Puel so far, not a good fit for saints? or the man to take us forward?

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Perhaps we should let Puel speak in his native tongue. Then at least those educated to O level French standard would make more sense out of what he is trying to say.

 

He really is the most un-animated of men, how the hell he impressed Reed in his interview I haven't a clue.

[Donatello]

I think Puel can take some credit on the defence because

a. He is doing it without Victor sitting in front.

 

b. We are only playing one holding DM instead of two like last season

c. The defence has still looked solid when we have rotated in Yoshida, Cuco and McQueen which wasn't the case last season.

 

Decent point.

 

Anyway, I can't imagine Puel is at risk at all. A top-half finish and a league cup semi-final will probably ensure that he's here next season, regardless of playing style.

[Kingsland Red]

It's credit to the man that he has given established players Long and JRod so much time to find their form.

How we are 9th with so few goals is a credit to his organisation.

Now it's over to Les to ship out the deadwood and the Black Box to identify and bring in some much needed firepower.

We will have a better idea of where we are after the window closes.

Edited 15 December, 2016 by Kingsland Red

[benjii]

Im think we need to back him in the transfer market to bring in his own team. I think the midfield pairing of Jwp, clasie davis and hoijberg are the issue. None offer that box to box driving runs (on and off the ball) that creates additionL number im and around the box and overlaps behind the lines.

 

Agreed, plus the absence of a striker that suits his system (other than Jay Rod but he is still clearly sub-optimal in performance level).

 

It's a work in progress. If the club wanted a quick-fix approach they could have appointed someone else but clearly they see something in him for the long-term. Talk of "giving him until the end of the season" is therefore, in my opinion, short-sighted.

 

I don't think Puel will have had any real say in what the current squad looks like, with the probable exception of endorsing the Boufal signing. I would give him until the end of next season, at least, and give him the opportunity to sign a decent forward that he thinks will suit his system. We also need a central midfielder who makes decent runs beyond the striker.

 

There's also a lot of rewriting history and plan-wrong assessments of the football. As though Koeman was some sort of total football maverick coach. We played a lot of crap under Koeman too at times. Our 6th placed finish was excellent but also a bit freakish in the context of how we played in a lot of matches.

 

Given the number of games we've had already and the strengthening of Man U, Chelsea and Liverpool, our current league position is pretty decent, I would say.

 

People are just getting annoyed because they aren't saying many goals. That's understandable but sometimes longer-term gains mean a bit of adjustment in the short term.

[benjii]

It's credit to the man that he has given established players Long and JRod so much time to find their form.

How we are 9th with so few goals is a credit to his organisation.

Now it's over to Les to ship out the deadwood and the Black Box to identify and bring in some much needed firepower.

We will have a better idea of where we are after the window closes.

 

Exactly. We don't have a single striker that any decent team would be interested in signing as their primary goal-threat.

[nta786]

My take is most fans would happily take are current style if we were winning 1-0 in most of our games and sitting in the top six tight now. I bet playing super exciting football but losing nine goal thrillers most weeks would get old pretty quick.

 

I'll admit to this.

 

I'd gladly take 1-0 wins every week even if it meant we score with our one and only chance and get dominated for the whole game.

Yes I'd love exciting football etc but all that matters ultimately is the result- and unless you are a big big club you can't have both.

[Saint_Jonny]

He's doing a good job with the players at his disposal - especially when you consider the number of games we have already played this season.

[The9]

We haven't had any stand out fixture win really this season. Under Koeman we had that 3-1 win away against Wham. We of course beat them away this season, but they weren't really the same team in their new stadium.

 

We beat them by more, and that's hardly Puel's fault. Also, we've beaten Inter Milan, and Arsenal away, and he's only been here 6 months. What more do you want exactly?

[The9]

Perhaps we should let Puel speak in his native tongue. Then at least those educated to O level French standard would make more sense out of what he is trying to say.

 

He really is the most un-animated of men, how the hell he impressed Reed in his interview I haven't a clue.

 

Champions League semi-final, French league winner, committed to bringing kids through, experience with a formation we clearly wanted to use, not asking to be paid top 10 in the world wages.

 

To be honest with what he's already done this season I'm quite surprised people aren't giving him more plaudits. Opportunities for McQueen, Targett, Reed and Sims, nicely managing Boufal, very solid defensively despite rotating the whole defence at various points, sensible management of the squad through a frankly ridiculous fixture list and giving us the best chance to get results without writing off any competition.

 

We are currently dull, whilst in the midst of a draining run of fixtures, and missed out on EL knockouts because we aimed to be one goal better than the third placed team and with the fine margins given... weren't.

[Dangermouth]

@ OP. Let's not change like the wind; it's terrible being downwards of it. Nor should we be happy clappers and club apologists. Wait and see is the answer. Thus far it seems that all (most) of the reports of CP from his previous tenures in France are accurate. FYI OGC Nice are still hanging on at top of the league at present so must have a good team. They score about 2 a game. Perhaps the likes of Window Cleaner can tell us more. It seems to be a thing with this team and has been for a while: if we cannot win easily we struggle. The goals for column is very worrying as is the turgid fare on offer. What we need to recruit is mentally strong characters who will inject some of that into members of our squad and perhaps things will happen. Otherwise, provided we survive (and do well next year), we'll have to see if CP has his contract renewed. As our ambitions are far loftier than we have shown at the moment and currently it does not look as though we will win anything as we are playing very poorly - which surely by now is required if we are not simply to exist as "also-rans" - then CP's fate looks somewhat grim. Perhaps a few of the players' fates too.

 

Merry Christmas and all that.

[Pamplemousse]

We're 9th in the table and one round away from a Wembley final.

 

He's done wonders for us. If we can just work on converting our chances, we'll finish 6th or 7th again.

[Dangermouth]

At the end winning is all that matters but right after that comes entertainment and entertainment is good football. You can play bad tactically and make mistakes on the pitch but as long put a lot of entertainment against that then people will say that you play good.

 

Possession and controlling games might be good football in some peoples eyes cause 'the other team cant score when you have the ball' (and that kind of nonsense) but its boring, its been the biggest topic in Dutch football the last few years where coaches and players were padding themselves on the back because they had 70% ball possession, well who cares, you created one chance with that so thats a pretty poor job you did there. Passing the ball from your CB's to your midfielders, back to the CB's, then to the full backs and then back to the midfielders again isnt exciting and very easily to defend against.

 

Playing it safe with a good organisation on the pitch and going forward with as less risks as possible will get you some results, might even give you some compliments in the media but at the end, it will all blur away in the minds of the fans cause there's nothing memorable about that. And lets be honest, those are the only moments that stick in your mind while the rest of the season fades away.

 

In my eyes we dont play good football, havent been impressed this entire season so far and that started with the first game i saw in the pre-season. Now i wont blame Puel for the options we have on the midfield but then i dont understand why he wants to play in this style we play. So im not that impressed with Puel, havent seen a single substitute or change on the pitch as well that changed a game. Its all the same and very predictable, last night was a another prime example of that.

 

I agree with this.

[Jonnyboy]

If he hasn't got the charisma we obviously need an x-factor style popularity contest. I vote Dodd & Benali dream team.

[Kingsland Red]

Dennis Wise and Harry Bassett had that cockney charisma, they just never won a football match

[Ashby Saint]

From the few games I've seen at SMS and the many on the telly, I think the problem is professional strikers not doing their job. The team creates chances and some of the misses are simply un-excusable for someone paid £1000s per week to kick a ball around a pitch. I would like to see what a Puel team can do with better options up front - starting with a recall for Sam from Blackburn.

[Colinjb]

Yes.

 

Points wise, we're on track to match, or possibly surpass, last year's total at the half way stage.

 

Of course, that means we need to improve substantially in the 2nd half of the season, much like Koeman did.

 

So, bottom line, it's still way too early to judge Puel. One thing we can say is that we haven't gone backwards.... yet... but if we can't start finding the back of the net more regularly in the 3rd quarter of the season then that will be the time to start questioning the manager's credentials.

 

IMHO of course.

 

Entirely agree. Puel's challenge is to get our strikers firing again. Jay and Long are shadows of their former selves and without Austin we need them, Tadic, Boufal and our our midfield to take some chances themselves. At the moment only Boufal is making anything happen.

 

All manner of sins can be forgiven of our attacking players show their full hand.

[The Cat]

We missed a trick by not sacking him and poaching Martin Allen before he went to Eastleigh. If only our players were taking a dip in the Solent for training we'd be through to the knockout stages of the Europa League.

[darren2]

For me it's not just the strikers..... We're so bloody boring to watch!! After 16 games last year we were 5th (As opposed to 9th), but had 5 points more than we do now. But we'd scored 25 goals as opposed to 14, and despite our negative play this year had conceded one less goal at this stage last year...... So we're no better as some are saying. When we lost with the attacking football, as least we "Had a go", now we don't look like we want to get out of bed!

 

http://www.worldfootball.net/schedule/eng-premier-league-2014-2015-spieltag/16/

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table

 

Personally, I find it difficult to get excited about watching a team that doesn't even look like they're trying, with little attack.

[mrfahaji]

I'll admit to this.

 

I'd gladly take 1-0 wins every week even if it meant we score with our one and only chance and get dominated for the whole game.

Yes I'd love exciting football etc but all that matters ultimately is the result- and unless you are a big big club you can't have both.

 

Maybe at the extremes this works, of course I'd rather we were in the top half than fighting relegation regardless of style. However, if the choice is between 9th playing soporific football and 11th playing exciting football, is the first one necessarily better? At the time, throwing away a lead because we've been attacking might be frustrating, but at the end of the season wouldn't you rather look back at some genuine highs and lows rather than thinking "well overall that was good because because we won a couple of more 1-0s than we lost"?

 

I'm not saying this is the way everyone should feel, or even whether I feel it myself. Just making a case for the opposing view.

[doddisalegend]

For me it's not just the strikers..... We're so bloody boring to watch!! After 16 games last year we were 5th (As opposed to 9th), but had 5 points more than we do now. But we'd scored 25 goals as opposed to 14, and despite our negative play this year had conceded one less goal at this stage last year...... So we're no better as some are saying. When we lost with the attacking football, as least we "Had a go", now we don't look like we want to get out of bed!

 

http://www.worldfootball.net/schedule/eng-premier-league-2014-2015-spieltag/16/

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table

 

Personally, I find it difficult to get excited about watching a team that doesn't even look like they're trying, with little attack.

 

errr we weren't 5th this time last season we were 12th with 5W, 6 D, 5 L which I think is exactly the same as our record this season....

[sadoldgit]

Personally I don't think it is the manager or Les Reed we need to get rid of......its the negative fans who seem to have forgotten where we were just a few years ago!

[Wade Garrett]

9th in the league despite playing in the Europa Cup is pretty good. That competition has almost relegated teams in the past, so to be where we are is ok.

 

We definitely need more up front though. I'm not entirely convinced the players rate the manager.

[Strangely Brown]

We're 9th in the table and one round away from a Wembley final.

 

He's done wonders for us. If we can just work on converting our chances, we'll finish 6th or 7th again.

 

Spot on!

Long's loss of form and Jay Rod still trying to find his form in a rotation system and Charlie picking up an unfortunate injury, is a difficulty and we are still doing ok. If we were not creating any chances then I would be more concerned.

[DJ_TOAST]

Get Adkins back, and let him finish the job he didn't get a chance to finish.

[kitch]

He's basically been here 5mins. If we'd had no positives since the start of the season, then maybe I'd also be thinking of wetting my bed, but there have been plenty of positives. Easily enough to give him a full season at the very least, possibly two. He's clearly a clever guy, I reckon he knows what he's doing too.

The only problem I think is that our attacking players struggle to play in the defensive systems he operates in. Koeman played quite defensively, but looked to hit the opposition quickly on the break. When Puel wants to break, it seems the solution (one of his words) is to try and pass it forwards. I do that on FIFA17, and I get bored watching myself play!

 

My only concern is that the last manager who tried to pass it around without an end product was Roberto Martinez (to my mind). Now, he couldn't set his teams up to defend, and Puel is good at that, so it's not a mega-worry. It does sit in the back of my mind though.

 

But he has EASILY shown enough to be given a full season at the absolute minimum. To even suggest it's his fault at this stage, to me, seems crazy.

 

Besides, it's probably in his contract that we have to have a **** end to the year. It's standard procedure.

[warsash saint]

Champions League semi-final, French league winner, committed to bringing kids through, experience with a formation we clearly wanted to use, not asking to be paid top 10 in the world wages.

 

To be honest with what he's already done this season I'm quite surprised people aren't giving him more plaudits. Opportunities for McQueen, Targett, Reed and Sims, nicely managing Boufal, very solid defensively despite rotating the whole defence at various points, sensible management of the squad through a frankly ridiculous fixture list and giving us the best chance to get results without writing off any competition.

 

We are currently dull, whilst in the midst of a draining run of fixtures, and missed out on EL knockouts because we aimed to be one goal better than the third placed team and with the fine margins given... weren't.

 

Too much sense for one post !!

 

Too many supporters are getting unrealistic expectations after the last couple of seasons results.

[mrfahaji]

In terms of his overall club management he is doing an excellent job. My main concern is about our style of play and whether it's here to stay or just that the players are quite getting it right at the moment (or that they aren't good enough).

 

Be'er Sheva, Middlesbrough and Stoke have all been played in exactly the same manner (maybe Palace too?) i.e. pass it around with no tempo, urgency or creativity, sucking the life out of the game and rarely looking likely to score. Maybe with so many games at the moment this style of play is necessary to preserve energy and maximise points over the period, in which case fair enough. But if this is going to be the way we play out every game then surely it deserves questioning?

 

For some people it's not about where the club are or expectations of where we should be, but rather the simple question of how enjoyable it is to watch our team play.

[OttawaSaint]

Despite what folks on here claim to know, we don't know the inner workings of Saints.

 

We don't know what Claude's mandate is, but what we do know are the players that have been afforded to him to get a job done. I'm guessing here but likely; top half, decent cup runs, out of the group in Europa.

 

So far he's doing pretty well with what he has. My opinion is that he is a very smart man who knows more about coaching a football team than any of us here do. I think he knows his attacking options are a bit limited, he's been unlucky with injuries to Boufal, Tadic, Austin, JRod, Long etc. but realises that even though the attack is a bit blunt, he can still install a team defense and make sure not to lose games while we are in this difficult period.

 

To me it's a bit like Karate Kid (the original, not that new ****ty version), Daniel wants to go all out attack but Mr Miagi knows that he might win a few but he will likely get his ass kicked most of the time. So what he does is have Daniel work tirelessly (even tediously) on defense because he knows that a strong defense is what wins Karate bouts.

[Wurzel]

For me it's not just the strikers..... We're so bloody boring to watch!! After 16 games last year we were 5th (As opposed to 9th), but had 5 points more than we do now. But we'd scored 25 goals as opposed to 14, and despite our negative play this year had conceded one less goal at this stage last year...... So we're no better as some are saying. When we lost with the attacking football, as least we "Had a go", now we don't look like we want to get out of bed!

 

http://www.worldfootball.net/schedule/eng-premier-league-2014-2015-spieltag/16/

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table

 

Personally, I find it difficult to get excited about watching a team that doesn't even look like they're trying, with little attack.

 

You are linking to and quoting from a league table from 2 years ago not last year.

Try this one for last year http://www.worldfootball.net/schedule/eng-premier-league-2015-2016-spieltag/16/ Same as this year, 5-6-5 , admittedly with more goals scored (and conceded) but were lying in 12th place

[Lord Duckhunter]

I can't see too many managers given Shane Long,a post injury JRod, JWP, Davo,Redmond & Classie would do much better than Claude has done, certainly not Ronald Koeman. Just look at their career records and then ask yourself why we're not scoring goals. With the tools he's been given,he's doing a pretty good job.

[Pamplemousse]

Get Adkins back, and let him finish the job he didn't get a chance to finish.

 

He was the opposite to a Puel! Great going forward, not so much at the back.

 

Perhaps we should do it NFL style. Puel can be our defensive coordinator and Adkins our offensive coordinator.

[doddisalegend]

He was the opposite to a Puel! Great going forward, not so much at the back.

 

Perhaps we should do it NFL style. Puel can be our defensive coordinator and Adkins our offensive coordinator.

 

 

I'm thinking a forward line of Guly, Lambert and Lallana in their championship pomp might actually score more goals than our current front line....

[Mr X]

I'm thinking a forward line of Guly, Lambert and Lallana in their championship pomp might actually score more goals than our current front line....

Agreed I think that's a better lineup

 

Redmond = potential talent for the future clearly not a striker

 

Austin = out for three months maybe more, may return as jay rod ie not the player he was

 

Long = works his socks off but not a natural finisher better in a supportive role

 

Jay Rod = love the guy but he may never be the same player again & not at the level we require currently

 

Sam Gallagher = on loan, might not be at the level we need but can't see him being any worse an option than the others

 

We have noone at the quality levels we need basically

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

[Tom & Gerry]

It's all about margins really. Arsenal won the league once winning 1-0 most weeks.

I expect that would be too boring for some Saints fans.

[Saint Benali]

I am still undecided on him. I wonder how much our results are actually down to his tactics etc or just because VVD has been on fire recently. What I do believe however is that his subs rarely if ever change the game. Especially if we are chasing a goal.

We have some really tough games coming up. Spuds, Bompey and Everton. Add to that West Brom who are the surprise packages this year. Of the top 6 we are yet to play Spurs but the other 5 have been 3 defeats and 2 draws. With 2 goals scored and 7 conceeded.

It is pretty remarkable that we are 9th considering we have actually only got 13 points from the last 30 on offer.

[Batman]

It's all about margins really. Arsenal won the league once winning 1-0 most weeks.

I expect that would be too boring for some Saints fans.

 

yeah but we wont be anywhere near winning the league, or Europe for that matter

[shurlock]

For me it's not just the strikers..... We're so bloody boring to watch!! After 16 games last year we were 5th (As opposed to 9th), but had 5 points more than we do now. But we'd scored 25 goals as opposed to 14, and despite our negative play this year had conceded one less goal at this stage last year...... So we're no better as some are saying. When we lost with the attacking football, as least we "Had a go", now we don't look like we want to get out of bed!

 

http://www.worldfootball.net/schedule/eng-premier-league-2014-2015-spieltag/16/

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table

 

Personally, I find it difficult to get excited about watching a team that doesn't even look like they're trying, with little attack.

 

That table was from two years ago. The goals for column also included the 8 against Sunderland which was a proper freak result.

[tobes8]

Slow uninspired football which may end up with us having a mid table finish. But a lot of our current problems are down in

My opinion to les reeds inability in the summer to see what every saints fan could see. Lack of goals.

[Dalek2003]

9th in the league despite playing in the Europa Cup is pretty good. That competition has almost relegated teams in the past, so to be where we are is ok.

 

We definitely need more up front though. I'm not entirely convinced the players rate the manager.

 

I am sure that is why we made a tactical exit from a European competition that earns us little money.

 

The business is only interested in the PL.

[forever a red and white]

He is doing pretty good I would say. The loss of Pelle and Mane are difficult to replace, if you consider the quality of player they were, and the goals they provided he is at an immediate disadvantage.

 

He is giving more academy players a chance and we are (despite the small difference in points) in the top half of the table and League Cup Semi- Final. However, going out of the Europa was a major, major disappointment and more so to do with the style in which we went out. You can blame the manager for his approach but also point the finger at the players for not being more brave and question their desire a little. Did they want it enough?

 

Overall he is doing well but there is certainly room for improvement with regards to playing style. It is his first season in a new league with a new team. He needs time to learn about the Premier League, he has good European experience, which unfortunately, is now less relevant. But he was signed on a two or three year contract. I just don't see any advantage of replacing him at moment.

 

Klopp has proven that you can have an entertaining style of football and still win plenty of games and be competitive. That is something we should be working towards.

 

A get a striker in. Back him with some more funds.

[Toomer]

My wife who knows sweet FA about football made the comment what a boring sounding person he is how the devil is going to inspire players with a voice like that he must send them to sleep.

[SaintRobbie]

Perhaps we should let Puel speak in his native tongue. Then at least those educated to O level French standard would make more sense out of what he is trying to say.

 

He really is the most un-animated of men, how the hell he impressed Reed in his interview I haven't a clue.

I agree. Worst manager I've seen since Wotte.

[Spoonman]

Given the circumstances Puel has done ok. The lack of goals is of course disappointing but, as others have said, some of the glaring misses have been criminal, you can't blame him for that. He's made us hard to break down, and has reopened the path to the first team for the young lads.

Need to look at the longer term. I'll take a step back in order to take two steps forward etc. We've had a ridiculous amount of managers over the past twenty odd years, its time for stability, and for me he's doing alright so far.

[OttawaSaint]

My wife who knows sweet FA about football made the comment what a boring sounding person he is how the devil is going to inspire players with a voice like that he must send them to sleep.

 

Did she think Alec Ferguson was really boring and uninspiring too?

Edited 15 December, 2016 by OttawaSaint

[John B]

Puel was bought in to develop this young squad so they will be better next season which it probably will be if we are not in Europe.

 

He has done pretty well in rotation because of the sheer number of games but having a settled team playing week in and week out would probably have led to better results in the PL.

 

In previous seasons other English clubs in the Europa League have performed badly in the PL.

 

Losing Mane and Pelle obviously has had an affect which is not surprising but if Long and JRod had scored three or four goals each things would have been a great deal better as the team is based on a tight defence I think only Chelsea and Spurs have conceded less.

 

Of course another striker would be welcome but finding a suitable one to come to SFC and fit in with the other players may have been difficult.

[View From The Top]

So we are currently in a better league position than last year with a cup semi-final to look forward to? Yeah, real sh_it manager and lets face it, in the terminally stupid like Robbie don't rate him we can be rest assured he's decent enough.

 

That said, I too like to see the ball moved quicker (dour often springs to mind) but he needs to bring in a box to box midfielder and we all know a strikers required as the Long / Jay gamble hasn't paid off. Only then will we really be able to judge him.

 

As for those who say they don't like him because of his language skills, well you're just morons.

[IFHP]

And maybe those fans who remember where we were 7 years ago also remember how bad management got us there in the 1st place.....

[Gunnery]

Oh goody, the forum Gestapo are removing threads again....sigh.

[Nordic Saint]

And maybe those fans who remember where we were 7 years ago also remember how bad management got us there in the 1st place.....

 

It's that time of year again:

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/les-sacked-for-giving-turkeys-xmas-654543

[adrian lord]

We have clicked and played really nice football on the odd occasion under Puel, and I have been left purring at times. He also pulled off some masterful tactical substitutions earlier in the season. However the majority of games, especially recently, have been insipid, turgid affairs, redolent of the post match interview style. Exiting the Europa with barely a whimper has raised anxieties as has our subsequent league form. The misfiring front-line are a major concern. The feel-good factor around he club has evaporated, the mood music is different. I think the rumours of Kat selling are not helping. I detect a corrosive uncertainty stalking the corridors, locker-rooms and training pitches.

 

I don't think it is all down to Puel and he should certainly be allowed the season at least, and preferably a second after a proper pre-season. Unless we nosedive and need emergency surgery in early-mid March.

Edited 16 December, 2016 by adrian lord