Wake up...Eric Black is the problem!

[Lord Duckhunter]

Likewise we must have weak players, a weak manager, and weak footballing structure if a single coach can exert more influence than all those other things. It's pure bunkum.

 

Exactly.

 

It just nuts to try and blame a first team coach, particularly when the modern managers are basically first team coaches that pick the team anyway ( with others doing the other bits old fashioned managers did). I doubt MP is a Bertie Mee type figure that is office based whilst Black is the Don Howe figure coaching & doing the tactical work all week.

 

 

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[captainchris]

Likewise we must have weak players, a weak manager, and weak footballing structure if a single coach can exert more influence than all those other things. It's pure bunkum.

 

You say that, however how come there are so many bizzare unbelievable coincidences of the exactly the same mistakes being repeated from last year?

That would not be possible without a common denominator or an unbelievable alignment of the stars.....

[Saint Fan CaM]

You say that, however how come there are so many bizzare unbelievable coincidences of the exactly the same mistakes being repeated from last year?

That would not be possible without a common denominator or an unbelievable alignment of the stars.....

 

Absolutely this. OR there is a significant amount of influence from our Les on the coaching staff. My feeling is that both Puel and MoPe have been instructed to play in a certain way and field certain players, which in turn has shackled our more creative players - hence the goal drought. This all has been underpinned by inconsistent team selections and a lack of cohesion and team spirit. It's going to take a huge sea change to turn things around and just sacking the manager may not be the answer this time. The danger is that MoPe loses the dressing room in the meantime.

[Simon3737]

Controversial suggestion, but maybe the most important common denominator is not Eric Black or Les Reed, so much as the 22 current players who spent a year being indoctrinated by Puel to play negative unambitious football.

 

I hope Pellegrino nos realises his gradual change approach isn't working and starts making more ambitious changes so the players unlearn last years bad habits.

[Saint86]

Controversial suggestion, but maybe the most important common denominator is not Eric Black or Les Reed, so much as the 22 current players who spent a year being indoctrinated by Puel to play negative unambitious football.

 

I hope Pellegrino nos realises his gradual change approach isn't working and starts making more ambitious changes so the players unlearn last years bad habits.

 

Hmm, a fair point that can't easily be discounted i suppose.

[saint lard]

It won’t change while this clown is still at the club.

 

 

 

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[Kingsbridge Saint]

If I was allowed to do three things to attempt to fix up Saints woeful football one of those three things would be to fire Eric Black. He still has the stink of Puel on him and DOES NOT get the benefit of the doubt.

[Saint in Paradise]

I don't know why all the moaners are complaining so much.Saints are not yet quite in the worst 3 in the PL, it's not their personal Bank

accounts being raided and that money being spent. If Saints do get relegated remember how some on here are always saying how

much they enjoyed fighting for promotion to the PL. Saints management etc know much more about Football than us mere plebs so we

should all just shut up and accept what we are given and if that means woeful football tough luck on us.

[Winnersaint]

Sometimes there is a disinterest and malaise about our play reminiscent of the relegated Villa team.

[Convict Colony]

If Eric Black is so well liked by the players then the question for me is who is helping Pelligrino by reading the players the riot act, whose his Sgt Major ?

[Nordic Saint]

I don't know why all the moaners are complaining so much.Saints are not yet quite in the worst 3 in the PL, it's not their personal Bank

accounts being raided and that money being spent. If Saints do get relegated remember how some on here are always saying how

much they enjoyed fighting for promotion to the PL. Saints management etc know much more about Football than us mere plebs so we

should all just shut up and accept what we are given and if that means woeful football tough luck on us.

 

 

For a club which gets the 12th biggest gates in the league, and which could get bigger than that if not for the limitations of the stadium, it is sad how many of our fans will settle for and in some cases even welcome underachievement. I guess we have had so much of it in our history that lethargy has set in and there is a distinct lack of ambition in our fan base.

[Show me the mané]

For a club which gets the 12th biggest gates in the league, and which could get bigger than that if not for the limitations of the stadium, it is sad how many of our fans will settle for and in some cases even welcome underachievement. I guess we have had so much of it in our history that lethargy has set in and there is a distinct lack of ambition in our fan base.

100% this

[Heisenberg]

For a club which gets the 12th biggest gates in the league, and which could get bigger than that if not for the limitations of the stadium, it is sad how many of our fans will settle for and in some cases even welcome underachievement. I guess we have had so much of it in our history that lethargy has set in and there is a distinct lack of ambition in our fan base.

 

We do still have passionate and ambitious fans.... They are just discouraged from posting on here.

 

Passion and ambition on here = trolling

[Fan The Flames]

You say that, however how come there are so many bizzare unbelievable coincidences of the exactly the same mistakes being repeated from last year?

That would not be possible without a common denominator or an unbelievable alignment of the stars.....

 

....or having the same set of players.

[CB Fry]

We do still have passionate and ambitious fans.... They are just discouraged from posting on here.

 

Passion and ambition on here = trolling

Despite being languishing in 16th and at a woeful point a game you have indeed remained passionate and ambitious. Fair play.

[eurosaint]

We do still have passionate and ambitious fans.... They are just discouraged from posting on here.

 

Passion and ambition on here = trolling

 

Passion is not determined by non stop slagging off of the the club and it's officials !

Ambition is not defined by just spending money !

When you get your head around that you might just see why people class you as a troll !

[Dusic]

Amazing that some people genuinely feel Black is a major problem. Keep clutching.

[Heisenberg]

Amazing that some people genuinely feel Black is a major problem. Keep clutching.

 

organ grinder not the monkey

[doddisalegend]

....or having the same set of players.

 

 

Lol no couldn't be that ?

[Monk]

Amazing that some people genuinely feel Black is a major problem. Keep clutching.

 

Nothing being clutched. Very poor coach.

[St Louis]

Very poor coach.

 

How do you know that then? I assume you're guessing/assuming!?

 

How do you know we wouldnt be even worse without his coaching... oh you dont, you're just speculating.

[GGalpin]

How do you know that then? I assume you're guessing/assuming!?

 

How do you know we wouldnt be even worse without his coaching... oh you dont, you're just speculating.

 

in fairness, Monk I believe I'm right in saying is a coach of some sort and does have connections in coaching.

 

Even if he doesn't know himself, he may know others who do.

 

I'm not sure how much influence Eric Black would have (if anything going from assistant to coach would surely diminish his influence) but he may know better.

[St Louis]

Apologies if thats the case, and there is inside info that the squad and football community believe he is a very poor coach.

Personally I've not heard anybody speak badly of him or his ability, but I've heard many on here put 2 + 2 together because we've been crap for a couple of seasons now (since he joined us) - forgetting we've lost all of our best players in recent seasons

[Kingsbridge Saint]

I am judging Black's input on our results and performances since he joined. I think that's fair. On that evidence he has taken us backwards, which is completely in keeping with his CV. He needs to go.

[DuncanRG]

I am judging Black's input on our results and performances since he joined. I think that's fair. On that evidence he has taken us backwards, which is completely in keeping with his CV. He needs to go.

 

The whole sport went to pot when they let assistant coaches decide results directly.

[CB Fry]

in fairness, Monk I believe I'm right in saying is a coach of some sort and does have connections in coaching.

 

Even if he doesn't know himself, he may know others who do.

 

I'm not sure how much influence Eric Black would have (if anything going from assistant to coach would surely diminish his influence) but he may know better.

Monk is full of sh it.

[suewhistle]

Passion and ambition on here = trolling

 

Well, don't worry, you won't be criticised for passion and ambition. Possibly for snide criticism and negativity and being a bit of a ******.

[trousers]

Textbook

[Monk]

Monk is full of sh it.

 

Cute.

 

Tit.

[Monk]

How do you know that then? I assume you're guessing/assuming!?

 

How do you know we wouldnt be even worse without his coaching... oh you dont, you're just speculating.

 

Because of his track record - player I worked with who have played under him at Villa. The three members of staff where I currently work who don’t rate him and the two bog standard sessions I’ve seen him lead.

[Saint Fan CaM]

Because of his track record - player I worked with who have played under him at Villa. The three members of staff where I currently work who don’t rate him and the two bog standard sessions I’ve seen him lead.

 

Very interesting insights Monk. Tell me, is it usual for a Director of Football to appoint his own first team coach to work amongst the Manager and his staff? Just seems a bit strange and divisive to me...makes me wonder how the arrangement plays out with the squad dynamic in general.

[larry12]

You really are one of the most patronising, boring posters on here. I'd recommend learning to read before criticising other posters for things they haven't written.

 

Fully agree. He personally attacks people, who he thinks have personally attacked people. I think CB Fry talks shiite as well. That's not a personal attack though, just my opinion.

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

Black should've gone when Puel went. A fresh start.

[Heisenberg]

Black should've gone when Puel went. A fresh start.

 

100%

[captainchris]

Very interesting insights Monk. Tell me, is it usual for a Director of Football to appoint his own first team coach to work amongst the Manager and his staff? Just seems a bit strange and divisive to me...makes me wonder how the arrangement plays out with the squad dynamic in general.

 

Exactly.... This arrangement is very divisive and undermining for the Manager. A really poor decision to keep Black around.

The longer he stays around the more the stink festers .... Black is holding up progress by perpetuating more of exactly the same....

[Micky]

Passion is not determined by non stop slagging off of the the club and it's officials !

Ambition is not defined by just spending money !

When you get your head around that you might just see why people class you as a troll !

You are of course spot on. But you are also wasting your time, he is a master troll.

 

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[Wade Garrett]

Controversial suggestion, but maybe the most important common denominator is not Eric Black or Les Reed, so much as the 22 current players who spent a year being indoctrinated by Puel to play negative unambitious football.

 

I hope Pellegrino nos realises his gradual change approach isn't working and starts making more ambitious changes so the players unlearn last years bad habits.

 

This, in spades.

[Wade Garrett]

Is it right that Black is popular with the squad?

 

They're pros and would quickly find out a coach who was crap.

[doddisalegend]

Controversial suggestion, but maybe the most important common denominator is not Eric Black or Les Reed, so much as the 22 current players who spent a year being indoctrinated by Puel to play negative unambitious football.

 

I hope Pellegrino nos realises his gradual change approach isn't working and starts making more ambitious changes so the players unlearn last years bad habits.

 

So most of them have been playing football for years but one season with Puel and they have forgotten everything they learned previously?

 

The truth is more likely that the club hierarchy want to see the first team play possession football they've hired two managers whose style suits that and explains why (a few tweaks aside) we are playing very similarly to last season . It is interesting looking at the stats on the PL official website saints have similar stats to the big six in terms of things like back passes (Liverpool for example were the biggest back passers in the league last year and no one calls them boring) and ball possession the biggest difference, seems to be, the big teams have quality players who can turn possession into goals we have a bunch of very average players who can't.

[doddisalegend]

Is it right that Black is popular with the squad?

 

They're pros and would quickly find out a coach who was crap.

 

from the echo

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/15389768.Saints_set_to_announce_Mauricio_Pellegrino_s_backroom_team__with_Eric_Black_staying_on/

 

Saints feel the Scotsman, who is said to be popular among the players, can offer support to Pellegrino as he settles in to his first management job in the Premier League, as he did for Puel.

Black's familiarity with the current squad and experience of English football is viewed as highly valuable.

[richardc]

When you see MoPe in the dugout he is not talking to Black but to his other assistants - If Black was so influential then surely he would be conferring with him not the other two. I am sure I remember a few murmurings from players that the training was pretty poor last year and i am sure if true that might be partly attributable to Black. In the end of the day success is due to a combination of the managers tactical input or the ability to get this across to the players and also the ability of the players themselves - I would say both are questionable

[Monk]

Is it right that Black is popular with the squad?

 

They're pros and would quickly find out a coach who was crap.

 

Not necessarily, the amount of pros turned coaches that are poor is horrifying.

[SKD]

Not necessarily, the amount of pros turned coaches that are poor is horrifying.

 

This is very very true, and which is in the main (IMO) the reason why we generally produce very poor British coaches.

 

A lot of very good coaches get overlooked / can't get the relevant qualifications because they don't have experience in the professional game.

 

Something the FA need to look at, if you ask me.

[Wade Garrett]

Not necessarily, the amount of pros turned coaches that are poor is horrifying.

 

That's a completely different argument. Decent pro's will quickly suss out coaches who are poor. Nothing to do with whether or not they'll become decent coaches themselves.

[mrfahaji]

This is very very true, and which is in the main (IMO) the reason why we generally produce very poor British coaches.

 

A lot of very good coaches get overlooked / can't get the relevant qualifications because they don't have experience in the professional game.

 

Something the FA need to look at, if you ask me.

 

Funny that these quotes have just cropped up here, I was about to post something in the Stoke match thread on a very similar topic that captainchris was alluding to.

 

Ask yourself three questions regarding the lack of good english managers (less so for coaches but still applicable):

 

1) are english footballers generally an intelligent bunch?

2) do get a break in English Football management, do you invariably need to have played professionally?

3) do you need to be fairly smart to be a successful manager?

 

I would say No, Yes and Yes. If that's the case, it exposes the flaw in the setup and why don't have many good english managers, and to a lesser extent, coaches.

[Lets B Avenue]

Funny that these quotes have just cropped up here, I was about to post something in the Stoke match thread on a very similar topic that captainchris was alluding to.

 

Ask yourself three questions regarding the lack of good english managers (less so for coaches but still applicable):

 

1) are english footballers generally an intelligent bunch?

2) do get a break in English Football management, do you invariably need to have played professionally?

3) do you need to be fairly smart to be a successful manager?

 

I would say No, Yes and Yes. If that's the case, it exposes the flaw in the setup and why don't have many good english managers, and to a lesser extent, coaches.

 

And the clever ones realise its a lot easier and healthier, in front of the camera. Unfortunately, the TV Companies still employ Robbie Savage.

[Monk]

This is very very true, and which is in the main (IMO) the reason why we generally produce very poor British coaches.

 

A lot of very good coaches get overlooked / can't get the relevant qualifications because they don't have experience in the professional game.

 

Something the FA need to look at, if you ask me.

 

It’s actually gone the other way, we’re producing some incredible coaches and players. It’s a generation thing unfortunately. A lot of ex pros go to Wales to complete UEFA A and B licences because they’re fast tracked. The FA appreciate coaching is a different skills set altogether - and won’t fast track (anymore).

[Micky]

This is very very true, and which is in the main (IMO) the reason why we generally produce very poor British coaches.

 

A lot of very good coaches get overlooked / can't get the relevant qualifications because they don't have experience in the professional game.

 

Something the FA need to look at, if you ask me.

Dead right, I'm an FA coach and I reckon I could do a much better job than our Eric, easily.

 

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[skintsaint]

Could end up at Leicester now?

[doddisalegend]

Could end up at Leicester now?

 

 

I doubt it isn't the skate staying as their no.2