Great strategy at the wrong time

[Ultimatt]

It's clear the club/board have adopted a new strategy in the last year of locking all players into long term deals so we don't need to sell. Yoshida and Davis are the only 1st teamers not contracted to at least 2020, with the latter only because of his age. In theory it sounds great to have all our players locked in giving the club the power in negotiations. In reality, as witnessed by the VVD situation, or Fonte last season, the players can still be petulant children and try to force a move.

 

The other key point is that our best XI is arguably the worst it's been since coming back to the PL. Only 1 of our players is being courted by another club. The rest were given long term deals and big payrises so we wouldn't need to sell but no one really wants them anyway. Getting into Europe can be seen as a curse in disguise because it forced us to bloat our squad, losing sight of that strong first XI over depth and rotation. If you look at Leicester's title run, 9 players started 30+ games. Their depth was poor but it didn't matter because they only played once a week. The depth was exposed last season with their European run. We go into this season with no Europe but still with our "Ready for Europe" bloated squad.

 

So what we have now is a situation where we're paying big wages to a lot of players that will get barely any gametime this season, which takes funds away from signing/paying better players to improve our first team. The long contracts are fairly meaningless when these players aren't desired by clubs above us in the food chain. I feel like the board have gone overboard with this strategy and lost sight of smart business decisions. Get our best players on long contracts but there's no need to give payrises/long contracts to squad players that'll bench warm all season.

[baggytrousers]

It's clear the club/board have adopted a new strategy in the last year of locking all players into long term deals so we don't need to sell. Yoshida and Davis are the only 1st teamers not contracted to at least 2020, with the latter only because of his age. In theory it sounds great to have all our players locked in giving the club the power in negotiations. In reality, as witnessed by the VVD situation, or Fonte last season, the players can still be petulant children and try to force a move.

 

The other key point is that our best XI is arguably the worst it's been since coming back to the PL. Only 1 of our players is being courted by another club. The rest were given long term deals and big payrises so we wouldn't need to sell but no one really wants them anyway. Getting into Europe can be seen as a curse in disguise because it forced us to bloat our squad, losing sight of that strong first XI over depth and rotation. If you look at Leicester's title run, 9 players started 30+ games. Their depth was poor but it didn't matter because they only played once a week. The depth was exposed last season with their European run. We go into this season with no Europe but still with our "Ready for Europe" bloated squad.

 

So what we have now is a situation where we're paying big wages to a lot of players that will get barely any gametime this season, which takes funds away from signing/paying better players to improve our first team. The long contracts are fairly meaningless when these players aren't desired by clubs above us in the food chain. I feel like the board have gone overboard with this strategy and lost sight of smart business decisions. Get our best players on long contracts but there's no need to give payrises/long contracts to squad players that'll bench warm all season.

 

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

[Redslo]

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

 

Agreed.

[Greenridge]

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

 

There's a reason that Spurs are held as a reference model. An ex-Saints reason.

[saintdean]

Good that you've noticed....

 

Nothing more to add but brilliant post. It's been a long time since I thought that on here

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[broncoboy]

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

 

The trouble with the new strategy is you have to survive in the most competitive league whilst the players mature

Last season after VVD was injured we really struggled and if the season had gone on another month we would have been in deep trouble. This squad is going to really struggle . Th truth is there is no money if Kat is not as rich as we thought or if she is not willing to spend. The idea we don't need to improve the squad with the second least number of goals and a squad that has lost two key defenders is laughable

[Ultimatt]

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

 

The young squad is very true and some of them have strong potential. Young players need as much game time as possible to develop. Redmond, JWP, Hojbjerg, Boufal, Stephens are all at the age where they need to be starting every game they can. If they all start regularly this season i'm ok with it but they won't. Tadic/Long will get games ahead of Redmond/Boufal. Davis/Clasie will get games ahead of JWP/PEH. Yoshida will get games over Stephens (though he hasn't taken an improved contract yet). If we want to develop these younger players then we have Tadic/Long/Davis/Clasie on long contracts getting very limited game time.

 

Then there's the next age bracket of Targett, McQueen, Gallagher, Bednarek, Sims that could easily be those backup players but most are 3rd or 4th down the line. They're all probably above the U23 level so we can't expect much development in any of them this season.

 

The spurs comparison is good. The difference is there young players are at a much higher level than ours. Alli vs JWP. Dier vs PEH. Eriksen/Son vs Redmond/Boufal. We're investing a lot in this young squad sticking together for a few years but the big questions are 1) Will these young players turn out to be good enough? 2) Will they get enough game time to develop 3) Can we even hold on to them if a big club comes calling despite their long contracts. The clubs strategy has merit but there's definitely potential for it to fail with our PL position slipping while we try to develop this young squad.

[tajjuk]

Good that you've noticed that the club have adopted a new strategy. Most on here don't seem to have noticed and are still touting the "Les sells all our players to fill Kat's pockets" line.

 

You make some good points but it feels like you have overloaded your argument. To say that only 1 of our players is being courted by another club is wrong. Bertrand and Cedric have certainly had big clubs interested in them this summer but we have nipped that attention in the bud by making it known we're not selling. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of other player like Romeu. What you should have said is that only 1 of our players has rebelled against this situation. Which begs the question why, when he signed a new long term contract last year, like the rest.

 

Other very important points you missed are the fact that we have signed very young promising players who are at the start of their career. Hojbjerg for example is still only 21 but people are complaining that he's not as good as Wanyama in his prime. We also have great facilities and put a premium on employing excellent technical coaches with the obvious intention of making these young prospects significantly better as they mature.

 

Last season our team had the second lowest average age with only Tottenham being younger. Indeed, if you want to look at one club in the premiership who adopt a very similar strategy to the new club strategy you've identified then look towards White Hart Lane.

 

Were Tottenham better when they spent all their Bale money on a host of big name signings or when they built up a talented young squad from smart buys (e.g. Ali from MK Dons) and their academy and gave them excellent coaching and their chance to prove themselves ?

 

You're correct in identifying that the club have changed tacks from the days of being forced to sell on our better players to along term more sustainable strategy but I think your analysis misses some vital points.

 

Ask Tottenham fans if their happier now in their young squad, don't spend much current state or when they had all their expensive Bale money guns-for-hire a few years back.

 

 

Very good post, whilst I'm sure most people on here won't like Spurs, they should recognise that they are basically being run in a similar way to us and in reality have just been a bit luckier with their youth (a player like Kane is once in a generation) and finding Ali, plus have greater resources than us to add to this and keep their players. They also have our old manager who IIRC was brought to us because of his ability to bring through young players, which Spurs are tapping into.

 

But no real signings from Spurs this summer and it looks like they have concentrated on retaining their best players much like us. No one seems to be criticising Spurs.

[East Kent Saint]

Apart from MoPo who says they need some signings if they are going to compete this season . Spurs are hamstrung as they are spending all the money on a new stadium .

[vectraman]

Very good post, whilst I'm sure most people on here won't like Spurs, they should recognise that they are basically being run in a similar way to us and in reality have just been a bit luckier with their youth (a player like Kane is once in a generation) and finding Ali, plus have greater resources than us to add to this and keep their players. They also have our old manager who IIRC was brought to us because of his ability to bring through young players, which Spurs are tapping into.

 

But no real signings from Spurs this summer and it looks like they have concentrated on retaining their best players much like us. No one seems to be criticising Spurs.

 

That is because spurs man for man are better than us. How many Saints players would get in the spurs first team? Two? VVD and possibly Bertrand maybe? They are not selling their players who are at an excellent level. We're not selling ours who in general are average/good. We need to sign players, they don't. Easy.

If spurs did put a for sale sign up, top teams from all over Europe would be knocking on the door - can't say that would be the case with Saints, we are just nowhere near spurs level sadly.

[baggytrousers]

That is because spurs man for man are better than us. How many Saints players would get in the spurs first team? Two? VVD and possibly Bertrand maybe? They are not selling their players who are at an excellent level. We're not selling ours who in general are average/good. We need to sign players, they don't. Easy.

If spurs did put a for sale sign up, top teams from all over Europe would be knocking on the door - can't say that would be the case with Saints, we are just nowhere near spurs level sadly.

 

Yes. Spurs are at this point in time, man for man, better than us.

 

That doesn't mean that our strategy is wrong as it's basically the same strategy as Spurs.

 

The difference is that under Poch they've been a bit better at it than we have recently.

 

However, I don't think we're as far off from making it succeed as many on here would have us believe.

[Batman]

Yes. Spurs are at this point in time, man for man, better than us.

 

That doesn't mean that our strategy is wrong as it's basically the same strategy as Spurs.

 

The difference is that under Poch they've been a bit better at it than we have recently.

 

However, I don't think we're as far off from making it succeed as many on here would have us believe.

 

a bit better?

they were 40 points better than us last season.

 

we were closer to Newcastle/Brighton than Spurs last year

[mrfahaji]

That is because spurs man for man are better than us. How many Saints players would get in the spurs first team? Two? VVD and possibly Bertrand maybe? They are not selling their players who are at an excellent level. We're not selling ours who in general are average/good. We need to sign players, they don't. Easy.

If spurs did put a for sale sign up, top teams from all over Europe would be knocking on the door - can't say that would be the case with Saints, we are just nowhere near spurs level sadly.

 

Not if Rose is fit.

[Ultimatt]

Worst squad since coming back to the PL?

 

Jesus. Imagine how the forum would be if we actually had a bad team? Rather than 2 of the best full backs in the league, a top quality DM, international strikers and exciting young players with potential all over the place.

 

Our team 4 years ago 2013/14:

Boruc - Shaw Lovren Fonte Clyne - Davis Schneiderlin Wanyama - Lallana Lambert JRod

 

Fits your description quite well. 7 of those 11 players made moves to top 6 clubs, would've been 8 if JRod didn't get injured and went to Spurs.

[sammysaint]

Our team 4 years ago 2013/14:

Boruc - Shaw Lovren Fonte Clyne - Davis Schneiderlin Wanyama - Lallana Lambert JRod

 

Fits your description quite well. 7 of those 11 players made moves to top 6 clubs, would've been 8 if JRod didn't get injured and went to Spurs.

 

100% Worse team since we have joined the premier league again.

 

With Stephens and Yoshi as the main CBs unless VVD comes around we have no chance of a top 8 finish unless Austin and Gabba stay fit all season and both bang in 15 plus goals and we out score teams.

 

I say with the current squad and everyone staying fit majority of the season - VVD we will finish between 9th and 11th, If VVD stays and plays then 8th is achievable and another cup final, one his day he is one of the best CB in the world at the moment and makes us so much better.

[baggytrousers]

a bit better?

they were 40 points better than us last season.

 

we were closer to Newcastle/Brighton than Spurs last year

 

Last season was an exceptionally good one for Spurs and a poor one for us, culminating in us sacking our manager.

 

The previous season we only finished 7 points behind Spurs who themselves finished third.

 

Last season Spurs moved forward with their strategy under Poch, in my view by far our best manager of recent years, where we stuttered under Puel, who clearly fell short of expectations.

 

The key point in this whole thread is that our strategy is not wrong just because we've had one season where we slid back bit after seven seasons of moving forward.

 

Spurs present us with the classic example of a club unable to compete financially with the big boys (their wage bill is massively short of the other top six clubs) but who have found a way to do it on the field.

 

Moreover, that way was not to throw money at big-name transfers. They tried that post-Bale without much success. Instead they've moved forward organically and intelligently and the way they've chosen to do it hasn't been much different from Saints.

 

It's not the strategy but the quality of its implementation that has differentiated the two clubs recently. That has come down to a combination of good management (I believe Poch is the best manager in the league, bar none) coupled with a fair wind, both of which Spurs possessed but Saints lacked last season.

[SaintBobby]

I'm a fan of the "long contract" strategy, although it hasn't really been tested yet.

 

I don't think you can say that bigger clubs won't still come in, but it does give the club the whip hand.

 

It also acts as a deterrent though. Let's assume (just for sake of argument) that Shane Long is an average player who we want to keep. We'd be battling to keep him if he had just a year left on his contract.

 

For more desirable players (Redmond, Cedric, Bertrand and Tadic), the long contracts act as a major block to us losing them. VVD is an exception - he is a world class player, not just an excellent player.

[shurlock]

Last season was an exceptionally good one for Spurs and a poor one for us, culminating in us sacking our manager.

 

The previous season we only finished 7 points behind Spurs who themselves finished third.

 

Last season Spurs moved forward with their strategy under Poch, in my view by far our best manager of recent years, where we stuttered under Puel, who clearly fell short of expectations.

 

The key point in this whole thread is that our strategy is not wrong just because we've had one season where we slid back bit after seven seasons of moving forward.

 

Spurs present us with the classic example of a club unable to compete financially with the big boys (their wage bill is massively short of the other top six clubs) but who have found a way to do it on the field.

 

Moreover, that way was not to throw money at big-name transfers. They tried that post-Bale without much success. Instead they've moved forward organically and intelligently and the way they've chosen to do it hasn't been much different from Saints.

 

It's not the strategy but the quality of its implementation that has differentiated the two clubs recently. That has come down to a combination of good management (I believe Poch is the best manager in the league, bar none) coupled with a fair wind, both of which Spurs possessed but Saints lacked last season.

 

What guff. So the only things that separates us from Spurs is the quality of management and a fair wind?

[Oldeuboi]

What guff. So the only things that separates us from Spurs is the quality of management and a fair wind?

 

To be fair, Spurs last season were the team we were statistically close to.

 

Our final goals for/against were well below what we were "expected" to get from the type and quality of chances created (biggest difference in the entire league). Spurs were the total opposite with their expected goals for/against. A massive chunk of the variance in that stat can quite simply be put down to luck (this is expected goals, not chalking up 35-yard hit and hopes as "chances"). Southampton were the unluckiest team in the Premier League last season by a long way as shown here:

 

 

Spurs are extremely similar to us as a club now and no doubt they learned from the way we do business and reaped the rewards through good manager selection, investment in youth and shrewd recruitment.

[Lukee]

^Perhaps they've learned that from 2 key ex-Southampton staff in Paul Mitchell and MoPo

[shurlock]

To be fair, Spurs last season were the team we were statistically close to.

 

Our final goals for/against were well below what we were "expected" to get from the type and quality of chances created (biggest difference in the entire league). Spurs were the total opposite with their expected goals for/against. A massive chunk of the variance in that stat can quite simply be put down to luck (this is expected goals, not chalking up 35-yard hit and hopes as "chances"). Southampton were the unluckiest team in the Premier League last season by a long way as shown here:

 

 

Spurs are extremely similar to us as a club now and no doubt they learned from the way we do business and reaped the rewards through good manager selection, investment in youth and shrewd recruitment.

 

I've never seen any real evidence that the expected goals has any real predictive power by normal statistical standards. Spurs approach may be superficially similar (and certainly closer to us than the other big sides) but they still have spent money on players that we simply can't compete with. Everybody, even the moneybags of the division, wishes they had a Harry Kane in their Academy. We don't. Would Spurs have responded differently and bought big if they didn't. I bet they would have done. Claiming that luck and management are the only things separating us from Spurs is risible.

Edited 6 August, 2017 by shurlock

[Oldeuboi]

^Perhaps they've learned that from 2 key ex-Southampton staff in Paul Mitchell and MoPo

 

I think it's a lot to do with MoPo but also because they learned from their mistakes in recruitment. They tried the Liverpool tactic of splashing insane cash on "flavour of the month" players and really suffered.

[baggytrousers]

I've never seen any real evidence that the expected goals has any real predictive power by normal statistical standards. Spurs approach may be superficially similar (and certainly closer to us than the other big sides) but they still have spent money on players that we simply can't compete with. Everybody, even the moneybags of the division, wishes they had a Harry Kane in their Academy. We don't. Would Spurs have responded differently and bought big if they didn't. I bet they would have done. Claiming that luck and management are the only things separating us from Spurs is risible.

 

When Poch joined Spurs Roberto Soldado was their main striker and Kane was a youngster who'd returned from

Not particularly impressive loan spells. Dier was a very average reserve centre back, DannyRose was very unimpressive and Dele Ali was a little known Mk Dons youngster. He's take these youngsters and realised their potential which has taken not only great coaching but also depended on the kids grabbing their chances and staying injury free.

 

In contrast Southampton have not yet realised the potential of the talented young players we currently have in our squad but we do have that potential. Whether all our fans have the patience for this approach is another question.

 

To suggest that Daniel "money bags" Levy has splashed the cash and that Spurs success has nothing to do with good management and a fair wind is, in my opinion, risible.

[The9]

To be fair, Spurs last season were the team we were statistically close to.

 

Our final goals for/against were well below what we were "expected" to get from the type and quality of chances created (biggest difference in the entire league). Spurs were the total opposite with their expected goals for/against. A massive chunk of the variance in that stat can quite simply be put down to luck (this is expected goals, not chalking up 35-yard hit and hopes as "chances"). Southampton were the unluckiest team in the Premier League last season by a long way as shown here:

 

 

Spurs are extremely similar to us as a club now and no doubt they learned from the way we do business and reaped the rewards through good manager selection, investment in youth and shrewd recruitment.

 

Well, it's nice to see someone else saying it, anyway. But for luck, see also fatigue. Having said that, Spurs are clearly doing the same as we have been but at a slightly higher level of expenditure, with predictable results.

Edited 9 August, 2017 by The9

[Rebel]

The young squad is very true and some of them have strong potential. Young players need as much game time as possible to develop. Redmond, JWP, Hojbjerg, Boufal, Stephens are all at the age where they need to be starting every game they can. If they all start regularly this season i'm ok with it but they won't. Tadic/Long will get games ahead of Redmond/Boufal. Davis/Clasie will get games ahead of JWP/PEH. Yoshida will get games over Stephens (though he hasn't taken an improved contract yet). If we want to develop these younger players then we have Tadic/Long/Davis/Clasie on long contracts getting very limited game time.

 

Then there's the next age bracket of Targett, McQueen, Gallagher, Bednarek, Sims that could easily be those backup players but most are 3rd or 4th down the line. They're all probably above the U23 level so we can't expect much development in any of them this season.

 

The spurs comparison is good. The difference is there young players are at a much higher level than ours. Alli vs JWP. Dier vs PEH. Eriksen/Son vs Redmond/Boufal. We're investing a lot in this young squad sticking together for a few years but the big questions are 1) Will these young players turn out to be good enough? 2) Will they get enough game time to develop 3) Can we even hold on to them if a big club comes calling despite their long contracts. The clubs strategy has merit but there's definitely potential for it to fail with our PL position slipping while we try to develop this young squad.

 

Taking a radical view maybe it is time for the club to move on players like Tadic, Long, Clasie, Gardos and give the younger players like Redmond, Stephens, Boufal, JWP, Lemina and PEH the game time to develop - and add more young players like Roberts, Karamoh, Hoedt and Christensen who will also develop with game time and use players like Targett, McQueen, Gallagher, Bednarek, Sims, Flannigan and Slattery as the back up players.

 

You could argue that maybe we do need to move on players like Yoshida, Davis and Pied as well to give younger players the room to develop. Even Bertrand to give Targett and McQueen the room to develop.

 

Now I am not saying I would actually do this - you need balance and experienced quality in the squad - but I don't think its a million miles away from what the club is actually thinking - bringing in or through young players from the academy, developing them, flipping them as someone said by selling them and replacing them with younger players, giving the younger players room to develop, focusing on new younger players with real potential - and repeating the process.

 

In some ways its the 'pathway' they talk about.

 

I probably would move on Tadic, Clasie, Long and Gardos this summer (to give the existing younger players room to develop) and replace them with younger players who will also need the room to develop.

 

So it looks like Lemina will replace Clasie anyway and Bednarek will probably replace Gardos (when he goes out on loan for his final year I expect). And we could be looking to bring in someone like Patrick Roberts to replace Tadic and maybe someone like Yann Karamoh to replace Long.

 

Vietto or Gabriel Barbosa might also fit this model as well - but the slight adaptation that we look for players like Lemina and PEH with real potential that haven't been given the time to develop at a big club.

 

And if Van Dijk goes replacing him with someone like Christensen or Hoedt (or both) would make sense based on this model as well.

[Oldeuboi]

Well, it's nice to see someone else saying it, anyway. But for luck, see also fatigue. Having said that, Spurs are clearly doing the same as we have been but at a slightly higher level of expenditure, with predictable results.

 

Fatigue?? What's that?! Players are robots who can play 180 minutes a week consistently without flinching.

 

I know he's a little radical but Ray Verheije (https://twitter.com/raymondverheije) is worth a follow on twitter. A massively talented coach who truly seems to understand fitness and fatigue with training and matches.