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Guided Missile

By Guided Missile,
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Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum  

220 members have voted

  1. 1. Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum

    • Leave Before - Leave Now
      46
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      11
    • Leave Before - Not Bothered Now
      2
    • Remain Before - Remain Now
      129
    • Remain Before - Leave Now
      7
    • Remain Before - Not Bothered Now
      1
    • Not Bothered Before - Leave Now
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    • Not Bothered Before - Remain Now
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    • I've never been bothered - Why am I on this Thread?
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    • No second Ref - 2016 was Definitive and Binding
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Mosin

Mosin

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

Ok. No personal insults but you clearly do not know what you are going on about. Ellwood 's article has evidently gone right over your head. Have you read it? 

The Single Market came about in 1993. It was not the same as the old common market. EU states are all in the Single Market along with non EU countries such as Norway, Iceland and Switzerland. To make it clear  T.

Margaret Thatcher was one of the leading architects of the Single Market. She could see the economic benefits of being part of a market of 320 million people. Look up her speech at Lancaster House in 1988.

The debates back in 2017/ 2019 about a "soft Brexit" and "hard Brexit" were essentially about whether we stayed in the Single Market or completely cut off all links with European countries. At the time of the referendum people like Daniel Hannon and Michael Gove claimed that the debate was not about the Single Market. According to them we would be staying in that even if we left the EU. Boris's "oven ready" Brexit deal has seen us leave the Single Market and Ellwood (a Tory MP) is advocating rejoining it.

Go on. Read Ellwood's piece. You may learn something. 

 

Im well aware you dont have to be a member of the EU, But YOU  HAVE TO OBEYTHE ECJ TO BE IN THE SINGLE MARKET, If you join the SM, you must obey all the rules and regulations, freedom of every thing, we are supposed to be freeing our selfs from, by having regulatory independence, the two are not compatible. That is some thing you cant / fail to understand.

My point with the article is claiming its some thing MT wanted, ill quote " Let’s not forget, both Winston Churchill and Margaret Thatcher endorsed this model ", its not, she wanted an SM free from brussles, which was agreed then changed 5 years later with the creation of the European Union and her removal from office.

The current crisis is a result of war n covid, some thing remainers fail to understand, gas electric and fuel prices are not going to suddenly drop around the world because the UK joined the SM, so it rejoining isnt going to change that, is it?

Just like some bbc article claiming one kilo of veg will cost more because its written as 35.2 ounces / 2.2 pounds instead of 1 kilogram, remainers lap that rubbish up.....





 

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Weston Super Saint

Weston Super Saint

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Mosin said:

Im well aware you dont have to be a member of the EU, But YOU  HAVE TO OBEYTHE ECJ TO BE IN THE SINGLE MARKET, If you join the SM, you must obey all the rules and regulations, freedom of every thing, we are supposed to be freeing our selfs from, by having regulatory independence, the two are not compatible. That is some thing you cant / fail to understand.

My point with the article is claiming its some thing MT wanted, ill quote " Let’s not forget, both Winston Churchill and Margaret Thatcher endorsed this model ", its not, she wanted an SM free from brussles, which was agreed then changed 5 years later with the creation of the European Union and her removal from office.

The current crisis is a result of war n covid, some thing remainers fail to understand, gas electric and fuel prices are not going to suddenly drop around the world because the UK joined the SM, so it rejoining isnt going to change that, is it?

Just like some bbc article claiming one kilo of veg will cost more because its written as 35.2 ounces / 2.2 pounds instead of 1 kilogram, remainers lap that rubbish up.....





 

I'm not sure that is what they were claiming.  I only skimmed the article so could be wrong, but I thought the gist of it was that it would be more expensive in terms of producing labelling, packaging etc, which is clearly not going to be a big issue for a local market trader using chalk / pens to write the price of goods, but could be substantial for producers supplying to large supermarkets etc.  Those expenses will inevitably be passed on to the consumer, making the products more expensive...

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Tamesaint

Tamesaint

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Mosin said:

Im well aware you dont have to be a member of the EU, But YOU  HAVE TO OBEYTHE ECJ TO BE IN THE SINGLE MARKET, If you join the SM, you must obey all the rules and regulations, freedom of every thing, we are supposed to be freeing our selfs from, by having regulatory independence, the two are not compatible. That is some thing you cant / fail to understand.

My point with the article is claiming its some thing MT wanted, ill quote " Let’s not forget, both Winston Churchill and Margaret Thatcher endorsed this model ", its not, she wanted an SM free from brussles, which was agreed then changed 5 years later with the creation of the European Union and her removal from office.

The current crisis is a result of war n covid, some thing remainers fail to understand, gas electric and fuel prices are not going to suddenly drop around the world because the UK joined the SM, so it rejoining isnt going to change that, is it?

Just like some bbc article claiming one kilo of veg will cost more because its written as 35.2 ounces / 2.2 pounds instead of 1 kilogram, remainers lap that rubbish up.....





 

Ok. I give up. Carry on with counting your Brexit benefits.

Nice to see that you now understand that we wouldn't have to join the Euro to join the Single Market as you thought s few hours ago. Progress. 

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The Left Back

The Left Back

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Mosin said:

Im well aware you dont have to be a member of the EU, But YOU  HAVE TO OBEYTHE ECJ TO BE IN THE SINGLE MARKET, If you join the SM, you must obey all the rules and regulations, freedom of every thing, we are supposed to be freeing our selfs from, by having regulatory independence, the two are not compatible. That is some thing you cant / fail to understand.

My point with the article is claiming its some thing MT wanted, ill quote " Let’s not forget, both Winston Churchill and Margaret Thatcher endorsed this model ", its not, she wanted an SM free from brussles, which was agreed then changed 5 years later with the creation of the European Union and her removal from office.

The current crisis is a result of war n covid, some thing remainers fail to understand, gas electric and fuel prices are not going to suddenly drop around the world because the UK joined the SM, so it rejoining isnt going to change that, is it?

Just like some bbc article claiming one kilo of veg will cost more because its written as 35.2 ounces / 2.2 pounds instead of 1 kilogram, remainers lap that rubbish up.....





 

Are you the only person left in the country who uses the term 'remainer'? It's a little out of date now don't you think given we left 5 years ago?  And also a bit hypocritical given your request for no name calling earlier today

As for the quality of your political history knowledge, it's so far-fetched and creative I'm surprised you're not referencing Hans Christian Anderson as a source.  

I think we all understand you are determined to defend Brexit at every opportunity, and who can blame you given how wealthy it appears to have made you.  But you need to find a way of doing it that does not re-write history based on google searches.  and maybe perhaps provide the rest of us with a few examples of the benefits we are seeing that don't involve your own bank account.

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Mosin said:

The current crisis is a result of war n covid, some thing remainers fail to understand,...........
 

1) "Remainers" are not a homogenous group of lesser beings to be ridiculed and derided.

2) The current crisis is a result of war, covid, AND Brexit. 

Edited by badgerx16
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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

This whole not being in the EU seems to have come as a surprise to a few of those travellers - I'm sure most media outlets have at least touched upon Brexit in passing.

But having voted to lose privileges and make travel more difficult, the thicker ones seem surprised that they've lost privileges and that travel is more difficult.

 

 

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Weston Super Saint

Weston Super Saint

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, rallyboy said:

This whole not being in the EU seems to have come as a surprise to a few of those travellers - I'm sure most media outlets have at least touched upon Brexit in passing.

But having voted to lose privileges and make travel more difficult, the thicker ones seem surprised that they've lost privileges and that travel is more difficult.

 

 

To be fair, nobody predicted it would be quite so tricky to get OUT of the country.

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Mosin

Mosin

Posted
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, The Left Back said:

Are you the only person left in the country who uses the term 'remainer'? It's a little out of date now don't you think given we left 5 years ago?  And also a bit hypocritical given your request for no name calling earlier today

As for the quality of your political history knowledge, it's so far-fetched and creative I'm surprised you're not referencing Hans Christian Anderson as a source.  

I think we all understand you are determined to defend Brexit at every opportunity, and who can blame you given how wealthy it appears to have made you.  But you need to find a way of doing it that does not re-write history based on google searches.  and maybe perhaps provide the rest of us with a few examples of the benefits we are seeing that don't involve your own bank account.

So its ok to say brexiteers, but not remainers.. double standards no?. "No Brexiters left anymore to cheerlead for our act of national self harm? Anyone?  " remainer comment a month ago on this forum. so again, hows your double standards coming along?
Find me one speach / article of MT endorsing and promoting the EUs regulatory take over of the single market the EU commision now controls?
You can find it on bbc, google the bruges speach, that quite an attack on the EU, nicely written too. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55454106 

 

 

15 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

1) "Remainers" are not a homogenous group of lesser beings to be ridiculed and derided.

2) The current crisis is a result of war, covid, AND Brexit. 

1)Neither are brexiters, but i dont see you defending them when ppl say it, wonder why... more double standards, bit funny really, do any thing to stop democracy you lot.

2)So show me some, i dont know, OECD data or some thing, that shows a direct link that is affecting the UK comsumers only because of brexit ( No links to war or covid please.. ill know you will struggle to find any. Or opinion pieces).

https://www.oecd.org/

 

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Mosin said:

So its ok to say brexiteers, but not remainers.. double standards no?. "No Brexiters left anymore to cheerlead for our act of national self harm? Anyone?  " remainer comment a month ago on this forum. so again, hows your double standards coming along?
Find me one speach / article of MT endorsing and promoting the EUs regulatory take over of the single market the EU commision now controls?
You can find it on bbc, google the bruges speach, that quite an attack on the EU, nicely written too. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55454106 

 

 

1)Neither are brexiters, but i dont see you defending them when ppl say it, wonder why... more double standards, bit funny really, do any thing to stop democracy you lot.

2)So show me some, i dont know, OECD data or some thing, that shows a direct link that is affecting the UK comsumers only because of brexit ( No links to war or covid please.. ill know you will struggle to find any. Or opinion pieces).

https://www.oecd.org/

 

Re (2): In my opinion Brexit is making things worse and exacerbating current issues. You mentioned the "current crisis" without indicating what factors we are currently experiencing constitute that "crisis". The advantage for the Government is that COVID and the war in Ukraine are proving very effective at concealing the underlying consequences of Brexit.

Where are the tangible Brexit benefits ?

Edited by badgerx16
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Mosin

Mosin

Posted
Posted
16 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

 Brexiters are lesser beings in my view. Only my opinion , of course. Mosin being one only reinforces my opinion.

Lol.... 

baby GIF

 

Such a bigger better human being, obviously.. 

 

pile GIF

 

 

 

 

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ecuk268

ecuk268

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, whelk said:

In no way were the people who wanted this thick in any way

 

There was study by the LSE that used education attainment data for each of the the 348 voting districts in England and Wales to predict the voting outcome.

In 91% of the districts they correctly classified the outcome based on the the proportion of degree-level voters. Adding other factors such as age, socio-economic status, ethnicity and sex only improved the results by a point or two. However, removing the educational data considerably reduced the accuracy of the predictions.

https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/educational-attainment-brexit/

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moonraker

moonraker

Posted
Posted

The more I watch and listen to Brexit supporting Tory MPs the more I realise what an absolute bunch of imbeciles they are.  Because many of the truths of project fear are coming home to roost they claim or at best challenge that international conventions and treaties can be simply voted out of existence by the U.K. parliament.  We are fast becoming the North Korea of Europe, I sincerely hope we collectively are capable and willing to put an end to this farce.

 

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AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

Posted
Posted
37 minutes ago, moonraker said:

The more I watch and listen to Brexit supporting Tory MPs the more I realise what an absolute bunch of imbeciles they are.  Because many of the truths of project fear are coming home to roost they claim or at best challenge that international conventions and treaties can be simply voted out of existence by the U.K. parliament.  We are fast becoming the North Korea of Europe, I sincerely hope we collectively are capable and willing to put an end to this farce.

 

 

C7E5C2EC-A982-41F2-918E-66551EC08ABF.jpeg

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Mosin

Mosin

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, StDunko said:

In the wallet, like almost everyone else?

How is it hurting your wallet? Prices rises are currently world wide, but i am interested in learning what items you pay more for as a direct consequence of brexit. 

I know my wallet is feeling it because ill just quote a bit of an article i just read posted above "

However, wage growth is failing to match soaring inflation fuelled by global supply chain blockages and Russia’s war in Ukraine driving up already high wholesale energy prices." 

 

So as i said, im interested in learning what items you buy that costs more as a direct result of brexit. 

 

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, Mosin said:

How is it hurting your wallet? Prices rises are currently world wide, but i am interested in learning what items you pay more for as a direct consequence of brexit. 

I know my wallet is feeling it because ill just quote a bit of an article i just read posted above "

However, wage growth is failing to match soaring inflation fuelled by global supply chain blockages and Russia’s war in Ukraine driving up already high wholesale energy prices." 

 

So as i said, im interested in learning what items you buy that costs more as a direct result of brexit. 

 

Food, according to this:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-04-26/brexit-drives-rise-in-u-k-food-prices-and-lifts-cost-of-living

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Mosin said:

How is it hurting your wallet? Prices rises are currently world wide, but i am interested in learning what items you pay more for as a direct consequence of brexit. 

I know my wallet is feeling it because ill just quote a bit of an article i just read posted above "

However, wage growth is failing to match soaring inflation fuelled by global supply chain blockages and Russia’s war in Ukraine driving up already high wholesale energy prices." 

 

So as i said, im interested in learning what items you buy that costs more as a direct result of brexit. 

 

Because I can’t sell anything to Europe anymore thanks to you and your ilk. Therefore I am not earning any money.

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Mosin said:

So as i said, im interested in learning what items you buy that costs more as a direct result of brexit. 

 

At least 2 online European shops I have previously bought from that sell bicycle components no longer export to the UK, so I have had to buy from UK outlets which charge more. I can still browse their websites, so know that their prices are cheaper.

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

What were you selling to Europe that you can't now sell to the UK / rest of the world?

Electronic display systems. The rest of the world is a long way away in every sense of the world. I can't put a CE mark on any new stuff. Anything sent to Europe has to go through an importer in the EU. Anything returned for service involves extra handling charges. We can't go and install or commission or deliver direct.

We have lost our markets. Britain and the rest of the world have not changed and certainly not improved.

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Tamesaint

Tamesaint

Posted
Posted

In the 5  or so years before the Brexit vote the pound used to trade normally in the range of $1.55 / $1.60. The Brexit decision meant that foreign investors could see the damage to the economy  to be caused by Brexit and the pound has weakened. In the last year it has only momentarily risen above $1.40 and for most of the time since Brexit it has been in the $1.20 / $1.35 range. 

Oil is priced in dollars. A weaker pound means that we pay more for our petrol than would have been the case before June 2016. Even allowing for the tax element of the price of petrol , just due to currency weakness everyone has been paying at least 4; pence more for every litre of petrol that they have bought over the last 6 years. The current price would be c 10 -15 pence per litre cheaper if the pound was at $1.55 instead of current levels.

 But at least we "got our country back". Not sure that it is worth it.

 

 

 

 

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, whelk said:

 

So, the UK Government ratified a treaty they negotiated having been given 18 months advanced notice of potential issues, and now claims these 'issues' are 'new and emerging', and represent a "Grave and Immediate Danger". Why are the Government so desperate to appease the DUP ?

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, harvey said:

It's like a lefty twitter chamber on here.

Brexit is not / was not a Left/Right issue. It was an In/Out issue, where Liz Truss, Sajid Javid, Jeremy Hunt, ( among others ), supported Remain - as did Boris until about 2 days before the referendum polling day.

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harvey

harvey

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Brexit is not / was not a Left/Right issue. It was an In/Out issue, where Liz Truss, Sajid Javid, Jeremy Hunt, ( among others ), supported Remain - as did Boris until about 2 days before the referendum polling day.

And as it stands we're out...but there's an unrelenting faction that still doesn't accept it.

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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, harvey said:

And as it stands we're out...but there's an unrelenting faction that still doesn't accept it.

How do you determine that they are 'lefties' ? And there is a difference between not 'accepting it' and holding the Government's position and attitude up to scrutiny, ( and if necessary ridicule ).

Edited by badgerx16
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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, harvey said:

Accept, like I would if the result had gone the other way.

I am not sure there are many on here, other than perhaps Warrior, who don't accept that we are out. However, we are not happy to simply sit back and give Boris and his bunch of incompetent acolytes a free hand to sell us further down the river than we, as a nation, have allowed ourselves to go. Their position on NI is particularly worrying, if only for the level of stupidity and arrogance being displayed.

Yes he got a mandate to "Get Brexit Done", but he was not given a free hand to fuck the whole country over.

Edited by badgerx16
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harvey

harvey

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

I am not sure there are many on here, other than perhaps Warrior, who don't accept that we are out. However, we are not happy to simply sit back and give Boris and his bunch of incompetent acolytes a free hand to sell us further down the river than we, as a nation, have allowed ourselves to go. Their position on NI is particularly worrying, if only for the level of stupidity and arrogance being displayed.

Yes he got a mandate to "Get Brexit Done", but he was not given a free hand to fuck the whole country over.

"fuck the whole country over"?.....he's been far from perfect but he's a politician. Jesus wept could you imagine Angela R as a Prime Minister!

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