Which Saints manager has done the best, and what would they want to forget?

[david in sweden]

Looking back, I asked myself Which managers got the best out of their teams....and which transfers deals would they want to forget?

Prior to the Liebherr takeover, Kelvin Davis, Lallana and Schneiderlin were already "regulars " in the squad that was relegated from the Championship in 2009; that

 

Alan Pardew inherited after summer 2009. It goes without saying the purchases of; Lambert, Hammond, Jaidi and Fonte gave us the backbone of a squad that saw us through 3 seasons and back up into the Prem. Amongst the loan deals were the young Michail Antonio, and Papa Waigo who DAJFU that season and the loan of David Connolly (cruelly shortened by his ongoing injuries) was worth it just to see his class performances - when he was fit enough to play.

The first loan period of Puncheon had it's ups and downs, but after the dust settled in his relationship with Cortese, he proved to be a valuable asset.

With hindsight the Saints career of Lee Barnard doesn't seem a success, but for one mid-season period, his partnership with Rickie Lambert was a joy to behold.

Perhaps not the greatest success with the signings of; Harding, Seabourne and Otsemobor, although it didn't cost a fortune to have them available.

We might have to wait a long time before Alan Pardew's autobiography tells the story behind his abrupt dismissal, but go he did and was quickly followed by ;

 

Nigel Adkins. Nothing I say should detract from the excellent job that NA did in navigating us through two divisions in the following two seasons, but I'm sure he would admit that he had the benefit of an almost unchanged Pardew squad which was later supplemented by Fraser Richardson and we also saw the best of Guly's time with Saints. The buys / loans of; Dickson, Chaplow and Forte had their high points, but in the end were nothing to write home about.

 

NA's second season saw us loaning Jack Cork, and signing Jos Hooiveld and Danny Fox. In hindsight they all had their detractors, but Jos' enthusiasm and contribution of 7 goals were vital to our promotion effort, as were the 20+ "assists" from Fox and Richardson for our in-form strikers. Although it soon became clear that Billy Sharp wasn't " Prem.material, his 5 month sojourn at the end of that season was vital to our eventual promotion, at a time when Rickie Lambert had an unsually poor spell in front of goal. The mention of Steve De Ridder and Tadanari Lee bring memories of a different sort. SDR just wasn't the right material - even for the Championship, but we will never know what "might have been" for Tadanari's career, had it not been for his long term injury problems.

 

Adkins had barely half-a-season to make it "gell" in the Prem. and started the season with the purchases of; Clyne, Rodriguez, Steven Davis and Yoshida. Even though Yoshida rarely had a run of games to prove himself, but the others clearly proved their worth over and over in later years.

On the downside, Birmingham's refusal to sell the young Jack Butland to Saints (we're rumoured to have bid £6 million) meant choosing Paolo Gazzaniga instead.

Although he may have "looked the part", PG just never made it to Prem. standard, and we can only hope that 4 years later, his loan out might help his career.

Only the timely loan of Artur Boruc kept us above the relegation zone that season.

 

Mauricio Pochettino arrived and stepped up the tempo, in what was essentially Adkins' squad playing at a faster pace. The addition of Dejan Lovren, who looked good at first, *****il his head was turned to thoughts of Liverpool), but was perhaps " made to look better than he was" by through his partnership with still excellent Jose Fonte. Argeuably he did even better when having Wanyama in the side. The mention of Forran and Osvaldo will surely be avoided in any future Pochettino biography.

A man of high ambition, Pochettino moved on and half that season's squad following suit to various points north.

 

Ronald Koeman had the "advantage " that he could almost buy a new team, which was done well. Not sure who were Koeman's choices and who were from " Les Reed and the Black Box ", but none of the new purchases could be faulted for their contributions; Forster, Bertrand, Tadic, Pelle, Long, Mane and the (sadly only loaned) Alderweireld ....all produced excellent performances on a regular basis and all improved their international prospects into the bargain.

Gardos played few games, was rarely in a losing side but spent a lot of time on the bench. The loan deals for Elia and Druricic were thankfully short-lived. The Koeman's second season brought in Romeu, Cedric and Clasie who for all their talent have yet to prove themselves. Martina was signed because of his history with the Koeman's, but few will ever forget his Goal of the Season v Arsenal. The outstanding buy of the season was undoubtedly Virgil van Dijk, and we can only hope that his long term contract is one that will keep him here for the duration. Stekelenburg's loan was important and HDAJFU when needed.

The only down sides must be the failure of Juanmi to establish himself at Prem. level...... and the less said about the loan of Steven Caulker - the better.

Ronald Koeman - a truly outstanding player in his own right, also showed he wasn't lacking ambition when his head was turned to Merseyside, and only time will tell if he will be worth his new millionaire's salary at Everton.

 

So who did the best?. It has to be said that all four .....DAJFU, at the level they were at, during the time they were with Saints, and we progressed.

 

Claude Puel...has a lot to do if he is to continue the progress that his predecessors had achieved. To better their achievements would be a real success.

Inheriting a side that finished 6th in the Prem. may sound like a dream job for many......but maintaining that level against free-spending oppositions may be " a bridge too far ." Holding onto the 6th spot maybe "a big ask", but a good Cup run....or "winning something" in this era may prove to be Puel's greatest achievement.

 

 

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Edited 3 September, 2016 by david in sweden

[Batman]

pochettino IMO

then, adkins in the championship

[Saint-Fred]

RK got the best results.

[Roger]

Koeman was best had to sell best players. Poch didn't and finished higher.

[Dalek2003]

Whatever you say, Hoddle was a great manager.

 

The way he left us for Spurs was wrong and I bet he regrets it. I am also sure that we would have retained our PL status if he had been re-appointed in 2004.

[SFCMatt]

Alan Ball, definition of a one man team.

[Dalek2003]

Alan Ball, definition of a one man team.

 

A great enthusiast. Leaving for Man City a massive mistake.

[SFCMatt]

A great enthusiast. Leaving for Man City a massive mistake.

 

Completely over achieved with us but got the best out of Le Tiss and apart from Adkins double promotions and maybe the WGS cup final year, i've never enjoyed watching Saints so much as under Bally. Massive mistake going to City but he wasn't the first to make that mistake and certainly won't be the last.

[thefuriousb]

An honourable mention for Chis Nicholl. Playing 4-2-4 (MLT, Shearer, Rideout, Wallace). The heady days of standing on the under east terrace. I think he also achieved a 6th place finish too.

[supersonic]

Pardew did the most for us post-Liebherr. Steadied the ship, signed Lallana and Morgan to long-term deals which helped the club, bought in the spine of the team (Fonte, Lambert etc) and built the squad that Adkins then took up.

 

I think, without someone as strong as Pardew in charge, we would have had to wait a LOT longer to be back in the PL than we did.

[eelpie]

You left out Ted Bates there. It wasn't easy for him when he became manager and he didn't always get it right. But the club had faith in him, and so did the fans. It took a while before Saints emerged from the then 3rd Division, but he had advantages - charisma, vision, common sense and time to get it right.

The best manager by far.

(The Op didn't specify which era btw.)

[stevy777_x]

Whatever you say, Hoddle was a great manager.

 

The way he left us for Spurs was wrong and I bet he regrets it. I am also sure that we would have retained our PL status if he had been re-appointed in 2004.

 

Was Hoddle part of the OP's shortlist you dimwit?

Can someone get this troll banned from this forum?

Contributes nothing whatsoever. 17th, 2004 and Hoddle is his only vocabulary.

[saintalan]

In terms of enjoying each game MoPo for me

[Dalek2003]

An honourable mention for Chis Nicholl. Playing 4-2-4 (MLT, Shearer, Rideout, Wallace). The heady days of standing on the under east terrace. I think he also achieved a 6th place finish too.

 

Agreed. We were very consistent under Nicholl and as you say he kept our heads well above water.

[Dalek2003]

Was Hoddle part of the OP's shortlist you dimwit?

Can someone get this troll banned from this forum?

Contributes nothing whatsoever. 17th, 2004 and Hoddle is his only vocabulary.

 

Stop being a trouble maker.

[eelpie]

Was Hoddle part of the OP's shortlist you dimwit?

Can someone get this troll banned from this forum?

Contributes nothing whatsoever. 17th, 2004 and Hoddle is his only vocabulary.

 

The Op didn't actually specify that it had to be from the examples that he mentioned, not that it matters.

[Dalek2003]

His signings for Saints were atrocious. He had us playing ok and we finished mid table but we'd had good spells under dave jones too and did better under strachan.

 

Hoddle treated le tissier appallingly for saints and england. Anyone that loves hoddle and never mentions MLT isn't a southampton fan, clearly.

 

Awful at spurs, awful at wolves, horrendous pundit and complete dinosaur now. All that's before you get to his views on the disabled.

 

You might want to find yourself a better idol.

 

We are talking about Hoddle as a Saints manager, not what he did afterwards. Under his time as a manager Saints were high up in the table. we had a become a well organised team, hard to beat and grinding out results.

 

Statistics have shown in the past that Hoddle was one of the best managers at points to games ratio, all achieved in the Premier League.

 

Hoddle is NOT my idol, but he was a damn good Saints manager and surely should have been appointed in 2004 instead of the clueless clown Sturrock.

[ecuk268]

You left out Ted Bates there. It wasn't easy for him when he became manager and he didn't always get it right. But the club had faith in him, and so did the fans. It took a while before Saints emerged from the then 3rd Division, but he had advantages - charisma, vision, common sense and time to get it right.

The best manager by far.

(The Op didn't specify which era btw.)

 

The past is another country etc.

 

Ted wouldn't have lasted long in today's climate (who does?) but he deserves an enormous amount of credit for the part he played in getting us where we are today.

 

Mind you, getting rid of Martin Chivers and bringing in Frank Saul was a bit of a bummer.

[Mowgli]

I grew up in an era when few thought a manager could emulate the achievement of Ted Bates taking from 3rd to 1st tier of English football. So it's Nigel for me although Pards and Big Mac get a special mention for the silverware.

 

Had he stayed I honestly believe Poch would have become our greatest ever manager but I suspect his short tenure will leave him a forgotten man in a few years time. We've not yet had a dud under the Liebherr era. Long may it continue

[david in sweden]

The Op didn't actually specify that it had to be from the examples that he mentioned, not that it matters.

 

ER ....

I wasn't comparing those mentioned with Ted Bates or anyone else, but the fact that I wrote about the four since the Liebherr takeover ..was surely a clue, or was it?

[Lord Duckhunter]

Chris Nicholl was the most under rated , I guess that's the problem with following the big fella .

 

Alan Ball was great for 18 months , but there's nothing to suggest it was particularly sustainable . Hoddle made a real difference but I was biased because I never rated Dave Jones . Nigel is a legend , great bloke , perfect for us and the championship season was fantastic . Poch was head s shoulders above him or Koeman IMO . He'll manage a really big club one day .

 

However , despite what some people say & the innuendos we read on here , as a 50 year old bloke there's only one man for me.

 

Sorry , edit . Just read it's Marcus era only . Poch is far and away the best , no question about it

[eelpie]

ER ....

I wasn't comparing those mentioned with Ted Bates or anyone else, but the fact that I wrote about the four since the Liebherr takeover ..was surely a clue, or was it?

 

Questionable, and not stated clearly enough for me anyway, and by mentioning players pre-Pardew it focused attention on his predecessors, and so on. But if this is not what you wanted, sorry. I did enjoy reading your post btw, but I can't think about recent managers without comparing them with the daddy of them all, Ted Bates.

Back to the OP, I think we owe most to Pardew, because without his experience and canny purchases we might not have got out of League 1 at the second attempt and with a different manager at that difficult time we could even have wallowed there for years. Pity he couldn't keep his hands off players' ladies, though. After him Pochetino gave us the punch and flair that moved us to the next level, more so than Koeman. Truly, each played a vital part in our rise and I'm so pleased to have seen it.

[Dalek2003]

Ok, since the Liebherr takeover. Has to be Koeman for me.

[Wade Garrett]

Lawrie Mac. The golden period for Saints.

[SaintRobbie]

Koeman.

 

Best manager we've had in the Premier League.

 

By a country mile.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Katalinic]

Chris Nicholl was the most under rated , I guess that's the problem with following the big fella .

 

He was't rated much by the players that played for him.

[adrian lord]

Of the modern era, Koeman by far the most amusing and likeable. Adkins was likeable and presided over a golden era but was just a bit 'David Brent'. Poch was arrogant and I didn't like how he kept aloof with the interpreter but dropped it as soon as he went to N. London - but no doubt will go on to great things. Pardrew? Never warmed to the fellow.

[The9]

ER ....

I wasn't comparing those mentioned with Ted Bates or anyone else, but the fact that I wrote about the four since the Liebherr takeover ..was surely a clue, or was it?

 

Seemed pretty clear to me, but equally you didn't actually specify it.

 

FWIW there is a 100% correlation for me between success of the manager and highest league position achieved with Saints.

 

So it goes

Koeman

Pochettino

Adkins

Pardew

Wotte

[Shance]

For us it was undoubtedly Koeman. I actually think Poch is a much better manager but at Saints Koeman pips him. Koeman had to see his best players leave whilst dealing with Schniederlin who wanted to go but wasn't allowed. He then rebuilt the squad and bettered Pochetino's record, whilst getting us into the Europa league group stages.

 

I also think Adkins achievements are underrated at times. League 1 was a league we should've been getting out of with the squad we had but to get out of the championship at the first time of asking is an exceptional achievement. Most of us were predicting mid table consolidation that season with a promotion push the next year but we smashed it!

Edited 4 September, 2016 by Shance

[Hamilton Saint]

Seemed pretty clear to me, but equally you didn't actually specify it.

 

FWIW there is a 100% correlation for me between success of the manager and highest league position achieved with Saints.

So it goes

Koeman

Pochettino

Adkins

Pardew

Wotte

 

Yes ... but Adkins is a special case, since he brought us up through League One and the Championship. In two years.

[Whitey Grandad]

Seemed pretty clear to me, but equally you didn't actually specify it.

 

FWIW there is a 100% correlation for me between success of the manager and highest league position achieved with Saints.

 

So it goes

Koeman

Pochettino

Adkins

Pardew

Wotte

 

No McMenemy?

[Portugalsaint]

IMO, in the recent past

Gordon Strachan

[eelpie]

Koeman.

 

Best manager we've had in the Premier League.

 

By a country mile.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Our league position under Koeman will probably not be improved on for many years, so he will be a legend when memories of his leaving are less hurtful, but he probably had the best squad to work with, and I think much of his success is due to Mane's incredible last weeks . But fair play, Koeman did us proud. I still feel we owe most to Pardew though in that we virtually had zilch squad when he came.

Edited 4 September, 2016 by eelpie
Bl**dy predictive spelling changes

[wadesmith]

Has anyone noticed that all our managers since Ted bates have had really strong hairlines apart from Portfleet...and he was ****. Is there some strategy behind this?

[Yorkshire Saint]

Chris Nicholl every day of the week. Beautiful football and we would be 2-0 down half time and always know we would win.

[The9]

No McMenemy?

 

Not in the post-takeover period, no.

[The9]

Yes ... but Adkins is a special case, since he brought us up through League One and the Championship. In two years.

 

Yeah, and while that was impressive for the level he was at at the time, Pochettino got basically the same team Adkins left in the bottom half into 8th. Despite Osvaldo.

[Saint86]

Koeman.

 

Best manager we've had in the Premier League.

 

By a country mile.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Yeah, but he fell out with Les and then gave him the perfect chance to get rid.... Fatal.

[sammysaint]

Koeman followed by Nigel.

 

Poch did a good job don't get me wrong but as others have said he didn't have to sell players and he was given the most funds to spend and wasted alot of it on Depp/music artist wanna be, but he had it easiest.

[Wade Garrett]

Koeman best in the Liebherr era.

 

But Adkins consecutive promotions was the catalyst for everything that followed. Will never forget that Championship season, our football was brilliant.

[Cheeky Monkey]

Considering his starting position, the chairman and the policy not to spend the WGS has done the best since the millennium. A cup final and a team playing to its strengths.

 

In the post war era has to be Lawrie...

 

Adkins got is two promotions in two years... That has to be "the best" for liebheir era imo that's two seasons of winning football from start to finish with no major collapses in form.

[Miltonaggro]

Since the takeover Koeman by some distance for me. Perhaps the saddest thing was that SFC and Ron appeared to be a great fit, and I genuinely thought he was going to be at the club long term and win things here. Outwardly he seemed to love the club, the fans, and living in the area - the sticking point a difference of opinion in the Boardroom. In this sense there are comparisons with the Strachan era (another partisan delight with charisma welded to common sense), with a frustrating exit at seemingly the height of his powers. Not perfect Ron, but a winner who knew how to win games. Early days, but I think both Saints and Koeman will regret not trying harder at conciliation.

[beowulf]

Lawrie Mac. The golden period for Saints

 

Absolutely, amazed more haven't mentioned him.

Lawrie brought class players down to the Dell, it was a magical time to be a Saints fan in those days. The Channon/Keegan partnership has never been bettered. Alan Ball,Steve Williams,David Armstrong,the Wallace brothers, etc fantastic players.