Cortese

[bubblyone]

Nicola Cortese will be on with Jim White, Talksport

at 10am tomorrow.

[ALWAYS_SFC]

Nicola Cortese will be on with Jim White, Talksport

at 10am tomorrow.

 

[JRM]

 

Great at spending other people's money, you realise he didn't invest a penny of his own, in fact quite the opposite. Interesting he's not been employed by any other clubs since he left.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

[DuncanRG]

 

Great at spending other people's money, you realise he didn't invest a penny of his own, in fact quite the opposite. Interesting he's not been employed by any other clubs since he left.

 

It's 'quite the opposite' in the fact that he took a salary, I suppose. He didn't own the club.

 

Always interesting but not always welcome to see him pop up. Wonder what he's got on his mind this time.

[Saint86]

It's 'quite the opposite' in the fact that he took a salary, I suppose. He didn't own the club.

 

Always interesting but not always welcome to see him pop up. Wonder what he's got on his mind this time.

 

Would you seriously begrudge that man for his efforts. Wowsa. And people go on about the Cult of Cortese on here...

[DuncanRG]

I think you've misunderstood. I'm a big admirer of Cortese.

[Saint86]

I think you've misunderstood. I'm a big admirer of Cortese.

 

Ah sorry Duncan, I did, i thought you were implying he did a bad job and got paid for it

[Heisenberg]

I presume he went back to banking? Get the feeling the flurry into football was more a favor for his good friend Markus rather than a desired future permanent career move.

 

Still with zero experience and a total disrespect for the football hierarchy he did a bloody good job. -10 league one to top 10 premier league. its an easy job :) Waltzes in - smashes it, drops mic and leaves. Kudos

 

Some people have been in the game 50+ years and achieved less than Nic. I can imagine that riles some people up

[Lord Duckhunter]

Could be interesting if somebody asked him some tough questions. But White is incapable of doing so, it'll be one big love in.

 

 

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[Heisenberg]

Could be interesting if somebody asked him some tough questions. But White is incapable of doing so, it'll be one big love in.

 

 

what tough questions would you ask?

[SKD]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

 

It depends on what you would consider 'run properly' to be.

 

He was very good at getting results, selling a dream and not being afraid to make key decisions. However, we were spending other peoples money, getting into debt which it would have come a time where it would have been unsustainable and he ****ed off a number of ex and current staff.

 

If you consider running properly as win at all costs and don't worry about being sustainable, then yeah, you're bang on.

 

FWIW, I liked the bloke at the club. I thought he done a great job and you cannot argue with his results. Although it has to be said he was becoming out of control.

[Heisenberg]

Wasn't our debt relatively small comparatively? Wasn't it also essential given we were new to the premier league and wanted to be competitive.?

 

Doesn't every club have debt and aren't most chairman spending someone elses money???

[alpine_saint]

Wonder where we would be if he hadnt left.

 

I find the comment about "spending other peoples money" f**king ridiculous. What are Reed and Krueger doing ???

 

They've wasted more money on Boufal than NC did on The Gash.

Edited 11 September, 2017 by alpine_saint

[shurlock]

Wasn't our debt relatively small comparatively? Wasn't it also essential given we were new to the premier league and wanted to be competitive.?

 

Doesn't every club have debt and aren't most chairman spending someone elses money???

 

We also built Staplewood which we obviously didn't need. We further spunked loads of cash on extravagant designs for private elevators, rescue parties for missing spoons and cleaning bills to remove faeces from the Benali family's swimming pool.

Edited 11 September, 2017 by shurlock

[once_bitterne]

Obviously we didn't need a top-rate training ground. I mean what football club would?

[SW5 SAINT]

Wonder where we would be if he hadnt left.

 

I find the comment about "spending other peoples money" f**king ridiculous. What are Reed and Krueger doing ???

 

They've wasted more money on Boufal than NC did on The Gash.

 

This, he was an employee of the club. In other words he was paid to spend ( invest ) the owner's money. Never understood all the bile he got for the brilliant way he did his job.

[John B]

This, he was an employee of the club. In other words he was paid to spend ( invest ) the owner's money. Never understood all the bile he got for the brilliant way he did his job.

 

Well he cant have being it right otherwise he would not have been sacked

[saintadjg]

I ****ing loved him. We'd have made champions league if he'd stayed imo.He was a winner a bastard but he was ours.I bet there was a collective sigh of relief from other chairmen when he left. God can't believe I'm agreeing on something with Glasgow

[Turkish]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

 

Are you sure?

 

https://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?50102-A-meeting-with-Ralph-Krueger#.WbbDFH-9KSM

https://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?51479-Katharina-Liebherr#.WbbDQ3-9KSM

https://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?48621-CORTESE-a-personal-and-factual-view-of-why-Ms-Liebherr-was-right#.WbbDWH-9KSM

https://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?49105-The-club-is-no-longer-run-FOR-the-fans#.WbbDcH-9KSM

[St Marco]

 

Great at spending other people's money, you realise he didn't invest a penny of his own, in fact quite the opposite. Interesting he's not been employed by any other clubs since he left.

 

So who spends their own money then?

And if we are talking money the owner who he brought in just sold it for a huge profit. Based on the foundations he put in place. And didn't we take out loans years after he left? I guess that was his fault too right?

 

I do find it funny how some people want to re-write history and base their opinions on rumours. He did many things wrong but we wouldn't be where we are if it was not for him and that's a fact.

[St Marco]

Well he cant have being it right otherwise he would not have been sacked

 

Not true. Another myth. He was actually asked to stay on if you read KL statement. He declined.

[Toomer]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

 

This

[70's Mike]

This

 

Agree we are just a flashy advertising campaign these days, that has lost site of the fact that in football without a strong first team everything else is "sand".

[Matthew Le God]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

 

We finished higher in the Premier League without Cortese (6th & 7th)... than we did with him.

[Saint Benali]

We finished higher in the Premier League without Cortese (6th & 7th)... than we did with him.

 

Yeah because we were always going to finish that high in our first couple of seasons right? On the flip side who knows where we would of finished. But a certain manager wouldn't have left. Wonder what he is up to these days.

[aintforever]

We finished higher in the Premier League without Cortese (6th & 7th)... than we did with him.

 

Yes, and I remember him talking ******** in the press - sticking the boot in because we sold some players - the summer before we finished higher than he ever did.

 

Poisonous little dwarf.

[Morse]

If ML had stuck with Andrew Oldknow as CEO we would have had just as good a run to the Premiership but probably a better commercial revenue.

Clotese was fantastic in his personal PR, every new player had to mention him as a reason to come to Saints is a good example, but to suggest he was in anyway responsible for our success on pitch is laughable. If he had a genuine 'midas' touch why haven't Liverpool hired him, or any football club for that matter?

[Heisenberg]

Yes, and I remember him talking ******** in the press - sticking the boot in because we sold some players - the summer before we finished higher than he ever did.

 

Poisonous little dwarf.

 

Wasn't 95% of the squad from Nicolas era?

 

But i agree we did it completely without Nics help

[Disco Stu]

Perhaps the couple of years after he left us was an afterglow and what the current board have been doing is starting to show?

[Heisenberg]

Perhaps the couple of years after he left us was an afterglow and what the current board have been doing is starting to show?

 

Classic momentum curve.

[aintforever]

Perhaps the couple of years after he left us was an afterglow and what the current board have been doing is starting to show?

 

Yeah, and absolutely nothing to do with our billionaire owner dying and his daughter trying to flog the club.

[John B]

Dislike the guy intensely but I have more confidence that the club was being run properly then.

 

Me too but it was pretty easy to get to the PL with the support we had and the money provided by ML.

 

We just acted like Man City and Chelsea bought the best players in lower divisions people like Lambert Barnard Fonte Puncheon Dickson Richardson Hammond Harding etc no doubt were well paid and wanted to play for a PL team like Southampton

[Disco Stu]

Yeah, and absolutely nothing to do with our billionaire owner dying and his daughter trying to flog the club.

 

Well I mean that's a big reason why he left so it has everything to do with that.

[angelman]

Wonder where we would be if he hadnt left.

 

I find the comment about "spending other peoples money" f**king ridiculous. What are Reed and Krueger doing ???

 

They've wasted more money on Boufal than NC did on The Gash.

 

You seem to have a rather unique view on what actually happened. When the person whose money he was spending wanted to have their own person on the board to keep an eye on how the money was being spent, NC threw a paddy and resigned. Who knows, maybe the new owners want their own man on the board, and NC could be that man.

[Dangermouth]

You seem to have a rather unique view on what actually happened. When the person whose money he was spending wanted to have their own person on the board to keep an eye on how the money was being spent, NC threw a paddy and resigned. Who knows, maybe the new owners want their own man on the board, and NC could be that man.

 

:thumbup:

[Lord Duckhunter]

I ****ing loved him. We'd have made champions league if he'd stayed imo.He was a winner a bastard but he was ours.I bet there was a collective sigh of relief from other chairmen when he left. God can't believe I'm agreeing on something with Glasgow

 

That must be why he's in so much demand by other clubs,

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Badger]

You seem to have a rather unique view on what actually happened. When the person whose money he was spending wanted to have their own person on the board to keep an eye on how the money was being spent, NC threw a paddy and resigned. Who knows, maybe the new owners want their own man on the board, and NC could be that man.

 

I have wondered the same, but if Cortese wasn't happy working under KL, I'd be surprised if he readily accepts a role with the current owners. He'd be under greater scrutiny under the Gao's than with the Liebherrs.

[John Boy Saint]

If ML had stuck with Andrew Oldknow as CEO we would have had just as good a run to the Premiership but probably a better commercial revenue.

Clotese was fantastic in his personal PR, every new player had to mention him as a reason to come to Saints is a good example, but to suggest he was in anyway responsible for our success on pitch is laughable. If he had a genuine 'midas' touch why haven't Liverpool hired him, or any football club for that matter?

Oldknow was known around St Marys as Oh-know his way was the only way.......... which is probably why Nik-Nak saw him off: 2 Ko

 

You also wonder if Cortese's presence around the club was too much of a reminder of her father. Also Cortese was also a senior director of Mali - Markus's source of wealth, pretty certain that he had an even bigger hand in stuff there when Markus was gone. I swear I read something somewhere that the atmosphere in Mali wasn't too pleasant when he was strutting about (bit like stories that seeped out of SMS). Maybe he also started getting too big for his Cuban Heels where Ms Liebherr was concerned.

[rooney]

I do not think MLT or Franny liked him either.

[alpine_saint]

So, lets get things straight here...

 

Markus Liebherr bought SFC. Not Katharina. He put Cortese in place, and they had a shared vision to bring greatness to this club.

 

We all know what tragically happened to Markus. His daughter took over, and in tribute to her Dad, and because Germans tend to be more committed and willing to stick at things, she stuck to the plan, after a fashion.

 

The goal to return to the PL was delivered. But that was a tick-in-the-box for her, in my opinion; at that point I think she felt that she had followed her Dad's dream enough, and not having a particular affintiy with football or Southampton, she planned her exit and decided that she wasnt going to support the longer-term vision, which NC was pursuing still.

 

That's fine, but I am sick of reading NC being portrayed as a monster. He was brilliant for this club, only now its lost all the momentum he provided.

 

I read once he put a faxed bid for a player from LIVERPOOL in the bin without reading it, considering it a disgrace they hadnt approached the club properly. Do you lot really think we would be stuck clueless with Carlos Kickaballs as manager and would have sold off all our decent players following assorted degrees of tapping-up if he were still here ??

 

Reed and Krueger have read their own damned press and hype far too much over the "Southampton Way", "black box" and "academy" b*ll*cks; the club is, as shown last night, starting to fail at EVERY level.

Edited 12 September, 2017 by alpine_saint

[Turkish]

Not true. Another myth. He was actually asked to stay on if you read KL statement. He declined.

 

Yep, asked to stay on if he agreed to toe the line, which he didn't so he was fired, you believe what you want to believe pal, but ask yourself this, is Katrina was so happy with the work he was doing why did she want a change of policy and greater governance over what he was up to? He was supposedly doing a brilliant job after all, why change it?

 

Here's why, he was out of control His ego was running away with him. He was spending money hand over fist, having to take out high interest loans, got bailed out once by Katrina before. He got us a £20m training ground for £40m, mainly due to his knobbish behaviour, wanting a personal lift, getting the builders to deck the toilets out in expensive tiles before demanding they take them all of and do it again as he didn't like them. Refusing to pay them so they had to down tools until he did. He is the only chairman in the history of premier league football to see commercial income go down on back to back promotion, this was his job don't forget, to make the club money. You're never going to do that when you p*ss off pretty much every local business that would spend money with you, including getting himself banned from a top City Centre restaurant for yet more knobbish behaviour

 

Cortese was brilliant at PR for himself, a few well placed journalists happy to suck up to him, the players and managers being made to mention how great he was every time they spoke publically and of course his little stunt of the front cover of the programme. And you saps lapped it all up and sang his name, turning your back on one of the clubs greatest every players because some midget dictator told you what you wanted to hear. It's absolutely laughable people claiming we'd have been in the champions league if he was still here, the reality is we'd be more likely to be in administration again. Still I'm sure people like Fitzhugh Fella who despised him when he was here and all the other saps who lapped up his bulls*it will continue to believe we were so much better run then than now.

[alpine_saint]

Yep, asked to stay on if he agreed to toe the line, which he didn't so he was fired, you believe what you want to believe pal, but ask yourself this, is Katrina was so happy with the work he was doing why did she want a change of policy and greater governance over what he was up to? He was supposedly doing a brilliant job after all, why change it?

 

Here's why, he was out of control His ego was running away with him. He was spending money hand over fist, having to take out high interest loans, got bailed out once by Katrina before. He got us a £20m training ground for £40m, mainly due to his knobbish behaviour, wanting a personal lift, getting the builders to deck the toilets out in expensive tiles before demanding they take them all of and do it again as he didn't like them. Refusing to pay them so they had to down tools until he did. He is the only chairman in the history of premier league football to see commercial income go down on back to back promotion, this was his job don't forget, to make the club money. You're never going to do that when you p*ss off pretty much every local business that would spend money with you, including getting himself banned from a top City Centre restaurant for yet more knobbish behaviour

 

Cortese was brilliant at PR for himself, a few well placed journalists happy to suck up to him, the players and managers being made to mention how great he was every time they spoke publically and of course his little stunt of the front cover of the programme. And you saps lapped it all up and sang his name, turning your back on one of the clubs greatest every players because some midget dictator told you what you wanted to hear. It's absolutely laughable people claiming we'd have been in the champions league if he was still here, the reality is we'd be more likely to be in administration again. Still I'm sure people like Fitzhugh Fella who despised him when he was here and all the other saps who lapped up his bulls*it will continue to believe we were so much better run then than now.

 

Hillarious.

 

Fans put up with behaviour like this from their player idols every day of the week.

 

I bet you dont hear many Everton fans slagging Rooney off at the moment. Drink-driving prosecutions of our players on here are met with nudge-nudge, wink-wink, "whos a naughty boy" type comments. I doubt you would be laughing if they mowed down your wife and toddler crossing a zebra while DUI.

 

He delivered an on-pitch performance. Period. Make your mind up whats important, that or the morality.

[Saint Benali]

So Turkish should we believe what KL actually said or your rumours?

[Turkish]

So Turkish should we believe what KL actually said or your rumours?

 

Believe what you want I don't give a sh*t. What I will say is they aren't rumours and there are plenty more incidents that our tiny Italian was involved in as well.

 

As I said ask yourself this, if Katrina was happy with him why did she want a greater view of what he was doing? Why was Cortese only giving her a top line financial figure and not full access the finances which she had to get rid of him to get? Why did he take out a high interest offshore loan with Vibrac despite brashly claiming a couple of years early that the club didn't do debt, that in good times he would put money anyway for bad? Why did the training ground cost twice as much as budget and delivered 18 months later than planned? Why were there multiple court cases involving the club and everyone one of them settled at the last minute out of court? Why, despite successive promotions did the corporate boxes stay empty, why was a midsize premier league clubs commercial income smaller than a midsized championship club despite playing in the richest league in the world. How despite playing in this league was the best shirt sponsorship deal he could deliver being with the largest recruitment company in Chillworth Business Park? Not rumours, all FACT, same theme here, spending money, not making it.

 

As for delivering on the pitch, I've always said he did a good job in the lower leagues but his ego ran away with him when we got in sniffing distance of the premier league and it all started to go downhill. However do you really think an Italian banker was responsible for signing Fonte, Lambert, Hammond etc all players key to our rise through the league? He appointed a decent manager when he first arrived who built the team, do you think he knew who Pardew was when he was sitting behind his desk at his Swiss bank?

 

Believe what you want and continue to think we'd be so much better off if he was still here, we wouldn't not rumour. FACT.

[Noodles34]

Yep, asked to stay on if he agreed to toe the line, which he didn't so he was fired, you believe what you want to believe pal, but ask yourself this, is Katrina was so happy with the work he was doing why did she want a change of policy and greater governance over what he was up to? He was supposedly doing a brilliant job after all, why change it?

 

Here's why, he was out of control His ego was running away with him. He was spending money hand over fist, having to take out high interest loans, got bailed out once by Katrina before. He got us a £20m training ground for £40m, mainly due to his knobbish behaviour, wanting a personal lift, getting the builders to deck the toilets out in expensive tiles before demanding they take them all of and do it again as he didn't like them. Refusing to pay them so they had to down tools until he did. He is the only chairman in the history of premier league football to see commercial income go down on back to back promotion, this was his job don't forget, to make the club money. You're never going to do that when you p*ss off pretty much every local business that would spend money with you, including getting himself banned from a top City Centre restaurant for yet more knobbish behaviour

 

Cortese was brilliant at PR for himself, a few well placed journalists happy to suck up to him, the players and managers being made to mention how great he was every time they spoke publically and of course his little stunt of the front cover of the programme. And you saps lapped it all up and sang his name, turning your back on one of the clubs greatest every players because some midget dictator told you what you wanted to hear. It's absolutely laughable people claiming we'd have been in the champions league if he was still here, the reality is we'd be more likely to be in administration again. Still I'm sure people like Fitzhugh Fella who despised him when he was here and all the other saps who lapped up his bulls*it will continue to believe we were so much better run then than now.

 

A lot of what you say is probably (I guess you, like me do not know for sure either way) is true and makes sense, but some of it is based on your personal bias.

A brilliant job, yes, to a point. The fact we went straight back to the PL without a blip (once we were on a level playing field) and then took the decision to sack a much loved and respected manager (who knew his time was up at the Coventry game anyway) and bought in someone most people had never even heard of, well that was genius and look where Poch is now, one of the few to leave and still get better. You wonder if he would have stayed if NC had, a strong possibility as well as some (not all) of the players. What you cannot take away from the man was his tenacity and passion for winning and competing with the big boys, we haven't seen that since the 80's.

You have highlighted some of the bad stuff, his egotistical nature that clearly cost the club money however most building jobs go over budget, I am not party to the actual figures but I would say your figures are guess work at the very least. It is not going to cost £20m to replace some tiles and build a lift.

KL did not want him because he was a loose cannon and he did not hesitate in spending money to get us somewhere, a feat that he achieved in the lower leagues, as someone alluded too previously, we were the Chelsea/City of DIV 1, no one could compete with us, lets not kids ourselves that Adkins didnt have the best players to take us up with.

But to suggest we were going to administration under him is just fanciful, we have enough behind us to stop that from happening and I really do not think overspending on a training ground and not having a shirt sponsor for a year would have sent us under.

I am not sure who you are referring to in respect of us (the fans?) 'turning our backs top one of the greatest ever players...', see that is where you stop being objective and just spin a some bull to suit your own agenda. I think most fans were disappointed with NC's treatment of MLT etc. but did not turn theri back on them, where is your evidence for that?

I liked Cortese for the fact that he told Arsenal what he wanted and gave them half an hour to decide, he did not put up with something he did not like, he didnt give a ****.

Clearly, there are genuine people he ****ed off and in a lot of instances he was totally out of order, so you have to weigh up which is more important, what we have now and what we are going to get (I am not overly optimistic) or what he wanted to do, but at a price.

Edited 12 September, 2017 by Noodles34

[Noodles34]

Believe what you want I don't give a sh*t. What I will say is they aren't rumours and there are plenty more incidents that our tiny Italian was involved in as well.

 

As I said ask yourself this, if Katrina was happy with him why did she want a greater view of what he was doing? Why was Cortese only giving her a top line financial figure and not full access the finances which she had to get rid of him to get? Why did he take out a high interest offshore loan with Vibrac despite brashly claiming a couple of years early that the club didn't do debt, that in good times he would put money anyway for bad? Why did the training ground cost twice as much as budget and delivered 18 months later than planned? Why were there multiple court cases involving the club and everyone one of them settled at the last minute out of court? Why, despite successive promotions did the corporate boxes stay empty, why was a midsize premier league clubs commercial income smaller than a midsized championship club despite playing in the richest league in the world. How despite playing in this league was the best shirt sponsorship deal he could deliver being with the largest recruitment company in Chillworth Business Park? Not rumours, all FACT, same theme here, spending money, not making it.

 

As for delivering on the pitch, I've always said he did a good job in the lower leagues but his ego ran away with him when we got in sniffing distance of the premier league and it all started to go downhill. However do you really think an Italian banker was responsible for signing Fonte, Lambert, Hammond etc all players key to our rise through the league? He appointed a decent manager when he first arrived who built the team, do you think he knew who Pardew was when he was sitting behind his desk at his Swiss bank?

 

Believe what you want and continue to think we'd be so much better off if he was still here, we wouldn't not rumour. FACT.

 

But you always said he spunked our money on Ramirez and Osvaldo, but you are saying he did not buy players, which is it pal?

 

Its quite clear why KL got rid of him, because her long term vision was to sell, it was ****ing obvious pal and now it has happened.

[sadoldgit]

So, lets get things straight here...

 

Markus Liebherr bought SFC. Not Katharina. He put Cortese in place, and they had a shared vision to bring greatness to this club.

 

We all know what tragically happened to Markus. His daughter took over, and in tribute to her Dad, and because Germans tend to be more committed and willing to stick at things, she stuck to the plan, after a fashion.

 

The goal to return to the PL was delivered. But that was a tick-in-the-box for her, in my opinion; at that point I think she felt that she had followed her Dad's dream enough, and not having a particular affintiy with football or Southampton, she planned her exit and decided that she wasnt going to support the longer-term vision, which NC was pursuing still.

 

That's fine, but I am sick of reading NC being portrayed as a monster. He was brilliant for this club, only now its lost all the momentum he provided.

 

I read once he put a faxed bid for a player from LIVERPOOL in the bin without reading it, considering it a disgrace they hadnt approached the club properly. Do you lot really think we would be stuck clueless with Carlos Kickaballs as manager and would have sold off all our decent players following assorted degrees of tapping-up if he were still here ??

 

Reed and Krueger have read their own damned press and hype far too much over the "Southampton Way", "black box" and "academy" b*ll*cks; the club is, as shown last night, starting to fail at EVERY level.

 

But according to you we have been failing for the last four years despite 4 top ten finishes and a cup final.

[Dellman]

NC inherited a club on bad times, not only bankrupt. But with warring factions who had all tried and failed to get things in order. NCdecided all those factions inc LMc who was still taking the club's freebies alongside others should go. Matt LeT had made failed attempt to find finance and become chairman. The old regime had failed. A clean sweep was necessary and thanks to Markus and NC we got it.

[OldNick]

I recall the story of how ML in his dying days made a long journey to present his friend a watch ( I think this was the case) and that NC promised ML to carry on Marcus's dream. Therefore if that was indeed the case, he may have thought that was his remit.

I know it is heresy to say anything about KL, but IMO her long term plan, was only ever to get the best price for herself. Nothing wrong in that, but ML with NC were going to be ruthless to get our club where they had stated it would be.CL football as fanciful as it seemed was very close to us if the investment had been made, in those days when the big clubs were in flux.

NC run the club as a dictator and yes it did ruffle the feathers of many people, especially those who were used to freebies.

I have no malice toward KL or any board since the Go Wilde days but I think fans should show a bit more respect and gratitude to NC, who put SFC under the nose of ML and sold us to him. If not imagine that consortium that Matty had foolishly backed taking over, we would now be playing at the Sports Centre