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Puel out

Lastman73

By Lastman73,
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The9

The9

Posted
Posted (edited)
Do you seriously think the drab football is down to fatigue/energy conservation?

 

And what about the chronic lack of movement ?

 

For me we've been insipid and whatever way you look at it. 17 home goals all season is not entirely down to opportunities spurned - that's a flaw in the tactical and coaching side as well.

 

Didn't we buy Gabbiadini to 'fix' the goal issue then subsequently starved him of chances? We've got enough firepower alongside him to muster a few more goals, despite their indifferent seasons. Tadic, renowned for his assist making has been dire. I don't attribute hat just to Tadic, I'd also put the blame squarely on our coaching and tactical setup.

 

Talking of which... how many times this season have we only had one or two players in the box for crosses? Too many to count...

 

Most of the time it's not drab to begin with. We created as many chances as Arsenal last season. Are you saying we're NOT going to be fatigued from playing nearly six solid months of back to back to back midweek and weekend games at both ends of the season? It was a huge factor. There's no "chronic lack of movement" - what there might be is a centre midfield which has no confidence it will score goals and chooses not to support the *three* front players, which possibly means all of our chances come against embedded and comfortable defences.

 

We didn't score 17 home goals all season. That was only league games. 13 of which were played within 4 days of a previous match.

 

Gabbiadini wasn't starved of chances, but a lot of his chances early on came from teams not knowing how to defend against him. A bit of video later, teams know what they should and shouldn't do. We did stop playing early balls over the top which created variety, though that might have been due to teams dropping off.

 

Tadic provided 2 Key Passes per game, that's 13th in the entire league. 0.1 p/game behind Sanchez and Coutinho. Not his fault people weren't scoring from his passes that created chances. Though he did have as many assists as Eden Hazard in 6 fewer starts even so.

 

FWIW I do agree with you about loading the box, but then we've had 2-3 years of relative success based on solid defence so it's maybe not a surprise the likes of Davis and Romeu hang back - Davis in particular has awful shot stats. Maybe it's as much about getting the other winger in the area instead of waiting for an overhit cross? But then that's often our full back anyway.

Edited by The9
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The9

The9

Posted
Posted
This does make me laugh...and someone said the Puel out camp were unrealistic in their view of where the club sits!

 

We've challenged the top 6 in 3 of the past 4 seasons. Stats show our goals were significantly below the expected return for the chances we created. Ditto shots against us were disproportionately high in resulting in goals. Why is it unrealistic now?

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Batman

Batman

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Posted
We've challenged the top 6 in 3 of the past 4 seasons. Stats show our goals were significantly below the expected return for the chances we created. Ditto shots against us were disproportionately high in resulting in goals. Why is it unrealistic now?

 

when redknapp took us down, we were actually challengers.

just that shots (goals) against us was disproportionately high compared to goals we actually managed to score

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verlaine1979

verlaine1979

Posted
Posted
We've challenged the top 6 in 3 of the past 4 seasons. Stats show our goals were significantly below the expected return for the chances we created. Ditto shots against us were disproportionately high in resulting in goals. Why is it unrealistic now?

 

Honestly, do you really believe that the statistical model for 'expected goals' is accurate enough to account for the myriad variables at work in every moment of a football match?

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doddisalegend

doddisalegend

Posted
Posted
I agree with you about not wanting him to go, albeit with the events of the last two weeks I think it is sadly inevitable. But he is supposed to be on £3 million per year. It's mad to fork out £6 million for two remaining years if someone else will take him on with only the difference to pay, if that. It's worth waiting a week or two for that. If it went on until July I would agree with you, but I cannot imagine it will

 

Your assuming Saint-Étienne are going to pay us. If Puel spoke to them it will only be because we told him he has no future here so why would Saint-Étienne pay us and why would Puel take the job without compensation? Puel can just wait for saints to sack him take his compensation and Saint-Étienne get him for free.

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jasoneuelllfanclub

jasoneuelllfanclub

Posted
Posted
Can we have a poll? Do you find football stressful or enjoyable?

 

Did you know that Puel let's the players take one training session a week? They get to choose what they want to do. The rest of the time they just look disinterested.

They do alot of head tennis it seems.

 

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk

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doddisalegend

doddisalegend

Posted
Posted
Can we have a poll? Do you find football stressful or enjoyable?

 

Did you know that Puel let's the players take one training session a week? They get to choose what they want to do. The rest of the time they just look disinterested.

 

Is that better than Koeman (allegedly) ditching training so he can go golfing in Spain...

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The9

The9

Posted
Posted
when redknapp took us down, we were actually challengers.

just that shots (goals) against us was disproportionately high compared to goals we actually managed to score

 

Feel free to point us all at the actual statistics for that.

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The9

The9

Posted
Posted (edited)
Honestly, do you really believe that the statistical model for 'expected goals' is accurate enough to account for the myriad variables at work in every moment of a football match?

 

It's not supposed to be accurate enough to account for all the variables, it's supposed to indicate if the specific end chance itself is likely to result in a goal or not. That's as straightforward a metric as you're going to get from football. It also correlates well with the stats for chances, goals, successful teams and their final league positions, and reflects evident general trends (like Saints scoring far fewer goals from the same numbers of chances as Arsenal, for instance). That's good enough for the point I'm making about us not being poor at creating chances, just scoring.

 

The other change next season will be the lack of effect of fatigue.... I may as well bust out that Saints ran the least distance of any team in any single Prem game this season as well, whilst Man U who are (probably) the only Premier League team to have played more games than Saints this season, ran the least of any team in the entire division.

 

And with the overall impact of the Europa League... here's a research paper which covers the 10 years from 2001-2011 and says that "teams playing on Sunday following a Thursday night Europa League match were 0.41 points per game worse off." "The study also focused upon 71,251 goals and when they were scored during games. In parallel

with winning less and losing more after just two recovery days, teams scored 0.52 fewer goals per game, scored 0.3 goals less in the final third and conceded 0.45 more goals than average in the final half hour".

http://worldfootballacademy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/WFA_Study-on-recovery-days.pdf.

 

So the combination of improved returns from our created chances and the likely reduction in the number of times Saints have to play tired next season makes me think we'll do better in terms of League points "even if" Puel stays in charge. Reason for optimism.

 

FWIW if there's something we might improve on, it's taking shots from closer in - this season we've been shooting from further out overall than in most recent seasons. That and Arsenal's shot distances probably explains why they score more from the same number of chances as us, and why they're expected to.

2rod3cje-1.jpg?w=657.

Edited by The9
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captainchris

captainchris

Posted
Posted
Your assuming Saint-Étienne are going to pay us. If Puel spoke to them it will only be because we told him he has no future here so why would Saint-Étienne pay us and why would Puel take the job without compensation? Puel can just wait for saints to sack him take his compensation and Saint-Étienne get him for free.

 

No....

Not the case at all....

If we pay him off he can't get another job until his old contract runs out - if we choose. Puel will not want that at all, he wants to work so is quickly looking for a new job!

 

We should not wait long though as uncertainty is very bad for direction and a clear message to the players.

Unfortunately Les has a terrible habit of letting events overtake him and ending up in a right mess! If Les lets this drag on and and trips up again he should go too.

Les is the captain of this ship and its decision time right now...

Has he learnt his lessons or will Puel finally leave the last week in July followed by a group of our best players again ?

This year Les you need to make things happen not watch them happen...

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Saint-Fred

Saint-Fred

Posted
Posted
We've challenged the top 6 in 3 of the past 4 seasons. Stats show our goals were significantly below the expected return for the chances we created. Ditto shots against us were disproportionately high in resulting in goals. Why is it unrealistic now?

 

Absolutely mental.

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SKD

SKD

Posted
Posted
Why does the club need to save face?. They weren't worried about saving face when they sacked Adkins. In this situation they would actually become more popular with the fan base by canning Puels arse would they not?

 

Adkins was very much a success and had longer than 1 season at the club. They weren't worried about saving face with him, because there was no face to save. Nigel was appointed to do a job and that job he done. Puel on the other hand, arguably hasn't.

 

I still don't see any reasonable justification as to why you would pay someone a large sum of money, when someone will have to pay you a large sum of money for them... thank god you're not in charge of the club.

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vectraman

vectraman

Posted
Posted (edited)
Can we have a poll? Do you find football stressful or enjoyable?

 

Did you know that Puel let's the players take one training session a week? They get to choose what they want to do. The rest of the time they just look disinterested.

 

Claude, okay with you if we practice passing the ball backwards and sideways from corners back to our keeper?

Oui

Cool.

;-)

Edited by vectraman
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Ken Tone

Ken Tone

Posted
Posted
The delay in the managerial review outcome must surely be linked to the takeover?

 

https://www.thegamblingtimes.com/2017/05/02/puel-axed-saints-takeover-goes/

 

not clear when that article was written? (There's a reference to the current campaign nearing the end)

 

 

but but in any event it does makes sense that puel's future is linked to the possible takeover. I can't see any other reason for this speculation to be allowed to continue .

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Saint-Fred

Saint-Fred

Posted
Posted
We've challenged the top 6 in 3 of the past 4 seasons. Stats show our goals were significantly below the expected return for the chances we created. Ditto shots against us were disproportionately high in resulting in goals. Why is it unrealistic now?

 

Our record against the top 6 last years was something like (from memory so might be wrong)

 

P 12 W 0 D 4 L 8 F 6 A 22 pts 4

 

And you think Puel is going to close that gap so we actually compete against them?

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Dusic

Dusic

Posted
Posted
So as i suspected LLL has no balls and we need the takeover before we ditch Puel the clown.

 

Les is probably just focusing on his sales to Liverpool

The article was from the start of May.

 

Highly likely that Puel has already been ditched. Just waiting for things to fall into place.

 

He couldn't exactly end up staying now and probably wouldn't even want to given how clear the lack of faith in him is from both club, fans and possibly players.

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Saint_lambden

Saint_lambden

Posted
Posted

Had a quick look on the Saint Etienne forum to see what's happening at their end. Interesting post on there (have no idea if this guy is ITK or not):

 

"Tuchel will sign at Southampon, both sides agree.

Puel has already said yes to Sainté (Saint Etienne), it's a matter of hours but behind the scenes it's already all done, Puel must even be starting the transfer window.

99.99% chance that he signed this morning with us, Tuchel's negos (negotiations) yesterday were productive for Southampon and ASSE."

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SuperSAINT

SuperSAINT

Posted
Posted
Had a quick look on the Saint Etienne forum to see what's happening at their end. Interesting post on there (have no idea if this guy is ITK or not):

 

"Tuchel will sign at Southampon, both sides agree.

Puel has already said yes to Sainté (Saint Etienne), it's a matter of hours but behind the scenes it's already all done, Puel must even be starting the transfer window.

99.99% chance that he signed this morning with us, Tuchel's negos (negotiations) yesterday were productive for Southampon and ASSE."

 

I can't see this being true without the German sports media getting a sniff.

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Badger

Badger

Posted
Posted
Had a quick look on the Saint Etienne forum to see what's happening at their end. Interesting post on there (have no idea if this guy is ITK or not):

 

"Tuchel will sign at Southampon, both sides agree.

Puel has already said yes to Sainté (Saint Etienne), it's a matter of hours but behind the scenes it's already all done, Puel must even be starting the transfer window.

99.99% chance that he signed this morning with us, Tuchel's negos (negotiations) yesterday were productive for Southampon and ASSE."

 

Hope he/she is correct.

 

It does make sense that Saints may not be prepared to ditch Puel until a better replacement is lined up.

 

But even so, this does seem too good to be true.

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Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Posted
Posted

Anyone else getting déjà vu?

 

Same as last summer we have "ITKs" with different information and randoms on other football forums being ITK on all things SFC too, papers ate wildly speculating and bookies have no clue.

 

Top names being linked and hope building.....

 

This all leading one way (same as last summer) an LLL motivational speach or article followed by an underwhelming announcement re manager and players.

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Give it to Ron

Give it to Ron

Posted
Posted
Had a quick look on the Saint Etienne forum to see what's happening at their end. Interesting post on there (have no idea if this guy is ITK or not):

 

"Tuchel will sign at Southampon, both sides agree.

Puel has already said yes to Sainté (Saint Etienne), it's a matter of hours but behind the scenes it's already all done, Puel must even be starting the transfer window.

99.99% chance that he signed this morning with us, Tuchel's negos (negotiations) yesterday were productive for Southampon and ASSE."

Posted by Jacques Le Schitte??? [emoji3]

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted
Hope he/she is correct.

 

It does make sense that Saints may not be prepared to ditch Puel until a better replacement is lined up.

 

But even so, this does seem too good to be true.

 

St E had a short list, Celestini was favourite but that's fallen through apparently. Now they're looking at the other 4, Garcia, Ranieri, Puel and believe it or not Viera. Puel wants to run everything his way with them and that's not the way StE want.

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Pamplemousse

Pamplemousse

Posted
Posted
http://www.poteaux-carres.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=23277&start=2500

 

use translate...some seem to think all will be revealed about Puel by thursday. Pretty much done, maybe in the next 48 hours

 

"Southampton are one of the most boring sides in the english premier league"

 

The ones who are saying 'Decision from Southampton about Puel next Thursday' seem to be the ITKs there. And it seems most of think it is a done deal.

 

What also appears to be the case is their chairman and directors wanting a coach who will promote young players, which is why Puel is their number 1 choice.

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Bad Wolf

Bad Wolf

Posted
Posted
Anyone else getting déjà vu?

 

Same as last summer we have "ITKs" with different information and randoms on other football forums being ITK on all things SFC too, papers ate wildly speculating and bookies have no clue.

 

Top names being linked and hope building.....

 

This all leading one way (same as last summer) an LLL motivational speach or article followed by an underwhelming announcement re manager and players.

 

Not the most positive person on here, are you?

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The9

The9

Posted
Posted
Absolutely mental.

 

What's mental is hearing and seeing evidence, and ignoring it because it doesn't match your opinion. I'm resigned to agreeing we didn't score enough home league goals, I'm not even close to thinking we didn't create enough chances.

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