Rumours of takeover/investment interest

[Saint Fan CaM]

Guys, at £200m I would imagine Lander are taking a major stake in the club. What remaining control Kat and the current Board retain remains to be seen - hopefully she has ensured that legally the club still has the strong backing set-up by Marcus as I do not have a lot of confidence in any Chinese investment. It seems like a significant step outside the comfort zone we have enjoyed for the last 5 years.

[Saint_clark]

Wait I just saw the letter from Kat, what the hell is happening now?

[scousesaint84]

£200 million will build one hell of a stadium, are the rumours of saints owning/buying land in hedge end true?

[mattyd]

Basically says

 

BRIEF-Lander Sports Development to buy assets from controlling shareholder

 

 

With a PDF in Chinese... no idea what it's about tho

 

Have a look at the UK Reuters site. They have more detail

[James]

Guys, at £200m I would imagine Lander are taking a major stake in the club. What remaining control Kat and the current Board retain remains to be seen - hopefully she has ensured that legally the club still has the strong backing set-up by Marcus as I do not have a lot of confidence in any Chinese investment. It seems like a significant step outside the comfort zone we have enjoyed for the last 5 years.

 

I guess we need to wait and see how big a stake they take if and when this is announced. At this stage, the structure of the board and who controls it is completely up in the air. Remember that we don't know what valuation has been put on the club so also wouldn't be able to assess the relative size of the Chinese interest even if we knew the headline cash value.

[angelman]

£200 million will build one hell of a stadium, are the rumours of saints owning/buying land in hedge end true?

 

£200m to buy a stake in the club. Where is that £200m going to? The person who owns that stake, ie Ms Liebherr. It does not mean SFC have the £200m to play with

[scousesaint84]

£200m to buy a stake in the club. Where is that £200m going to? The person who owns that stake, ie Ms Liebherr. It does not mean SFC have the £200m to play with

 

very true.....but no harm in wishful thinking

[beatlesaint]

Is there a parent company set up and then within that a Southampton Football Club company or is everything - club, stadium, holdings etc just under the one name ?

[angelman]

Out of interest, who owns Jackson Farm at the moment?

[SuperSAINT]

£200m to buy a stake in the club. Where is that £200m going to? The person who owns that stake, ie Ms Liebherr. It does not mean SFC have the £200m to play with

 

The £200m figure is slightly strange. We don't know the size of the stake yet. £200m wouldn't buy you a minority share either - It would likely buy you the whole club.

 

Maybe they have £200m to invest in the infrastructure & surrounding area - that would be cool

[Saint Fan CaM]

I guess we need to wait and see how big a stake they take if and when this is announced. At this stage, the structure of the board and who controls it is completely up in the air. Remember that we don't know what valuation has been put on the club so also wouldn't be able to assess the relative size of the Chinese interest even if we knew the headline cash value.

 

Well 85% of £235m is about £200m which has been touted as the stake, so there's your evaluation roughly if the rumours of Kat holding 15% are true. I would say that's a realistic sale figure but perhaps a little low?

[Greenridge]

£200 million will build one hell of a stadium, are the rumours of saints owning/buying land in hedge end true?

 

Jacksons Farm. They've had it years. Lots of development taking place just up the road at the former Botley Park Golf course and a new app just gone over the road from the farm for 142 houses plus a newly approved development on the other side of the road from the golf course starting at Boorley Green railway bridge. Basically development everywhere and Jacksons Farm has a better chance now than it ever has.

[Marsdinho]

Ive heard from a good source that there will be a one child policy on match days!

[SKD]

Jacksons Farm. They've had it years. Lots of development taking place just up the road at the former Botley Park Golf course and a new app just gone over the road from the farm for 142 houses plus a newly approved development on the other side of the road from the golf course starting at Boorley Green railway bridge. Basically development everywhere and Jacksons Farm has a better chance now than it ever has.

 

I don't think for 1 second we will build a new stadium. Anyhow if we do and it's at Jacksons Farm, that'll be a disaster.

 

IMO the stadium (for a relatively new stadium) is located in the perfect location. I'd be gutted if we moved from pretty much the center of town.

 

I'd suggest it's more realistic that we expand St Marys and develop surrounding land (as per original plans under Cortese). I'm sure someone mentioned about the requirement of an additional train station if we would like to expand? Well perhaps the plans for a new tram line could assist this?

 

An interesting years ahead I think! Personally, I fell like stadium revamp is required. It wouldn't make a difference to me or you, but these american and Chinese fans would love a modern stadium with top of the range corporate facilities!

[alpine_saint]

Out of interest, who owns Jackson Farm at the moment?

 

I thought that was sold off during administration.

[farawaysaint]

I thought that was sold off during administration.

 

Not afaik.

[itchen_dan]

I don't think for 1 second we will build a new stadium. Anyhow if we do and it's at Jacksons Farm, that'll be a disaster.

 

IMO the stadium (for a relatively new stadium) is located in the perfect location. I'd be gutted if we moved from pretty much the center of town.

 

I'd suggest it's more realistic that we expand St Marys and develop surrounding land (as per original plans under Cortese). I'm sure someone mentioned about the requirement of an additional train station if we would like to expand? Well perhaps the plans for a new tram line could assist this?

 

An interesting years ahead I think! Personally, I fell like stadium revamp is required. It wouldn't make a difference to me or you, but these american and Chinese fans would love a modern stadium with top of the range corporate facilities!

 

I've been thinking this for a long long time. St Marys looks incredibly dated and worn. Look at the King Power Stadium and compare it to ours - built only 1 year later but looks SO much more modern and with the times especially with the modern blue fascias on the exterior etc. St Mary's needs money throwing at it if we want to maintain our image IMO and continue to grow our brand.

[Whitey Grandad]

So, aside from Property/Construction and exposure in China. What else can Lander bring to the table?

 

What have the Chinese ever done for us?

[Foxstone]

Out of interest, who owns Jackson Farm at the moment?

 

Wes Tender will know if he is around.

[Weston Saint]

Just had a personal email from Kat

[sotonist]

£200m to buy a stake in the club. Where is that £200m going to? The person who owns that stake, ie Ms Liebherr. It does not mean SFC have the £200m to play with

 

depends on the structure of the deal. there could be a sale of shares (money goes to the owner of the shares) or an allotment of shares (money is paid to the company)

[Mallagroth]

Just had a personal email from Kat

 

Me too how weird, did she also ask you for **** pics?

[alehouseboys]

I thought that was sold off during administration.

 

I'm pretty certain Markus Liebherr acquired that as part of the deal.

 

 

I don't think for 1 second we will build a new stadium. Anyhow if we do and it's at Jacksons Farm, that'll be a disaster.

 

IMO the stadium (for a relatively new stadium) is located in the perfect location. I'd be gutted if we moved from pretty much the center of town.

 

I'd suggest it's more realistic that we expand St Marys and develop surrounding land (as per original plans under Cortese). I'm sure someone mentioned about the requirement of an additional train station if we would like to expand? Well perhaps the plans for a new tram line could assist this?

 

An interesting years ahead I think! Personally, I fell like stadium revamp is required. It wouldn't make a difference to me or you, but these american and Chinese fans would love a modern stadium with top of the range corporate facilities!

 

I would suggest there's absolutely no desire or chance of building a new stadium out-of-town at Jacksons Farm. It's just potentially a very valuable plot of land the club have sat on for years waiting for the day it would finally be given permission to build homes on. There was no chance for decades but things have now changed, I'm sure any future plans for it are selling it to developers or the Chinese may be involved there?

 

If this goes through I'm sure think we can at least look forward to a spruced-up St Mary's Stadium and surrounding area.

[SuperSAINT]

Southampton owner Katharina Liebherr assures fan Chinese sale won't harm club:

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/01/26/southampton-owner-katharina-liebherr-assures-fan-chinese-sale/

 

A few interesting little pieces of detail in there from Sam Wallace.

[Greenridge]

I'm pretty certain Markus Liebherr acquired that as part of the deal.

 

 

 

 

I would suggest there's absolutely no desire or chance of building a new stadium out-of-town at Jacksons Farm. It's just potentially a very valuable plot of land the club have sat on for years waiting for the day it would finally be given permission to build homes on. There was no chance for decades but things have now changed, I'm sure any future plans for it are selling it to developers or the Chinese may be involved there?

 

If this goes through I'm sure think we can at least look forward to a spruced-up St Mary's Stadium and surrounding area.

 

That's what I was alluding to. Not a stadium as SKD interpreted. That indeed would be a lodgistical nightmare.

[doddisalegend]

Southampton owner Katharina Liebherr assures fan Chinese sale won't harm club:

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/01/26/southampton-owner-katharina-liebherr-assures-fan-chinese-sale/

 

A few interesting little pieces of detail in there from Sam Wallace.

 

 

Isn't he the clubs pet jurno? This bit I interesting not a take over.

 

The Chinese investment will not represent a takeover of the club and Southampton do not want to change the model that has made them so phenomenally successful.

[eelpie]

I agree. The worst thing possible would be an owner who wants to impose themselves and change our whole ethos.

 

Or one who borrows money to buy the club and foots the bill the club, not themselves.

[Manuel]

The club slowly being placed in the hands of people who have no interest in Southampton, the club history, the city. The Chinese will do well financially out of it, and might even tart up the stadium but at what long term cost. If this is what it takes to attempt to push on up the league it's not for me, I'd rather stay as we are.

[Saint_clark]

The club slowly being placed in the hands of people who have no interest in Southampton, the club history, the city. The Chinese will do well financially out of it, and might even tart up the stadium but at what long term cost. If this is what it takes to attempt to push on up the league it's not for me, I'd rather stay as we are.

 

Football being a money making business is an absolute myth, especially if you're buying clubs at this level.

[Shroppie]

I don't claim to be in any way an ITK, but I have just heard from someone I trust that the deal is done, announcement imminent.

 

Kat to retain 15%

 

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Looks like my info was pretty well right

 

I guess £200m would buy 85%

 

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[doddisalegend]

Looks like my info was pretty well right

 

I guess £200m would buy 85%

 

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

 

 

85% would be a take over though? The club mouth piece said in his article it wasn't a take over just investment.

[Faz]

The club slowly being placed in the hands of people who have no interest in Southampton, the club history, the city. The Chinese will do well financially out of it, and might even tart up the stadium but at what long term cost. If this is what it takes to attempt to push on up the league it's not for me, I'd rather stay as we are.

 

You mean like Marcus Liebherr?

[Badger]

The club slowly being placed in the hands of people who have no interest in Southampton, the club history, the city. The Chinese will do well financially out of it, and might even tart up the stadium but at what long term cost. If this is what it takes to attempt to push on up the league it's not for me, I'd rather stay as we are.

 

Agree.

 

The Liebherr era has been a steady climb and progress. Don't really want their involvement to be changed. That said, I couldn't criticise KL if she wanted to give up on a football club that she just happened to inherit.

[Saint Albert]

So just an ordinary, run of the mill slow news week for Saints supporters then.

 

I still have reservations about Lander based on the info already dug up about them here. I certainly hope that this is not a Man U style leveraged takeover.

[shurlock]

85% would be a take over though? The club mouth piece said in his article it wasn't a take over just investment.

 

Yep, strictly speaking, it implies KL will retain the controlling stake; but who knows. The journo might be using the term loosely or figuratively as in the Chinese have offered assurances they won't be changing the club's personnel, organisation or culture.

Edited 26 January, 2017 by shurlock

[farawaysaint]

Think there may be some disinformation being spread here, sounds like the Chinese will outright own us.

[SuperSAINT]

Think there may be some disinformation being spread here, sounds like the Chinese will outright own us.

 

Kat says "partnership" in her statement though.

 

Depends on the validity of the £200m.

[Shroppie]

85% would be a take over though? The club mouth piece said in his article it wasn't a take over just investment.

Investment can mean takeover. Just not buyout.

 

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[Faz]

Investment can mean takeover. Just not buyout.

 

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Investment can also mean we value the club at £210m, you give us £200m in return for new shares and you own 49%. Hey presto, the club has money to invest and a bridge to China, and Kat retains control.

 

I have to say, if I was pumping £200m in, I'd want some degree of control.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

£200m doesn't seem enough to me for 85% of the business.

[Saint_clark]

Kat says "partnership" in her statement though.

 

Depends on the validity of the £200m.

 

Perhaps part of the money is going into shares, part is coming in as a loan to be paid back?

[Charlie Wayman]

The bad news being buried is not this but the deafening silence on transfer dealings.

[Saint_clark]

The bad news being buried is not this but the deafening silence on transfer dealings.

 

The club could use some new signings - but I don't want us to buy for the sake of it. I only want players we would buy anyway.

[CanadaSaint]

A 15% stake isn't really much, and Katharina doesn't need the money, so there has to be something else behind it.

 

This could be less about changing anything inside the club and more about targeting the Chinese market, which is notoriously difficult to crack.

 

The other angle, and probably the more likely one, is the potential development around the ground. I'm sure the club doesn't want to spend a ton of time and money on that because it deflects focus away from core purpose. Lander Sports Development was formerly Lander Real Estate - property development.

 

Does anyone know if the club has right of first refusal on any of that land?

 

The worst case scenario, for me, is that it's step one in a multi-stage takeover, but Katharina's letter suggests that she's still here for the long term.

[alpine_saint]

In terms of steering club direction, 15% might as well be 0%.

 

15% would mean staying in for a profit. Football doesnt make profit.

 

I dont believe the 85% story.

[shurlock]

A 15% stake isn't really much, and Katharina doesn't need the money, so there has to be something else behind it.

 

This could be less about changing anything inside the club and more about targeting the Chinese market, which is notoriously difficult to crack.

 

The other angle, and probably the more likely one, is the potential development around the ground. I'm sure the club doesn't want to spend a ton of time and money on that because it deflects focus away from core purpose. Lander Sports Development was formerly Lander Real Estate - property development.

 

Does anyone know if the club has right of first refusal on any of that land?

 

The worst case scenario, for me, is that it's step one in a multi-stage takeover, but Katharina's letter suggests that she's still here for the long term.

 

There really isn't a Chinese market when it comes to supporting English sides. Chinese consumers are as interested in following star players as they are in teams and even then are likely to support sides across all the European leagues rather than be invested in one side in one league.

[a1ex2001]

There really isn't a Chinese market when it comes to supporting English sides. Chinese consumers are as interested in following star players as they are in teams and even then are likely to support sides across all the European leagues rather than be invested in one side in one league.

 

You've contradicted yourself there if Chinese fans are likely to follow multiple sides across Europe then there clearly is a market if we become one of there multiple clubs it up's our visibility in china which in turn ups our potential revenue generating ability. Just because they aren't 'Southampton until the die' doesn't mean they can't be milked for a few million!

 

My general feeling about this is one of concern, it worries me that a Chinese property development firm is anywhere near the club, it worries me that we might be loosing our stable ownership and it worries me that Kat and her people have felt the need to issue this rather vague statement. Personally I'd be happy if the Chinese investment was blocked.

[Chez]

A 15% stake isn't really much, and Katharina doesn't need the money, so there has to be something else behind it.

 

isn't 15% the unofficial equity requirement companies ask for before offering a place on the board?

Edited 26 January, 2017 by Chez

[Chris27687]

In terms of steering club direction, 15% might as well be 0%.

 

15% would mean staying in for a profit. Football doesnt make profit.

 

I dont believe the 85% story.

 

The 85% doesn't make any sense as that values the entire club at £235m. The total transfermart squad value is £170mish and that values VVD at £13m~ add in all the rest of the assets and continued revenue from the premiership and we are easily worth £400-£500m.

[SuperSAINT]

Sam Wallace (who has good club connections) made it pretty clear in his preview tweet earlier that it isn't a takeover:

 

Sam Wallace ‏@SamWallaceTel (6h6 hours ago)

Southampton FC in talks with Chinese investors Lander Sports over sale of stake of club, but not a full takeover.