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Investing in Ethereum & tokens

Convict Colony

By Convict Colony,
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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Afternoon guys

 

Just wondered if anyone else in here has been investing in crypto at all, I assume most of you would have heard of Bitcoin but I just wondered how many had heard of Ethereum (the future) and other alt coins and if anyone else has invested in it and what tokens (BAT, GNT etc) you are also following.

 

For reference I did my 1st investmet in Ethereum at 9.5 euro per ETH back in jan and have invested every month since and it now sits around 235 euro per ETH.

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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That's a helluva good return, but can you sell them?

 

Yeah I buy mine on coinbase (san fran company fully insured) and you can sell them on there and can send the cash back to any bank I want using a SEPA transfer.

 

http://www.coinbase.com

 

Currently my ROI is for every 1k invested I have currently 10K back and I expect the price for each Ether to be around 400 - 500 euro by Aug-Sept (233 currently)

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benjii

benjii

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Interesting, thanks.

 

With something like Ether, it's nature is probably even more ambiguous than Bitcoin. It's not a currency in the sense that it has very limited buying power (ie. it's essentially a piece of work on a particular digital platform). It's more akin to an equity investment than a currency speculation, albeit probably subject to pretty high potential volatility.

 

I have been thinking about ways to deploy a relatively small amount of cash that is sitting idly in a bank account so I will give this some further thought.

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benjii

benjii

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Its more akin to a ponzi scheme.

 

I'm not sure that's entirely fair. Ethereum is being evaluated and tested as a platform by a lot of major institutions and there's little doubt that blockchain technology will be deployed at increasing pace in coming years. Ponzi schemes typically promise guaranteed returns over a certain period - there is no promise of guaranteed returns here and the ability to realise a profit is contingent on there being someone willing to buy the Ethers. As with anything, increased demand generally drives up prices. If people are investing in these things expecting a guaranteed return then they are stupid. It's more of a calculated gamble, which is why the old adage that you shouldn't risk more than you are able to lose holds true.

 

I think it's probably worth a smallish punt, as there is definitely future in this technology. The main thing that concerns me off is the lack of trustworthy exchanges. The OP mentioned Coinbase but online reviews suggest people are experiencing a lot of problems with it.

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buctootim

buctootim

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I'm not sure that's entirely fair.

 

Its not, I got it confused with Ripple. It is however more speculation than investment imo. I admit I don't really understand Ethereum - but I suspect most people who put money in don't either. Its more like a bet. The state involvment of Russia is worrying too. Thery have a long record of backing technology dead ends and turkeys.

Edited by buctootim
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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Its not, I got it confused with Ripple. It is however more speculation than investment imo. I admit I don't really understand Ethereum - but I suspect most people who put money in don't either. Its more like a bet. The state involvment of Russia is worrying too. Thery have a long record of backing technology dead ends and turkeys.

 

Yeah ripple is a pump and dump and I've never or would ever invest in that or Ethereum Classic (ETC) if you invest invest in Ethereum makes sure you buy ETH not ETC.

 

Think of the Ethereum blockchain as the oil that will power the mega companies (smart contract) cars.

 

I am starting to look at some tokens that will run on Ethereum ,example is Basic Attention Token (BAT) and Golleum (GNT) but want to understand a lot more first.

 

Good explanation video below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygag0d81IqM

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benjii

benjii

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Yeah ripple is a pump and dump and I've never or would ever invest in that or Ethereum Classic (ETC) if you invest invest in Ethereum makes sure you buy ETH not ETC.

 

Think of the Ethereum blockchain as the oil that will power the mega companies (smart contract) cars.

 

I am starting to look at some tokens that will run on Ethereum ,example is Basic Attention Token (BAT) and Golleum (GNT) but want to understand a lot more first.

 

Good explanation video below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygag0d81IqM

 

Have you ever had issues withdrawing from Coinbase?

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Have you ever had issues withdrawing from Coinbase?

 

No not at all.

 

I actually moved 1k out of there on monday and it hit my HSBC account in the UK Tues afternoon.

 

They had a bit of an issue (outage etc) about 2 weeks ago as the price rocketed so everyone was trying to join/send money and do credit card transactions and it fell over (they've recruited more support staff now apparently and are setting up a UK office)

 

But seriously used it since Jan and no major issues, got my withdrawal limit increased, my spend limit increased etc no worries.

 

A good place to learn about what is going on via the exchanges daily is here:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethtrader/

 

A more holistic view of what is ethereum, news, the future and the EEA (next conference is in china on 14th -16th June so expect a big increase due to chinese users buying):

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/

 

Again happy to answer questions etc but I have learnt everything just by reading about it and following it daily :-)

Edited by Convict Colony
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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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I spent £500 on ETH last week, it cost roughly £480 after fees. Looking at my coinbase account today my account is holding £550, so in roughly a week £70 has been made

 

Nice, I just wish I flagged this here when I first started buying in as that 480 pounds would of got you 60 ETH which would now be worth 12300 pounds now !!!

Edited by Convict Colony
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Millbrook Saint

Millbrook Saint

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Nice, I just wish I flagged this here when I first started buying in as that 480 pounds would of got you 60 ETH which would now be worth 12300 pounds now !!!

 

I know, am gutted, I remember seeing them when they were around the £20 mark each and thinking that they wouldn't go up much as bitcoin was the way forward, not sure how much bitcoin was then but it may have just dropped down to around £400, an investment in either back then would be showing good returns right now. 20 20 hindsight.

 

Just out of interest, do you keep your ETH in the Coinbase wallet or you have your own wallet?

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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I know, am gutted, I remember seeing them when they were around the £20 mark each and thinking that they wouldn't go up much as bitcoin was the way forward, not sure how much bitcoin was then but it may have just dropped down to around £400, an investment in either back then would be showing good returns right now. 20 20 hindsight.

 

Just out of interest, do you keep your ETH in the Coinbase wallet or you have your own wallet?

 

I have 50% in CB and 50% in a nano s wallet.

 

Read CBs insurance and they keep most of the money off line themselves and only put enough on for people to trade with and ae fully insured against hacks.

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shurlock

shurlock

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what , dont you want to pay your tax? as those are ways of avoiding tax

 

You caught me red handed pal. Taking part in the government's universally accessible flagship program to encourage saving and investment makes me a two-faced, tax-evading scumbag.

 

Ever thought of a career in investigative journalism or at the HMRC? Before you consider career change, however, you might want to brush up on the HMRC's tax avoidance :lol:

 

"Tax avoidance is bending the rules of the tax system to gain a tax advantage, that parliament never intended".

 

https://www.ftadviser.com/2016/04/15/ifa-industry/can-a-pension-or-an-isa-be-considered-tax-avoidance-dQme7W3IvdEOh1rkQs6eNI/article.html

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OldNick

OldNick

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You caught me red handed pal. Taking part in the government's universally accessible flagship program to encourage saving and investment makes me a two-faced, tax-evading scumbag.

 

Ever thought of a career in investigative journalism or at the HMRC? Before you consider career change, however, you might want to brush up on the HMRC's tax avoidance :lol:

 

"Tax avoidance is bending the rules of the tax system to gain a tax advantage, that parliament never intended".

 

https://www.ftadviser.com/2016/04/15/ifa-industry/can-a-pension-or-an-isa-be-considered-tax-avoidance-dQme7W3IvdEOh1rkQs6eNI/article.html

it is still avoiding paying tax in a legal way, I would have thought that soaking the rich and making them pay more would resonate and so you would not ever consider trying to avoid a tax
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shurlock

shurlock

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it is still avoiding paying tax in a legal way, I would have thought that soaking the rich and making them pay more would resonate and so you would not ever consider trying to avoid a tax

 

Am afraid to inform you that HMRC will not be offering you a job at this point.

 

Avoidance is a technical term. According to HMRC, using the tax relief available through Isas and pensions is purely saving tax and not considered avoidance. Parliament fully intended these schemes to be used in this way.

Edited by shurlock
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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Ethereum is busting up today (261 euro - check the price at my first post at the beginning of this week) and we still have the conference in China next week to push us further.

 

I expect us to get to near 300 euros after the conference and then a correction to about 280 the following week before further growth.

 

My unscientific prediction will be by Sept we will be near 500 euro and maybe 800 + by end of year.

 

Also in Netherlands you do not have captial gains you just pay a wealth tax of 1.5 % on any gains over 25k :-)

 

giphy.gif

Edited by Convict Colony
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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Been trying to buy from coinbase today, seems there are issues with purchasing with debit/credit cars

 

Yeah I got an email a couple of day ago saying they acknowledged there was an issue for UK customers which they are fixing (I use SEPA so have no worries - a tip is to move the money you want to spend into your account and then just buy on a dip).

Edited by Convict Colony
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OldNick

OldNick

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Am afraid to inform you that HMRC will not be offering you a job at this point.

 

Avoidance is a technical term. According to HMRC, using the tax relief available through Isas and pensions is purely saving tax and not considered avoidance. Parliament fully intended these schemes to be used in this way.

No different than the schemes by the rich and famous, legal ways of paying less tax. Of course as always with Socialists its ok if they do it but jealousy if others do
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shurlock

shurlock

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No different than the schemes by the rich and famous, legal ways of paying less tax. Of course as always with Socialists its ok if they do it but jealousy if others do

 

Trouble undestanding, old man? It's very different. Avoidance is legal but it involves using the tax system differently from the purpose for which it was intended. Parliament did not intend for UK domiciled individuals to establish bogus overseas companies that are controlled from the UK or to manipulate the tax system to gain an advantage. By contrast, parliament fully intended that the British public could utilise tax-free savings, make use of personal allowances and pay into pension schemes to reduce the tax burden.

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OldNick

OldNick

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Trouble undestanding, old man? It's very different. Avoidance is legal but it involves using the tax system differently from the purpose for which it was intended. Parliament did not intend for UK domiciled individuals to establish bogus overseas companies that are controlled from the UK or to manipulate the tax system to gain an advantage. By contrast, parliament fully intended that the British public could utilise tax-free savings, make use of personal allowances and pay into pension schemes to reduce the tax burden.
Are they both legal? Is the idea of ISA's to avoid paying tax ? if not just leave it in a building society. You don't want to pay more tax on some savings, I don't blame you for that.
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Millbrook Saint

Millbrook Saint

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No different than the schemes by the rich and famous, legal ways of paying less tax. Of course as always with Socialists its ok if they do it but jealousy if others do

 

You wouldn't mean that lefty hypocrite Gary evil tories blah blah blah, evil austerity cuts blah blah. I'll just avoid paying taxes, that's for the little people. Linker would you

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OldNick

OldNick

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You wouldn't mean that lefty hypocrite Gary evil tories blah blah blah, evil austerity cuts blah blah. I'll just avoid paying taxes, that's for the little people. Linker would you
as its Isa's and so avoiding tax that's alright as its his money, but if its other people who will lose their money that's ok, you know the rules of Socialists

Envy and jealousy, a true socialist would not bother trying to save paying any tax as they would be contributing to all peoples good.

I would add that I do not have any ISAs

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shurlock

shurlock

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Are they both legal? Is the idea of ISA's to avoid paying tax ? if not just leave it in a building society. You don't want to pay more tax on some savings, I don't blame you for that.

 

No you're trying to allege hypocrisy and play gotcha. I'll take my cues from the HMRC that says I can live with the happy socialist conscience that I pay my fair share while your claims are entirely specious, if that's OK with you :lol:

Edited by shurlock
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OldNick

OldNick

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No you're trying to allege hypocrisy and play gotcha. I'll take my cues from the HMRC that says I can live with a happy conscience that I pay my fair share while your claims are entirely specious. Hope that's OK with you :lol:
well it is hypocrisy, the only reason you have ISA's is to avoid paying tax, in so doing reducing the Governments resources, it is legal I never said any differently, but I don't go around spouting off about social justice. If you were earning £1m a year you would be looking for ways of avoiding paying 500k of it to the Government. It is how it is.
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shurlock

shurlock

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well it is hypocrisy, the only reason you have ISA's is to avoid paying tax, in so doing reducing the Governments resources, it is legal I never said any differently, but I don't go around spouting off about social justice. If you were earning £1m a year you would be looking for ways of avoiding paying 500k of it to the Government. It is how it is.

 

No it isn't. One is using the tax system as intended by Parliament, the other isn't.

 

It is a crucial distinction that guides the HMRC in everything it does - the latter can be challenged and defeated by the HMRC. But hey what does the HMRC know - some dimwit on a forum thinks he's uncovered the Panama Papers and knows better. Better try next time.

 

#happyinmysocialistskin

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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well it is hypocrisy, the only reason you have ISA's is to avoid paying tax, in so doing reducing the Governments resources, it is legal I never said any differently, but I don't go around spouting off about social justice. If you were earning £1m a year you would be looking for ways of avoiding paying 500k of it to the Government. It is how it is.

You are insane.

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

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Yeah its over 360 euro on Gdax this morning, I've theoretically made 12k this morning !!!!! - (edit) correction has happened i'm down to 9k now hahahhaah

 

I expect a correction but everyone is piling on before the conference starts in China i think tomorrow or weds

Edited by Convict Colony
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benjii

benjii

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Climbing again now.

 

The point about the exchanges is relevant. They've grown too quickly for their own infrastructure (technical and human) to cope at peak transaction-demand times. It's something that would put me off speculating too much at the moment. If you're loaded up and decide you need to get out quickly, I'm not sure you can be entirely confident of being able to sell.

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