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Guided Missile

By Guided Missile,
in The Lounge

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Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum  

220 members have voted

  1. 1. Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum

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shurlock

shurlock

Posted
Posted (edited)
Once the house votes for no deal tomorrow then May's deal becomes by some distance the least worst option for the ERG.

 

Better than a short extension

Better than a long extension that the EU might demand

Better than a revocation of A50 which could go to a commons vote as a last ditch attempt to stop actual no-deal

Better than a General Election

Better than a second referendum

 

 

The ERG will vote for May's deal and call it their victory. As will Les and Guided Missile and everyone else posting Union Jacks and pictures of champagne flutes and singing the Great Escape tune and all the other sh it we will get on March 29th.

 

The ERG might still reason that as long as there isn't a cross-party majority for a positive alternative i.e. a permanent customs union or a second referendum, no deal won't be completely dead. The EU might grant a short extension to the UK only for the UK to remain mired in gridlock at the end of that period. The difference is that the option for a further extension will then have been exhausted, giving the ERG a flicker of hope. The sooner the PM allows indicative votes so that a positive alternative can emerge, the better but in doing so May will completely surrender control of the process - hence her reluctance and obstructiveness.

Edited by shurlock
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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
Once the house votes for no deal tomorrow then May's deal becomes by some distance the least worst option for the ERG.

 

Better than a short extension

Better than a long extension that the EU might demand

Better than a revocation of A50 which could go to a commons vote as a last ditch attempt to stop actual no-deal

Better than a General Election

Better than a second referendum

 

 

The ERG will vote for May's deal and call it their victory. As will Les and Guided Missile and everyone else posting Union Jacks and pictures of champagne flutes and singing the Great Escape tune and all the other sh it we will get on March 29th.

 

The endgame I referred to yesterday is not about the ERG vs May. The endgame now is about the ERG stopping Anna Soubry and Chukka Umuna "winning". They will not let them win.

 

So the Conservatives will force through a deal that Parliament has already twice said is sh!t for the country, just to get one over on Labour. Can’t see it myself.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
So the Conservatives will force through a deal that Parliament has already twice said is sh!t for the country, just to get one over on Labour. Can’t see it myself.
Yeah, I don't think you understand what is actually happening. Not least because I named two MPs that are not members of the Labour party.

 

Bless you for trying though x x

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
The ERG might still reason that as long as there isn't a cross-party majority for a positive alternative i.e. a permanent customs union or a second referendum, no deal won't be completely dead. The EU might grant a short extension to the UK only for the UK to remain mired in gridlock at the end of that period. The difference is that the option for a further extension will then have been exhausted, giving the ERG a flicker of hope. The sooner the PM allows indicative votes so that a positive alternative can emerge, the better but in doing so May will completely surrender control of the process - hence her reluctance and obstructiveness.
Yes, that is probably what keeps the ERG going, and they're right that parliament will struggle to coalesce around anything.

 

The "No No deal" option will win tomorrow, which will change the game because it will send a message to the country. It gives a certainty of direction that UK businesses will not want to let go. UK big business have already pi ssed enough money away planning for no deal, I know the one I work for has and they are already fu cking furious about it. Shocking, pointless waste.

 

Anyway, from that point, the issue will be forced and the ERG will see a load of things they really don't want to happen creeping up on them. And off they will run, into the arms of May's deal which actually is okay really when you think about etc etc.

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Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
Yes, that is probably what keeps the ERG going, and they're right that parliament will struggle to coalesce around anything.

 

The "No No deal" option will win tomorrow, which will change the game because it will send a message to the country. It gives a certainty of direction that UK businesses will not want to let go. UK big business have already pi ssed enough money away planning for no deal, I know the one I work for has and they are already fu cking furious about it. Shocking, pointless waste.

 

Anyway, from that point, the issue will be forced and the ERG will see a load of things they really don't want to happen creeping up on them. And off they will run, into the arms of May's deal which actually is okay really when you think about etc etc.

 

Its interim, and from a Remainers point of view it's certainly least economic damage. The fact that a different PM or Government may negotiate a customs union deal with the EU to get around the GFA is another kettle of fish.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
Yeah, because you’ve been bang on so far [emoji38]
Says the man who supported Brexit because he wanted to stick one over Management Consultants and Lobbyists like Goldman Sachs, the very people who will make an absolute killing out of the contracts and consultancy work that this uttetly pointless endeavour will throw up. Right on, sister.

 

And the man who, let's never forget, spent months on this thread going on about sticking it to the man and then bottled the fu ck out of voting at all when the day came. You're an utter joke mate.

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
I'm taking some time off actually - off to Bridgetown for a couple of weeks, do a bit of training to further my qualifications, and sort out trying to convince the other half to emigrate somewhere that I don't have to share oxygen with wastrels like yourself.

 

:lol: calm down dear

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
Says the man who supported Brexit because he wanted to stick one over Management Consultants and Lobbyists like Goldman Sachs, the very people who will make an absolute killing out of the contracts and consultancy work that this uttetly pointless endeavour will throw up. Right on, sister.

 

And the man who, let's never forget, spent months on this thread going on about sticking it to the man and then bottled the fu ck out of voting at all when the day came. You're an utter joke mate.

 

Yeah, because walking down to the village hall and putting a cross on a bit of paper takes real bottle :lol:

 

I didn’t bother voting because among other reasons, I was on the fence. Still am to a degree, can’t stand the EU yet leaving has proved to be more hassle than its worth. Think you need to calm down a bit as well sweetie.

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Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
Yeah, because walking down to the village hall and putting a cross on a bit of paper takes real bottle :lol:

 

I didn’t bother voting because among other reasons, I was on the fence. Still am to a degree, can’t stand the EU yet leaving has proved to be more hassle than its worth. Think you need to calm down a bit as well sweetie.

 

I'm assuming you didn't vote either way as you didn't understand either argument, leave or remain, and struggled to read the side of the bus.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
Yeah, because walking down to the village hall and putting a cross on a bit of paper takes real bottle [emoji38]

 

I didn’t bother voting because among other reasons, I was on the fence. Still am to a degree, can’t stand the EU yet leaving has proved to be more hassle than its worth. Think you need to calm down a bit as well sweetie.

Yeah, it's pretty easy to go and vote but you still couldn't bring yourself to do it. Gutless.
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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
Yeah, it's pretty easy to go and vote but you still couldn't bring yourself to do it. Gutless.

 

To be honest my heart said leave but I’m doing pretty well, have a good job, nice detached house in a leafy part of Hampshire so there was no real desire for change. Hence I chose not to vote.

 

Is that so hard to understand, even for you?

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
I'm assuming you didn't vote either way as you didn't understand either argument, leave or remain, and struggled to read the side of the bus.

 

 

You still sound bitter.

 

Are you sure you got sacked because of Brexit and not because you spent all day posting cr@p on here instead of working?

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
To be honest my heart said leave but I’m doing pretty well, have a good job, nice detached house in a leafy part of Hampshire so there was no real desire for change. Hence I chose not to vote.

 

Is that so hard to understand, even for you?

 

But you were on this thread a lot before the vote and still here now.

 

So yes, it is hard to understand. If you're not fussed, fine. My missus isn't fussed, she's sick of me watching the news all the time. Guess what, she still voted in the biggest decision this country has made since WW2.

 

It's a football forum, go off and talk about football on another thread. You want to talk Brexit then your gutlessness will be brought up by me when I feel like it because it bears repeating and is relevant.

 

Is that so hard to understand, even for you?

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
But you were on this thread a lot before the vote and still here now.

 

So yes, it is hard to understand. If you're not fussed, fine. My missus isn't fussed, she's sick of me watching the news all the time. Guess what, she still voted in the biggest decision this country has made since WW2.

 

It's a football forum, go off and talk about football on another thread. You want to talk Brexit then your gutlessness will be brought up by me when I feel like it because it bears repeating and is relevant.

 

Is that so hard to understand, even for you?

 

You still need to explain why it takes courage to vote, where do you live, Baghdad? :lol:

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Portugalsaint

Portugalsaint

Posted
Posted (edited)

It appears that the EU elections will not be settled until the Autumn as they have to fill all the top posts and it’s a complete change. Apparently they don’t want to be bothered with the UK indecision whilst they have this going on. It’s more likely that the Eu would prefer an extension past the Autumn when their new ministers are settled in.

 

This could create more problems for the Uk as more and more indecision going on. Let’s face it, if the parliament couldn’t get it right over two years what bloody hope is there even for another year.

 

Some young people on tv tonight said they were losing the will to live. Probably the most sensible comment I have heard this year over brexit!

Edited by Portugalsaint
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Portugalsaint

Portugalsaint

Posted
Posted
Well then they're just idiots. They just need to ask any expat who has residual income from the UK, let alone those who retired to Spain and Portugal with no local income whatsoever. I know a few, they're nigh on 20% down now. Some have even had to get loans from their kids instead of the usual vice-versa.

 

I can believe this WC. I know people who came out to Portugal on the assumption that the pound would remain 1.48 euros to the UK£! When it dropped to 1.32 in 2011 some went back to the Uk. I find it difficult to understand how people could rely on anything less than 1 : 1.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
But the EU are desperate to not see a hard border in Ireland - they can't be seen to be the ones that made it happen.
Today is the the day the government outline what no deal actually means.

 

The ERG will soon learn it will not be all their dreams come true because the border will still have to be respected. They have all rejected the horrible old backstop so that means they will have to accept one of the alternatives like a border down the Irish sea instead. No deal doesn't make the problem go away.

 

Which is kind of why David Davis sucked up the May deal yesterday. He can see what's coming, and he's thick as s hit.

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whelk

whelk

Posted
Posted
No it's not, not if you've read this thread and seen my general responses to fools.

 

I know enough about you that you fit squarely into that bracket.

 

Your incredible deduction worked out I have no kids. Great work.

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Weston Super Saint

Weston Super Saint

Posted
Posted

Can anyone - including Jeff, the certified loony - argue that this is not a sensible plan?

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47551266

 

Surely this is what we should have been focusing on when it became clear that the EU were / are never going to negotiate further and May's deal was dead in the water? Perhaps if this was highlighted earlier in the process it could have saved a lot of businesses a lot of unnecessary costs?

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Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted (edited)
Can anyone - including Jeff, the certified loony - argue that this is not a sensible plan?

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47551266

 

Surely this is what we should have been focusing on when it became clear that the EU were / are never going to negotiate further and May's deal was dead in the water? Perhaps if this was highlighted earlier in the process it could have saved a lot of businesses a lot of unnecessary costs?

 

It's a sensible plan for the people of this country in regards to imports. It'll blow a big hole in public finances - depending how big the tax implications of the lost tariffs are - but that's fine, we can just make further cuts, because as I'm sure we can all agree, austerity hasn't gone far enough. Imported cars and meats will cost us more, but that's not a big deal, we can buy old Rover's and will end up eating chlorinated chicken anyway. There is also the fact that with further cuts to tariffs, it means manufacturers in this country are going to be more squeezed in those areas, but then we don't really care about UK manufacturing anyway - why do we need to make ****?

 

However, perhaps you can answer what happens with our Exports to the rest of the World in the event of a No-deal?

Edited by Unbelievable Jeff
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badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
Can anyone - including Jeff, the certified loony - argue that this is not a sensible plan?

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47551266

 

Surely this is what we should have been focusing on when it became clear that the EU were / are never going to negotiate further and May's deal was dead in the water? Perhaps if this was highlighted earlier in the process it could have saved a lot of businesses a lot of unnecessary costs?

But the Director General of the CBI says "These are being imposed on this country with no consultation with business with no time to prepare. This is no way to run a country,"

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whelk

whelk

Posted
Posted
Mainly because I couldn't believe someone with children couldn't care less if babies died or not.

 

That's on you mate, not me.

 

Unmoved is not the same as couldn’t care less.

Helps your polarised world as good guys v bad guys no doubt

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Kingsland Codger

Kingsland Codger

Posted
Posted
But the Director General of the CBI says "These are being imposed on this country with no consultation with business with no time to prepare. This is no way to run a country,"

 

And yet, lower down in the same article, Adam Marshall, Director General of the British Chamber of Commerce tells us that the government had listened to businesses.

 

Who does one believe? The DG of the CBI? The DG of theBCC? Or the BBC journalist?

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted (edited)
DUP won't though, I wouldn't have thought, and they're the Kingmakers...

 

Depends, yesterday there were 242 for and 75 conservatives against . 633 total votants. Must have been 17 abstentionists or non- presents then.

 

So if the 75 conservative againsters voted for and everything else remained the same that would give 317 of 633, ie a majority.

Think there was at least 1 conservative absentee for personal reason so if the rebels all came into line the government could win without the DUP.

Edited by Window Cleaner
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Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
Depends, yesterday there were 242 for and 75 conservatives against . 633 total votants. Must have been 17 abstentionists or non- presents then.

 

So if the 75 conservative againsters voted for and everything else remained the same that would give 317 of 633, ie a majority.

Think there was at least 1 conservative absentee for personal reason so if the rebels all came into line the government could win without the DUP.

 

And as CB rightly says, if Labour MPs see ERG going that way a few will defy the whip.

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whelk

whelk

Posted
Posted
Fine, you're unmoved if any babies die. Makes you seem more caring :lol:

 

Have you stopped sobbing or honest enough to understand your posturing on forums isn’t a window to your soul?

 

How many tragedies today have ‘moved’ you?

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Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted (edited)
Have you stopped sobbing or honest enough to understand your posturing on forums isn’t a window to your soul?

 

How many tragedies today have ‘moved’ you?

 

What are you on about? I said it was tragic that a baby died. You said you were unmoved by it - not even that it was a sad piece of news - just that you were completely unmoved by it.

 

What are your 'red lines' (trying to keep on topic) for the death of a baby to be tragic? Do you have to know them? Do they have to be white?

Edited by Unbelievable Jeff
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