Brexit - Post Match Reaction

[Lord Duckhunter]

Andrew Neils reputation  was clearly damaged by not kidnapping the PM & subjecting him to a hostile interview. By taking no as an answer to his repeated requests to interview Boris, he showed all his bias for all to see. I remember when Robin Day’s heavies bundled Mrs T into a car and took her to a remote farmhouse for Robin to interview her. That’s what you call unbiased journalism, not Neil’s hard right pussy footing around. 

[hypochondriac]

7 minutes ago, rallyboy said:

So are you both saying that Neil did everything he could and it was Boris at fault, hiding and dodging scrutiny? 

That's not a good look for a statesman.

 

Yes I said at the time that Boris should have done the interview. What's that got to do with Andrew Neil? 

[Tamesaint]

4 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Andrew Neils reputation  was clearly damaged by not kidnapping the PM & subjecting him to a hostile interview. By taking no as an answer to his repeated requests to interview Boris, he showed all his bias for all to see. I remember when Robin Day’s heavies bundled Mrs T into a car and took her to a remote farmhouse for Robin to interview her. That’s what you call unbiased journalism, not Neil’s hard right pussy footing around. 

...and of course "the great lady" was always dodging from interviews and hiding in freezers to avoid scrutiny. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

3 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

...and of course "the great lady" was always dodging from interviews and hiding in freezers to avoid scrutiny. 

Which is probably why her first election as sitting PM she secured 144 majority as opposed to Boris’ 80 odd

[Tamesaint]

6 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Which is probably why her first election as sitting PM she secured 144 majority as opposed to Boris’ 80 odd

Foot v Corbyn. Blimey its difficult to decide which one is more unelectable. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

She also hammered Sunny Jim & The Welsh Windbag. 

[Tamesaint]

20 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

She also hammered Sunny Jim & The Welsh Windbag. 

Blair would have smashed her.

[Wes Tender]

38 minutes ago, rallyboy said:

So are you both saying that Neil did everything he could and it was Boris at fault, hiding and dodging scrutiny? 

That's not a good look for a statesman.

There's that well known saying, that you can take a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink. Boris probably weighed up the repercussions of being interviewed and having the leftie biased media, especially the BBC, running stories that he had been skewered by Neil, against the flak he would get for not attending. 

How that equates to Neil being judged by you to be guilty of not being even-handed compared to the treatment he dished out to the other interviewees, is a mystery.

But I note that you deem Boris to be a statesman, albeit slightly tarnished by this little episode which is a fading memory to most of the electorate, even if it registered in the first place. 

[Guided Missile]

24 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

She also hammered Sunny Jim & The Welsh Windbag. 

Thatcher will never compare to Jo Swinson, though, who was the greatest Prime Minister we never had.

[Guided Missile]

2 minutes ago, Wes Tender said:

But I note that you deem Boris to be a statesman, albeit slightly tarnished by this little episode which is a fading memory to most of the electorate, even if it registered in the first place. 

Boris had to be a politician and he had nothing to gain and a lot to lose by granting an interview to Neil. You can only become a statesman and enact policies if you get elected, which was his first job.

I think he's now got the chance, with Brexit and the vaccine, to become the greatest PM since Thatcher.

[Tamesaint]

33 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

Boris had to be a politician and he had nothing to gain and a lot to lose by granting an interview to Neil. You can only become a statesman and enact policies if you get elected, which was his first job.

I think he's now got the chance, with Brexit and the vaccine, to become the greatest PM since Thatcher.

The anti Nostradamus has spoken.

If the success of GM's other predictions are anything to go on, I would expect Boris to be out of the job by next New Year. 😁😁

[spyinthesky]

3 hours ago, Tamesaint said:

The anti Nostradamus has spoken.

If the success of GM's other predictions are anything to go on, I would expect Boris to be out of the job by next New Year. 😁😁

You may well be right
A recent Focaldata/MRP poll of 22,000 shows Labour at 37.7% (compared to 32.2% at same stage in 2019) and Tories at 35.6% (v 43.6%)
Based on all the other voting preferences in the poll, the Tories would maintain a 2 seat majority over Labour but would be a minority Govt.
Boris only kept his own seat by 5.034 votes in 2019 (the lowest majority of any sitting PM since 1924) so his Parliamentary seat would be at risk if an election was held tomorrow..
Boris and his buddies have a lot to do to maintain the impetus the Tory party had in 2019 and they dont have a lame duck like Jezza and his mates to contend with either.
This may be doable if the Covid situation improves and the Brexit deal is not as 'thin' as many people assume.
However if the cards don't fall right for Boris and Co and he doesn't handle the call for Scottish Independence (and possibly unification of Ireland) correctly then it is likely history won't look back fondly at his time in Office.
I am a natural right of centre voter but I would be hard pressed to vote Tory under this current Govt, perhaps 'Let's Go To a Party' party would be an option!!

[buctootim]

26 minutes ago, spyinthesky said:

You may well be right
A recent Focaldata/MRP poll of 22,000 shows Labour at 37.7% (compared to 32.2% at same stage in 2019) and Tories at 35.6% (v 43.6%)
Based on all the other voting preferences in the poll, the Tories would maintain a 2 seat majority over Labour but would be a minority Govt.
Boris only kept his own seat by 5.034 votes in 2019 (the lowest majority of any sitting PM since 1924) so his Parliamentary seat would be at risk if an election was held tomorrow..
Boris and his buddies have a lot to do to maintain the impetus the Tory party had in 2019 and they dont have a lame duck like Jezza and his mates to contend with either.
This may be doable if the Covid situation improves and the Brexit deal is not as 'thin' as many people assume.
However if the cards don't fall right for Boris and Co and he doesn't handle the call for Scottish Independence (and possibly unification of Ireland) correctly then it is likely history won't look back fondly at his time in Office.
I am a natural right of centre voter but I would be hard pressed to vote Tory under this current Govt, perhaps 'Let's Go To a Party' party would be an option!!

I'd like Johnson gone because he is a lying self serving shit who cant be trusted. I think he has also lost the confidence of most Tory MPs. However his lowest point has probably passed. Its starting to look a bit more likely he will survive past this year and if he does who knows what happens then. Would much prefer Sunak though.  

[Lord Duckhunter]

19 minutes ago, buctootim said:

I think he has also lost the confidence of most Tory MPs. 

Lol. What a load of old pony. 

[badgerx16]

3 hours ago, spyinthesky said:

Boris and his buddies have a lot to do to maintain the impetus the Tory party had in 2019 and they dont have a lame duck like Jezza and his mates to contend with either.
 

They would need to think up some actual policies, rather than relying on a three word slogan.

[Wes Tender]

12 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

They would need to think up some actual policies, rather than relying on a three word slogan.

https://www.conservatives.com/our-plan

The manifesto isn't just three words. Naturally at the time it was written, they hadn't factored in the Chinese virus, but it can act as your guide as to what the intentions were. Now that Brexit has been delivered as promised, they have already made some changes, like abolishing the VAT on female sanitary products, banning pulse fishing and changes to the immigration rules stopping the EU's free movement, and not paying out benefits to anybody not a citizen before they have been here five years. Also benefits not to be paid to their family members not resident in the country too, I understand. These are only things that could have been brought about after 31st December, so no doubt there will many other changes to come.

[badgerx16]

4 minutes ago, Wes Tender said:

https://www.conservatives.com/our-plan

The manifesto isn't just three words. Naturally at the time it was written, they hadn't factored in the Chinese virus, but it can act as your guide as to what the intentions were. Now that Brexit has been delivered as promised, they have already made some changes, like abolishing the VAT on female sanitary products, banning pulse fishing and changes to the immigration rules stopping the EU's free movement, and not paying out benefits to anybody not a citizen before they have been here five years. Also benefits not to be paid to their family members not resident in the country too, I understand. These are only things that could have been brought about after 31st December, so no doubt there will many other changes to come.

The voters in the Red Wall constituencies, which voted to leave the EU in the referendum, almost certainly didn't pay any attention to the manifesto, they just wanted to "Get Brexit Done".

[buctootim]

1 hour ago, Wes Tender said:

https://www.conservatives.com/our-plan

The manifesto isn't just three words. Naturally at the time it was written, they hadn't factored in the Chinese virus, but it can act as your guide as to what the intentions were. Now that Brexit has been delivered as promised, they have already made some changes, like abolishing the VAT on female sanitary products, banning pulse fishing and changes to the immigration rules stopping the EU's free movement, and not paying out benefits to anybody not a citizen before they have been here five years. Also benefits not to be paid to their family members not resident in the country too, I understand. These are only things that could have been brought about after 31st December, so no doubt there will many other changes to come.

Odd that France banned pulse fishing last year then. Thought they were still in the EU. Oh and the UK could have abolished VAT on sanitary products at anytime since 2018 but didnt choose to.   

[Guided Missile]

1 hour ago, Wes Tender said:

https://www.conservatives.com/our-plan

The manifesto isn't just three words. Naturally at the time it was written, they hadn't factored in the Chinese virus, but it can act as your guide as to what the intentions were. Now that Brexit has been delivered as promised, they have already made some changes, like abolishing the VAT on female sanitary products, banning pulse fishing and changes to the immigration rules stopping the EU's free movement, and not paying out benefits to anybody not a citizen before they have been here five years. Also benefits not to be paid to their family members not resident in the country too, I understand. These are only things that could have been brought about after 31st December, so no doubt there will many other changes to come.

The ban on pulse fishing in our waters is great and can only help to conserve fish stocks and protect non-target species. Disgraceful that the EU has failed to do this and they had so many derogations that allowed it to continue.

[Wes Tender]

40 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

The ban on pulse fishing in our waters is great and can only help to conserve fish stocks and protect non-target species. Disgraceful that the EU has failed to do this and they had so many derogations that allowed it to continue.

Next step will be to ban the super trawlers from our waters. Boris has indicated that it is being considered, and an online poll campaign has growing support to give him a nudge that it would be a popular policy.

[Wes Tender]

1 hour ago, buctootim said:

 Oh and the UK could have abolished VAT on sanitary products at anytime since 2018 but didnt choose to.   

Really? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tampon-tax-abolished-from-today

[Guided Missile]

8 minutes ago, Wes Tender said:

Next step will be to ban the super trawlers from our waters. Boris has indicated that it is being considered, and an online poll campaign has growing support to give him a nudge that it would be a popular policy.

I don't know about you, but it seems to me that there are a lot of troll posters on this thread that are gagging for our great nation and our PM to fail. Traitors, every last one of them and the type that would boo the Saints and the manager when we go one nil down, instead of cheering them on and hoping for success.

[Winnersaint]

33 minutes ago, Guided Missile said:

I don't know about you, but it seems to me that there are a lot of troll posters on this thread that are gagging for our great nation and our PM to fail. Traitors, every last one of them and the type that would boo the Saints and the manager when we go one nil down, instead of cheering them on and hoping for success.

Disagreeing with your view on the world is merely a difference of opinion and very clearly not treasonous in a country which upholds freedom of speech. Talk about trolling!

Try this dictionary definition for size.

Traitor - a person who gives away or sells secrets of his or her country, or someone who is not loyal to particular beliefs or friends.

 

 

[badgerx16]

13 minutes ago, Winnersaint said:

Disagreeing with your view on the world is merely a difference of opinion and very clearly not treasonous in a country which upholds freedom of speech. Talk about trolling!

Try this dictionary definition for size.

Traitor - a person who gives away or sells secrets of his or her country, or someone who is not loyal to particular beliefs or friends.

 

 

Somewhere on the forum GM states "I am a moron, but I blame it on my education at King Edwards". If you put each of his posts in that context it makes them easier to understand. After all, he thinks Donald Trump is "playing a blinder".

Edited 4 January, 2021 by badgerx16

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, buctootim said:

Odd that France banned pulse fishing last year then. Thought they were still in the EU. Oh and the UK could have abolished VAT on sanitary products at anytime since 2018 but didnt choose to.   

Pulse fishing is banned by the EU by Article 31 of Council Regulation (EC) No. 850/98. There is a "get out" clause that allows for "research purposes" that is particularly exploited by the Dutch, in much the same way the some countries divert around bans on commercial whaling.

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Wes Tender said:

Really? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tampon-tax-abolished-from-today

Really;

https://qz.com/642811/the-eu-will-finally-allow-member-states-to-scrap-their-tampon-tax/

[Wes Tender]

21 minutes ago, Winnersaint said:

Disagreeing with your view on the world is merely a difference of opinion and very clearly not treasonous in a country which upholds freedom of speech. Talk about trolling!

Try this dictionary definition for size.

Traitor - a person who gives away or sells secrets of his or her country, or someone who is not loyal to particular beliefs or friends.

 

Try this definition  - Hyperbole

exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally.

As nobody on here is likely to be able to do anything individually to change the situation regarding Brexit, then as you say, posts from them on a football club forum are opinions only.

As such, charges of treasonable behaviour are much more closely attributable to those fifth columnists who independently attended meetings without the government's blessing to give counsel to the EU negotiators and Commissioners about how they could best act to thwart the Brexit negotiations from our side. 

 

[buctootim]

 

 

4 hours ago, Wes Tender said:

Really? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tampon-tax-abolished-from-today

 

Really. This Government, particularly the PM, lies. Not finesses the truth or puts a spin on, flat out lies. Trump and Johnson are two peas in a pod. 

Edited 4 January, 2021 by buctootim

[Weston Super Saint]

47 minutes ago, buctootim said:

 

 

4 hours ago, Wes Tender said:

Really? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tampon-tax-abolished-from-today

 

Really. This Government, particularly the PM, lies. Not finesses the truth or puts a spin on, flat out lies. Trump and Johnson are two peas in a pod. 

Source?

[badgerx16]

9 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Source?

Their lips move.

[badgerx16]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55530721

"Some EU specialist online retailers have said they will no longer deliver to the UK because of tax changes which came into force on 1 January."

The companies are angry because they now face higher costs and increased bureaucracy in order to comply with UK tax authorities.

However, it is unclear how many have taken the drastic step of refusing all UK orders.

At the same time, international shipping companies including Federal Express and TNT have said they are levying additional charges on shipments between the UK and the EU.

......mail and freight company TNT has said it is now imposing a surcharge of £4.31 on all shipments between the UK and the EU. Rivals DHL and UPS have also taken similar measures.

 

Edited 4 January, 2021 by badgerx16

[SW5 SAINT]

/

Edited 7 January, 2021 by SW5 SAINT

[badgerx16]

New border rules introduced last week are already creating problems for exporters and traders, say firms.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55583244

 

"

But major retailers that use the UK as a distribution hub for European business could face possible tariffs if they re-export goods to the EU.

"Tariff free does not feel like tariff free when you read the fine print," M&S's chief executive Steve Rowe told Reuters on Thursday, ahead of the retailer's trading update on Friday.

"For big businesses there will be time-consuming workarounds but for a lot of others this means paying tariffs or rebasing into the EU."

[Tamesaint]

11 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

New border rules introduced last week are already creating problems for exporters and traders, say firms.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55583244

 

"

But major retailers that use the UK as a distribution hub for European business could face possible tariffs if they re-export goods to the EU.

"Tariff free does not feel like tariff free when you read the fine print," M&S's chief executive Steve Rowe told Reuters on Thursday, ahead of the retailer's trading update on Friday.

"For big businesses there will be time-consuming workarounds but for a lot of others this means paying tariffs or rebasing into the EU."

Nah. Its Project Fear.... bump in the road.....

[Sheaf Saint]

UK fishermen halting exports to EU as ‘catastrophe’ Brexit bureaucracy renders business unviable

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-fish-trade-uk-eu-lorries-exports-b1784312.html

If only there was a way we could have foreseen this 

[trousers]

2 hours ago, Sheaf Saint said:

UK fishermen halting exports to EU as ‘catastrophe’ Brexit bureaucracy renders business unviable

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-fish-trade-uk-eu-lorries-exports-b1784312.html

If only there was a way we could have foreseen this 

How does one know who to believe?

https://dailybusinessgroup.co.uk/2021/01/snp-hindering-fish-exporters-to-score-brexit-points/

 

[Winnersaint]

Who'd have thought this might be a consequence.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-exports-dpd-marks-spencer-b1784376.html

 

Edited 8 January, 2021 by Winnersaint

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, trousers said:

How does one know who to believe?

https://dailybusinessgroup.co.uk/2021/01/snp-hindering-fish-exporters-to-score-brexit-points/

 

Perhaps the fishing industry itself ?

https://thefishingdaily.com/latest-news/scottish-seafood-exporters-hit-by-perfect-storm-of-brexit-disruption/

"

Responding to the current Brexit disruption, Donna Fordyce, Chief Executive of Seafood Scotland, said:

“The last 48 hours has really delivered what was expected – new bureaucratic non-tariff barriers, and no one body with the tools to be able to fix the situation.   

“It’s a perfect storm for Scottish seafood exporters. Weakened by Covid-19, and the closure of the French border before Christmas, the end of the Brexit transition period has unleashed layer upon layer of administrative problems, resulting in queues, border refusals and utter confusion.

“IT problems in France meant consignments were diverted from Boulogne sur Mer to Dunkirk, which was unprepared as it wasn’t supposed to be at the export frontline. There have also been HMRC IT issues on the UK side that need to resolved ASAP regarding certification. A lack of knowledge and understanding of the required paperwork means some companies are ill prepared for the new checks, which are taking far longer because of the mistakes being uncovered.  When the systems settle down, checks should be carried out on samples from each load but now entire consignments are having to be checked to satisfy requirements. 

“These businesses are not transporting toilet rolls or widgets. They are exporting the highest quality, perishable seafood which has a finite window to get to markets in peak condition.  If the window closes these consignments go to landfill.  The knock-on effect of export falling over is that the fishing fleet will have little reason to go out.  In a very short time we could see the destruction of a centuries old market which contributes significantly to the Scottish economy.

“The problem is no longer hypothetical. It is happening right now.  We are working with industry, Government, and other bodies to try to mop up the mess to allow trade to flow again.  We are doing all we can to help companies get the paperwork done. It will take time to fix – which we know many seafood companies can’t afford right now.”

 

[Wes Tender]

If there is all this trouble over so-called additional bureaucracy because of the deal we have with the EU, then perhaps we should just go WTO and have done with it. How do all of those other countries export and import with the EU under WTO terms with seemingly none of the fuss that is being created here at the moment? Either it is deliberate stirring of the pot by the usual anti-Brexit suspects, or some businesses which had months and months to get their houses in order, haven't bothered to do so.

[John B]

3 hours ago, Wes Tender said:

If there is all this trouble over so-called additional bureaucracy because of the deal we have with the EU, then perhaps we should just go WTO and have done with it. How do all of those other countries export and import with the EU under WTO terms with seemingly none of the fuss that is being created here at the moment? Either it is deliberate stirring of the pot by the usual anti-Brexit suspects, or some businesses which had months and months to get their houses in order, haven't bothered to do so.

I know you do not believe it but there were major advantages to be in EU and SM/CU that is why there are 27 Full members an other associates ones and that is why I have been trying to explain that leaving the UK is going to be awful for the UK with no tangible benefits

 

I have no idea of your background but you dont seem to be very well informed on how the EU works and that WTO rules are worse than our current new treaty

 

I used to work for a French IT company and realised how FOM  SM/CU was so good for trade one benefit was we could ship hardware direct from the Factory in the Loire Valley direct to our UK customers without hardly any paper work .

 

It is not so called bureaucracy it is real I have sold some football books to someone in Liverpool it took me some time to  get the documentation sorted out.

 

 

 

 

[badgerx16]

3 hours ago, Wes Tender said:

......or some businesses which had months and months to get their houses in order, haven't bothered to do so.

Or the fact that the Government IT system for the new customs arrangements isn't working as it has yet to be fully specified let alone tested, which is actually the case.

[John B]

A week ago, Brexit became reality – and it’s as bad as we all feared, with barriers to trade and a loss of rights. One week into 2021, here’s how those sunlit uplands are looking:  

Businesses hit with red tape, delays and costs: New customs declarations have put up barriers to trade, as a consequence of which many UK companies ceased trading with the EU this week, hauliers have been turned back at ports, the cost of sending packages to the EU has shot up and EU companies have stopped delivering to UK customers.

€6bn has already left the City, with worse to come: Six billion euros of EU share trading left the City this week and is lost for good, while the loss of passporting rights on January 1 and failure to agree a deal on equivalence has put £26 billion of financial services exports at risk.

Travel to EU will be more hassle: From January 1, for anyone travelling to the EU, there will be more costs, paperwork, delays and limits, including a reduction in free healthcare and the return of roaming charges. You will also need more paperwork to bring a pet – even to take it to Northern Ireland. Brexit means borders within Britain.

 

[Wes Tender]

14 hours ago, John B said:

I know you do not believe it but there were major advantages to be in EU and SM/CU that is why there are 27 Full members an other associates ones and that is why I have been trying to explain that leaving the UK is going to be awful for the UK with no tangible benefits

I have no idea of your background but you dont seem to be very well informed on how the EU works and that WTO rules are worse than our current new treaty

I used to work for a French IT company and realised how FOM  SM/CU was so good for trade one benefit was we could ship hardware direct from the Factory in the Loire Valley direct to our UK customers without hardly any paper work .

It is not so called bureaucracy it is real I have sold some football books to someone in Liverpool it took me some time to  get the documentation sorted out.

 

In the same way that there were advantages of our EU membership, then of course any sensible intelligent person would also acknowledge that there were disadvantages too. The decision to stay or leave the EU was based on whether one's assessment considered the the advantages to outweigh the disadvantages and vice versa. You have said on more than one occasion that there were no advantages to leaving, so clearly you are completely blinkered, and it would be a waste of time attempting to argue with you. I am confident that time will prove that our decision to leave the failing EU will have been the right one, and that now was the right time too.

We have container ships coming into Southampton from all over the World, and the goods are unloaded and checked within minutes. I understand that the French are being their usually bolshie selves deliberately delaying our exports via Calais in order that serial remoaners like you can bleat about how we have made a massive error in leaving, but they will soon realise that such pettiness is counter productive and soon things will settle down to an efficient routine.

Oh, and bully for you selling some football books to somebody in Liverpool. Has your name been submitted for a Queen's Award to Industry?

[Wes Tender]

14 hours ago, John B said:

A week ago, Brexit became reality – and it’s as bad as we all feared, with barriers to trade and a loss of rights. One week into 2021, here’s how those sunlit uplands are looking:  

Businesses hit with red tape, delays and costs: New customs declarations have put up barriers to trade, as a consequence of which many UK companies ceased trading with the EU this week, hauliers have been turned back at ports, the cost of sending packages to the EU has shot up and EU companies have stopped delivering to UK customers.

€6bn has already left the City, with worse to come: Six billion euros of EU share trading left the City this week and is lost for good, while the loss of passporting rights on January 1 and failure to agree a deal on equivalence has put £26 billion of financial services exports at risk.

Travel to EU will be more hassle: From January 1, for anyone travelling to the EU, there will be more costs, paperwork, delays and limits, including a reduction in free healthcare and the return of roaming charges. You will also need more paperwork to bring a pet – even to take it to Northern Ireland. Brexit means borders within Britain.

 

On the other hand, we are motoring ahead with trade deals all over the place, plans are being made to open several free ports around the country, especially in run-down areas of the country, we have in place our own immigration policy now that FOM has ended, and the Government is liaising with business chiefs to ask for ways that industry and commerce can be made more efficient by getting rid of EU red tape, you know, the sort that had to apply to all businesses whether they dealt with the EU or not. £100 million to be invested in our fisheries to assist their growth as the quota of fish in our own waters grows over the next five years. The Erasmus programme ditched and replaced with one that allows student changes around the world, instead of just Europe, aimed to benefit the poorer students in particular. All this already and we only left five minutes ago.

 

[spyinthesky]

19 hours ago, Wes Tender said:

I

On 03/01/2021 at 12:16, Tamesaint said:

 

 

Edited 9 January, 2021 by spyinthesky

[badgerx16]

51 minutes ago, Wes Tender said:

The Erasmus programme ditched and replaced with one that allows student changes around the world, instead of just Europe....

 

A European scheme budgeted at £160m on the UK side replaced with a Worldwide version funded by £100m. And the immigration policy we now have is exactly the same as the one we always had, except it now applies to the EU27 as well.

Edited 9 January, 2021 by badgerx16

[spyinthesky]

59 minutes ago, Wes Tender said:

On the other hand, we are motoring ahead with trade deals all over the place, plans are being made to open several free ports around the country, especially in run-down areas of the country, we have in place our own immigration policy now that FOM has ended, and the Government is liaising with business chiefs to ask for ways that industry and commerce can be made more efficient by getting rid of EU red tape, you know, the sort that had to apply to all businesses whether they dealt with the EU or not. £100 million to be invested in our fisheries to assist their growth as the quota of fish in our own waters grows over the next five years. The Erasmus programme ditched and replaced with one that allows student changes around the world, instead of just Europe, aimed to benefit the poorer students in particular. All this already and we only left five minutes ago.

 

Wes
Always interested in your view but perhaps I can comment on a couple of points.
Re Freeports, there were a number in the UK from the early/mid 1980's (including Southampton) but the UK legislation that established them lapsed about 8-10 years ago so it is interesting to know what the Government will do differently with their new arrangements that they were unable to do in the past.
Re Trade deals, as I understand that around 60 trade deals worth approx £160 billion have rolled over from existing EU trade deals.
Japan is a new one representing approx 2% of our worldwide trade and there are ongoing talks with Canada & Mexico.
Meantime the highly promoted trade deal with the USA will be subject to all sorts of 'ifs, buts and maybe's' as a consequence of the new leadership in the country.
I am involved in the Logistics industry and I can assure you there are significant issues with additional paperwork and, to be fair the French/Belgian and Dutch ports are taking a relatively soft approach to processing paperwork at the moment.
Challenges in accessing Northern Ireland are well documented.
In view of this I am finding a number of our staple imports are increasing in price and some supply being adversely affected.
This may only be a temporary situation but only time will tell.
With a couple of friends working in the City (one of the most important sectors of the British economy) they are very concerned about their future and can see a future where our finance industry is essentially regulated by Brussels if our negotiators are unable to agree a suitable deal.
Only time will tell if things will improve but initial signs are not too encouraging.
Good job we are not Sheff Utd or West Brom fans!!

Edited 9 January, 2021 by spyinthesky

[John B]

1 hour ago, Wes Tender said:

On the other hand, we are motoring ahead with trade deals all over the place, plans are being made to open several free ports around the country, especially in run-down areas of the country, we have in place our own immigration policy now that FOM has ended, and the Government is liaising with business chiefs to ask for ways that industry and commerce can be made more efficient by getting rid of EU red tape, you know, the sort that had to apply to all businesses whether they dealt with the EU or not. £100 million to be invested in our fisheries to assist their growth as the quota of fish in our own waters grows over the next five years. The Erasmus programme ditched and replaced with one that allows student changes around the world, instead of just Europe, aimed to benefit the poorer students in particular. All this already and we only left five minutes ago.

 

As usual you do not seem to realise what you are talking about

Yes we are getting new trade deals but they are the same or inferior to the
 ones we had when we were in the EU especially the Japan deal

We are trying to get Free Trade deals with both Australia and NZ with FOM but 
both countries have rejected our advances because they do not want to be flooded
with low skilled Brits

There are free ports in the EU. There were free ports in the UK until 2012, 
when UK legislation establishing them expired. So presumably they were not 
thought to be a good thing

Most of reputable business does not want to reduce your so called red tape because they
are in effect standards for their products which they wish they keep when 
competing with other EU countries

However the EU FT deal as aknowledged by Gove is going to be crippled for traders 
by Red Tape for goodness knows for how long 

But yes you are right in that the UKIP wing of the Tory Party want to cut loads
of rights in the work place in order to increase profits and reduce workers benefits 
and wages

There are significant issues still with Fishing NI Passporting in the Financial Services  
sector and the ability for service providers to gain Access to the EU without FOM as well as the 
loss of EU companies relocating to the EU

So we are no where near the Sunny Uplands and £350 m a week we were promised

According to the Bank of England the cost of leaving the EU is at least £80b which I would 
have thought was far from being of great Value

Keep safe but do read some articles written by Business People Economists Hauliers and Fishermen as you seem to be indoctrinated by Brexit propaganda 

You could have a St Paul on the way to Damascus moment on the way to St Mary's and see the error 
of your ways
 

[ecuk268]

3 hours ago, John B said:

Yes we are getting new trade deals but they are the same or inferior to the
 ones we had when we were in the EU especially the Japan deal

There are free ports in the EU. There were free ports in the UK until 2012, 
when UK legislation establishing them expired. So presumably they were not 
thought to be a good thing

 

Lyn Truss looks like she's swallowed a wasp.

Southampton Freeport was started in 1983. The company still exists as Southampton Free Trade Zone but has been dormant for many years.

 

[Wes Tender]

2 hours ago, John B said:

As usual you do not seem to realise what you are talking about

Yes we are getting new trade deals but they are the same or inferior to the
 ones we had when we were in the EU especially the Japan deal

We are trying to get Free Trade deals with both Australia and NZ with FOM but 
both countries have rejected our advances because they do not want to be flooded
with low skilled Brits

There are free ports in the EU. There were free ports in the UK until 2012, 
when UK legislation establishing them expired. So presumably they were not 
thought to be a good thing

Most of reputable business does not want to reduce your so called red tape because they
are in effect standards for their products which they wish they keep when 
competing with other EU countries

However the EU FT deal as aknowledged by Gove is going to be crippled for traders 
by Red Tape for goodness knows for how long 

But yes you are right in that the UKIP wing of the Tory Party want to cut loads
of rights in the work place in order to increase profits and reduce workers benefits 
and wages

There are significant issues still with Fishing NI Passporting in the Financial Services  
sector and the ability for service providers to gain Access to the EU without FOM as well as the 
loss of EU companies relocating to the EU

So we are no where near the Sunny Uplands and £350 m a week we were promised

According to the Bank of England the cost of leaving the EU is at least £80b which I would 
have thought was far from being of great Value

Keep safe but do read some articles written by Business People Economists Hauliers and Fishermen as you seem to be indoctrinated by Brexit propaganda 

You could have a St Paul on the way to Damascus moment on the way to St Mary's and see the error 
of your ways
 

As usual, anybody who disagrees with your opinions  doesn't know what they are talking about. Typical arrogance from your side. Whereas most of the trade deals so far negotiated are rolled over from the EU deals we were a part of, that is the immediate expedient position as a starting point. Further negotiations will concentrate on the specific areas of beneficial advantage to both sides and expand the deals with those Countries. We will not only arrange trade deals with Australia and New Zealand, but a combined one with them and Canada too, to form CANZUK. We are also looking towards joining the massive CPTPP block, with whom we already have deals with several members. A further possibility is a bloc comprising Commonwealth members. You do not seem to have realised that the EU is the declining force in world trade, whereas most of the growth is in the Pacific region, India and Brazil.

Yes, there are Free Ports in the EU, 80 of them, mostly in the newer member states in Eastern or Central Europe and they existed before those countries became members. It is generally accepted that the benefits will be far greater outside of the EU rules regime, provided that we would be free from the level playing field rules on state aid investment, which thankfully we largely are.

Regarding your assertions that EU rules applied to all UK businesses regardless of whether they traded with the EU or not will be retained because they are deemed to be essential to maintain standards, no doubt those business leaders will soon enough highlight those areas where they disagree with you. Many of them were put in place to make the UK less competitive against EU manufacturers and producers in Germany and France in particular, and decimated much of our manufacturing base and producers as a result. Manufacturing standards in the UK are to a high level, and only need to be commensurate to the specifications required by the buying country, not the EU. Naturally we will need to maintain EU standards when selling to them, but not to others. 

You have this bizarre notion that cutting ourselves free from EU red tape will result in a race to the bottom on workers rights and the lowering of wages. In most areas, we have much higher standards in both compared to the EU. I suggest that you look at the EU's policy of FOM which had the biggest effect on falling wages and work conditions in this country, and now that we are out and have ended FOM, wage levels will rise as a whole when we employ our points based system on immigration and raise the standards and qualifications of those coming in to the UK for work and residency.

You seem obsessed with this £350 million a week. Now we are not paying into the EU slush fund, we are saving much more than that. I seem to recall asking you before, but I will ask you again, as I don't think I received a reply; how much do you think our contribution would have been to the EU emergency budget post Covid? What do you reckon; would it be more, or less than that £80 billion you mention? 

Forecasts like those from the OBR and BoE are very long term, and rely on a lot of assumptions, basically guesswork. When Singapore left the Federation of Malysia, their GDP was half of the UK's. A few decades later, it is now double that in the UK. What did the forecasters predict for the Singapore economy at the time of their departure?