Being a football supporter

[thesaint sfc]

I don't know if its just as I've got older and now I know all about the importance of adulthood, but has supporting a football club changed?

 

I feel like supporting a football club used to be far more about the starting 11 and who was staying, who were we going to sign. Now I find myself reading the financial reports that the club release and all of that sort of thing.

 

It's made me feel a lot more pessimistic towards the club and sport than I was in my younger days.

 

I suppose a big part of that is the joys of being in the Premiership. It's so much about money now that even the fans have to be heavily involved in the financial affairs.

 

I've fallen out of love with the sport in a big way and if it wasn't for my love of Southampton FC I think I would have another sport at the top of my pecking order.

 

It seems to me that we've reached our peak and a lot of fans aren't happy about it. I personally wouldn't want us to become a Man City or Chelsea where we just buy our success. I'd rather nail ourselves in to finish mid-table and have a cup run or get a lucky break one season and find ourselves in the top 3.

 

What changes would you like to see in Football to make things more exciting? What would you have Saints do that they're not doing at the moment?

[Pass the Dutchie]

I wouldn't want to support a club that's always expected to win and be champions at the end of it. Of course the ultimate goal is to achieve just that, but the great thing about supporting (a club like) Southampton FC is that one can actually be very excited and happy and proud about a win, because it's not considered 'normal'.

 

The disappointment anbout losing a few games in a row, like what's happening right now, is part of that. I'll take that any day over paying over $100M for a promising midfielder and maybe win a few games more.

 

I go into each game hoping but never expecting.

 

Changes? It'd be nice if some rules were (re-)introduced/enforced, like a minimum amount of players from the club's own youth in the starting 11, a stricter maximum amount of foreign players, a salary cap, and so on. Also on an international level. Clubs from smaller countries like the Netherlands don't stand a chance anymore.

[Jai27]

I don't know if its just as I've got older and now I know all about the importance of adulthood, but has supporting a football club changed?

 

I feel like supporting a football club used to be far more about the starting 11 and who was staying, who were we going to sign. Now I find myself reading the financial reports that the club release and all of that sort of thing.

 

It's made me feel a lot more pessimistic towards the club and sport than I was in my younger days.

 

I suppose a big part of that is the joys of being in the Premiership. It's so much about money now that even the fans have to be heavily involved in the financial affairs.

 

I've fallen out of love with the sport in a big way and if it wasn't for my love of Southampton FC I think I would have another sport at the top of my pecking order.

 

It seems to me that we've reached our peak and a lot of fans aren't happy about it. I personally wouldn't want us to become a Man City or Chelsea where we just buy our success. I'd rather nail ourselves in to finish mid-table and have a cup run or get a lucky break one season and find ourselves in the top 3.

 

What changes would you like to see in Football to make things more exciting? What would you have Saints do that they're not doing at the moment?

 

For a general change in football, I'd enforce a rule about having 3-5 home grown academy players in each starting line up. Not only would this likely improve the international squad but it would also stop teams just buying their way to the top. I think it would also give each club more of an identity with academy players having more of an allegiance to the club which taught them their trade (in theory...).

 

For Saints, I'm fairly happy with the way we are run as a club bar the lack of investment in the squad. If we sell a player then I expect us to put those profits back into the 1st team, not buy a half price replacement and pocket the rest.

 

I'd also like to see us have a club playing style as an identity. Reed always harps on about how we bring in managers that fit in with our style of play and the 'Southampton Way' but the reality is Poch, Koeman and Puel all have vastly different ideas about how to win a game of football and our academy has to adjust each time to fit in with this. Surely this can't be good for player development in the academy and first team.

[angelman]

What changes?? I would take Jai27 a bit further and impose a 2 or 3 foreign player limit to your starting XI. I can't recall football in the 1970s/80s being any less exciting than it is today, and I believe that there was a 2 foreign player limit then (but stand to be corrected). I remember recently catching some CL between Man City and Barca, and looking at the City team and wondering what exactly the connection between the players and the supporters was, apart from them playing at a stadium that so happened to be located in Manchester. We are a little better as we like to bring through from the academy, which I think is very important. Get a balance of academy and "imported" players. Keep a link between the club, the players and the community. The players/community link is naturally going to be stronger if you play (local) lads who have come through your academy.

Edited 17 January, 2017 by angelman

[mrfahaji]

I know there's plenty of reasons why it wouldn't work in practise, but a team salary cap would be fantastic. Sure, Manchester United could still have a bigger budget than Hull, but there would a semblance of scale to it. That way the big clubs couldn't afford to buy up all the best players unless those players agreed to significantly lower wages. It would certainly flush out which players were about the money or success. Plus clubs would have a genuine reason not to just hand players whatever wages they want, and it would become a more competitive environment.

[Mallagroth]

I've had a season ticket now since League one under Pardew (could only start affording one then).

 

I nearly didn't bother this season (writing has been on the wall) and pretty sure I won't next season if nothing changes much from where we are now.

Can't see the point in having spent all this money and not look forward to many games (and its not about results, its about the overall spectacle and match day experience). It feels as if the joy, excitement and passion is being sucked out of the club year on year. Whilst the overall game is getting more seedy, more corrupt and more ludicrous in its coverage.

 

The league has been much more successful when more teams are in the race. The desire to appease the top 6 and make it a shut shop needs to come to an end. True financial fair play needs to be introduced.. Referees need to be interviewed and held accountable. The vast money involved in the game means referees need to be in the spotlight when they blow it. If they need to be paid more to do this, then the clubs together need to cough it up because it is intrinsically damaging the sport now.

 

From saints point of view this should have been a great year but even in the build up to the Euro games I heard many fans saying they don't know why but they just didn't feel excited.

 

The club is becoming more 'stable' sure but not in the least bit entertaining or inspiring. It isn't just Puels fault, there is a real sense that across the entire operation we are becoming very passionless and process based. Yet what makes Football so great is the passion, the rivalry and the competition.

 

Bizarrely the thought of a relegation battle or a drop to the championship excites me much more right now than watching money be vacuumed out Saints whilst the team play a stable, uninspiring game with a group of mostly journeyman footballers and the occasional 'star' who rises above average and gets a chance to immediately move to a competitive team.

(lower the overall quality and its easier for one or two to stand out? Could be a good sales tactic.)

Edited 17 January, 2017 by Mallagroth

[angelman]

What really annoys me.....

 

Current Season Ticket holders will have until midnight on Sunday 15th May to take advantage of the renewal prices. Between Tuesday 5th April and Sunday 15th May, current unoccupied seats will be available to purchase.

 

This was for renewing your ST and the 15th May was the last day of last season. So the club on the back of a good season entices you to renew your ticket, and then serves up mediocre dross having predictably sold the players that went, and somewhat unsurprisingly bought inferior players who haven't preformed. Coupled with that a change in manager to one who changes the team so damned often, that it is somewhat annoying. Sure you can say that you support Saints and you will go come what may, but I think it a pretty shoddy way of treating your customers, what with taking their custom as guaranteed.

[Oldeuboi]

Isn't it just simply because all this and more information is out there and easily accessible via the internet?

 

In the past, information was drip fed through paper media, limited TV slots and word of mouth. People didn't know much about finances etc because the information wasn't out there, so therefore it wasn't an issue. Now we can actually go and read Saints' yearly accounts online. I like doing that because I find all the "background" stuff at football clubs fascinating but I'm sure others feel it's too far away from the game.

 

Of course, knowing so much can sort of kill the excitement for games because we're encountering football pretty much every day of the week (this forum is testament to that). I'm definitely less excited during the week for games, but I still get the thrill and excitement on the matchday.

[Graffito]

Football's not perfect but I don't know what I'd do without it. First playing and supporting Saints, now just supporting and following football. It's been my life since I was a small boy. What I would be doing without it. Going around Sainsbury's with Mrs G probably. Nice but, ya know. Some will disagree but I think all this angst is mostly because we're not winning. Get to Wembley and everything will look more positive.

[OldNick]

What changes?? I would take Jai27 a bit further and impose a 2 or 3 foreign player limit to your starting XI. I can't recall football in the 1970s/80s being any less exciting than it is today, and I believe that there was a 2 foreign player limit then (but stand to be corrected). I remember recently catching some CL between Man City and Barca, and looking at the City team and wondering what exactly the connection between the players and the supporters was, apart from them playing at a stadium that so happened to be located in Manchester. We are a little better as we like to bring through from the academy, which I think is very important. Get a balance of academy and "imported" players. Keep a link between the club, the players and the community. The players/community link is naturally going to be stronger if you play (local) lads who have come through your academy.

Now we are out of Europe (or when) perhaps we will be able to put such a player limit, up til now that has been impossible due to European law

[Secret Site Agent]

I don't know if its just as I've got older and now I know all about the importance of adulthood, but has supporting a football club changed?

 

I feel like supporting a football club used to be far more about the starting 11 and who was staying, who were we going to sign. Now I find myself reading the financial reports that the club release and all of that sort of thing.

 

It's made me feel a lot more pessimistic towards the club and sport than I was in my younger days.

 

I suppose a big part of that is the joys of being in the Premiership. It's so much about money now that even the fans have to be heavily involved in the financial affairs.

 

I've fallen out of love with the sport in a big way and if it wasn't for my love of Southampton FC I think I would have another sport at the top of my pecking order.

 

It seems to me that we've reached our peak and a lot of fans aren't happy about it. I personally wouldn't want us to become a Man City or Chelsea where we just buy our success. I'd rather nail ourselves in to finish mid-table and have a cup run or get a lucky break one season and find ourselves in the top 3.

 

What changes would you like to see in Football to make things more exciting? What would you have Saints do that they're not doing at the moment?

 

I've got to be honest, that I do the same and I believe it is down to the fact that we went bust. I remember telling my wife that I was going to take my 5 year old daughter to the match. She asked me why, when I didn't take my other two until they were 8-9, and I remember telling the missus, 'I want to take her to see Saints play, before there are no more Saints left.' And I must confess that, oddly enough, once we got relegated again to the League one, I found my love for football again especially Saints.

Now we are back, and it looks like we're ging to be the mid table, Johnny also rans again, I can feel my love waning again.

Still watch it, still enjoy it, still hopeful, but more critical when we don't spend on players, critical when we sell, but understanding (and frustrated) none the less that we are financially stable and won't go POP again.

But how many of us would wish to spunk it all for a cup win and languish in the lower leagues, or remain where we are with the business model we have now, financially stable, but with the two year cycle of an unknown team and manger one year, success year two, sales and moving , and rebuilding and starting again.

But hey, at least my kids can still see saints, as they do still exist. And part of me still misses watching us against Dagenham and Redbridge

[Pamplemousse]

I know there's plenty of reasons why it wouldn't work in practise, but a team salary cap would be fantastic. Sure, Manchester United could still have a bigger budget than Hull, but there would a semblance of scale to it. That way the big clubs couldn't afford to buy up all the best players unless those players agreed to significantly lower wages. It would certainly flush out which players were about the money or success. Plus clubs would have a genuine reason not to just hand players whatever wages they want, and it would become a more competitive environment.

 

I agree with the idea of a salary cap in principle, but for it to work, at the very least it would have to be applied across all of the UEFA nations. Otherwise, everyone would just buggger off to Spain, France, Germany and Italy.

[mrfahaji]

I agree with the idea of a salary cap in principle, but for it to work, at the very least it would have to be applied across all of the UEFA nations. Otherwise, everyone would just buggger off to Spain, France, Germany and Italy.

 

Yeah exactly, and there would be plenty of legal problems with it too. But I can dream!

[Mowgli]

It's a different game but the fans are the same. My first season I could not believe the abuse that players like Stokes, Fisher and Melia got from the fans. A lot of moaning idiots around me. Wasn't even sure I wanted to stick around but I did. Even the legend that is Francis Benali was held in less regard than JWP has is in recent weeks (incidentally, I'd rather see a team of JWP's in the side than the likes of Mane, Clyne, Wanyama and Alderweireld who clearly just see us as a stepping stones to a 'real' club).

 

The lack of internet meant we really did not know anything of the club behind the scenes, And frankly we didn't care (personally speaking I still don't)

 

I think Lawrie Mac changed the club big time. Most players stayed for 10 years or more under Ted Bates but LM created a team of journeymen reaching the end of their career, that won us the cup. He also was the first to delve into the European market. The turnover has been significantly higher ever since. Right now, we are about to lose the last of the players that was with us five years ago. Quite some change!

 

That said, I think we are starting to revert to our former glory. There are some really good youngsters coming through and JWP, Reed, Sims, McQueen and Gape have already been here around 10 years. I think the youngsters will get a real kick about sticking together to win major honours with the first team but time will tell. It will take a while to get there and if we lose a few fans along the way who demand instant success then so be it. Not a bad thing.

[bangkoksaint]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

[SKD]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

 

Have to say I agree.

 

Obviously as a supporter I want to see us do the best we can, but I hate the PL and the type of fan and corporate bulls!t it brings. For me, other than being in the top league and seeing some of the best players in the world (even that gets boring after a while), the only benefit of the PL is getting into Europe. Unfortunately I can't see that happening for a while and when we do, we don't take it seriously anyway.

[Heisenberg]

Could learn alot from the NFL

[mrfahaji]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

 

The Championship under Adkins or under Poortvliet?

 

When we were relegated I remember looking on the bright side - "at least we'll win a few more games now!" I chortled, safe in the knowledge that we would never again be facing a relegation battle, until of course we were inevitably promoted again. Losing every week in the Championship is no more fun, and probably worse, than in the Premier League.

 

Of course that is the paradox that we football fans are forever locked in. We spurn the top division, because it is the breeding ground of all that is wrong with the modern game. But ultimately, winning makes fans happy, and fans throughout the country aspire for promotion (the causality of the two could be argued...), and yet when they reach the promised land they realise it isn't all it's cracked up to be.

[davefoggy]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

 

This

[Whitey Grandad]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

 

And Saturday afternoons

[adrian lord]

Loved league 1 and The Championship. Gave me the feel good factor winning which is the same as the Prem but happened more often. Cheaper to see Saints and more games. For me if we were destined for mediocrity in the Prem with mid table finishes and no cups runs I'd plump for relegation and some excitement.

 

Same.

 

Not been to a single game since promotion to the prem. Loved the League 1 and Championship games. P'boro away, terraces, muddy carparks, etc.

[DuncanRG]

I'd also like to see us have a club playing style as an identity. Reed always harps on about how we bring in managers that fit in with our style of play and the 'Southampton Way' but the reality is Poch, Koeman and Puel all have vastly different ideas about how to win a game of football and our academy has to adjust each time to fit in with this. Surely this can't be good for player development in the academy and first team.

 

That's a bit unfair. Each manager has his quirks, but 'vastly different' would be Pulis vs Guardiola vs Conte. We can't expect total uniformity because any decent manager wants to have input on how the team plays, but they all have a passing style and (basic) formation in common.

 

I know there's plenty of reasons why it wouldn't work in practise, but a team salary cap would be fantastic. Sure, Manchester United could still have a bigger budget than Hull, but there would a semblance of scale to it. That way the big clubs couldn't afford to buy up all the best players unless those players agreed to significantly lower wages. It would certainly flush out which players were about the money or success. Plus clubs would have a genuine reason not to just hand players whatever wages they want, and it would become a more competitive environment.

 

...and all the best players would move abroad.

[mrfahaji]

That's a bit unfair. Each manager has his quirks, but 'vastly different' would be Pulis vs Guardiola vs Conte. We can't expect total uniformity because any decent manager wants to have input on how the team plays, but they all have a passing style and (basic) formation in common.

 

...and all the best players would move abroad.

 

Yes it would obviously have to be a UEFA-wide or even worldwide policy. And I realise that that is impractical, but from a purely theoretical/hypothetical point of view, it would improve the game immensely in my opinion.

 

Also, while it is nice to see good players, I support Southampton and I want us to be better than everyone else. I don't really mind if that's through us improving or everyone else getting worse.

[THINWHITEDUKE]

Have to say I agree.

 

Obviously as a supporter I want to see us do the best we can, but I hate the PL and the type of fan and corporate bulls!t it brings. For me, other than being in the top league and seeing some of the best players in the world (even that gets boring after a while), the only benefit of the PL is getting into Europe. Unfortunately I can't see that happening for a while and when we do, we don't take it seriously anyway.

 

Exactly this

[Barry the Badger]

For me it's simple really. I've been aligned with the clubs goals for many many years, through relegation battles, cup runs, promotion campaigns, I knew what the club were trying to achieve and it matched what I wanted the club to achieve as a fan. It's easy to get passionate about that, you feel at one with the club and players targets.

 

Having established ourselves as a very good prem team, I was aligned with the clubs goals as it fought to make Europe. Then it's diverged.

 

The club weren't that bothered about Europe, I REALLY was. I wanted us to prioritise it, the club gave it second billing behind trying to finish "top of our mini league" in the prem. I understand why they're doing that, it's where the money is, but I just feel like there's little point in finishing 6th, 7th, 8th if we then aren't going to really try in Europe.

 

So success for the club now is finishing 7th, and I don't really care about that, but we're good enough to stay out of trouble, so the consequence of the club failing is we finish 13th or something. I just don't really care. In the past it felt as though every match mattered, whether it was a relegation battle, cup run, promotion attempt or push for Europe. This season feels like the games don't really matter at all, because even if we have a great season and get into Europe, the club will **** it away again. I don't even feel confident that we will play our best 11 for the second leg Liverpool game, which is a mad situation to be in.

[mrfahaji]

Have to say I agree.

 

Obviously as a supporter I want to see us do the best we can, but I hate the PL and the type of fan and corporate bulls!t it brings. For me, other than being in the top league and seeing some of the best players in the world (even that gets boring after a while), the only benefit of the PL is getting into Europe. Unfortunately I can't see that happening for a while and when we do, we don't take it seriously anyway.

 

Without wanting to start a "What have the Romans ever done for us?" thread, it is nice being able to watch every game, even if it is on a dodgy stream... although on the flip side I do like regular Saturday 3pm kick offs throughout the division!

[SonicBoom]

I am fed up with the media coverage. Talk Sport has a real opportunity to cover football 24/7. They could cover every league team in depth and yet every single show starts with "we are going to talk about the top 6. Jose, Pep, Wenger, ...." over and over again. No one else really gets mentioned other than being there to provide opposition.

The back pages and the websites are the same. There are 15 stories about Man U before any other team is mentioned. Including pictures of the players walking in or out of a hotel.

Drives me nuts. No one else exists.

I know they think that most people support these clubs but when you add all the supporters together from all the other clubs, the majority most definitely don't support the top 6.