Virgil Transfer Rumours - Summer 17

[eddie]

I wouldn't think any less of Les or Ralph if they decided to sell. I don't trust what people say in front of the camera anyway (i.e. club videos from Ralph/Les) given it is just marketing anyway - how they present the club. Marketing and branding are a necessary evil to shine a good light on the club, but it's all fake.

 

It's not an easy decision. For people saying it's black and white, that Van Dijk should be "left to rot", nonsense. If he refuses to play and brings a "toxic" atmosphere to the dressing room I would be very wary about keeping him around the club.

 

My guess is the club predicted that by releasing such a public statement ("we are keeping VVD"), they would convince Van Dijk to stay. It obviously hasn't happened, so now the situation has changed. I don't feel "betrayed" by Les & co if they were to sell him now. If it really is as toxic as papers are claiming, and has gone so downhill in the last couple of weeks, I don't want much to do with the guy. It's difficult to see a player just for their physical attributes. He was captain for ****s sake. The leadership, example, organisation of the team, motivation. These are very important and I doubt that he can bring anything like what we expect of him in those areas.

 

He's a tall presence in the box and that's about it.

 

By letting him go now, they recover his wages and arguably his highest transfer fee. Who knows how he could devalue next year if he doesn't play.

 

I'm not saying unequivocally kick him out. I'm saying it really really is not an easy decision for the club. It's not black and white. If he goes, we win a lot of money but the club have caved in. If we keep him, there is no guarantee whatsoever that he is worth 70m on the pitch to us. His integration, dressing room atmosphere, motivation and presence on the pitch are no guarantees at all. We could keep him and he never plays for us again until he's sold in January for much less.

[angelman]

I would be disappointed if Les/Ralph came out and said that he was for sale as that would weaken our position. We all know that, so that is why they say he is not for sale. If they do end up selling after having said he isn't, then that to me is just part of making sure we don't weaken our hand any more than the player and his agent are trying their hardest to do. Personally, I do not envisage seeing him in a Saints shirt again.

[Toon Saint]

No offence, but why are so

many hanging on Tom28's every word?

 

Seems to me as if he made an informed guess about VvD going on strike - which had a decent probability of being true - and as a result seems to have gained ITK status.

 

I haven't seen anything posted that's particularly revelatory since then, or ahead of what was in the public domain anyway.

 

Personally I doubt that Liverpool have made a bid, given the public apology and our boards hardening stance. That also goes against every press report which states Liverpool are waiting on us to give the green light, which after Ralph's recent interview seems very unlikely.

 

 

 

 

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[alpine_saint]

Maybe Ralph and Les dont care about fan reputation anyway. Maybe they are on their way out due to the sale of the club.

 

Hoedt is supposed to be Fonte's replacement, not VVDs

[Saint_Ash]

No offence, but why are so

many hanging on Tom28's every word?

 

Seems to me as if he made an informed guess about VvD going on strike - which had a decent probability of being true - and as a result seems to have gained ITK status.

 

I haven't seen anything posted that's particularly revelatory since then, or ahead of what was in the public domain anyway.

 

Personally I doubt that Liverpool have made a bid, given the public apology and our boards hardening stance. That also goes against every press report which states Liverpool are waiting on us to give the green light, which after Ralph's recent interview seems very unlikely.

 

 

 

 

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Tend to agree with this. I know some people get some itk snippets from time to time but as far as I can tell Tom got the strike thing spot on and everything else was in the news before being said on here. Nothing against Tom but people hanging on every word he says is a bit foolish.

[Gemmel]

Maybe Ralph and Les dont care about fan reputation anyway. Maybe they are on their way out due to the sale of the club.

 

Ralph almost certainly, but would expect Les to stay. It would be very unusual not to put your own people in from a business perspective, but Les remains the knowledge on the footballing side of things. For all the stick he takes, I doubt there are many DOF CV's that could come close to what he has achieved in the last 7 years.

[LeBizzier69]

I find it hard to believe that this sort of issue with players has any affect on other players at all. Other than organisation on the pitch, do we really think that because VVD is being a little to55er, the other players run out on a Saturday thinking..."oh, I'm so upset about what's happening...how do i kick the ball again? I'm too emotional to play" nonsense. We all have played football (I'm assuming) when there are things going on in our lives, and when you start playing you go into auto pilot and play the game. I don't believe that it's a distraction to the team for one minute, apart from the fact one of our best players isn't playing.

[egg]

No offence, but why are so

many hanging on Tom28's every word?

 

Seems to me as if he made an informed guess about VvD going on strike - which had a decent probability of being true - and as a result seems to have gained ITK status.

 

I haven't seen anything posted that's particularly revelatory since then, or ahead of what was in the public domain anyway.

 

Personally I doubt that Liverpool have made a bid, given the public apology and our boards hardening stance. That also goes against every press report which states Liverpool are waiting on us to give the green light, which after Ralph's recent interview seems very unlikely.

 

 

 

 

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He seems Kosher to me, just something about his tone and content. Personally I don't think anyone but Liverpool would bid. Chelsea have plenty of defensive options and would have bid if they wanted him. City ditto and are about to sign Evans. Plus, if he's (for reasons I cannot fathom) got his heart set on Liverpool why would others bid if his agent has made it clear he's not interested in joining them.

 

Like it or not, he'll go to Liverpool.

[Millbrook Saint]

Ralph almost certainly, but would expect Les to stay. It would be very unusual not to put your own people in from a business perspective, but Les remains the knowledge on the footballing side of things. For all the stick he takes, I doubt there are many DOF CV's that could come close to what he has achieved in the last 7 years.

 

I know Les gets a lot of stick but ultimately he is an employee and if the owner says sell a player, then that's what he has to do. I thought it was telling that in an interview a while back, the board all agreed that VVD had to be kept, the only person open to selling to the scouse was Kat. At the end of the day I'm sure Les would love it if the owner told him he had unlimited funds but that just doesn't seem to be the case so he has to be shrewd in his dealings which to my mind he has done pretty successfully.

[shurlock]

No offence, but why are so

many hanging on Tom28's every word?

 

Seems to me as if he made an informed guess about VvD going on strike - which had a decent probability of being true - and as a result seems to have gained ITK status.

 

I haven't seen anything posted that's particularly revelatory since then, or ahead of what was in the public domain anyway.

 

Personally I doubt that Liverpool have made a bid, given the public apology and our boards hardening stance. That also goes against every press report which states Liverpool are waiting on us to give the green light, which after Ralph's recent interview seems very unlikely.

 

 

 

 

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He also got the timing of the transfer request right, though agree his recent info is more or less in the public domain and (by his own admission) he's speculating in some cases (like the rest of us).

[tisspahars]

Apologies for bring betting into this (as usual), but are those in the "Duh, it's so obvious he's going to Liverpool - he always was" camp aware they can back him at odds against to do just that?

[mrfahaji]

I wouldn't think any less of Les or Ralph if they decided to sell. I don't trust what people say in front of the camera anyway (i.e. club videos from Ralph/Les) given it is just marketing anyway - how they present the club. Marketing and branding are a necessary evil to shine a good light on the club, but it's all fake.

 

It's not an easy decision. For people saying it's black and white, that Van Dijk should be "left to rot", nonsense. If he refuses to play and brings a "toxic" atmosphere to the dressing room I would be very wary about keeping him around the club.

 

My guess is the club predicted that by releasing such a public statement ("we are keeping VVD"), they would convince Van Dijk to stay. It obviously hasn't happened, so now the situation has changed. I don't feel "betrayed" by Les & co if they were to sell him now. If it really is as toxic as papers are claiming, and has gone so downhill in the last couple of weeks, I don't want much to do with the guy. It's difficult to see a player just for their physical attributes. He was captain for ****s sake. The leadership, example, organisation of the team, motivation. These are very important and I doubt that he can bring anything like what we expect of him in those areas.

 

He's a tall presence in the box and that's about it.

 

By letting him go now, they recover his wages and arguably his highest transfer fee. Who knows how he could devalue next year if he doesn't play.

 

I'm not saying unequivocally kick him out. I'm saying it really really is not an easy decision for the club. It's not black and white. If he goes, we win a lot of money but the club have caved in. If we keep him, there is no guarantee whatsoever that he is worth 70m on the pitch to us. His integration, dressing room atmosphere, motivation and presence on the pitch are no guarantees at all. We could keep him and he never plays for us again until he's sold in January for much less.

 

A reasoned post. There would be a case of cutting off our nose to spite our face by keeping an unhappy, disruptive player. One of the reasons Fonte left I believe was because he was undermining the manager and being a bad influence on other players.

 

That being said, I wonder if there should be a principle of "the worse you behave, the stronger we will be", particularly if it all stems from his scumbag agent, because else it sets a precedent for players to force a move away.

 

I think we should say "£60m from anyone but Liverpool and he can leave. £100m from Liverpool and he can leave." As much as I would like us to dig in for a bit more (eg £65m - £70m), not sure you could sniff at a world record fee for a defender, perhaps with a sell on % in case the market goes crazy (crazier) and he ends up going to Barca or Madrid a couple of years down the line.

[East Kent Saint]

I feel the club have done what they could to hang on to VVD but he seems determined to go , even Barca couldn't hang on to Neymar , you would have thought that Barca was the pinacle of the football pyramid as well.

If VVD was forced to stay I can't see that working , Morgan was OK but Wanyama and Mane only put any effort in when we were playing their target clubs if not getting red cards/turning up late etc.

[Saints foreva]

Why, Hoedt is his replacement. The fact that Bednarek isn't good enough to be 4th pick doesn't mean that the club will bring in another CB. We have Stephens, Yoshida, Hoedt, Bednarek, Gardos (yeah I know) possibly all taking 5 of our 25 squad places and won't add to that. If we play a back 3 then Bertrand can play left side. In the very unlikely event VVD stays the question is whether he gets a squad place in place of say Gardos or whether he's left to nurse some vague injury without a squad number til jan.

 

Hoedt is the Fonte replacement we never got in January. Yoshida and Stephens are not good enough for where this club claims they want to be.

[angelman]

I think people under rate Yoshida too much.

[saint-crinny]

I feel the club have done what they could to hang on to VVD but he seems determined to go , even Barca couldn't hang on to Neymar , you would have thought that Barca was the pinacle of the football pyramid as well.

If VVD was forced to stay I can't see that working , Morgan was OK but Wanyama and Mane only put any effort in when we were playing their target clubs if not getting red cards/turning up late etc.

 

Technical point but Barca couldn't hold onto Neymar because his release clause was paid.

 

But in general, I'm inclined to agree - wanted us to stand firm on VVD but if we do, and he just becomes a divisive figure within the camp, I don't think that really benefits anyone. least of the new manager who I'm sure could do without this saga as he tries to make his mark on the team.

 

If he left and Hoedt is as good as we hope, then we're pretty much back to where we were once Jose had left (albeit Hoedt is probably not quite as good as VVD), given Yoshida was outperforming an ageing Fonte before he left anyway. Which is not distastrous, just not as good as VVD removing his head from him backside, focusing and playing alongside Hoedt.

[sadoldgit]

He seems Kosher to me, just something about his tone and content. Personally I don't think anyone but Liverpool would bid. Chelsea have plenty of defensive options and would have bid if they wanted him. City ditto and are about to sign Evans. Plus, if he's (for reasons I cannot fathom) got his heart set on Liverpool why would others bid if his agent has made it clear he's not interested in joining them.

 

Like it or not, he'll go to Liverpool.

 

Weren't we told a while back that he had softened his stance on the whole only going to Liverpool thing and would consider another club in the CL? Also it is his agent's job to get him the best deal? That might not be at Liverpool.

[Gemmel]

Also it is his agent's job to get him the best deal? That might not be at Liverpool.

 

You would think right? But also what's best for the agent - which club would he (The agent) personally benefit the most from - Who is going to pay the agent the most.

[Faz]

Of course the club could agree "You can leave provided our valuation is met. You're the one with the super Agent, let him go and find a buyer at £70m. If he can't then either find a new agent, or just get on with things."

[egg]

Hoedt is the Fonte replacement we never got in January. Yoshida and Stephens are not good enough for where this club claims they want to be.

 

Feck me, so if he goes you want another (6th) cb? That's not gonna happen. Stephens has stepped into Fonte's boots, and we've also signed Bednarek. We can't just keep signing cb's because previous signings (under contract) haven't made the grade.

[Batman]

Feck me, so if he goes you want another (6th) cb? That's not gonna happen. Stephens has stepped into Fonte's boots, and we've also signed Bednarek. We can't just keep signing cb's because previous signings (under contract) haven't made the grade.

although very good on the ball, is terrible in the air and is killing us

[Baird of the land]

Really hope the club stand firm & don't sell Van Dijk. There's no way it could be spun positively. Rolling over now would just make us a laughing stock and do nothing for our credibility in future if we say we want to keep hold of any player. Selling him to Liverpool would be even more craven.

[egg]

although very good on the ball, is terrible in the air and is killing us

 

I agree to an extent, but my point is that the club see him as Fonte's replacement. Hoedt is vVd's and Bednarek long term/cover. it's unrealistic to expect the club to sign yet another cb when vvd goes next week, we'll make do with what we have. People seem to think that we can just stockpile pro's cos they think that someone is sh:t - that's not how it works.

[egg]

Weren't we told a while back that he had softened his stance on the whole only going to Liverpool thing and would consider another club in the CL? Also it is his agent's job to get him the best deal? That might not be at Liverpool.

 

I hope that's the case. If he was dignified and went with the clubs blessing to Barc, Real Madrid or PSG for a fat fee most of us wouldn't mind.

 

This whole saga has been soured by the apparent illegal approach, but the club haven't helped by the posturing of "he's not for sale" which understandably some take at face value. Assuming Tom28 is correct though, Liverpool are the only bidder and unless that changes I think he'll go there.

 

If I didn't think it's damage morale and/pr his value I'd prefer that we kept him, didn't allocate him a number, made him train with the kids and move him on Jan when they'll doubtless be clubs desperately needing cb's.

[saintadam]

Tom28 has been accurate before but I just think its odd that the if the situation is toxic and inevitable we are gonna sell him, why on earth would Les Reed say " we believe he (Hoedt) can develop even further here at Southampton, alongside his international teammate Virgil van Dijk" to further signal he's going nowhere.

[SKD]

although very good on the ball, is terrible in the air and is killing us

 

He can't really mark either, which doesn't help. Too often does he lose his man inside the box.

 

Really, his best trait (at the moment) is his composure on the ball, but as a defender this should come secondary to his defensive ability.

 

Should we sell Virgil, it is vital that we replace him. Stephens and Yoshida are not good enough to be first choice CB's in a top half PL team.

[aintforever]

How can they force him to play if he's refusing to? How can they sell him when noone wants to pay our valuation & he refuses to go anywhere other than liverhampton?

 

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Has he actually said he is on strike now? Must have missed that , last I read he said he was not refusing to play.

[SKD]

Tom28 has been accurate before but I just think its odd that the if the situation is toxic and inevitable we are gonna sell him, why on earth would Les Reed say " we believe he (Hoedt) can develop even further here at Southampton, alongside his international teammate Virgil van Dijk" to further signal he's going nowhere.

 

Oh Adam, bless you, you are naive.

 

I'm not saying that we will sell VvD (FWIW I think we will), but you are a fool to believe any PR spill that comes out of Les Reed's mouth, generally it's all bullsh*t.

 

If we are looking to sell, is our hand stronger or weaker (meaning more or less £'s) if we are to come out publicly and say "we need to sell VvD" and "Virgil will be leaving the club"?

[Viking Saint]

He can't really mark either, which doesn't help. Too often does he lose his man inside the box.

 

Really, his best trait (at the moment) is his composure on the ball, but as a defender this should come secondary to his defensive ability.

 

Should we sell Virgil, it is vital that we replace him. Stephens and Yoshida are not good enough to be first choice CB's in a top half PL team.

 

not disputing what you've said about either, but all seems a bit farcical that we a) sign Caceres as a last-ditch replacement for Fonte, and then don't retain him - if he was good enough, why not keep him, and if he wasn't good enough, why bother having him here in the first place, when Gardos or Jones could've served as back up CBs b) sign Bednarek, and c) didn't bid for Hoedt and Wimmer if both were, as alleged, on our radar? Seems to be an absence of planning, anticipation and the black box??

[Cartman]

No offence, but why are so

many hanging on Tom28's every word?

 

Seems to me as if he made an informed guess about VvD going on strike - which had a decent probability of being true - and as a result seems to have gained ITK status.

 

I haven't seen anything posted that's particularly revelatory since then, or ahead of what was in the public domain anyway.

 

Personally I doubt that Liverpool have made a bid, given the public apology and our boards hardening stance. That also goes against every press report which states Liverpool are waiting on us to give the green light, which after Ralph's recent interview seems very unlikely.

 

 

 

 

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No idea. He got two things right, the strike and the transfer request, all info that could, and probably did come from Van Dijk's side. He probably knows someone who knows Van Dijk or his agent but when he is asked to provide information that you could only get from the executive level in the club he gives a load of waffle and says whatever was recently in the media. Didn't see Lemina coming or the takeover or Hoedt, not even a "big news coming" type hint. He is fairly ITK when it comes to Van Dijk's intentions but until proven otherwise he is using his limited ITK credentials to pretend that he knows more than he really does, particularly when it comes to Les' plans.

[Matthew Le God]

No idea. He got two things right, the strike and the transfer request

 

Did he though? Not hard to guess those were going to happen.

[Cartman]

Did he though? Not hard to guess those were going to happen.

 

Not hard to guess, but the timing was very good, both times the day before it went public. So I'll give him the benefit of the doubt there. But that's the kind of thing he could have got from Van Dijk's barber (barbers seem to be very ITK these days).

When it comes to inside knowledge on the clubs' plans, he has been shooting blanks despite trying to give the appearance that he knows things we don't. Even his latest post is just waffle based on the Kevin Palmer article.

[pimpin4rizeal]

After spending the whole summer pushing the club’s strategy of wanting to keep all of our best players and that VVD was definitively not for sale, to go back on it now would be a total capitulation in my eyes. There’s also the fact that we’ve already heard that the likes of Cedric and Bertrand will want to go if he is sold and of course this would just show that we can be backed into a corner and will succumb to player demands meaning this could happen over and over again in the future.

 

 

I don’t care how much of a d*ckhead he’s being or even if he refuses to play – giving in now is likely to have negative ramifications for the club for years to come and is bigger than just a single player or transfer. We have CB cover now and I’m hoping we’re not desperate for the money, so make him stay and then if he still refuses to play ball and wants to sit out a season then more fool him.

 

A ridiculous bid that would be inconceivable for anyone to turn down may be enough to change things but I can’t see that happening, what with Liverpool apparently being the only team making a bid and even then Tom28 has said he doesn’t even know if we are willing to deal with them.

 

This 1000 percent...: plus I'm very confident he will soon eat humble pie and be ready to play after the window shuts

[angelman]

The papers seem to have run out of the usual stories so have started on vD & Arsenal now.

[darren2]

Did he though? Not hard to guess those were going to happen.

 

Yes, he said the day before the transfer request that there would be "Developments tomorrow"

[Highfield Saint]

Surely the new owner will have a say in this? We were told that Kat was open to a sale but now we had no need to sell. Accept it is a commercial decision but the final call has to be acceptable to the owner.

[DT]

Hope the new owner has a big (trad) sense of saving 'face' and will dig his heels in over this. He needs to know how popular that would make him.

[Saint Albert]

The club has consistently said he's not for sale but often provisos along the lines of "unless a ridiculous offer is made for him" have been added to the statements, particularly in the early part of this transfer saga. It might give Les and Ralph an out if they decide to sell because VVD and his agent have burnt too many bridges.

 

I'd be annoyed if he goes, particularly to Liverpool but I could never have anticipated that VVD would act up to this degree so I would probably be prepared to give Les and co. the benefit of the doubt. My biggest concern with his sale would be the knock on effect towards Cedric Soares and Ryan Bertrand's willingness to stay. Unlike VVD they seem to have acted professionally so far.

[Mr X]

This 1000 percent...: plus I'm very confident he will soon eat humble pie and be ready to play after the window shuts

Does anyone actually have anything concrete that liverhampton have bid? Thought they said they'd only come back in if saints gave them permission?

 

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[baggytrousers]

Oh Adam, bless you, you are naive.

 

I'm not saying that we will sell VvD (FWIW I think we will), but you are a fool to believe any PR spill that comes out of Les Reed's mouth, generally it's all bullsh*t.

 

If we are looking to sell, is our hand stronger or weaker (meaning more or less £'s) if we are to come out publicly and say "we need to sell VvD" and "Virgil will be leaving the club"?

 

Les, Ralph and Mauricio might be stringing everyone along with their public quotes on this issue purely to try and get the best price. That's a possibility.

 

It's also a possibility that they're telling the truth and we're not going to sell. Their statements on VVD have been a lot more definite than I can remember on any player in the past and the situation with VVD is much more favourable to Saints in that the club are now debt free and have a player with 5 years of a 6 year contract still to run, which is a way stronger position that in any previous situation.

 

Whilst it's true that keeping an unhappy VVD could be cutting off our nose to spite our face the same is equally true for Virgil. He is already out of the Holland squad for their vital World Cup qualifier with France next week whilst new club teammate Wesley Hoedt is in. How does it possibly benefit him to continue to play up when 1st September has come around ? Would all the big clubs around Europe be impressed by this behaviour and clamouring to sign him or would they be more likely to come in for him if he got his head down and put in some good performances for us in the Premier League and Holland in their qualifiers ?

 

He's 26 now and will be 31 when his current contract with Saints runs out. Granted it would hurt Saints to keep VVD on the books whilst not playing but it would also hurt VVD's career at the same time. That's the nature of contract disputes - both sides lose and the longer it goes on the more they both lose.

 

It would be naive to think that the possibility of Saints holding him to his contract for the best years of his career would not focus VVD's mind come September 1st.

[Give it to Ron]

Apparently also met Chelsea without permission

 

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Ps

Apologies just seen source Daily Fail.

Edited 24 August, 2017 by Give it to Ron

[Saint IQ]

I put a cheeky £5 on him joining Arsenal earlier today at 50/1 as saw Wenger refused to rule out Mustafi sale and just think he'd be perfect for them and they're not Liverpool.

 

2 hours later and it's gone to 9/1 on the same site.

 

Probably means nothing but it wouldn't of been just my £5 that made the odds change in such a way.

[Jimmy_D]

I put a cheeky £5 on him joining Arsenal earlier today at 50/1 as saw Wenger refused to rule out Mustafi sale and just think he'd be perfect for them and they're not Liverpool.

 

2 hours later and it's gone to 9/1 on the same site.

 

Probably means nothing but it wouldn't of been just my £5 that made the odds change in such a way.

 

You'd be surprised just how tiny the next club markets are.

 

Besides, newspaper stories about him going to Arsenal were always going to affect the odds.

[derry]

Personally, tell him to get match fit with the U23's, if he doesn't, fine him until he does. If he does, pick him for the first team if he refuses, fine him until he fulfils his contract. Play hard ball and more importantly be seen to play hard ball. Show him what toxic means. and how far away June 2022 is. Tell him he won't be released until he plays a complete year in the first team however long that takes. Tell his agent they aren't acceptable to us and we won't deal with them again. Then nail anybody we have evidence of tapping up. It might not solve the VVD problem but it would save us money and get us a lot of respect. Transfer him when we are through and not to Liverpool.

[Dalek2003]

The papers seem to have run out of the usual stories so have started on vD & Arsenal now.

 

If they pay £60 million plus, then I would understand the club selling to anyone but Liverpool, out of principle.

[mrfahaji]

Personally, tell him to get match fit with the U23's, if he doesn't, fine him until he does. If he does, pick him for the first team if he refuses, fine him until he fulfils his contract. Play hard ball and more importantly be seen to play hard ball. Show him what toxic means. and how far away June 2022 is. Tell him he won't be released until he plays a complete year in the first team however long that takes. Tell his agent they aren't acceptable to us and we won't deal with them again. Then nail anybody we have evidence of tapping up. It might not solve the VVD problem but it would save us money and get us a lot of respect. Transfer him when we are through and not to Liverpool.

 

As much as the club would be stupid to lose out on £50m+, there is part of me that rather enjoys the prospect of our response, if he continues being a d1ck, being to keep him in the reserves (or the equivalent) until he's 31, with his career totally down the pan.

 

(of course, preferably he either would return to playing, or be sold for a lot of money to non-LFC club)

[RedWillie]

If he goes, surely Ralph has to offer his resignation to? Categorically staying he won't be sold.

[angelman]

If he goes, surely Ralph has to offer his resignation to? Categorically staying he won't be sold.

 

Question - would you prefer that Ralph says he is for sale?

[Mr Saints]

Question - would you prefer that Ralph says he is for sale?

 

He obviously doesn't need to say that. He also doesn't need to spout BS promises if he can't keep them, time will tell if the latest interviews are BS, but I know where my money would be.

[West Stand]

Personally, tell him to get match fit with the U23's, if he doesn't, fine him until he does. If he does, pick him for the first team if he refuses, fine him until he fulfils his contract. Play hard ball and more importantly be seen to play hard ball. Show him what toxic means. and how far away June 2022 is. Tell him he won't be released until he plays a complete year in the first team however long that takes. Tell his agent they aren't acceptable to us and we won't deal with them again. Then nail anybody we have evidence of tapping up. It might not solve the VVD problem but it would save us money and get us a lot of respect. Transfer him when we are through and not to Liverpool.

 

A response David that I and quite a few others would love!! Unfortunately, although I believe Ralph Kruger that he will not be sold this window unless there is a stupid offer I'm not at all convinced that they would have the b**ls to let him rot until 2022, but that would be great.