World Super League not far away

[van Hanegem]

You have a gigantic misunderstanding of what the likes of Coca-Cola do. They'll sponsor and partner up with successful propositions that drive their brand awareness/equity but they aren't about to start demanding that football clubs or competitions or administrators create leagues for them. There's plenty of opportunities for Coke to get their brand out there and they'll take the opportunities as they arrive.

 

And of course Watford v Swansea isn't particularly interesting but all leagues have ballast and filler and Watford v Swansea is ballast that is logistically easy to deliver and is part of the very successful proposition that is making billions around the world. Shanghai Athletic vs Seoul United is neither of those things. As well as being logistically complicated, there's nothing to suggest that fixture has any appeal in the Premier League's core markets.

 

Plus as I mentioned before I don't understand why Manchester United would sign up to a load of rigmarole of playing Seoul for a league fixture: logistical nightmare, delivers a product of questionable quality and very questionable global appeal and enriches a football club they really don't need to enrich. You're asking Manchester United to schlep around the globe playing league fixtures purely to make other parasite clubs rich. You might live in a fantasy land where Coca Cola will be telling MUFC that they have to do this but sorry they will not get involved.

 

Ditto Barcelona - lord knows why you think they're about to drop their current perfectly workable and profitable arrangement to play league matches in Sydney.

 

Coca Cola will not be forcing this all to happen. They are too busy running a global soft drink multinational to give a monkeys. We shall see indeed.

 

Apparantly you're not aware that the biggest Spanish, Italian and German clubs are behind the initiative to start a global super league as they are afraid they can't compete anymore with the biggest British clubs in the near future. According to the chairman of the European Professional Football Leagues (EPFL) it will be driven by tv-markets, big sponsor deals and global marketing and this will be a threat to the PL as in the PL there are billions at stake while in the other leagues we're talking about "just" millions.

 

Also, you keep talking about Chinese and American clubs who have no appeal for fans in the rest of the world. However, no one has said there will be that many Chinese and American clubs from the beginning. Which European clubs could take part? Let's name a few: from Italy: AC Milan, Inter Milan, Juventus. From Germany: Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund. From France: Paris SG. From Spain: Barcelona, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Sevilla. Add 4 or 5 clubs from the PL and a couple from South America (choose from River Plate, Boca, Santos, Flamengo etc.) and one from China and the USA and you'll have a competition with more appealing clubs for a world wide audience than the PL. When the British clubs don't join there are still enough other European clubs who would gladly take part like Roma, Napoli, Wolfsburg, Lyon etc. Bigger and more appealing names than most of the clubs in the PL.

 

It's not me making things up CB, it's all coming from this chairman from the EPFL. Somehow I believe he knows "a bit" more about this subject than you or me or anyone else on this forum...

[CB Fry]

Apparantly you're not aware that the biggest Spanish, Italian and German clubs are behind the initiative to start a global super league as they are afraid they can't compete anymore with the biggest British clubs in the near future. According to the chairman of the European Professional Football Leagues (EPFL) it will be driven by tv-markets, big sponsor deals and global marketing and this will be a threat to the PL as in the PL there are billions at stake while in the other leagues we're talking about "just" millions.

 

Also, you keep talking about Chinese and American clubs who have no appeal for fans in the rest of the world. However, no one has said there will be that many Chinese and American clubs from the beginning. Which European clubs could take part? Let's name a few: from Italy: AC Milan, Inter Milan, Juventus. From Germany: Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund. From France: Paris SG. From Spain: Barcelona, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Sevilla. Add 4 or 5 clubs from the PL and a couple from South America (choose from River Plate, Boca, Santos, Flamengo etc.) and one from China and the USA and you'll have a competition with more appealing clubs for a world wide audience than the PL. When the British clubs don't join there are still enough other European clubs who would gladly take part like Roma, Napoli, Wolfsburg, Lyon etc. Bigger and more appealing names than most of the clubs in the PL.

 

It's not me making things up CB, it's all coming from this chairman from the EPFL. Somehow I believe he knows "a bit" more about this subject than you or me or anyone else on this forum...

 

Well we shall see won't we.

 

I haven't said you're making it up, but I will happily maintain that the dogs dinner of a football competition you seem to think is going to happen will not happen. It's a classic horse-designed-by-committee idea which thinks it is going to make everyone happy but won't make anybody happy.

 

Wolfsberg vs River Plate? Not sure most people would open the curtains to watch that in the back garden.

 

Personally I think you are mistaking some football club big business brinkmanship with a viable workable idea.

 

See you in five years. There might be an adapted European comp, and their might be some nods to Global tournaments hand in hand with the Premier League, but there won't be much and there won't be some all encompassing Formula One with shinpads that you think is coming.

[van Hanegem]

Well we shall see won't we.

 

I haven't said you're making it up, but I will happily maintain that the dogs dinner of a football competition you seem to think is going to happen will not happen. It's a classic horse-designed-by-committee idea which thinks it is going to make everyone happy but won't make anybody happy.

 

Wolfsberg vs River Plate? Not sure most people would open the curtains to watch that in the back garden.

 

Personally I think you are mistaking some football club big business brinkmanship with a viable workable idea.

 

See you in five years. There might be an adapted European comp, and their might be some nods to Global tournaments hand in hand with the Premier League, but there won't be much and there won't be some all encompassing Formula One with shinpads that you think is coming.

 

Maybe you're right and this whole idea is doomed to fail but at least the reason behind it- Bayern Munich, Barcelona, Real Madrid etc. being afraid the British clubs are getting to rich to compete with - sounds very real to me. Just look at Dutch clubs like Ajax and PSV for example, once they were big clubs in international football but nowadays their total budget is half of the tv money a club like Watford gets and that's just the tv money. Of course the Dutch market is of little importance compared to Spain, Germany and Italy but those markets have reached their limits also while the PL gets bigger and bigger and the income from the Champions League isn't enough for Barcelona and Madrid to close the gap with the likes of United, City or Chelsea. So, if this goes on they will lose in the end and therefore it's simply to understand they're in need of alternatives. Wether a global Super League will be the answer remains to be seen but yes, I do believe this league is going to happen like insiders are telling.

 

Wether it's going to happen or not: would you as a Saints fan regret clubs like United, City and Chelsea leaving the PL?

[CB Fry]

Maybe you're right and this whole idea is doomed to fail but at least the reason behind it- Bayern Munich, Barcelona, Real Madrid etc. being afraid the British clubs are getting to rich to compete with - sounds very real to me. Just look at Dutch clubs like Ajax and PSV for example, once they were big clubs in international football but nowadays their total budget is half of the tv money a club like Watford gets and that's just the tv money. Of course the Dutch market is of little importance compared to Spain, Germany and Italy but those markets have reached their limits also while the PL gets bigger and bigger and the income from the Champions League isn't enough for Barcelona and Madrid to close the gap with the likes of United, City or Chelsea. So, if this goes on they will lose in the end and therefore it's simply to understand they're in need of alternatives. Wether a global Super League will be the answer remains to be seen but yes, I do believe this league is going to happen like insiders are telling.

 

Wether it's going to happen or not: would you as a Saints fan regret clubs like United, City and Chelsea leaving the PL?

This was mentioned on another thread yesterday and I would be more than comfortable with MUFC and Chelsea leaving to go to some elite league. Quite happy for Saints to be in competition with the remaining English clubs of which there will be plenty to make it interesting - West Ham, Leeds, Derby, Forest, Everton, Newcastle.

 

I have little interest in the Champions League now so would just let an elite competition completely pass me by.

 

I can see where there big European clubs are coming from but not sure their solution is the solution. Yep, the bottom placed Prem team gets more than the CL winner but there must be a reason for that. The PL works like Top Gear works. Top Gear wasn't "let's get all the greatest presenters from every country in the world and let's try and appeal to every person in every country". It just worked on a global scale.

 

The Champions League has got a lot of those clubs you listed out but still can't compete with the Prem. There must be a reason for that.

 

The PL for whatever reason has got the television x-factor world wide and it's been achieved relatively effortlessly. Trying to work out how Dortmund are going to play two games in Brazil, then two at home against a Chinese and Argentine team then a game in France etc is not logistically easy and is going to have to go some to be as profitable for all concerned as a simple-to-put-on Premier League match. How many people are clamouring to watch Dortmund now and how many more will once they're regularly playing Santos?

[alehouseboys]

I'm still with van Hanegem on this, think it will happen, eventually. Us traditionalists will despise it but your modern fan will embrace it. All the biggest clubs and best players, and TV audiences, will want to be part of it. Dortmund v Santos will still have far more appeal than Burnley v Watford. People around the world now only want watch the Premier League's big 6 clubs.

[100%Red&White]

You could make a massive-money-making, global-appealing, advertisers-dream, World League out of most of these:

 

Real Madrid, Barcelona, (Atletico Madrid, Seville, Valencia), Man Utd, Man City, Arsenal, Chelsea, (Spurs), AC Milan, Inter Milan, Juventus (Napoli, Roma), PSG, (Lyon, Marseille), Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Benfica, Sporting Lisbon, Ajax, Feyenoord, Boca Juniors, River Plate, Glasgow Rangers, Celtic, a couple of Brazil’s top clubs, one or two I’ve probably not considered, and David Beckham’s US-Soccer-Allstars.

 

It wouldn’t just be about the current best clubs but the best names and biggest fan clubs around the world. Rangers and Celtic would probably be invited because they are massive globally, and would just get even bigger with the potential financial field-leveller.

It would still have more appeal to the Asian market than the Premier League even if, say, no Chinese team was involved (at the start, anyway). Not for me but can’t see it not happening now, imo.

[van Hanegem]

This was mentioned on another thread yesterday and I would be more than comfortable with MUFC and Chelsea leaving to go to some elite league. Quite happy for Saints to be in competition with the remaining English clubs of which there will be plenty to make it interesting - West Ham, Leeds, Derby, Forest, Everton, Newcastle.

 

I have little interest in the Champions League now so would just let an elite competition completely pass me by.

 

I can see where there big European clubs are coming from but not sure their solution is the solution. Yep, the bottom placed Prem team gets more than the CL winner but there must be a reason for that. The PL works like Top Gear works. Top Gear wasn't "let's get all the greatest presenters from every country in the world and let's try and appeal to every person in every country". It just worked on a global scale.

 

The Champions League has got a lot of those clubs you listed out but still can't compete with the Prem. There must be a reason for that.

 

The PL for whatever reason has got the television x-factor world wide and it's been achieved relatively effortlessly. Trying to work out how Dortmund are going to play two games in Brazil, then two at home against a Chinese and Argentine team then a game in France etc is not logistically easy and is going to have to go some to be as profitable for all concerned as a simple-to-put-on Premier League match. How many people are clamouring to watch Dortmund now and how many more will once they're regularly playing Santos?

 

In my opinion you can't compare the CL with the PL as the CL with it's group stages to protect the "big clubs"' from getting out too early is a designed and marketed cash cow for the Uefa and the likes of Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich and the super rich clubs from England. The Uefa now even wants more clubs in the CL from the "big" countries at the expense of the "smaller" countries in order to prevent the big clubs to start a super league by themselves. It seems they don't mind that this way the gap between the three or four big countries (does Italy still count as a big country?) and the rest becomes unbridgeable and the majority of european football fans will lose intrest in the CL eventually which will lead to smaller revenues in the end.

 

A national competition like the PL, Primera Division or even the Eredivisie in Holland is far more "genuine" than the CL and therefore much more interesting to football fans than a plastic product like the CL. The PL has the advantage of course that there are more appealing clubs taking part and able to win the league then there are in Spain, Germany and Italy all together (that's a problem for the Bayern Munichs and Barcelona's too...). I reckon the only alternative to beat the PL is a super league in which the biggest clubs of (mainly) Europe will take part and play each week like in a regular competition. Probably they even doesn't have to add clubs from America or China at all to get a world audience, that would make it even more easy when it comes to logistics.

 

Anyway, just like you I wouldn't mind when the biggest clubs leave their national competition. I even believe it will be a good thing as it could mean there will be less foreigners in the national leagues so local talent will get more of a chance and the remaining clubs pay more attention to their local roots instead of just being run like a business who you can move anywhere else. But that's just the traditionalist I am speaking...

[van Hanegem]

You could make a massive-money-making, global-appealing, advertisers-dream, World League out of most of these:

 

Real Madrid, Barcelona, (Atletico Madrid, Seville, Valencia), Man Utd, Man City, Arsenal, Chelsea, (Spurs), AC Milan, Inter Milan, Juventus (Napoli, Roma), PSG, (Lyon, Marseille), Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Benfica, Sporting Lisbon, Ajax, Feyenoord, Boca Juniors, River Plate, Glasgow Rangers, Celtic, a couple of Brazil’s top clubs, one or two I’ve probably not considered, and David Beckham’s US-Soccer-Allstars.

 

It wouldn’t just be about the current best clubs but the best names and biggest fan clubs around the world. Rangers and Celtic would probably be invited because they are massive globally, and would just get even bigger with the potential financial field-leveller.

It would still have more appeal to the Asian market than the Premier League even if, say, no Chinese team was involved (at the start, anyway). Not for me but can’t see it not happening now, imo.

 

I like your idea but the financial gap between a club like Feyenoord and Manchester United is far too big. For the 125 million euros paid for Pogba you can buy all the players and staff of Feyenoord. Twice...

 

Hopefully Feyenoord doesn't get slaugthered tonight like Celtic by Barcelona.

[van Hanegem]

Oi, everything I said above doesn't involve Manchester Utd. They're rubbish...