth...There's no sign we will improve under him...He plays the same way nearly all the time and its just not working...My god I thought we were boring to watch last season...This season we are boring and sh it!...Only trouble is I don't think there is a manager out there that can turn this damage around quick, it's so negative how we play and set up.

[for_heaven's_Saint]

Out out out out out out out out

[Pamplemousse]

I’m still of the opinion that the players have to take a lot of the responsibility but a new manager would help too.

[Dusic]

Has to be out. He has also been dealt a poor hand by Reed like Puel was, but something needs to change and he isn't the right person.

[James]

I’m still of the opinion that the players have to take a lot of the responsibility but a new manager would help too.

 

Totally agree. The attitude of some of our players has been shocking but our setup and team selections have been diabolical.

[The Flying Finn]

If we don't beat Palarse then he has to go.

[ally_uk]

Needs to go otherwise we are relegated it is that simple.....

[Saint Albert]

If we don't beat Palarse then he has to go.

 

Many were saying the same thing about the Huddersfield game. At some point Les and the board need to recognize that this is simply not working, and bring someone else in. He’s had enough chances to prove himself already.

[simo]

Still 11/1 somehow on MP next prem manager to leave post on unibet. it'll go down soon, 6/1 elsewhere.

 

Benitez and Hughes other candidates both won today.

 

I just chucked a few quid on us going down !