Brexit - Post Match Reaction

[Guided Missile]

15 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Like I said, no idea who he is.

It looks like he's used an extreme for the UK versus an average for the EU which is misleading at best.

If only we hadn't abandoned nuclear power we would have had a stable, cheap supply of electricity that would have been carbon neutral....

You're totally out of touch with the latest solution dreamed up by the anti-scientific woke left. 

Forget nuclear power, it's loft insulation...

[warsash saint]

So anyone found any benefits of leaving?

[Guided Missile]

8 minutes ago, warsash saint said:

So anyone found any benefits of leaving?

The Aukus defence pact between the UK, US and Australia is game-changing. A courageous decision to share nuclear technology with a friendly power, it re-tilts UK foreign policy towards the Pacific, where the threat of China must be managed, and proves that Global Britain is a concrete idea. Brexit, finally, is making a real, historic difference.

[Guided Missile]

Aukus vindicates the UK’s exit from the EU. Brexit set the UK free to re-evaluate its own interests and serve them better. The deal proves decisively that the Remainer claim that Britain can have no influence outside of a European bloc, to which it must necessarily surrender its sovereignty or become irrelevant, was a lie. The UK is an attractive geopolitical partner, with significant military and diplomatic advantages, that now has the capacity to act more flexibly in global affairs.

[badgerx16]

So, to be clear, the only currently reported benefit of Brexit is that Australia can now build nuclear submarines using US nuclear propulsion technology. Didn't read that in the Leave.EU propaganda.

Edited 19 September, 2021 by badgerx16

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

 

It looks like he's used an extreme for the UK versus an average for the EU which is misleading at best.

 

No, that graphic is taken directly from the spot trading site yesterday. The figures are directly comparible.

[whelk]

Good news is coming then

 

[whelk]

2 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

No, that graphic is taken directly from the spot trading site yesterday. The figures are directly comparible.

Can’t claim to know much about it but every comparison map seems we are getting shafted

 

[whelk]

3 hours ago, warsash saint said:

So anyone found any benefits of leaving?

Mosin and his missus are taking advantage of the scarce labour market and charging people the earth.

[badgerx16]

24 minutes ago, whelk said:

Good news is coming then

 

The only honest noise he produces are his farts.

[badgerx16]

24 minutes ago, whelk said:

Can’t claim to know much about it but every comparison map seems we are getting shafted

 

The EU market levels everybody up due to the interconnections between the grids and common purchasing rules. Having left the EU we left this level playing field, and now that the cable under the channel that links the National Grid to France has been shut down until March, due to a major fire, we have lost our ability to top up from their system.

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

No, that graphic is taken directly from the spot trading site yesterday. The figures are directly comparible.

Presumably then, the lack of wind powering our wind farms and the lack of sun powering our solar farms can only be attributed to Brexit.

The fact that we ditched our own nuclear power strategy and have to rely on buying the excess capacity from the French must also be due to Brexit.  I imagine the fire in the cable that supplies that electricity is due to Brexit as well.

Add in the 'global' gas shortage and the curb in supplies from Russia and you have yet another Brexit reason driving the price of electricity upwards.

https://www.independent.co.uk/business/energy-prices-france-uk-fire-b1921154.html

I get that this is the thread which blames Brexit for any random events that happen that negatively impact the country, but the spot price of electricity on Friday being attributed to Brexit is a huge leap that I would expect snoriersaint to gobble up, but figured you would be one of the last people to fall for the rhetoric.

[badgerx16]

25 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Presumably then, the lack of wind powering our wind farms and the lack of sun powering our solar farms can only be attributed to Brexit.

The fact that we ditched our own nuclear power strategy and have to rely on buying the excess capacity from the French must also be due to Brexit.  I imagine the fire in the cable that supplies that electricity is due to Brexit as well.

Add in the 'global' gas shortage and the curb in supplies from Russia and you have yet another Brexit reason driving the price of electricity upwards.

https://www.independent.co.uk/business/energy-prices-france-uk-fire-b1921154.html

I get that this is the thread which blames Brexit for any random events that happen that negatively impact the country, but the spot price of electricity on Friday being attributed to Brexit is a huge leap that I would expect snoriersaint to gobble up, but figured you would be one of the last people to fall for the rhetoric.

Not at all, but leaving the EU left us outside the 'level playing field' for electricity futures trading and the spot market. So whilst the other factors make the situation worse, the reality is that we would still be paying more than we previously did for supply from France, and that is solely down to Brexit.

[whelk]

10 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Not at all, but leaving the EU left us outside the 'level playing field' for electricity futures trading and the spot market. So whilst the other factors make the situation worse, the reality is that we would still be paying more than we previously did for supply from France, and that is solely down to Brexit.

 

[Weston Super Saint]

21 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Not at all, but leaving the EU left us outside the 'level playing field' for electricity futures trading and the spot market. So whilst the other factors make the situation worse, the reality is that we would still be paying more than we previously did for supply from France, and that is solely down to Brexit.

Except you've completely ignored economics 101; supply and demand!

With the line supplying us from France catching fire, the amount of supply available diminishes.

Lower supply whilst retaining the same level of demand = higher prices.

If we had a week of 30+mph winds in the North sea our supply will increase and the prices decrease.

That has nothing to do with Brexit.

[kyle04]

Yet to see a curly cucumber in the shops, I think we've been shafted.

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Except you've completely ignored economics 101; supply and demand!

With the line supplying us from France catching fire, the amount of supply available diminishes.

Lower supply whilst retaining the same level of demand = higher prices.

If we had a week of 30+mph winds in the North sea our supply will increase and the prices decrease.

That has nothing to do with Brexit.

For clarification, having dug a bit further, there are, in fact, 5 connections from the Nationl Grid to Europe with a 6th under construction. The link that has shut down is the largest, providing at peak about 5% of the UK's power supply. The other links provide at peak about another 10%.

[Warriorsaint]

 

[Warriorsaint]

 

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

 

Rubbish !!! As Weston has pointed out, it is nothing to do with Brexit and everything to do with the law of "supply and demand" and the lack of wind. 🤣🤣( On that last point, if they put a turbine in the Cabinet meeting room at No 10 it would generate plenty with the amount of bluster those bastards produce).

Edited 20 September, 2021 by badgerx16

[Warriorsaint]

2 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

Rubbish !!! As Weston has pointed out, it is nothing to do with Brexit and everything to do with the law of "supply and demand" and the lack of wind. 🤣🤣( On that last point, if they put a turbine in the Cabinet meeting room at No 10 it would generate plenty with the amount of bluster those bastards produce).

I only hope with eyes opening on the disaster that Brexit has become that we can agrre a mote closer alignment with the EU is the only way to deal with this mess.

Not saying full rejoin but we have to tear down these walls we have erected that are damaging the UK.

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

Rubbish !!! As Weston has pointed out, it is nothing to do with Brexit and everything to do with the law of "supply and demand" and the lack of wind. 🤣🤣( On that last point, if they put a turbine in the Cabinet meeting room at No 10 it would generate plenty with the amount of bluster those bastards produce).

So just to be clear, there is some mythical 'cartel' operating in the EU ensuring that the prices are kept low?  Bearing in mind that Snoriersaint's latest random tweet is referring to the price of gas and not electricity which we were previously discussing.

Odd then that the EU is also suffering from 'soaring' gas (and electricity) prices, this marvellous EU cartel must be doing a pretty shit job at keeping prices low as claimed.

https://www.ft.com/content/0fba039b-9e1a-413f-aa3a-7478d02ef3a5

Quote

Surging gas and electricity costs are forcing European governments to discuss billions of euros in aid for households and stricken suppliers, as concern mounts over a deepening winter energy crisis.

Definitely got absolutely nothing to do with the Russians limiting the 'additional' supplies of gas and only fulfilling their contractual obligations, no sir, definitely not.

It's definitely Brexit causing the prices to rise in the EU 

Bloody FT, what do they know about economics 101 eh?

Quote

“You cannot cut supply without also reducing demand,” 

 

[Weston Super Saint]

46 minutes ago, Warriorsaint said:

I only hope with eyes opening on the disaster that Brexit has become that we can agrre a mote closer alignment with the EU is the only way to deal with this mess.

Not saying full rejoin but we have to tear down these walls we have erected that are damaging the UK.

Get over it, you lost, we left.

[Weston Super Saint]

Fucking Brexit!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58627325

Quote

Pig farmers fear they may soon have to start killing their animals because of a carbon dioxide shortage at abattoirs caused by soaring gas prices.

 

Obviously this is 100% the fault of Brexit!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58615784

Quote

The boss of a US company that supplies 60% of the UK's food-grade carbon dioxide supply has held crisis talks with the government over shortages.

Tony Will, chief executive of CF Industries, arrived in the UK earlier after the firm stopped production at its two fertiliser plants because of soaring wholesale gas prices.

Food firms are warning a shortage of CO2 is threatening produce supplies.

High global demand for gas has been blamed for the recent surge in prices.

 

[badgerx16]

49 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

So just to be clear, there is some mythical 'cartel' operating in the EU ensuring that the prices are kept low?  Bearing in mind that Snoriersaint's latest random tweet is referring to the price of gas and not electricity which we were previously discussing.

Odd then that the EU is also suffering from 'soaring' gas (and electricity) prices, this marvellous EU cartel must be doing a pretty shit job at keeping prices low as claimed.

https://www.ft.com/content/0fba039b-9e1a-413f-aa3a-7478d02ef3a5

Definitely got absolutely nothing to do with the Russians limiting the 'additional' supplies of gas and only fulfilling their contractual obligations, no sir, definitely not.

It's definitely Brexit causing the prices to rise in the EU 

Bloody FT, what do they know about economics 101 eh?

 

Explain why the UK is paying so much more for electricity than the EU countries, as compared to before Brexit;

Edited 20 September, 2021 by badgerx16

[egg]

1 hour ago, Warriorsaint said:

I only hope with eyes opening on the disaster that Brexit has become that we can agrre a mote closer alignment with the EU is the only way to deal with this mess.

Not saying full rejoin but we have to tear down these walls we have erected that are damaging the UK.

A) who's to say they'd welcome us? 

B) who's to say that if they do, they won't pull out pants down?

C) the public have yet to say that this is what they want its government to do. 

D) it'd take years when/if they do. 

[buctootim]

Many countries, including Germany, don't have a standing charge on top of the k/wh cost unit unlike the UK. So Britain is actually worse than hat chart shows.  

[Warriorsaint]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

A) who's to say they'd welcome us? 

B) who's to say that if they do, they won't pull out pants down?

C) the public have yet to say that this is what they want its government to do. 

D) it'd take years when/if they do. 

A, they might not

B, They will, we had a better deal than any other member.

C, Your right, so lets talk about how we gauge the public mood.

D, Yes it will. Its only been 9 months but I am hoping within the next 5/10 years we’ll get to where we should be, for my Son’s sake.

[Weston Super Saint]

15 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Explain why the UK is paying so much more for electricity than the EU countries, as compared to before Brexit;

Are we back to discussing Electricity prices or are we still conflating gas and electric?

If we're back to Electricity, as I've already mentioned there are a combination of issues :

1. Wind power - it hasn't been very windy so the entire North Sea wind farm has been unproductive.

2. Nuclear - we don't produce much by this method, and we import some from France (who add a bit of bunce on top of what they sell it to us for and who could blame them!).

3. Solar - yep, we've invested in solar farms to provide our electricity supply, in the UK, madness!

4. Coal - we've shut down most of our coal power plants.

All of these thigs (as well as a fire on the line that we use to import electricity from France), has led to a shortage of supply.  When the demand outstrips supply, prices go up, it's simple economics which some might term 'profiteering'.

In order to try and boost our supply, we have used gas in the gas fired power stations to produce more electricity. The price of gas is very high due to global demands which means the price of the electricity that is produced using it has risen.

You cannot 'simply' compare the cost of our electricity with the EU and blame Brexit for it!  For example, France has a very high reliance on nuclear power so it hasn't suffered quite as badly (although it is expecting price rises).  Germany has a similar power supply network to us and has focussed on 'renewables' but has suffered in much the same way as us when it comes to rising prices.

[badgerx16]

22 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

 Germany has a similar power supply network to us and has focussed on 'renewables' but has suffered in much the same way as us when it comes to rising prices.

So which factors are so different for Germany that our wholesale electricity price is now more than twice theirs when it was almost the same less than a year ago;

Lack of wind

decommissioning nuclear

decommissioning coal

rising gas prices

Brexit

Other national Government decisions

Edited 20 September, 2021 by badgerx16

[Weston Super Saint]

16 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

So which factors are so different for Germany that our wholesale electricity price is now more than twice theirs when it was almost the same less than a year ago;

Lack of wind

decommissioning nuclear

decommissioning coal

rising gas prices

Brexit

Other national Government decisions

I'll go with all of the above, including Brexit.  After all, the UK penalises itself in terms of 'carbon tax' more severely since we left the EU than when we were in it.  This drives up the cost of energy, especially if it wasn't generated using 'renewable' resources.

Who runs this mysterious cartel that keeps the EU prices low (and why are they not all the same?)?

Which specific element of the Brexit withdrawal agreement has contributed to the UK having higher prices than the EU since we left?

Why do you have an unhealthy relationship with the 'day ahead' wholesale prices for electricity - it is effectively a stock market where prices can go up or down dependent on a number of factors (many of which I've mentioned previously).  Surely the 'average' price over a length of time is more useful?

I'm assuming you got your chart from this website which states (no data yet for 2021) :

Quote

Household electricity prices in the EU highest in Germany (EUR 0.30 per kWh) and lowest in Bulgaria (EUR 0.10 per kWh) in the second half of 2020.

Meanwhile in good old blighty taken from this website :

Quote

According to the latest Department for Business, Energy & Industrial Strategy data, UK electricity prices per kwh were 17.4 p/kWh in March 2021—but the average kwh cost UK ranged from 16.8 p/kWh in Yorkshire to 18.6 p/kWh in Merseyside & North Wales.

NB the average for the UK for 2020 was 19.5p/kWh.

Apart from your 'day ahead' chart that you've posted a couple of times, how do you reach the conclusion that we are paying more for our electricity than Germany since we left the EU?

[Weston Super Saint]

7 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

 

Fucking Brexit 

[Whitey Grandad]

@Weston Super Saint re supply & demand

That’s an often quoted principle but why is it that when my customers demand a larger quantity they also demand a lower price for a larger quantity?

Anyway, as any businessman will tell you at the moment, demand is in short supply.

[Weston Super Saint]

16 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

@Weston Super Saint re supply & demand

That’s an often quoted principle but why is it that when my customers demand a larger quantity they also demand a lower price for a larger quantity?

Economies of scale (lesson two)

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

I'll go with all of the above, including Brexit.

...

[Warriorsaint]

I preferred the Britain when we had food and could heat our homes. I wonder what changed?

 

[spyinthesky]

Some interesting comments on the subject of energy prices.

Does anyone know what the effect of the green emission policy has on fuel prices?

[Mosin]

5 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

I preferred the Britain when we had food and could heat our homes. I wonder what changed?

 

you forgot to pay your gas bill and cause your so depressed about Brexit cause you lost the vote that you forgot your beloved freedom of movement to the EU does not stop you from opening your front door and going shopping??.


 

Edited 21 September, 2021 by Mosin

[Weston Super Saint]

Fucking Brexit!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58641394

Quote

The government has struck a deal with a US firm that supplies 60% of the UK's food grade carbon dioxide (CO2) to restart production after food shortages warnings.

Would we have been allowed to do this under EU rules?

[badgerx16]

17 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Fucking Brexit!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58641394

Would we have been allowed to do this under EU rules?

Yes.

[Tamesaint]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Fucking Brexit!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58641394

Would we have been allowed to do this under EU rules?

 Believe it or not trade between the UK and the US was allowed before Brexit. 🤫

 

[Warriorsaint]

3 hours ago, Mosin said:

you forgot to pay your gas bill and cause your so depressed about Brexit cause you lost the vote that you forgot your beloved freedom of movement to the EU does not stop you from opening your front door and going shopping??.


 

A lot to take in there and again where do I  start?

 I forgot,  you’re minting it mate aren’t you. One of Thatchers working class heroes.

Youre out there celebrating in the Sunny uplands we are all experiencing. 

[Tamesaint]

Why is Biden playing down the chances of a trade deal? Doesn't he know that it is only Project Fear to talk like this?

BBC News - Joe Biden plays down chances of UK-US trade deal https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58646017

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, Tamesaint said:

Why is Biden playing down the chances of a trade deal? Doesn't he know that it is only Project Fear to talk like this?

BBC News - Joe Biden plays down chances of UK-US trade deal https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58646017

Obviously hasn't read the OP of this thread. Perhaps BoJo should have taken Guided Missile to explain things.

[buctootim]

4 hours ago, Tamesaint said:

Why is Biden playing down the chances of a trade deal? Doesn't he know that it is only Project Fear to talk like this?

BBC News - Joe Biden plays down chances of UK-US trade deal https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58646017

No worries. Boris is telling us USMCA is fantastic - the US Mexico and Canada deal. You know, that one between three neighbouring countries with land borders. Im sure an island 3,500 miles away will slot in nicely and get loads of benefits. Besides the acronym will be fun.     

Edited 22 September, 2021 by buctootim

[Warriorsaint]

This country is an absolute fucking shambles at the moment. Its hilarious. I think there is some bet on to see what level it has to get to before people riot.

 I want it to be the no Turkey for Christmas for the country to burn the place down lol. 

[badgerx16]

12 minutes ago, Warriorsaint said:

This country is an absolute fucking shambles at the moment. Its hilarious. I think there is some bet on to see what level it has to get to before people riot.

 I want it to be the no Turkey for Christmas for the country to burn the place down lol. 

And where exactly will you be as these rioters "burn the place down" ?

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, Warriorsaint said:

 I want it to be the no Turkey for Christmas for the country to burn the place down lol. 

Fucking hell, forget the NHS getting a Brexit dividend, what about putting some extra into education. 

[Warriorsaint]

2 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

And where exactly will you be as these rioters "burn the place down" ?

Watching the BBC and tutting like most people. Im interested to see what it will take.

 I wonder which other clusterfuck crisis will befall the country next week. It seems they are coming thick and fast.

Its only a matter of time before all these coincidences and other excuses collide and people put two and two together and decide this is the most inept government the country have had in living memory.

Id love someone to explain to me how well the country is doing and how we are so well governed.

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, Warriorsaint said:

This country is an absolute fucking shambles at the moment. Its hilarious. I think there is some bet on to see what level it has to get to before people riot.

 I want it to be the no Turkey for Christmas for the country to burn the place down lol. 

Why not use your EU passport and fuck off to the EU then?