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The Next Manager Thread

ally_uk

By ally_uk,
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RobM

RobM

Posted
Posted
Viera is the new giggs

 

Former players who are given opportunities above their abilities and always think they should be managing massive clubs.

 

Give me a young hungry coach over those dudes

 

There's nothing to say those two aren't young hungry managers. I think your logic applies more to the likes of Tony Adams and Sol Campbell, who seem to have a chip on their shoulder about the lack of opportunities they have been gifted (despite being utterly dreadful, in Adam's case).

 

Our problem is we have absolutely no way of knowing whether an appointment will be a success or not, regardless of the managers history or 'record'. MoPo was OK with Espanyol, but then had a poor season and got sacked and he worked out well for us. Puel did very well in the French leagues and didn't work out so well. Equally, at other clubs, Howe had no 'record' before getting his opportunity and that's turned out OK. We just have to have faith in the people making the decision, as they've been right more than wrong in the past.

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baggytrousers

baggytrousers

Posted
Posted
There's nothing to say those two aren't young hungry managers. I think your logic applies more to the likes of Tony Adams and Sol Campbell, who seem to have a chip on their shoulder about the lack of opportunities they have been gifted (despite being utterly dreadful, in Adam's case).

 

Our problem is we have absolutely no way of knowing whether an appointment will be a success or not, regardless of the managers history or 'record'. MoPo was OK with Espanyol, but then had a poor season and got sacked and he worked out well for us. Puel did very well in the French leagues and didn't work out so well. Equally, at other clubs, Howe had no 'record' before getting his opportunity and that's turned out OK. We just have to have faith in the people making the decision, as they've been right more than wrong in the past.

 

Agree that we have to trust the people in charge to get it right.

 

Don't agree with your comment about MoPo. He worked miracles at Espanyol as anyone who looked a bit deeper would realise. The club were in dire financial straits and sold anyone who was any good so MoPo was continually having to rebuild from the youth team. By the time his last season came around he was having to play the tea lady.

 

Moral of the story is that you have to look deeper than last year's table to tell the worth of a manager.,

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RobM

RobM

Posted
Posted
Agree that we have to trust the people in charge to get it right.

 

Don't agree with your comment about MoPo. He worked miracles at Espanyol as anyone who looked a bit deeper would realise. The club were in dire financial straits and sold anyone who was any good so MoPo was continually having to rebuild from the youth team. By the time his last season came around he was having to play the tea lady.

 

Moral of the story is that you have to look deeper than last year's table to tell the worth of a manager.,

 

I agree entirely, which is why I don't think you can judge a potential manager on record alone. Puel's achievements in the French league were very good given his resources and getting to the ECL, he had a track record of working with youth and was happy to work on limited budgets... all sounds perfect, no?

 

My (badly made) point was historic records alone can't determine how successful a manager will be.

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Bad Wolf

Bad Wolf

Posted
Posted
Despite having little managerial experience, the idea of Viera coming to manage us excites me quite a bit but I can't put my finger on why.

 

Just typed his name into Google, there's nothing about him being linked to us. Where has this rumour even come from?

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Nolan

Nolan

Posted
Posted
Just typed his name into Google, there's nothing about him being linked to us. Where has this rumour even come from?

From the betting odds effectively. There's nothing on line or even on social media, so what's driving the betting?

 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted (edited)
From the betting odds effectively. There's nothing on line or even on social media, so what's driving the betting?

 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

Does constructive betting exist? Like you know putting a hundred on a complete outsider to push your real bet out to better odds. I see that De Boer has drifted to 6/1 ish with Sky. Ah right I see now that De Boer is 1/2 or the job at Palace, probably explains why he's 6/1 for Saints.

Edited by Window Cleaner
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miserableoldgit

miserableoldgit

Posted
Posted

Martin Samuels having a go again:-

We are*told that Gareth Southgate has the impossible job. Not true. Try managing Southampton.

 

Claude Puel was sacked last week, having finished eighth and reaching the League Cup final. The reason, apparently, was Southampton’s style of play. No goals, no excitement, it was claimed.

 

The fans were fed up — and the players, too.

 

So good luck to Puel’s successor. He needs to compete for Europe, while selling his best players — as Southampton always do — yet he must still win games with panache, in a way that keeps the crowd entertained and the players happy. Judging by what was intimated about Ronald Koeman after his departure, the owners probably want him to bring some kids through as well.

 

It might be easier for Southampton managers to please the crowd if the club had not sold Sadio Mane, Victor Wanyama, Graziano Pelle, Nathaniel Clyne, Morgan Schneiderlin, Luke Shaw and Adam Lallana over the last three years.

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

In the circumstances, he did rather well. Certainly, his successor has his work cut out.

 

 

 

 

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Saint_Jonny

Saint_Jonny

Posted
Posted
Martin Samuels having a go again:-

We are*told that Gareth Southgate has the impossible job. Not true. Try managing Southampton.

 

Claude Puel was sacked last week, having finished eighth and reaching the League Cup final. The reason, apparently, was Southampton’s style of play. No goals, no excitement, it was claimed.

 

The fans were fed up — and the players, too.

 

So good luck to Puel’s successor. He needs to compete for Europe, while selling his best players — as Southampton always do — yet he must still win games with panache, in a way that keeps the crowd entertained and the players happy. Judging by what was intimated about Ronald Koeman after his departure, the owners probably want him to bring some kids through as well.

 

It might be easier for Southampton managers to please the crowd if the club had not sold Sadio Mane, Victor Wanyama, Graziano Pelle, Nathaniel Clyne, Morgan Schneiderlin, Luke Shaw and Adam Lallana over the last three years.

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

In the circumstances, he did rather well. Certainly, his successor has his work cut out.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

He is not wrong though is he? Everything he says is true. I'd add "He needs to please Southampton's spoilt, trigger happy childish fanbase" to the list as well.

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Appy

Appy

Posted
Posted
Martin Samuels having a go again:-

We are*told that Gareth Southgate has the impossible job. Not true. Try managing Southampton.

 

Claude Puel was sacked last week, having finished eighth and reaching the League Cup final. The reason, apparently, was Southampton’s style of play. No goals, no excitement, it was claimed.

 

The fans were fed up — and the players, too.

 

So good luck to Puel’s successor. He needs to compete for Europe, while selling his best players — as Southampton always do — yet he must still win games with panache, in a way that keeps the crowd entertained and the players happy. Judging by what was intimated about Ronald Koeman after his departure, the owners probably want him to bring some kids through as well.

 

It might be easier for Southampton managers to please the crowd if the club had not sold Sadio Mane, Victor Wanyama, Graziano Pelle, Nathaniel Clyne, Morgan Schneiderlin, Luke Shaw and Adam Lallana over the last three years.

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

In the circumstances, he did rather well. Certainly, his successor has his work cut out.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

He had a go at us for appointing Puel in the first place.

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
Martin Samuels having a go again:-

We are*told that Gareth Southgate has the impossible job. Not true. Try managing Southampton.

 

Claude Puel was sacked last week, having finished eighth and reaching the League Cup final. The reason, apparently, was Southampton’s style of play. No goals, no excitement, it was claimed.

 

The fans were fed up — and the players, too.

 

So good luck to Puel’s successor. He needs to compete for Europe, while selling his best players — as Southampton always do — yet he must still win games with panache, in a way that keeps the crowd entertained and the players happy. Judging by what was intimated about Ronald Koeman after his departure, the owners probably want him to bring some kids through as well.

 

It might be easier for Southampton managers to please the crowd if the club had not sold Sadio Mane, Victor Wanyama, Graziano Pelle, Nathaniel Clyne, Morgan Schneiderlin, Luke Shaw and Adam Lallana over the last three years.

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

In the circumstances, he did rather well. Certainly, his successor has his work cut out.

 

 

 

 

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He's spot on.
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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted

Vieira only yesterday:

 

"I think to have my name linked with Saint-Etienne or any other team is always flattering, I think it's always good," Vieira said. "But it stops there. It's not going any further than that -- I am really happy here, I am really into the project because it is really exciting what we're trying to build at this football club and I want to be part of it."

 

So signing with us by the end of the week it is then.:rolleyes:

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted
He is not wrong though is he? Everything he says is true. I'd add "He needs to please Southampton's spoilt, trigger happy childish fanbase" to the list as well.

 

He's not really right though either, it's a typical tabloid trash article that twists the facts to fit an agenga and is written as if his opinion is what is actually happened. Pretty much typical Samuel, a mouthpiece who thinks his opinion is gospel.

 

He completely ignores the fact that the likes of Mane, lallana, Lovren, Shcniederlin, Wanyama all had massive tantrums and wanted to leave despite getting big contract offers from the club. Several of them were very clearly tapped up as well and had their heads turned by under hand tactics by the likes of Liverpool etc. I see he doesn't mention that one bit, I'm sure he's done articles on those moves and the underhand tactics of Liverpool probably claiming that it's just football and little clubs like Southampton should just accept it, but when it suits him it's a rod to beat the club with, very convenient.

 

The way he has written that is that the club wanted to sell the best players, which they didn't. The club was basically forced into a corner by the players throwing the tantrums and not wanting to lose those players for cut down prices or for free. If Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool etc. had been forced to sell players to say real madrid over and over would he have written about them the same way? I have my doubts.

 

Also

 

No goals, no excitement, it was claimed.

 

It wasn't claimed, no goals is a simple fact, we were very low scorers and failed to score at home for like 7 games. Football is an entertainment industry, I hope he's also criticising the West Brom fans who are moaning about Pulis and the terrible spectacle West Brom serve up to their paying customers.

 

He needs to compete for Europe

 

What is he basing this on?, where has anything been said that Puel was sacked because he didn't get into Europe? where is their an expectation that we are expecting this from our new manager? Again just making crap up.

 

yet he must still win games with panache, in a way that keeps the crowd entertained and the players happy
No **** Samuel, who'd have thought a club would expect a manager to win games, entertain the crowd and not fall out with players? That is like football management 101 for most clubs.

 

Fair play to him for getting paid for that sort of drivel, but that article is just tripe IMO.

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
He's not really right though either, it's a typical tabloid trash article that twists the facts to fit an agenga and is written as if his opinion is what is actually happened. Pretty much typical Samuel, a mouthpiece who thinks his opinion is gospel.

 

He completely ignores the fact that the likes of Mane, lallana, Lovren, Shcniederlin, Wanyama all had massive tantrums and wanted to leave despite getting big contract offers from the club. Several of them were very clearly tapped up as well and had their heads turned by under hand tactics by the likes of Liverpool etc. I see he doesn't mention that one bit, I'm sure he's done articles on those moves and the underhand tactics of Liverpool probably claiming that it's just football and little clubs like Southampton should just accept it, but when it suits him it's a rod to beat the club with, very convenient.

 

The way he has written that is that the club wanted to sell the best players, which they didn't. The club was basically forced into a corner by the players throwing the tantrums and not wanting to lose those players for cut down prices or for free. If Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool etc. had been forced to sell players to say real madrid over and over would he have written about them the same way? I have my doubts.

 

Also

 

 

 

It wasn't claimed, no goals is a simple fact, we were very low scorers and failed to score at home for like 7 games. Football is an entertainment industry, I hope he's also criticising the West Brom fans who are moaning about Pulis and the terrible spectacle West Brom serve up to their paying customers.

 

 

 

What is he basing this on?, where has anything been said that Puel was sacked because he didn't get into Europe? where is their an expectation that we are expecting this from our new manager? Again just making crap up.

 

No **** Samuel, who'd have thought a club would expect a manager to win games, entertain the crowd and not fall out with players? That is like football management 101 for most clubs.

 

Fair play to him for getting paid for that sort of drivel, but that article is just tripe IMO.

You've completely misunderstood his point.
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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
He's not spot on though is he. We've managed to improve season upon season doing exactly what he suggests for about 7 years in a row. It had to come to an end at some point and the club are seeming doing the right things to get 'back on track'. Replacing a manger who they didn't quite get right, seeking new investment so we can compete with Everton etc and a change in contract strategy (longer contracts). For example we are no longer under pressure to sell players to keep the club running. We are going through a change. We doing things the right way. One step back, two steps forward is fine by me.
You haven't understood him either. The point is simple. If you sell your best players, don't replace them and think you can do better than 8th, a cup final, whilst playing attacking football and using academy graduates, any new manager has an unenviable task.
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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
He's spot on.

 

He absolutely isn't. Maybe he could tell us how we keep hold of Wanyama and Clyne especially, when they are in the last year of their contracts and have made it clear that they are not going to sign a new one. It seems he is not criticising Everton for not getting Barkley to sign a new contract. Same really for Pelle. Morgan and Mane threw strops. Lallana had his head up someones harris. Funny he doesn't mention Lovren. But anyway Sour, if Samuels isn't going to, can you tell us all how we are supposed to keep the likes of Wanyama and Clyne here? I really would be interested to know anyone's thoughts on this.

 

And let's face it. Samuels is a bitter little man. Just because our ex chairman took him to the cleaners, he holds a rather childish grudge.

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
He absolutely isn't. Maybe he could tell us how we keep hold of Wanyama and Clyne especially, when they are in the last year of their contracts and have made it clear that they are not going to sign a new one. It seems he is not criticising Everton for not getting Barkley to sign a new contract. Same really for Pelle. Morgan and Mane threw strops. Lallana had his head up someones harris. Funny he doesn't mention Lovren. But anyway Sour, if Samuels isn't going to, can you tell us all how we are supposed to keep the likes of Wanyama and Clyne here? I really would be interested to know anyone's thoughts on this.

 

And let's face it. Samuels is a bitter little man. Just because our ex chairman took him to the cleaners, he holds a rather childish grudge.

You haven't understood his point. Have another read and cool down a bit would be my advice. You seem to have a childish, bitter grudge against Samuels for some reason.
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Nolan

Nolan

Posted
Posted
Would we conduct interviews at Staplewood? Don't we have offices in London?

You'd think a potential 'coach' would need to see the tools they have available...

 

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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
You haven't understood his point. Have another read and cool down a bit would be my advice. You seem to have a childish, bitter grudge against Samuels for some reason.

 

Oh I get his point Sour.....

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

He puts it down to player sales for the reason we played badly, and that Puel caught the flak from that. At least there is tacit acknowledgement that we were boring as hell even if contradicts what he said earlier in his piece. But tell me (asking again) how do you get the likes of Wanyama and Clyne to sign extensions? If they don't, the perceived course of action is to sell them rather than let the contract run out - are you against that? Pelle had huge wages on the table from China.

 

As for me holding a grudge against Samuels, I think you might have used the wrong word. unlike his relationship with the Club, and the Club suing him, I have never met nor interacted with him.

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Saint86

Saint86

Posted
Posted
Viera?? A rookie manager with zero success so far -

despite arguably having the best squad in the MLS and all the riches (Man C wealth) supporting him?

 

Didnt they lose the biggest game (playoff) 7-0?

 

Why would we be going down the untried and untested route?

 

No ta

 

They were struggling and at the bottom when he started...

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Saint86

Saint86

Posted
Posted
If Viera was appointed the meltdown on here would be f*****g biblical from the usual suspects!

 

I would actually be rather excited if we went for him.

 

Frustratingly he'll be gone to arsenal within 2 seasons if he does well though.

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
Oh I get his point Sour.....

 

Then again, to admit that this is the reason Southampton no longer play as they used to would mean taking responsibility for a drop in standards that was conveniently shifted on to Puel.

 

He puts it down to player sales for the reason we played badly, and that Puel caught the flak from that. At least there is tacit acknowledgement that we were boring as hell even if contradicts what he said earlier in his piece. But tell me (asking again) how do you get the likes of Wanyama and Clyne to sign extensions? If they don't, the perceived course of action is to sell them rather than let the contract run out - are you against that? Pelle had huge wages on the table from China.

 

As for me holding a grudge against Samuels, I think you might have used the wrong word. unlike his relationship with the Club, and the Club suing him, I have never met nor interacted with him.

You haven't understood his point. No-one has said we should have been able to hold onto Clyne or Wanyama.
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SKD

SKD

Posted
Posted
You haven't understood him either. The point is simple. If you sell your best players, don't replace them and think you can do better than 8th, a cup final, whilst playing attacking football and using academy graduates, any new manager has an unenviable task.

 

Whilst this is true, its a very simple way of looking at it.

 

Puel hasn't been sacked because of performances, he's been sacked because he lost the dressing room, fans and for the majority of the time played pretty awful football which probably resulted in the first 2.

 

I don't think we were wrong to sack him and whilst from the outside it appears a strange one, anyone who knows a bit of what happened last season will understand.

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JRM

JRM

Posted
Posted
So Samuels is saying that clubs shouldn't offload players who don't want to play for the club anymore? Interesting logic.

 

I don't think he is saying that? he is saying if over a period of time you lose your best players but expect the new manager to do as well (with inferior resources) then the job of the manager is made increasingly difficult, especially when we get to a cup final, finish 8th and that still isn't deemed good enough?

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
I don't think he is saying that? he is saying if over a period of time you lose your best players but expect the new manager to do as well (with inferior resources) then the job of the manager is made increasingly difficult, especially when we get to a cup final, finish 8th and that still isn't deemed good enough?
Exactly.
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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
I've stated it already. Don't get in a huff and actually read the article and the thread.

 

I really am not in a huff in the slightest. Its an anonymous forum - why would anyone get in a huff??

 

I did read the article and what you said, which is about selling players (or partially so) which is easy to criticise, yet you and him haven't come up with a bit about how to prevent them being sold. Replacing them - well look at the difference from last year to this one just gone. We sold a winger, a forward and a defensive midfielder, one who spent large parts of last season banned. We know who their replacements were. As for academy graduates, none were used out of necessity and none really featured that much.

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted
Whilst this is true, its a very simple way of looking at it.

 

Puel hasn't been sacked because of performances, he's been sacked because he lost the dressing room, fans and for the majority of the time played pretty awful football which probably resulted in the first 2.

 

I don't think we were wrong to sack him and whilst from the outside it appears a strange one, anyone who knows a bit of what happened last season will understand.

who says he lost the dressing room? He may have irked a few players but Ferguson did that as well. Jrod threw his toys out of the pram but he hardly is an important player to us
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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
I really am not in a huff in the slightest. Its an anonymous forum - why would anyone get in a huff??

 

I did read the article and what you said, which is about selling players (or partially so) which is easy to criticise, yet you and him haven't come up with a bit about how to prevent them being sold. Replacing them - well look at the difference from last year to this one just gone. We sold a winger, a forward and a defensive midfielder, one who spent large parts of last season banned. We know who their replacements were. As for academy graduates, none were used out of necessity and none really featured that much.

You've put your bitter grudge against Samuels over reading and understanding his article.
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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
who says he lost the dressing room? He may have irked a few players but Ferguson did that as well. Jrod threw his toys out of the pram but he hardly is an important player to us

 

I think you understate his importance to us. When you aren't as a team scoring goals, someone who in the past has scored plenty should be pretty important and you might think to try and get him match fit ASAP. Never really seemed that he was ever match fit, although more than happy to be corrected.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted
I think you understate his importance to us. When you aren't as a team scoring goals, someone who in the past has scored plenty should be pretty important and you might think to try and get him match fit ASAP. Never really seemed that he was ever match fit, although more than happy to be corrected.

 

Who can say with JRod, he was on fire in the Pochettino system until he got injured. Did the system make more of him than he actually is? Did being surrounded by such brilliant players make him look better than he actually was.

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DT

DT

Posted
Posted

We may be getting Palace's second choice...

 

 

Southampton and Crystal Palace are close to appointing new managers - with Mauricio Pellegrino and Frank de Boer on both clubs' final shortlists.

 

Sky Sports News HQ understands that Palace's search may be the more advanced, with Pellegrino and De Boer the hot favourites to replace Sam Allardyce at Selhurst Park.

 

Pellegrino has caught the eye of clubs across Europe after he led Alaves to a ninth-place finish in La Liga and an appearance in the Copa del Rey final.

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