One in... One out - Why is that an issue?

[Badger]

It's not simply a matter of having 25 bodies in the squad, and an issue if you don't either maintain the quality, or improve on it.

 

Of this summers business, and dealing with them as you've listed:

 

Mane - Boufal ; from some of the articles read, and comments made Boufal may be equal to, and possibly an improvement (the proviso being he recovers from his injury of course, and doesn't prove to have glass ankles or knees

 

Hojberg - Wanyama - Hojberg is an excellent signing, but NOT a VW replacement, we simply haven't recruited a DM of any note. Hojberg would be a lot more effective alongside a Wanyama type, or a Morgan. As it is he may be reluctant to venture too far upfield knowing Romeu isn't going to effectively cover.

 

Redmond - Juanmi - as a replacement for Juanmi, NR is an improvement, but just don't try to pretend he's a first choice striker

 

GK - McCarthy a few years ago was highly rated, no concern over him in place of Steklenberg or PG.

 

 

Austin - Pelle - we simply need more threat up front.

 

RB - we've gone from two unconvincing RB's, to having the same two AND a crock. No improvements.

 

 

None of which addresses limitations in DM , goalscoring threat, and Central Defence.

[Badger]

It's the lack of goals that concerns me, jrod & Austin have a lot to prove due to there injury record and long needs a good follow up season. Plenty of us were writing him off before last season, needs to get in the goals Stan but can't see it imho.

Redmond is not a striker but [ we hope ] is a good winger at best.

 

Added something to your last sentence.

[OldNick]

I really thought we'd make another good signing today. Rumours of another signing in the 10m bracket suggested haller. Then it suddenly becomes 'but we kept Rodriguez'. We needed another option even with him staying. But there we go.

 

I know no one wants to spend for the sake of it, but can see why some fans have gone that way. It would alleviate the doubts about investment. I mean having to sell each summer and have no net spend in the richest league in the world is a little odd.

 

I know there are no shades of grey on here and that gets taken as ok we should spend 30m on bony should we. But we could stick to our 10-15m bracket of quality and potential but just sign a couple more.

I don't get why we don't look closer to home. I have mentioned Will Hughes from Derby a few times, a decent prospect and I doubt would break the bank

[beatlesaint]

It's the lack of goals that concerns me, jrod & Austin have a lot to prove due to there injury record and long needs a good follow up season. Plenty of us were writing him off before last season, needs to get in the goals Stan but can't see it imho.

Redmond is not a striker but is a good winger at best.

 

totally agree. Redmond will not be a Henry in a million years, the guy is a winger, plain and simple.

If I'm wrong and in two or three years he is scoring 25 goals a season for Liverpool feel free to dig this up and point out the error of my ways in disagreeing with Puel.

[corky morris]

All that from the man who lapped up every word of Rupert Lowe!!!

 

Get the impression MLG has no opinions, just whatever the club does is amazing. It's as crazy as the solely negative people.

 

The replacing thing is odd. I mean you don't have to replace a reserve with a reserve. Replace them with a good starting player, improve the team and the squad in one move.

 

I'd ideally have added Hojbjerg to replace Clasie, or signed him last season. Then Wanyama and Hojbjerg play and we've improved the starting team quite a lot. It's not some impossible dream. Now we're lacking a strong DM. Boufal or Mane, who knows, but he'll do well to recreate Mane's form. Redmond depends whether we're saying versus Pelle, Juanmi or Mane really.

 

I think Boufal will be very good, and we won't be too far behind last season's team for quality. Which is fine, I guess. But a slight decline in quality in a league that's probably stronger...well it depends what you're aiming for doesn't it. In May I was hoping we could improve the team we had. That was probably extremely naive.

[pimpin4rizeal]

what is my expectations?

why have you decided I want it all now?

 

I want us to buy premiership proven quality. that is utterly dismissed. Yet all of our rivals are now doing it

and maybe stop selling 3-5 players in the summer and not have a negative net spend

I fully expect it to be no different next season. I will be amazed if VvD is a saint in 12 months. Throw in Forster, maybe even Hojbjerg

ffs, Mane was sold for a very similar price to that of a player in the championship. jesus wept

 

that does not mean doing a pompey or wasting money on no-marks

 

Nail on head. Feel completely the same

[eddie]

Same old crap being posted.

 

Upgrades on the outgoings, squad depth, injuries to JR/RG, changing the strategy to be less youth and more big name signings.

 

Wish people would just cut the bull and post something interesting. We all know the arguments. We all know that we need to wait until the end of the season to judge. Football happens every ****ing year, sometimes a different league but for heavens sake...I honestly don't know what you get out of complaining all the ****in g time. I'm not pulling out the 'support another club' crap, you're a welcome saints fan, just that the negativity serves no purpose. You aren't making your voice heard through any of the channels that will actually bring change.

 

Organise a picket outside Staplewood. Try and stage a walkout against the club strategy. Write a fans letter to Les Reed. Do some clever trickery with social media campaigning.

Stop talking to other Saints fans over and over about pointless crap of which you got no clue.

We don't see behind the scenes, and we don't really know a lot about the players/tactics. Half of our team I didn't even know existed before 2 years ago. See them on a Saturday afternoon but I'm sure Puel and the staff are clued up on their ideal team and being as competitive as possible. Least I hope so.

 

It's annoying how Pelle was bashed around for being slow, useless, doing fancy flicks and now his goals are irreplaceable. Wanyama played it cool the same as Morgan, stayed another year instead of pushing, FairPlay, we replaced those 2 DMs (don't need 2 DMs) with Clasie, Hojbjerg, Romeu, Davis (now that talent has been added further forward). It's weaker for certain but still a lot of potential. Worse case scenario our defensive midfield is dodgy for a season or half . We've had worse .

 

Not saying it's all in hand and the board is perfect, think we got burnt fingers and played bad hands recently with some transfers and some general management issues, but seems fairly well run. Honestly not got a clue what it is in reality as OS paints everything as rosy and full of good humour and encouraging contract talks.

Bring on January...lol

Edited 31 August, 2016 by eddie

[angelman]

If we were playing the same number of games then that would be fine but we aren't, we've got a minimum of six extra games.

 

Incorrect. We are playing 4 less than planned last year, that is unless you expected the club to not qualify for the group stages of EL last year

[James]

Incorrect. We are playing 4 less than planned last year, that is unless you expected the club to not qualify for the group stages of EL last year

 

My mistake.

[Mr Saints]

Boufal - Mané

Højbjerg - Wanyama

Redmond - Juanmi

McCarthy - Stekelenburg

Taylor - Davis

Austin* - Pellè

Pied** - Martina

Some Saints fans claim "all we are doing is replacing", but... you are only allowed 25 senior players. What is the alternative to replacing players one in, one out when you can't use senior player 26 or 27?

 

Why are people so quick to dismiss the possibility that for example Boufal, Redmond & Højbjerg may be improvements. Seems extremely premature to rule that out so soon after they've arrived.

 

People also say "upgrade Yoshida and/or Gardos. But is that really that easy to do? Centre backs unlike other positions are less likely to have rotation, you would want van Dijk and Fonte playing 90 minutes. It is therefore difficult to attract a better player than two internationals like Yoshida/Gardos who would be happy to play second fiddle to van Dijk and Fonte. Grades was back in training before the Man Utd game and is 4th choice, with multiple promising young academy centre backs below him.

 

 

* the club told Jeremy Wilson in the Telegraph that Austin signing was pre-empting Pellè's departure

** injured so Martina possibly staying

 

Sorry but anyone who thinks Hjojberg is a Wanyama replacement has never seen him play or just doesn't understand the game. They are completely different midfielders. We have a gaping hole in centre mid and crucially it's an area where we're physically light IMO.

[Saint Garrett]

Sorry but anyone who thinks Hjojberg is a Wanyama replacement has never seen him play or just doesn't understand the game. They are completely different midfielders. We have a gaping hole in centre mid and crucially it's an area where we're physically light IMO.

 

This, with the additional issue that we're playing 1 DM rather than 2! Gaping hole there and the sooner Puel realises we need to play with 2 in there the better IMO

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Saint_clark]

Do you ever disagree with what the club do?

 

Despite it being glaringly obvious we needed a couple more.

 

Only retrospectively, claiming that players from the past were not up to scratch. Which is strange.

Anyway I largely agree with him. Lets not forget our squad last season was put together with Europa League games in mind, we just crashed out early...look at how much game time Juanmi, Jay Rod got. You've got Gardos back from injury, you've got JWP another year more experienced having just won an international tournament - he's still only 21, we shouldn't write him off yet.

We've got a strong crop of youth players a year closer to the first team...Sims, Jones, Olomola, Hesketh, Slattery, Valery, all have been touted as having huge potential. Pretty sure our head of youth development said at last season awards that Alfie Jones was one of the best prospects this club has produced.

 

And we've done things the right way when others are going crazy.

[The9]

Ok, understood. Why is it that other clubs of similar statute are able to do it though? I suppose it comes from us having a squad which, whilst it lacks stand out stars, it is generally of a pretty good quality whereas other clubs may have a more pronounced difference in quality amongst their squads.

 

We also seem to do pretty well at managing the tightrope of player egos, which can't be hurt by not having people paid massively more than others (though I'm pretty sure every contract includes a no-discuss clause about wages).

[The9]

FWIW, we didn't play 2 DMs for probably more than half of last season. One of the reasons we didn't keep a clean sheet in the last 13 games of last season, but also one of the

reasons we scored more than we would have done playing more defensively.

[dobbo]

Not sure if this is correct but with ffp I thought that if you spend less on net transfers the extra goes into additional wages allowed, this would support the contract extensions and ensure in years to come we could compete (obviously not with the big clubs) and not lose as many players each year. May be wrong

[Le Timmier]

Same old crap being posted.

 

Upgrades on the outgoings, squad depth, injuries to JR/RG, changing the strategy to be less youth and more big name signings.

 

Wish people would just cut the bull and post something interesting. We all know the arguments. We all know that we need to wait until the end of the season to judge. Football happens every ****ing year, sometimes a different league but for heavens sake...I honestly don't know what you get out of complaining all the ****in g time. I'm not pulling out the 'support another club' crap, you're a welcome saints fan, just that the negativity serves no purpose. You aren't making your voice heard through any of the channels that will actually bring change.

 

Organise a picket outside Staplewood. Try and stage a walkout against the club strategy. Write a fans letter to Les Reed. Do some clever trickery with social media campaigning.

Stop talking to other Saints fans over and over about pointless crap of which you got no clue.

We don't see behind the scenes, and we don't really know a lot about the players/tactics. Half of our team I didn't even know existed before 2 years ago. See them on a Saturday afternoon but I'm sure Puel and the staff are clued up on their ideal team and being as competitive as possible. Least I hope so.

 

It's annoying how Pelle was bashed around for being slow, useless, doing fancy flicks and now his goals are irreplaceable. Wanyama played it cool the same as Morgan, stayed another year instead of pushing, FairPlay, we replaced those 2 DMs (don't need 2 DMs) with Clasie, Hojbjerg, Romeu, Davis (now that talent has been added further forward). It's weaker for certain but still a lot of potential. Worse case scenario our defensive midfield is dodgy for a season or half . We've had worse .

 

Not saying it's all in hand and the board is perfect, think we got burnt fingers and played bad hands recently with some transfers and some general management issues, but seems fairly well run. Honestly not got a clue what it is in reality as OS paints everything as rosy and full of good humour and encouraging contract talks.

Bring on January...lol

Terrific post mate

 

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

[Sour Mash]

It's clearly a poor window from Saints.

 

For those that disagree, which clubs have had worse?

[The9]

It's clearly a poor window from Saints.

 

For those that disagree, which clubs have had worse?

 

Everton, compared to their fans' expectations.

 

I'd say we did exactly what I expected us to do, other than replace Pelle like for like. We haven't signed anyone obviously disruptive or that doesn't work with our system(s), we've kept 5 or 6 who wanted more money which helps with the consistency, and we haven't lost anyone we haven't planned to lose. In fact we also kept Tadic who was expected to go by the ITKs. And we came out of it with two European Champions we didn't have at the start of it. Hojbjerg looks like a great investment too.

 

Plus we broke the club transfer record for the kind of creative central playmaker we haven't had since Gaston stopped being the solution.

 

While everyone else scrambles around for names or last-minute signings, we've known who we want to sign and improve for 18 months and have gone out to get them. It's not flashy but it's been working for the last 3 or so years now.

[Sour Mash]

Everton, compared to their fans' expectations.

 

I'd say we did exactly what I expected us to do, other than replace Pelle like for like. We haven't signed anyone obviously disruptive or that doesn't work with our system(s), we've kept 5 or 6 who wanted more money which helps with the consistency, and we haven't lost anyone we haven't planned to lose. In fact we also kept Tadic who was expected to go by the ITKs. And we came out of it with two European Champions we didn't have at the start of it. Hojbjerg looks like a great investment too.

 

Plus we broke the club transfer record for the kind of creative central playmaker we haven't had since Gaston stopped being the solution.

 

While everyone else scrambles around for names or last-minute signings, we've known who we want to sign and improve for 18 months and have gone out to get them. It's not flashy but it's been working for the last 3 or so years now.

So only one other club, and that's based on their fans expectations and not what's actually happened in the window.

[TwoPints]

So only one other club, and that's based on their fans expectations and not what's actually happened in the window.

So, who's squad, post transfer window, would you rather have, WBAs, Bournemouths, Sunderlands? Maybe Crystal Palace or Swansea? What do you think?

 

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

[OldNick]

So, who's squad, post transfer window, would you rather have, WBAs, Bournemouths, Sunderlands? Maybe Crystal Palace or Swansea? What do you think?

 

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

I suppose it depends on the starting position of each club. We finished 6th and had 50m in, as well as further surplusses in the past. The blatant weakinging of the squad, especially in the goalscoring department may well cost us in all competitions

[Heisenberg]

Assuming we have a transfer budget each summer like all premier league sides we are something like £110m up on transfers last 3 seasons alone

 

It's reasonable with TV money and income as it is now that we could spend £15-20m each summer (just like other heavy weights Boro and AFCB) without selling any players

 

So 2014 we made a transfer profit of £30m + saved our £20m transfer budget. Up £50m

2015 we had a net spend of -£2m so up £18m

2016 we had a net spend of +£20m so up £40m

 

No doubt we will flog VVD this summer, maybe Bertrand too and spend 50-70% of what we receive

 

Meanwhile the poor trophy cabinet will sit empty but the bank balance and Kats smile will get fatter

[Greenridge]

Everton, compared to their fans' expectations.

 

I'd say we did exactly what I expected us to do, other than replace Pelle like for like. We haven't signed anyone obviously disruptive or that doesn't work with our system(s), we've kept 5 or 6 who wanted more money which helps with the consistency, and we haven't lost anyone we haven't planned to lose. In fact we also kept Tadic who was expected to go by the ITKs. And we came out of it with two European Champions we didn't have at the start of it. Hojbjerg looks like a great investment too.

 

Plus we broke the club transfer record for the kind of creative central playmaker we haven't had since Gaston stopped being the solution.

 

While everyone else scrambles around for names or last-minute signings, we've known who we want to sign and improve for 18 months and have gone out to get them. It's not flashy but it's been working for the last 3 or so years now.

 

It says something of fans' current expectations / mindsets when we see holding on to a player mid-contract as some kind of accomplishment we should be grateful for / celebrating.

 

You're right we didn't 'scramble around' for last-minute signings. Maybe we should have. Just because we didn't sign players late on doesn't mean we didn't need them and doesn't actually mean anything.

[SW5 SAINT]

Assuming we have a transfer budget each summer like all premier league sides we are something like £110m up on transfers last 3 seasons alone

 

It's reasonable with TV money and income as it is now that we could spend £15-20m each summer (just like other heavy weights Boro and AFCB) without selling any players

 

So 2014 we made a transfer profit of £30m + saved our £20m transfer budget. Up £50m

2015 we had a net spend of -£2m so up £18m

2016 we had a net spend of +£20m so up £40m

 

No doubt we will flog VVD this summer, maybe Bertrand too and spend 50-70% of what we receive

 

Meanwhile the poor trophy cabinet will sit empty but the bank balance and Kats smile will get fatter

 

Well, I suppose it is after all a business first and foremost. What is it these Chinese "investors" hope to get out of it , apart from money? That's what investors usually hope for.

[Gemmel]

Assuming we have a transfer budget each summer like all premier league sides we are something like £110m up on transfers last 3 seasons alone

 

It's reasonable with TV money and income as it is now that we could spend £15-20m each summer (just like other heavy weights Boro and AFCB) without selling any players

 

So 2014 we made a transfer profit of £30m + saved our £20m transfer budget. Up £50m

2015 we had a net spend of -£2m so up £18m

2016 we had a net spend of +£20m so up £40m

 

No doubt we will flog VVD this summer, maybe Bertrand too and spend 50-70% of what we receive

 

Meanwhile the poor trophy cabinet will sit empty but the bank balance and Kats smile will get fatter

 

The actual net profit (Really not as simple as that based on staged payments and how deals are strictured these days) but in the spirit of what I think you are trying to get at....... Is not 110 million - It is just over 50 million.

 

Which is still a shortfall on the money that Cortese borrowed from Vibrac. ....... All kind of strange of strange for a club who was supposed to be living within its means and the same loans that Cortese publically mocked other clubs for taking out - Assuring everybody he would never take out such a loan.

 

Even stranger that when Cortese left Katrina restructured the loan at better terms against her personal estate.

 

How bizarre would it be if she hadn't known about the loans and if she had why didn't she take them out against the better terms from the off????????????

 

Regardless - There was a 60 million pound hole (I can't remember the exact amount) For a club that public stated many times that it would need to be self sustaining.

 

My best guess and that's all it is - Is the transfer surplus has simply gone to paying off the historic debt and really isn't lining Katrina's pocket

 

The next set of accounts will tell us a bit more, but I would expect to see a large part if not all of that debt repaid.

 

If that guess is correct, it has been an incredible business model that has taken a bottom of the table league one side, to the top half of the Premiership and European football, racking up 7 successive seasons with better year on year finishes and building out a squad worth over 150 million quid - whilst at the same time completely rebuilding and modernizing the infrastructure and academy of the club. All of which will ultimately have been self financed. Simply unbelievable and I would assume unrivaled.

 

It might also make sense as to why she might now be looking to sell, if the debts to her have been settled.

 

Katrina will have her payday - but she hasn't had it yet. That will come when she sells the club and her fathers 13 million pound investment returns her nearly 300 million.

 

For all your squinnying about bulging bank balances - I would suggest / guess that is total ******** and that we are simply paying for all the good things we had from Cortese's reign.

[Gemmel]

Come on Marmite - you're posting on every other thread - But have decided not to respond to this one.... wonder why

[Heisenberg]

Come on Marmite - you're posting on every other thread - But have decided not to respond to this one.... wonder why

 

Hey listen I appreciate the response and a decent response at that. I don't know the full details of the loan you refer to but I do agree that the next set of accounts will be an interesting read.

 

I would happily bet good money that Cortese wasn't acting as a maverick and was working on behalf of Markus or Kat. Chances are Cortese was working for Markus or his wishes - Kat simply had other plans for us and acted swiftly. With the increased TV money I'd argue that a loan could be repaid without selling the family silver over n over but hey she is the boss huh.

 

Next set of accounts will reveal more I guess - must be out soon?

[Gemmel]

Hey listen I appreciate the response and a decent response at that. I don't know the full details of the loan you refer to but I do agree that the next set of accounts will be an interesting read.

 

I would happily bet good money that Cortese wasn't acting as a maverick and was working on behalf of Markus or Kat. Chances are Cortese was working for Markus or his wishes - Kat simply had other plans for us and acted swiftly. With the increased TV money I'd argue that a loan could be repaid without selling the family silver over n over but hey she is the boss huh.

 

Next set of accounts will reveal more I guess - must be out soon?

 

Are you seriously telling me that after all the stuff you have spouted on here and how she is creaming off the profits, bulging her bank balance and fattening her smile (Disgusting comment by the way) that you haven't even bothered to look into all the information available in the public domain about our finances?

 

Come back when you actually have the slightest clue about what you are talking about.

[Heisenberg]

Are you seriously telling me that after all the stuff you have spouted on here and how she is creaming off the profits, bulging her bank balance and fattening her smile (Disgusting comment by the way) that you haven't even bothered to look into all the information available in the public domain about our finances?

 

Come back when you actually have the slightest clue about what you are talking about.

 

Next set of accounts will show how wide her smile is......

 

Until then you nor I know the full facts and can only speculate on a football forum

 

We are the only side selling players in volume each summer - either Kat is topping up her inheritance or we are being mismanaged elsewhere

 

When the accounts are out you can come back with an "I told you so" if you wish, personally you don't seem they type to me

[verlaine1979]

The actual net profit (Really not as simple as that based on staged payments and how deals are strictured these days) but in the spirit of what I think you are trying to get at....... Is not 110 million - It is just over 50 million.

 

Which is still a shortfall on the money that Cortese borrowed from Vibrac.

 

Huh? According to Swiss Ramble's most recent article about our accounts, the Vibrac loan was for about £14m. Total debt in the club is much higher, but the vast majority is owed directly to the owner.

[Gemmel]

Huh? According to Swiss Ramble's most recent article about our accounts, the Vibrac loan was for about £14m. Total debt in the club is much higher, but the vast majority is owed directly to the owner.

 

That was the first loan - We took a second

[Gemmel]

Next set of accounts will show how wide her smile is......

 

Until then you nor I know the full facts and can only speculate on a football forum

 

We are the only side selling players in volume each summer - either Kat is topping up her inheritance or we are being mismanaged elsewhere

 

When the accounts are out you can come back with an "I told you so" if you wish, personally you don't seem they type to me

 

So you have already admitted to having no idea about any loans that the club took out and yet you still try and make out you are right :lol::lol:

[Nordic Saint]

Some of the posters on here may think the club's transfer policy is a brilliant business strategy but the players and managers don't and I think it's taking its toll on team spirit:

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3972858/Southampton-players-shocked-Ronald-Koeman-joined-Everton-admits-Virgil-van-Dijk.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

[baggytrousers]

what is my expectations?

why have you decided I want it all now?

 

I want us to buy premiership proven quality. that is utterly dismissed. Yet all of our rivals are now doing it

and maybe stop selling 3-5 players in the summer and not have a negative net spend

I fully expect it to be no different next season. I will be amazed if VvD is a saint in 12 months. Throw in Forster, maybe even Hojbjerg

ffs, Mane was sold for a very similar price to that of a player in the championship. jesus wept

 

that does not mean doing a pompey or wasting money on no-marks

 

What is this obsession with proven premiership quality ? Over the summer all the trolls on here were banging on and on about how we should sign Bony, Berahinho and Siggurdson. How are those 3 doing ? Any better than the 3 main players we signed ? Don't think so. And our players have so much up side. None of them have passed 22 years old yet.

 

Last season's back page headline is quite often this season's chip paper but you pay exhorbitant amounts for the privalege of having a big name who quite often becomes an overpriced, overpaid liability.

 

We have invested in young up and coming prospects with good skills and good attitudes just like Leicester did with Mahrez, Vardy and Drinkwater or Tottenham did with Dele Alii.

 

I'm confident it will come good. We've already shown signs of it this season but we are lacking consistency and we're certainly not putting away our chances.

 

At the moment we are third in terms of number of chances created but worst in terms of percentage of chances finished and before you say it this isn't just a striker issue. How many chances has VVD missed this season for example and he's our best player.

 

The lack of confidence in front of goal seems to be a problem throughout the team. I coached a kids team who had this issue once and it got to the stage where I genuinely didn't know what else to try. Then we had a game where we got a couple of really flukey goals against the run of play followed by a game against the bottom team where we had enough chances to actually put some of them away and suddenly the team was away. A couple of games later the goals were flying in. It's all about confidence.

 

We have good, young, exciting players and a good coach. We also have a run of winnable games coming up. Can only see things getting better from here on in.

[Heisenberg]

So you have already admitted to having no idea about any loans that the club took out and yet you still try and make out you are right :lol::lol:

 

You seem to think our only source of income comes from player sales

 

You also think Cortese was taking out loans in secret without Markus or Kats knowledge

 

FYI we now receive £120-150 million a year from TV money alone, commercial income is up and gate receipts are higher than ever

 

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?56928-Where-is-all-the-money-going#.WDk8O4bfWaM

[trousers]

Textbook