Mauricio Pellegrino: In or Out?

[Master Bates]

Apparently Nigel Adkins is staying at the Grand de Vere?

Can anyone working there check the books and confirm?

[Master Bates]

I didn't think he was.

[Bad Wolf]

Nigel Adkins was at St Mary's yesterday and stayed at the De Vere hotel by the docks. Not saying there's anything in it, he's a pretty frequent visitor but thought it was worth noting.

[Pamplemousse]

He was speaking at some sort of convention.

[Charlie Wayman]

Hopefully he will run the Academy. My word, we need a positive character around the building? Never will forget his "building" his "bus" and his "man in the mirror".

[tobes8]

The panel were pretty damming on soccer Saturday today. All stated that some of the squad do not appear to care and they gave up after 25 mins at Liverpool. Charlie Nicholas said that the club were going nowhere under current regime. Also lots of talk re our formation and le tiss said it was pretty obvious it wasn’t working. Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

[Suhari]

The panel were pretty damming on soccer Saturday today. All stated that some of the squad do not appear to care and they gave up after 25 mins at Liverpool. Charlie Nicholas said that the club were going nowhere under current regime. Also lots of talk re our formation and le tiss said it was pretty obvious it wasn’t working. Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

 

Didn't see it....but we do seem to be lacking direction. I wonder if Kat sold a dream, or if the investors are really committed to the football side of the club?

 

The 7th most expensive squad outside of the top 6 (so the 13th most expensive in the league)? OR The most expensive after the top 6?

[Evil Monkey]

The panel were pretty damming on soccer Saturday today. All stated that some of the squad do not appear to care and they gave up after 25 mins at Liverpool. Charlie Nicholas said that the club were going nowhere under current regime. Also lots of talk re our formation and le tiss said it was pretty obvious it wasn’t working. Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

 

7th out of 6 feels about our level ATM.

[Suhari]

Hopefully he will run the Academy. My word, we need a positive character around the building? Never will forget his "building" his "bus" and his "man in the mirror".

 

Would be brilliant I think. He' such a positive character....could be great for motivating and supporting the #Pathway. Not sure he'll be a top flight manager again, which is no insult by the way.

[stmusicdude]

Everyone will be made up. I've never understood this thinking that you can't change your mind, i doubt any Saints fan wants him to do badly, most want him to be good as it's means we are.

 

Sadly nowadays there's this really backwards belief that you can't change your mind on things and everything's black and white. It's f*cking bizarre if you ask me.

Your confusing changing your mind with being wrong

 

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[Lord Duckhunter]

Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

 

Pretty meaningless statistic unless there's context added. Is it net spend or gross spend? We've had to spend big money (for us) to replace the even bigger money we got in for our deserters. If we've spent £50 million, replacing £100 million worth of talent, it's a bit disingenuous to say £50 million has been spent on the squad, they should be doing better. Wages also need to be taken into account, because they are the biggest barometer of where you should be sitting in league.

 

I'm not saying we shouldn't be doing better, but just throwing around transfer fees is lazy punditry imo

 

 

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[rooney]

The panel were pretty damming on soccer Saturday today. All stated that some of the squad do not appear to care and they gave up after 25 mins at Liverpool. Charlie Nicholas said that the club were going nowhere under current regime. Also lots of talk re our formation and le tiss said it was pretty obvious it wasn’t working. Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

 

They also said that some players may be browned off that vvd comes in at the expense of others.

[Fan The Flames]

Pretty meaningless statistic unless there's context added. Is it net spend or gross spend? We've had to spend big money (for us) to replace the even bigger money we got in for our deserters. If we've spent £50 million, replacing £100 million worth of talent, it's a bit disingenuous to say £50 million has been spent on the squad, they should be doing better. Wages also need to be taken into account, because they are the biggest barometer of where you should be sitting in league.

 

I'm not saying we shouldn't be doing better, but just throwing around transfer fees is lazy punditry imo

 

 

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Net spend is irrelevant when talking about the value of a squad, how much we've got in for ex players has no bearing on the current value of the current squad. I appreciate that valuing a squad by its transfer fees would inflate a team like ours that has a lot of recently purchased players, you could use current value as a measure but that is a bit subjective.

 

Maybe I'm missing something obvious.

[Dangermouth]

Your confusing changing your mind with being wrong

 

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Ah the good old 'you're' 'your' conundrum. How to defeat your own argument without any effort expended.

[Dangermouth]

Pretty meaningless statistic unless there's context added. Is it net spend or gross spend? We've had to spend big money (for us) to replace the even bigger money we got in for our deserters. If we've spent £50 million, replacing £100 million worth of talent, it's a bit disingenuous to say £50 million has been spent on the squad, they should be doing better. Wages also need to be taken into account, because they are the biggest barometer of where you should be sitting in league.

 

I'm not saying we shouldn't be doing better, but just throwing around transfer fees is lazy punditry imo

 

 

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Your measurement is wrong if you look at gross/net spend. It isn't anything to do with the amount spent as you say but it is more to do with what is spent relative to others as that's the only thing the argument states. It doesn't even mean the players are good, etc. The Neymar transfer obviously shows the context for this but likewise things like the Sanchez loan deal at Swansea (had he turned out well) wouldn't also show in the figures (as you rightly state: context is required as is more consideration) but what it does show is that we've spent more money than many (the source of the funds is immaterial) and that this *should* (a qualified should and partly, I suspect, based on the argument that more expensive players command higher wages and higher wages paid does apparently correlate with higher league position) mean that we *should* do better than we are. That assumes we've spent the money well, which is another argument of course.

[stmusicdude]

Ah the good old 'you're' 'your' conundrum. How to defeat your own argument without any effort expended.

Did you actually have a point to make or was the childish reply simply "because you can"

 

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[Wade Garrett]

The panel were pretty damming on soccer Saturday today. All stated that some of the squad do not appear to care and they gave up after 25 mins at Liverpool. Charlie Nicholas said that the club were going nowhere under current regime. Also lots of talk re our formation and le tiss said it was pretty obvious it wasn’t working. Apparently the 7th most expensive squad out of the top six big teams to. That’s worrying.

 

Saw that as well. He was pretty scathing.

 

They were horrified at the fact we've had a paltry 4 shots on target in 3 games, or was it 3 in 4?

[Pamplemousse]

Interestingly, Bosz, the Dortmund manager, will probably be sacked soon. They were 4-0 up against rivals Schalke and it ended up 4-4!!

 

At least we'd have entertaining games if he came here, that's for sure.

[derry]

No one disagrees with that and no one wants us to spend vast amounts we can't afford. Most just want us to return to what we were doing a few seasons ago- scouting and buying some hidden gems with decent potential, employing an exciting manager who sets us up to play attractive attacking football and investing the money that we do have in the correct areas. I think most people would be happy to finish mid table the majority of the time with the occasional foray into a European place.

 

This is probably the best post you've ever made. Absolutely nail on the head. Players that want to play, no more underperforming foreign managers, we see loads of good players on tv in the EFL every week, loads of great goals. It's how we got into the Premier. How Leicester won the PL, get in pace, power and stop bringing in foreign big ********es on loads a money that are already lining up their next move and buy hungry players that are grateful and want to be here. I've had it with the present team and set up.

[Suhari]

Interestingly, Bosz, the Dortmund manager, will probably be sacked soon. They were 4-0 up against rivals Schalke and it ended up 4-4!!

 

At least we'd have entertaining games if he came here, that's for sure.

 

If we scored 4 goals in a single game I would probably need a valium and a lay down.

 

I do so miss the days when 3-1 was the default Saints scoreline.

[InvictaSaint]

This is probably the best post you've ever made. Absolutely nail on the head. Players that want to play, no more underperforming foreign managers, we see loads of good players on tv in the EFL every week, loads of great goals. It's how we got into the Premier. How Leicester won the PL, get in pace, power and stop bringing in foreign big ********es on loads a money that are already lining up their next move and buy hungry players that are grateful and want to be here. I've had it with the present team and set up.

 

1000% this (and yes, I know it's not mathematically possible [emoji15][emoji106])

[Lets B Avenue]

This is probably the best post you've ever made. Absolutely nail on the head. Players that want to play, no more underperforming foreign managers, we see loads of good players on tv in the EFL every week, loads of great goals. It's how we got into the Premier. How Leicester won the PL, get in pace, power and stop bringing in foreign big ********es on loads a money that are already lining up their next move and buy hungry players that are grateful and want to be here. I've had it with the present team and set up.

 

Yeah! Players like Lallana, Lambert, Clyne, Shaw and Chambers.

 

**** Johnnie Foreigner!!

[doddisalegend]

Saw that as well. He was pretty scathing.

 

They were horrified at the fact we've had a paltry 4 shots on target in 3 games, or was it 3 in 4?

 

yeah getting shots "on target" is something our players struggle with its not that they don't have shots its just the corner flag is and easier target than the big goal thing.....

[spyinthesky]

I can understand the negative feelings with regard to Pellegrino

 

My default position is to keep faith with the Manager PROVIDED he has the support of the players and the Board.

 

I have no idea how Pellegrino stands in this respect.

 

My view is somewhat coloured by the decision to keep McMenemy in post after he presided over us being relegated in his first season in charge

 

However as a balance to this, getting rid of Branfoot was entirely the right decision and if younger supporters think things are bad now, the Branfoot days at the Dell were a particularly bad period in our history.

[Dellman]

My memory of the Branfoot nightmare is that the Board (Askham) were supporting hin right through, it was the supporters campaign which turned it round and led tohis departure and Alan Ball's return

[Fitzhugh Fella]

My memory of the Branfoot nightmare is that the Board (Askham) were supporting hin right through, it was the supporters campaign which turned it round and led tohis departure and Alan Ball's return

 

I also think McMenemy being invited onto the Board was the crucial factor into Branfoot then getting the bullet. One of Lawrie's skills was understanding where the fans were coming from and he knew Branfoot's time was up. Plus of course he was not part of the Board when Branfoot was originally appointed - that made the axe easier to swing. Now with Reed, he knows sacking MP makes him look bad and that's where our problem lies.

[Wade Garrett]

I also think McMenemy being invited onto the Board was the crucial factor into Branfoot then getting the bullet. One of Lawrie's skills was understanding where the fans were coming from and he knew Branfoot's time was up. Plus of course he was not part of the Board when Branfoot was originally appointed - that made the axe easier to swing. Now with Reed, he knows sacking MP makes him look bad and that's where our problem lies.

 

Sticking by him makes him look worse though.

 

For me, he's got enough credit in the bank to move forward from sacking his manager.

[SuperSAINT]

I also think McMenemy being invited onto the Board was the crucial factor into Branfoot then getting the bullet. One of Lawrie's skills was understanding where the fans were coming from and he knew Branfoot's time was up. Plus of course he was not part of the Board when Branfoot was originally appointed - that made the axe easier to swing. Now with Reed, he knows sacking MP makes him look bad and that's where our problem lies.

 

Sticking by him makes him look worse though.

 

For me, he's got enough credit in the bank to move forward from sacking his manager.

 

Agreed. Steve Parish took some stick for ditching FdB, but at least they decided it wasn't right & made the change ASAP.

Edited 25 November, 2017 by SuperSAINT

[Dellman]

I knnow it's not quite on topic but did Branfoot ever get another job anywhere?

[ashnats]

I knnow it's not quite on topic but did Branfoot ever get another job anywhere?

 

https://www.fulhamfc.com/history/managers/ian-branfoot

[VectisSaint]

I knnow it's not quite on topic but did Branfoot ever get another job anywhere?

Managed Fulham from 1994-1996.

[CB Fry]

If we had kept Branfoot in for a couple more years he would have turned into the next Alex Ferguson or Lawrie McMenemy.

[stknowle]

If we had kept Branfoot in for a couple more years he would have turned into the next Alex Ferguson or Lawrie McMenemy.

 

Possibly Fry.

[ashnats]

 

it's often the case that managers are sacked after a bad run of results, the question is, how would those clubs have done if they kept faith with the manager? is there a table showing crisis points where the manager wasn't sacked, and how they did? Fergie being one famous example.

 

Koeman might be another example - he was sacked after bad results against a lot of the big teams. it's to be expected that their results will improve now, and it won't really be because they sacked koeman.

 

we are an exception perhaps, we had an easy run, and if we sack MP now, we wouldn't expect an upturn, with the fixtures we have coming up. maybe we should let MP waste the Christmas break, then give the new manager an easier run in. the fans aren't patient at the moment, we need the new guy to start strong.

[hypochondriac]

it's often the case that managers are sacked after a bad run of results, the question is, how would those clubs have done if they kept faith with the manager? is there a table showing crisis points where the manager wasn't sacked, and how they did? Fergie being one famous example.

 

Koeman might be another example - he was sacked after bad results against a lot of the big teams. it's to be expected that their results will improve now, and it won't really be because they sacked koeman.

 

we are an exception perhaps, we had an easy run, and if we sack MP now, we wouldn't expect an upturn, with the fixtures we have coming up. maybe we should let MP waste the Christmas break, then give the new manager an easier run in. the fans aren't patient at the moment, we need the new guy to start strong.

Thats a really defeatist attitude and really if we are going to sack him anyway, we might as well give the new man as much time as possible.

[SaveloyMush]

Blueprint for Saints' board here:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42095164

[doddisalegend]

Blueprint for Saints' board here:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42095164

 

this always helps

 

Zaza, a West Ham reject, is the league's second top goalscorer after Lionel Messi.

 

Any team are going to do well if they can get a striker in form. Considering how **** Zaza was for West Ham that's a pretty amazing turn around. I wonder if we well ever see a 20 goals a season striker, in the premier league, in a saints shirt again? who was the last one to do that Beattie?

[SaveloyMush]

this always helps

 

Zaza, a West Ham reject, is the league's second top goalscorer after Lionel Messi.

 

Any team are going to do well if they can get a striker in form. Considering how **** Zaza was for West Ham that's a pretty amazing turn around. I wonder if we well ever see a 20 goals a season striker, in the premier league, in a saints shirt again? who was the last one to do that Beattie?

 

It would appear that West Ham under Bilic (good bloke though he appears to be) were woefully lacking in both fitness and motivation - sound familiar? What odds on Gabbiadini doing a Zaza under the right regime?

[sadoldgit]

Agreed. Steve Parish took some stick for ditching FdB, but at least they decided it wasn't right & made the change ASAP.

 

Not made a huge difference yet though has it?

[Suhari]

Not made a huge difference yet though has it?

 

They're playing better football, look far more committed and have some very winnable games coming up: Brighton, Bournemouth, Leicester, Watford, Swansea. I think they'll be okay.

[doddisalegend]

They're playing better football, look far more committed and have some very winnable games coming up: Brighton, Bournemouth, Leicester, Watford, Swansea. I think they'll be okay.

 

 

That could just be the return of some of their better players from injury.

[SaintMB]

Before kick off I’m still sure he has to go. Regardless of the result, he has to go.

[St Chalet]

First half proves that we have a decent team, it also proves the managers negativity and constant picking of Forster means he has to go.

[HKsaint]

MoPe finally finds Austin not insisting goalless Long and headless Redmond. Well done, though not waiting. Hope it is not too late.

[simo]

As long as he keeps the same front 4 that win gives him until Jan at least imo !

[shurlock]

As long as he keeps the same front 4 that win gives him until Jan at least imo !

 

As long as we can play Everton every week.

[HKsaint]

MoPe starting with a few 2nd team players like JWP, Austin, PHE was to let Long, Redmond and Gabby to play Manchester City on this Wednesday. This result surprised him and disturb his plan.

[Suhari]

Before kick off I’m still sure he has to go. Regardless of the result, he has to go.

 

My reaction too. I'm really pleased with the performance, and it shows that our players can do better.

 

Don't like that it has taken this long, or that it takes a game against such poor opposition for us to look like a team. So I remain in the MoPe out (and asap) camp.

 

.....and I HOPE I'm proven wrong: that he kicks on from here to become a very successful manager for us.

[badgerx16]

Remember, we sacked Pardew after a 4-0 win.

[Pamplemousse]

Bournemouth away will be the big test. Play like we did today, with pace and attacking them directly, and we'll win.

 

Man City result is irrelevant, as long as we play better than we did against Liverpool, a couple of shots on target would be nice.