10 year plan for St Mary's stadium

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Breaking News: Dinosaur skeleton found holding placard stating "Expand St Mary's now!" Experts say it's now closer than ever in geological time.

In Entertainment news...

 

[Turkish]

38 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

The current club CEO publically stating they have plans suggests it is edging closer in geological time. 

Welcome back MLG. 

[CB Fry]

I prayed and prayed and prayed.

And it worked.

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Just now, CB Fry said:

I prayed and prayed and prayed.

And it worked.

You want a stadium expansion that much?! 😂 

[Whitey Grandad]

Ten years is a long time for me and I doubt that I’ll see half of that but good luck with the future, lads!

[trousers]

Good to see you back MLG 👍

[suewhistle]

2 hours ago, CB Fry said:

I prayed and prayed and prayed.

And it worked.

It didn't work for me, you still can't manage an informative post or one without overdone sarcasm.

[Ted Bates Statue]

To paraphrase Kevin Costner, if you talk about building it, MLG will come.

Same time next year then...

[SaintBobby]

And to think....they used to say we'd never put a man on the moon (or whatever!)

 

[CSA96]

MLG coming back round for the world's most delayed victory lap 

[JRM]

This development is quite interesting in the context of land around the stadium and I think could also be relevant in the decision to move away fans away from what could soon become a building site 

 

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/24350849.plans-380-homes-former-gasworks-southampton-set-approval/?ref=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[Weston Super Saint]

4 minutes ago, JRM said:

This development is quite interesting in the context of land around the stadium and I think could also be relevant in the decision to move away fans away from what could soon become a building site 

 

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/24350849.plans-380-homes-former-gasworks-southampton-set-approval/?ref=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Not a hope in hell!

Quote

The proposed housing mix is 186 one-bed and 198 two-bed flats although there will be no affordable housing as part of the development.

 

[Nolan]

Seeing as this is recommended for approval, its worth noting that developers behind this are Groner Developments owned by Christoph Groner.

CG Elementum is one of his companies. and sponsors Hertha Berlin.

Pure absolute speculation, but a partnership for development around the stadium would surely be symbiotic. 

[Nolan]

27 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

  Quote

The proposed housing mix is 186 one-bed and 198 two-bed flats although there will be no affordable housing as part of the development.

If a viability assessment deems that the scheme would not be viable if affordable housing is in the scheme, then the plans can still be granted as the City needs housing provision. A net benefit of 400 properties within the city is better than 0 extra properties within the City.

There will more than likely be a stipulation that it is affordable housing viability is triple checked before a final agreement between the City and the developer is signed.

[SaintBobby]

Hate the term "affordable" housing...wish they'd just stipulate a price point. (Ultimately, all housing tends to be "affordable" for someone or no one would build it)

[Saint Fan CaM]

On 29/05/2024 at 08:17, SaintBobby said:

Hate the term "affordable" housing...wish they'd just stipulate a price point. (Ultimately, all housing tends to be "affordable" for someone or no one would build it)

I’ve always understood “affordable housing” to mean publicly owned rented housing…what in my time was once called ‘council houses’.  This made them ‘affordable’. They’re typically not so readily available to younger families nowadays thanks to the Tories introducing “Right to Buy” so they either fall into tenant private ownership or property developers buy up the houses and then rent them out themselves at higher rates.

[SaintBobby]

8 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

I’ve always understood “affordable housing” to mean publicly owned rented housing…what in my time was once called ‘council houses’.  This made them ‘affordable’. They’re typically not so readily available to younger families nowadays thanks to the Tories introducing “Right to Buy” so they either fall into tenant private ownership or property developers buy up the houses and then rent them out themselves at higher rates.

I don't think it has to be state owned, just comparatively cheap.

[VectisSaint]

7 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

I’ve always understood “affordable housing” to mean publicly owned rented housing…what in my time was once called ‘council houses’.  This made them ‘affordable’. They’re typically not so readily available to younger families nowadays thanks to the Tories introducing “Right to Buy” so they either fall into tenant private ownership or property developers buy up the houses and then rent them out themselves at higher rates.

Affordable housing can mean various things both for ownership and rental, but examples are shared ownership, first time buyer discounted etc.. Generally affordable homes are ways of providing homes to local people at less than the true market value. The developer often retains some part ownership of the property to protect their investment (make their profit).

[derry]

I've noticed in the past where developers for economic reasons exclude affordable housing have to make an equivalent contribution to allow affordable housing to be built on a different site.

[East Kent Saint]

2 hours ago, derry said:

I've noticed in the past where developers for economic reasons exclude affordable housing have to make an equivalent contribution to allow affordable housing to be built on a different site.

I don't think that happened if it did they changed the rules to allow developers to made a case to NOT build affordable homes if it affected their profits . They were also allowed to have separate poor people access so posh people would not have to mix with poor people or let poor people  use the gym or any other facility .

[Matthew Le God]

CEO Phil Parsons has 'apparently' said we'd need 24k season ticket holders to consider an expansion.

Perhaps we are getting close or maybe even there already....

https://x.com/SouthamptonFC/status/1800876707060064324?t=UHhbdpMvSdUNdJXNNIcsMA&s=19

[S-Clarke]

I think we need many years established in the PL, with regular high footfall and sell-outs before anything gets off the ground on this one.

All clubs need to keep an eye on expansion for sure, but there are more important costs for us to factor in over the next 4-5 years (i.e building a competitive and safe PL side). This is way down my list of priorities.

[goodymatt]

Everton’s new stadium is looking decent and will assist with supplementing their spend budgets in time. For a sustainable club like ours, we need to be similarly maximising our match day income. I would agree that we are not yet in the place to do that as relegation is a threat and we will not be selling more tickets in the championship.

Trouble is, unless we do get further investment, won’t relegation always be a real possibility? Everton have lucked out surviving in the PL over the last 3 seasons given this new stadium has been under construction since 2021. 

[Matthew Le God]

4 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I think we need many years established in the PL, with regular high footfall and sell-outs before anything gets off the ground on this one.

All clubs need to keep an eye on expansion for sure, but there are more important costs for us to factor in over the next 4-5 years (i.e building a competitive and safe PL side). This is way down my list of priorities.

We already have many recent years of top flight football with average of circa 30k. 

The season ticket number reaching 24k appears to be the metric the club will base a decision on. Perhaps we are close given the Tweet above.

Bigger attendances = bigger income = more money to improve squad to stay up under financial rules

[SambaMaverick]

6 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I think we need many years established in the PL, with regular high footfall and sell-outs before anything gets off the ground on this one.

All clubs need to keep an eye on expansion for sure, but there are more important costs for us to factor in over the next 4-5 years (i.e building a competitive and safe PL side). This is way down my list of priorities.

100%. It's not like any fans who want tickets can't get them. It'll just be full of more away fans and knobheads who get down the stairs on 35 minutes for the overpriced slop in the concourse.

[S-Clarke]

7 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

We already have many recent years of top flight football with average of circa 30k. 

The season ticket number reaching 24k appears to be the metric the club will base a decision on. Perhaps we are close given the Tweet above.

Bigger attendances = bigger income = more money to improve squad to stay up under financial rules

Yep I get that and it's a valid point, but it would still cost millions and millions of pounds to build - I don't personally think that's a sensible use of our money at the moment, let's build a PL side first and see where we are come 2030.

[Saint Gifford]

Dragon is a savvy media mogul that I guess understands that business more than most. 
 

I expect more trips and preseasons to Serbia and Eastern Europe to build the Saints name in the coming years. 
 

Expanding the fan base commercially on a pan European, global basis is where the income will be generated. Along with subscription services on TV mobile ect ect ect. 
 

We arent quite Man Utd status yet, but baby steps………..

St Mary’s in my humble opinion seems fit for purpose for the foreseeable. Team first.

 

[Turkish]

31 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Yep I get that and it's a valid point, but it would still cost millions and millions of pounds to build - I don't personally think that's a sensible use of our money at the moment, let's build a PL side first and see where we are come 2030.

didnt Lowe say the cost of expansion was £3k per seat, that was years ago so lets call if £5k per seat now. 10,000 new seats = £50m. What's the average cost of a season ticket, £600? So £6m a year. Would take about 8 years to pay for itself. But of course we'd sell more hot dogs too so maybe only 7.

[Chocolate Box]

Better value to be had in mending the bloody roof of the Chapel then. Fed up with getting soaked.🤬

[Miltonaggro]

31 minutes ago, Turkish said:

didnt Lowe say the cost of expansion was £3k per seat, that was years ago so lets call if £5k per seat now. 10,000 new seats = £50m. What's the average cost of a season ticket, £600? So £6m a year. Would take about 8 years to pay for itself. But of course we'd sell more hot dogs too so maybe only 7.

It might be that Lowe actually got something right after all.  Assuming that its just a stand expansion with Barr's bolt on used circa £40-50m, but if it also involved recladding / redeveloping the stadium infrastructure (which it should) getting on for £60-70m I would imagine.  We'd likely have to be nailed on top half and finding / selling a Lavia each summer before the green light from Serbia.

[rooney]

Rupes also said that we needed to sell 25K ST for 5 years before expansion considered.

[northam soul]

Should this actually happen in the future what would it consist of and look like.

Am i right in remembering it was just a Kingsland add on.

Edited June 12 by northam soul

[stevy777_x]

3 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Yep I get that and it's a valid point, but it would still cost millions and millions of pounds to build - I don't personally think that's a sensible use of our money at the moment, let's build a PL side first and see where we are come 2030.

Why delay what you can do now? Dragan can put some of his money without it hurting the club s finances. It would also not count for ffp rules

[JRM]

2 hours ago, rooney said:

Rupes also said that we needed to sell 25K ST for 5 years before expansion considered.

You'd have thought we'd need to be one of those teams with a season ticket waiting list 

[Charlie Wayman]

3 hours ago, Saint Gifford said:

Dragon is a savvy media mogul that I guess understands that business more than most. 
 

I expect more trips and preseasons to Serbia and Eastern Europe to build the Saints name in the coming years. 
 

Expanding the fan base commercially on a pan European, global basis is where the income will be generated. Along with subscription services on TV mobile ect ect ect. 
 

We arent quite Man Utd status yet, but baby steps………..

St Mary’s in my humble opinion seems fit for purpose for the foreseeable. Team first.

 

Sorry to throw cold water on your hopes but the first piority will be to survive in the PL and that will not be an easy task by any means. Think global but act local.

[Charlie Wayman]

On 30/05/2024 at 11:04, Saint Fan CaM said:

I’ve always understood “affordable housing” to mean publicly owned rented housing…what in my time was once called ‘council houses’.  This made them ‘affordable’. They’re typically not so readily available to younger families nowadays thanks to the Tories introducing “Right to Buy” so they either fall into tenant private ownership or property developers buy up the houses and then rent them out themselves at higher rates.

"Afforable housing" is meaningless Tory drivel aimed at pacifying the masses. Affordable for whom?

Let's hope Keir Starmer re-invents council housing, builds tens of thousands of them and ends the shame and anguish of young homelessness once and for all. 

Fourteen years of Tory Toffs starving the resources of public institutions, local authorities and the armed services so as to enrich themselves and their pals has left our country in a state of disorder, disarray and decline that would shame many developing countries and has left us defenceless against potential foes.

Edited June 12 by Charlie Wayman

[S-Clarke]

1 hour ago, stevy777_x said:

Why delay what you can do now? Dragan can put some of his money without it hurting the club s finances. It would also not count for ffp rules

The priority is that he invests in a team that allows us to compete and stay in the PL.

If he invests in a 70-100m stadium add on, but not the team, we then sit in the Champ with half an empty bowl and a shit ton of debt.

I never understand why fans get so excited about stadium expansion. It will happen when it happens, but it's so far down the list of things that need to be done right now.

Edited June 12 by S-Clarke

[Master Bates]

Apparently the red pedestrian line around the stadium is a measurement, a line to how far the Stadium can be expanded outwards.

[Saint Garrett]

Would be absolutely bonkers to stick an add on on the stadium, unless he’s got too much money and can’t spend it. 

My gut feeling is we got 4000 new STH, most of which probably cancelled last summer when we were relegated. Easy marketing. Even with 4k new ones, I would be shocked if we’ll have more than 22k STH next season.

[david in sweden]

On 12/05/2024 at 21:16, Whitey Grandad said:

Ten years is a long time for me and I doubt that I’ll see half of that but good luck with the future, lads!

I  guess we are in a similar generation Whitey..... so have faith . 

My inspiration is the thought that I look forward to Saints actually winning... something BIG ! 

[Mattio]

Improving the match day experience is much more important than increasing capacity. The new bars etc they're adding outside are the right way to go. Another massive improvement would be some sort of halt station on the train line outside, even if it was just a shuttle to central.

[suewhistle]

My Saints going experiences have ranged from 31,044 packed in to The Dell, down to its 14k capacity with the bench seats to St Marys where they were planning their budgets based on from 18k to 28k crowds and a 24k average..

So demand is a bit elastic, and although there has to be some fundamental underlying demand I wouldn't be too hung up on a waiting list for season tickets. Many can't justify them due to other commitments some of the time.

I'm a bit concerned the absence of a physical ticket will dissuade people from having one if you can't easily transfer it or lend it. I have an ST now but when living away was able to borrow various ones through connections. Either way there's a big casual market out there, and you also  need to keep a range of cheap seats for the kids and teenagers who can't commit.

I can't see expansion happening quickly but at least more likely than with the previous owners. How do concerts like Take That impact on the club's finances? Would more of them make expansion more likely?

[negium]

When you listen to the price of football podcast they go on about how clubs would rather not have too many season ticket holders as they make more money out of individual sales but obviously have to balance against the guaranteed income season tickets provide. So can imagine an expanded stadium allowing them to get more people in paying full price would be attractive to the club.

[northam soul]

This upcoming season will have an expansion though.

Block 1 will be open.

[Wade Garrett]

All the flats near the ground would be affordable if built.  Fucking shithole of an area, wouldn’t pay more than a tenner for one.

[Give it to Ron]

41 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

All the flats near the ground would be affordable if built.  Fucking shithole of an area, wouldn’t pay more than a tenner for one.

But you have a great pub opening right on door step in old ticket office!

An extra tenner at least….

[Lymington Saint]

6 hours ago, Mattio said:

Improving the match day experience is much more important than increasing capacity. The new bars etc they're adding outside are the right way to go. Another massive improvement would be some sort of halt station on the train line outside, even if it was just a shuttle to central.

We have had this before.  The problem is that the spur from the docks line westwards to Central was filled in and is now part of the school playing fields.  So even if the old Northam station was rebuilt trains could only go north.  The place for a matchday station is actually north of Northam road on the main line.  Unfortunately there is a traincare depot there now and there isn't room.  Think that we are stuck with having to walk back to Central.  Although I would love to see the bridge over the railway rebuilt to be twice as wide to stop the bottleneck going up the steps

I agree with you about improving the existing facilities.  SMS was built as a functional stadium without too many frills.  I can't imagine that the economics of expanding SMS are that great.  Much as a 40k+ stadium would be great, if SMS was 35-36k, then I think that it would be enough.

[The Kraken]

10 minutes ago, Lymington Saint said:

We have had this before.  The problem is that the spur from the docks line westwards to Central was filled in and is now part of the school playing fields.  So even if the old Northam station was rebuilt trains could only go north.  The place for a matchday station is actually north of Northam road on the main line.  Unfortunately there is a traincare depot there now and there isn't room.  Think that we are stuck with having to walk back to Central.  Although I would love to see the bridge over the railway rebuilt to be twice as wide to stop the bottleneck going up the steps

I agree with you about improving the existing facilities.  SMS was built as a functional stadium without too many frills.  I can't imagine that the economics of expanding SMS are that great.  Much as a 40k+ stadium would be great, if SMS was 35-36k, then I think that it would be enough.

Ideally I'd love to see a Leicester-type plan for expansion (I know Leicester aren't doing theirs but they got permission).  Would take capacity up to  around 40K which I think we could sell out for the top games.  Middle and lower ranked games wouldn't get up to that, but that's just something you have to accept.

What I wouldn't want is to a Cardiff, which is a similar thing but looks absolutely dreadful.

[Disco Stu]

I think that Leicester design is horrible. I hope ours won't look anything like that.

[OldNick]

Foresight is perhaps some people on here haven't got. I recall the people saying we wouldn't sell out a 30k stadium. As the population increases and perhaps with a modicum of success 40k is sustainable. 

The play off final showed how may fans we could attract with a bit of success. IMO we could have sold 5-10k more tickets on top of the 38k we did so.

I applaud the owners trying to generate bigger attendances, that I assume will help us to be able to spend more with the spending rules. 

Don't want to be left behind.

It will take years and so pretty quickly we will see if we are moving to sunlit uplands or swimming with Pompey and feeding at the sewer pipe