Brexit - Post Match Reaction

[ecuk268]

 

https://newsthump.com/2019/11/11/nigel-farage-demonstrates-fabled-brexiter-negotiating-skills-by-giving-tories-everything-they-want-for-nothing-in-return/

[sadoldgit]

Without any doubt though, the one who is able to trigger most people on here is SOG. Never seen anything like it.

 

I think you are giving me far to much credit. There are those who trigger far more than I do. I just trigger my stalker and a few of his ilk. They tend to be of a right wing persuasion too, so that tells you something.

[hypochondriac]

I think you are giving me far to much credit. There are those who trigger far more than I do. I just trigger my stalker and a few of his ilk. They tend to be of a right wing persuasion too, so that tells you something.

See. Falsely labelling people "right wing" would only be triggering if someone started having a meltdown about it or getting incredibly angry. Laughing at someone or calling out blatant lies and falsehoods isn't the definition of triggering I would use. Its just it's repeated by soggy on a regular basis so it needs shooting down fairly regularly too.

[shurlock]

https://news.sky.com/story/teslas-elon-musk-says-brexit-uncertainty-made-uk-too-risky-for-new-factory-11860444

 

All due to #diesel

[CB Fry]

It's going to be brilliant being with our true friends in the WTO.

 

.................................

 

Australia demands compensation over Brexit trade disruption

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/15/australia-demands-compensation-over-brexit-trade-disruption?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

[Tamesaint]

It's going to be brilliant being with our true friends in the WTO.

 

.................................

 

Australia demands compensation over Brexit trade disruption

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/15/australia-demands-compensation-over-brexit-trade-disruption?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

 

You can't believe anything in that Marxist rag. They just print lies.

 

We just need Farage to negotiate with the Aussies. He might get as good a settlement with them as he did with Johnson.

[Sheaf Saint]

https://www.businessinsider.com/government-has-no-plans-for-economic-assessment-of-brexit-deal-2019-11?r=US&IR=T

 

Boris Johnson's government admits it has no plans to carry out an economic assessment of his Brexit deal

 

Boris Johnson's government is accused of an "utterly staggering and a complete dereliction of duty" after admitting that it has no plans to carry out an assessment of the economic impact of the prime minister's Brexit deal.

 

Last month Brexit Secretary Stephen Barclay told a House of Lords committee that he would "expect so" when asked whether an economic impact assessment of the withdrawal deal would to appear at "some point."

 

However, in response to a Freedom of Information Request by Julie Ward, Labour Member of European Parliament, the Brexit Department [DExEU] said: "There is no 'economic impact assessment' based upon the Withdrawal Agreement, nor is there a date for an 'economic impact assessment' to take place."

[badgerx16]

We don't need an Economic Impact Assessment, we all know that Boris' deal is the best possible outcome, and Brexit will be a low tax, light regulation, bonanza under which our trade flourishes, having been freed from the shackles put in place by our largest trading partner.

[aintforever]

There is little point in an Economic Impact Assessment because expert opinions are apparently not important. Plus we have to plough on regardless of the consequences anyway - otherwise democracy dies or something.

[Sheaf Saint]

Anyone seen the Arron Banks leaks on Twitter? There's some dynamite stuff come out of it so far.

 

https://twitter.com/JoeZBlair/status/1196790921700036608

 

Worried much Andy?

[Sheaf Saint]

https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/1196837709094039558?s=20

 

The idea that Brexit is a negotiation between the EU and the UK is "the largest unicorn ever invented in history", according to the former director of the WTO.

 

Who'd have thought it, eh?

[Guided Missile]

 

The idea that Brexit is a negotiation between the EU and the UK is "the largest unicorn ever invented in history", according to the former director of the WTO.

 

Who'd have thought it, eh?

 

Who'd have thought it? A French ex EU Commissioner and all round EU fanatic thinks Brexit is a bad idea. I have to agree that to those like him that have been pushing for greater integration, it is a bad idea. Like Gavyn Davies, he's just another out of touch champagne socialist and ageing economist. Here's what Pascal "Out of Touch" said before our wonderful referendum:

 

As unease grows over how Britons will vote in a referendum on the country's EU membership, Lamy says he's confident the chances of the U.K. leaving the bloc were “low.” If a Brexit does occur, he adds, its impact on the EU project would be “catastrophic" — dramatically undermining the bloc's will to build a common security and defense union. “Who can say that we will be able to build it without the Brits?" Lamy asks. “They have a diplomatic system and a knowledge of the world that is astonishing.”

[Guided Missile]

The idea that Brexit is a negotiation between the EU and the UK is "the largest unicorn ever invented in history", according to the former director of the WTO.

Who'd have thought it, eh?

 

What the WTO really thinks of the EU protectionist state:

 

Largest Ever WTO Award Paves the Way for U.S. Countermeasures

 

Washington, D.C. 2nd October, 2019 – The United States has won the largest arbitration award in World Trade Organization (WTO) history in its dispute with the European Union over illegal subsidies to Airbus. This follows four previous panel and appellate reports from 2011-2018 finding that EU subsidies to Airbus break WTO rules. Today’s decision demonstrates that massive EU corporate welfare has cost American aerospace companies hundreds of billions of dollars in lost revenue over the nearly 15 years of litigation. “For years, Europe has been providing massive subsidies to Airbus that have seriously injured the U.S. aerospace industry and our workers. Finally, after 15 years of litigation, the WTO has confirmed that the United States is entitled to impose countermeasures in response to the EU’s illegal subsidies,” U.S. Trade Representative Robert Lighthizer said. “Accordingly, the United States will begin applying WTO-approved tariffs on certain EU goods beginning October 18. We expect to enter into negotiations with the European Union aimed at resolving this issue in a way that will benefit American workers.” The award of $7.5 billion annually is by far the largest award in WTO history—nearly twice the largest previous award. The Arbitrator calculated this amount based on WTO findings that EU launch aid for Airbus is causing significant lost sales of Boeing large civil aircraft, as well as impeding exports of Boeing large aircraft to the EU, Australia, China, Korea, Singapore, and UAE markets. Under WTO rules, the Arbitrator’s decision is final and not subject to appeal. The United States today has requested that the WTO schedule a meeting on October 14 to approve a U.S. request for authorization to take countermeasures against the EU. Pursuant to WTO rules, the WTO will provide this authorization automatically at that meeting. The EU is not allowed to retaliate against WTO-authorized countermeasures. The tariffs will be applied to a range of imports from EU Member States, with the bulk of the tariffs being applied to imports from France, Germany, Spain, and the United Kingdom – the four countries responsible for the illegal subsidies. Although USTR has the authority to apply a 100 percent tariff on affected products, at this time the tariff increases will be limited to 10 percent on large civil aircraft and 25 percent on agricultural and other products. The U.S. has the authority to increase the tariffs at any time, or change the products affected. USTR will continually re-evaluate these tariffs based on our discussions with the EU.

 

Additional Background Information

 

In May 2011, the Appellate Body confirmed that the EU and four of its member States (Germany, France, the UK, and Spain) conferred more than $18 billion in subsidized financing to Airbus and had caused Boeing to lose sales of more than 300 aircraft and significant market share throughout the world. In fact, in looking at the effect of the EU subsidies, the original WTO panel that first heard the case and the Appellate Body agreed that “[w]ithout the subsidies, Airbus would not have existed … and there would be no Airbus aircraft on the market. None of the sales that the subsidized Airbus made would have occurred.” None of these findings were altered in the May 2018 compliance appellate report, which confirmed that the EU provided additional billions of euros in subsidized financing to Airbus. In contrast, the WTO rejected the EU assertion in the EU’s counter-complaint that U.S. subsidies were responsible for the viability of large civil aircraft production in the United States. The WTO found that only a single Washington State tax measure that provided Boeing with additional pricing flexibility was inconsistent with WTO rules.

[benjii]

What the WTO really thinks of the EU protectionist state:

 

That it benefitted us?

[Guided Missile]

That it benefitted us?

Yeah, illegally and unfairly...

[shurlock]

As a wise sage would say, they all do it - earlier this month China was given permission to impose sanctions on US goods for the US failure to remove anti-dumping duties in compliance with WTO rules.

 

Alas little ole Global Britain will find itself caught in the crosshairs and crossfire of the big three - the US, EU and China.

Edited 24 November, 2019 by shurlock

[sadoldgit]

There has been a bright yellow mini doing the rounds with a big “Bo llocks To Brexit” sign on it. It was recently stopped by police, the driver shouted at and instructed to remove the sign before he was allowed to proceed. A while back there was a court case where the word “bo llocks” was found not to be obscene. Complaints have been lodged about the policeman and his conduct is being investigated.

[Shroppie]

Amazing how the Chief Rabbi (a personal friend of Boris Johnson) can be so damning of Jeremy Corbyn when the Tories have at least as much anti-Semitism in their ranks (and many would say far more) and Johnson's racist attitudes and remarks (women in burkhas looking like letterboxes, picaninnies etc) are clearly not worthy of mention.

 

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[hypochondriac]

Amazing how the Chief Rabbi (a personal friend of Boris Johnson) can be so damning of Jeremy Corbyn when the Tories have at least as much anti-Semitism in their ranks (and many would say far more) and Johnson's racist attitudes and remarks (women in burkhas looking like letterboxes, picaninnies etc) are clearly not worthy of mention.

 

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Probably just a raging tory like the Archbishop and the Rabbi.

[Shroppie]

The US/UK trade deal negotiation documents exposed by Labour clearly show advanced discussions on allowing the US access to the NHS.

 

It's a devastating indictment of Johnson's lying, but by tomorrow hell no doubt have denied everything, repeated his meaninglessness sound-bites several times more and have the reassurance of the Mail, Express, Torygraph, Times that we can "trust Boris to get Brexit done" and that the documentation of secret negotiations are fake or out of date.

 

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[Shroppie]

The US/UK trade deal negotiation documents exposed by Labour clearly show advanced discussions on allowing the US access to the NHS.

 

It's a devastating indictment of Johnson's lying, but by tomorrow hell no doubt have denied everything, repeated his meaninglessness sound-bites several times more and have the reassurance of the Mail, Express, Torygraph, Times that we can "trust Boris to get Brexit done" and that the documentation of secret negotiations are fake or out of date.

 

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[Batman]

The US/UK trade deal negotiation documents exposed by Labour clearly show advanced discussions on allowing the US access to the NHS.

 

It's a devastating indictment of Johnson's lying, but by tomorrow hell no doubt have denied everything, repeated his meaninglessness sound-bites several times more and have the reassurance of the Mail, Express, Torygraph, Times that we can "trust Boris to get Brexit done" and that the documentation of secret negotiations are fake or out of date.

 

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The NHS is not going to be sold.

I think that is quite obvious.

Who on gods earth wants to buy that?

 

Every single election the NHS appears to need saving from disaster, Labour dust off the old NHS playbook and give it another whirl.

Edited 27 November, 2019 by Batman

[sadoldgit]

The NHS is not going to be sold.

I think that is quite obvious.

Who on gods earth wants to buy that?

 

Every single election the NHS appears to need saving from disaster, Labour dust off the old NHS playbook and give it another whirl.

 

Your loyalty is commendable but parts have already been privatised and the pharma companies can’t wait to get their hands on our drugs contracts. Wake up and smell the iodine.

[Batman]

Your loyalty is commendable but parts have already been privatised and the pharma companies can’t wait to get their hands on our drugs contracts. Wake up and smell the iodine.

 

I don’t care who provides the drugs as long as it is free at the point of use and value for money.

 

The NHS as it is remains completely unsustainable and something needs to change.

 

Labour tried by privatising a small part (would never had though so) and I believe it needs removing from the political space. Having Jeremy Hunt or a Dianne Abbot like in charge Imodium something like that is barking mad.

[Sheaf Saint]

The NHS is not going to be sold.

I think that is quite obvious.

Who on gods earth wants to buy that?

 

Every single election the NHS appears to need saving from disaster, Labour dust off the old NHS playbook and give it another whirl.

 

Well nobody is going to buy it in its entirety are they. But can you genuinely not see how lucrative it would be for US healthcare firms to cash in on it piece by piece?

 

Have a read of this thread...

 

https://twitter.com/ByDonkeys/status/1196685828627533824

 

Johnson is a pathological liar. When he says the NHS is not up for grabs in any US/UK trade deal, you can be 100% certain he is not telling the truth.

[Sheaf Saint]

I don’t care who provides the drugs as long as it is free at the point of use and value for money.

 

Fook me, really?

 

Do you honestly not see the implications of US pharma companies securing the contracts to supply medicine and then raising the costs by 1000%?

[sadoldgit]

I don’t care who provides the drugs as long as it is free at the point of use and value for money.

 

The NHS as it is remains completely unsustainable and something needs to change.

 

Labour tried by privatising a small part (would never had though so) and I believe it needs removing from the political space. Having Jeremy Hunt or a Dianne Abbot like in charge Imodium something like that is barking mad.

 

Spoken like a true Tory! Have you ever fallen ill in the US?

[Shroppie]

The NHS is not going to be sold.

I think that is quite obvious.

Who on gods earth wants to buy that?

 

Every single election the NHS appears to need saving from disaster, Labour dust off the old NHS playbook and give it another whirl.

You can try to shrug it off, but this is far more serious. No, it's not selling the NHS, but it's allowing the US access to the market on their terms - higher prices (x3) for drugs, extended patents to protect high prices, privatisation wherever possible.

 

Read also the sections on reducing food hygiene standards. And more.

 

This isn't scaremongering. It's exposure of what the Tories' have been up to with the US for ages, and denying it. And yet another blatant example of Johnson's lying.

 

The attempted rebuttal by the Tories this morning was truly pathetic and showed how scared they are of this gathering momentum. But they can probably rely on the right wing media to deny clear truths.

 

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[Fan The Flames]

Fook me, really?

 

Do you honestly not see the implications of US pharma companies securing the contracts to supply medicine and then raising the costs by 1000%?

 

I guess he did include 'value for money'. But you are right the US pharma companies will want to sell their drugs at a higher rate then they can now. Currently the NHS drives a hard bargain on what it is prepared to pay for medicines and it's the NHS users that benefit by more money being available to go into service provision.

[Batman]

You can try to shrug it off, but this is far more serious. No, it's not selling the NHS, but it's allowing the US access to the market on their terms - higher prices (x3) for drugs, extended patents to protect high prices, privatisation wherever possible.

 

Read also the sections on reducing food hygiene standards. And more.

 

This isn't scaremongering. It's exposure of what the Tories' have been up to with the US for ages, and denying it. And yet another blatant example of Johnson's lying.

 

The attempted rebuttal by the Tories this morning was truly pathetic and showed how scared they are of this gathering momentum. But they can probably rely on the right wing media to deny clear truths.

 

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It’s not sticking... Labour have had this document for a while and clearly yesterday’s car crash has moved the time table when to release it.

 

It’s not sticking. No one believes the NHS is up for sale, on the table etc.

 

If the price of drugs is too high, I doubt they will be bought.

[buctootim]

The NHS gets fantastic prices on drugs and equipment because it functions as a single purchasing consortium - usually around 10-40% of what a patient in the US would pay. Where drugs expenditure per person in the UK is around £300 pa in the US it's around £850, despite lower survival rates.

 

If the NHS paid for drugs at US rates it would need an extra £36 billion pa just to standstill.

 

Breaking up the consortium to allow US pharma to claw back that £36bn in additional profits is what this is all about. To that end fter the election expect to see some kind of 'joint venture trial' announced by the Johnson government. It will encourage big US healthcare and venture capital companies putting in low ball bids to run flagship NHS units at below costs. It will be billed as super efficient US healthcare (which if you know anything about US healthcare is a sick joke) giving a much needed shot in the arm to the 'mismanaged' NHS. Once they've got the contracts they'll erode the NHS' purchasing power and start to increase charges. Its a ruse been used time and time again with things like privatisation of rubbish collection, rail and water.

Edited 27 November, 2019 by buctootim

[hypochondriac]

Labour in panic mode bringing out this leak now to deflect from the car crash last night. I don't think it will work...

[Shroppie]

Labour in panic mode bringing out this leak now to deflect from the car crash last night. I don't think it will work...

The only panic right now is on the Johnson camp. Yesterday was no new news. Today is the clearest evidence yet of blatant Tory lying.

 

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[Batman]

The only panic right now is on the Johnson camp. Yesterday was no new news. Today is the clearest evidence yet of blatant Tory lying.

 

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Lies everywhere [emoji23]

[hypochondriac]

The only panic right now is on the Johnson camp. Yesterday was no new news. Today is the clearest evidence yet of blatant Tory lying.

 

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You're insane!

[Weston Super Saint]

Fook me, really?

 

Do you honestly not see the implications of US pharma companies securing the contracts to supply medicine and then raising the costs by 1000%?

 

Could they not, you know, put a clause or two into the contract or is that an idea that is way off the charts?

 

Maybe a clause that says something along the lines of 'raise the prices of drugs and the contract is void'. Would that be impossible to implement??

[hypochondriac]

The only panic right now is on the Johnson camp. Yesterday was no new news. Today is the clearest evidence yet of blatant Tory lying.

 

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These "leaks" are a joke, released in a panic this morning because they are desperate to distract from yesterday. As all the journalists have pointed out, they simply don't show what Corbyn claims and even if they had done- which they don't- it was old negotiations under the useless May leadership and there's no evidence that the British side have agreed to anything. Desperate...

Edited 27 November, 2019 by hypochondriac

[Batman]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

These "leaks" are a joke, released in a panic this morning because they are desperate to distract from yesterday. As all the journalists have pointed out, they simply don't show what Corbyn claims. Desperate...

 

I’m sure Labour planned to release these at a later date but went early due to last night as this was probably the ace up their sleeve [emoji23]

 

Something said about dishing out ‘UK Eyes Only’ documents to anyone in the room though!

[Wes Tender]

Another devastating dissection of Labour's NHS attack on the Tories by Andrew Neil, this time tearing Barry Gardiner to shreds. Robert Buckland the Tory Justice Minister did far better, and is a far safer pair of hands than his opposite number Richard Burgon, but nowhere near as entertaining.

[Shroppie]

Of course that bunch of journalists, most of whom are in the pay of the Tory Party, will do anything to discredit the document.

 

Of course there is no evidence of agreement: these were discussions about what the US would demand, and that's clear enough and very dangerous. It's wrong to say it was the last government -it wasn't - just a different prime minister who was less keen than Johnson to be a lapdog of Trump.

 

The speed with which the Tories tried to move the agenda back to anti-Semitism shows their concern. But they needn't worry. No matter what they do or say, no matter what scrutiny they avoid, no matter how moronic their meaningless soundbites, no matter how much they lie, the MSM will reassure the unthinking masses and convince them it'll all be alright. Just trust Boris. There's the biggest joke of all. It's hard to imagine a less trustworthy individual.

 

Politics in the UK is broken, in the hands of self-seeking egotistical lying extremists.

 

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[Nolan]

I'm unsure if that's a parody post Shroppie....

 

Are you being serious?

 

The reason the story moved back onto anti semitism is because there wasn't a story in the NHS.

[Batman]

Of course that bunch of journalists, most of whom are in the pay of the Tory Party, will do anything to discredit the document.

 

Of course there is no evidence of agreement: these were discussions about what the US would demand, and that's clear enough and very dangerous. It's wrong to say it was the last government -it wasn't - just a different prime minister who was less keen than Johnson to be a lapdog of Trump.

 

The speed with which the Tories tried to move the agenda back to anti-Semitism shows their concern. But they needn't worry. No matter what they do or say, no matter what scrutiny they avoid, no matter how moronic their meaningless soundbites, no matter how much they lie, the MSM will reassure the unthinking masses and convince them it'll all be alright. Just trust Boris. There's the biggest joke of all. It's hard to imagine a less trustworthy individual.

 

Politics in the UK is broken, in the hands of self-seeking egotistical lying extremists.

 

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Jesus wept

[Shroppie]

Jesus wept

That sums up my view of the current state of politics.

 

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[Shroppie]

I'm unsure if that's a parody post Shroppie....

 

Are you being serious?

 

The reason the story moved back onto anti semitism is because there wasn't a story in the NHS.

Totally serious. But you believe what you like. If you've read it, it's obviously true.

 

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[Batman]

Totally serious. But you believe what you like. If you've read it, it's obviously true.

 

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Even a senior Labour MP has admitted there is no proof, ffs.

 

Labour go on about lies in politics, yet their ace in the pack is one big whopping porkie.

Edited 28 November, 2019 by Batman

[hypochondriac]

Of course that bunch of journalists, most of whom are in the pay of the Tory Party, will do anything to discredit the document.

 

Of course there is no evidence of agreement: these were discussions about what the US would demand, and that's clear enough and very dangerous. It's wrong to say it was the last government -it wasn't - just a different prime minister who was less keen than Johnson to be a lapdog of Trump.

 

The speed with which the Tories tried to move the agenda back to anti-Semitism shows their concern. But they needn't worry. No matter what they do or say, no matter what scrutiny they avoid, no matter how moronic their meaningless soundbites, no matter how much they lie, the MSM will reassure the unthinking masses and convince them it'll all be alright. Just trust Boris. There's the biggest joke of all. It's hard to imagine a less trustworthy individual.

 

Politics in the UK is broken, in the hands of self-seeking egotistical lying extremists.

 

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Spoken like a true Momentum supporter thrashing about and having a tantrum because his socialist utopia is evaporating before his eyes. You sound like little Owen Jones.

[Shroppie]

Spoken like a true Momentum supporter thrashing about and having a tantrum because his socialist utopia is evaporating before his eyes. You sound like little Owen Jones.

I'm not a socialist, or a member of the Labour Party, won't be voting Labour and haven't voted Labour since 1970.

 

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[buctootim]

Spoken like a true Momentum supporter thrashing about and having a tantrum because his socialist utopia is evaporating before his eyes. You sound like little Owen Jones.

 

Why do you still try to position yourself as politically neutral when your own posts discredit that?

 

Shroppies post was accurate. Johnson’s rush to get out of the EU come what may will leave us desperate and dependent on the US providing some kind of trade fig leaf. Their will be a price to pay for it, most likely including some access to the NHS. Deriding him as dogma driven momentum puts you in an unflattering light

[Wes Tender]

I'm not a socialist, or a member of the Labour Party, won't be voting Labour and haven't voted Labour since 1970.

 

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So you're an anti-democracy Lib Dumb then. They see no point in a third referendum on our EU membership, because they wouldn't honour it anyway, so what was the point in having it if they wouldn't abide by the decision, they reason. So they go straight to overturning the decision before it has even been enacted, and have the brass neck to have "Democrats" in their party title. Now finally realising that it isn't the vote winner they anticipated, they are back-tracking to the laughably so called "people's vote", but because of their previous stance, nobody can believe a word they say. As it has always been, it is easy to promise the earth if they have zero chance of being elected as the government. The stand-out comedy moment of the election so far has been the girl Swinson claiming that she would be the next Prime Minister.

[Wes Tender]

 

Shroppies post was accurate.

 

No it wasn't.