Brexit - Post Match Reaction

[shurlock]

And this, which I predicted very early on this thread, is the Brexiteers defence.

 

"They didn't implement the way we wanted it, so it's not our fault. It would have worked otherwise."

 

Had they implemented things as they wanted, we would have already crashed out.

 

Just look at the record Brexiters who have had a free hand at their departments because they don’t directly impinge on negotiations with the EU. Liam Fox at Dit can’t even roll over the EU’s existing FTAs -never mind improve on them because the world is a bit more complicated than he imagined while Michael Gove at Defra is vigorously championing May’s deal because he knows the alternative would be disastrous for his stakeholders.

 

It’s pretty clear the buck stops with the headbangers who promised the undeliverable.

[Doctoroncall]

I helped create the miserable deal? I'm afraid that I wasn't part of the negotiations, that was May and her Remainer advisors and Cabinet. I can't blame May for her total incompetence in the way that she (mis)handled the negotiations? Why can't I?

 

And what a shame it is that a majority of the electorate who voted to leave the EU can't be as worldly, well-informed and intelligent as you claim to be.

 

It is May’s mess. When Cameron rightly abdicated being very much for staying in the EU, May insist she was the best for the job and her party agreed.

 

Having seen some reaction as to why many voted leave was immigration, it is perfectly reasonable to question their thought process as the Conservatives have never upheld their manifesto promise to limit immigration to the electorate, either legitimate or illegal immigration.

 

Besides, it’s clear we need an influx to fill the vacancies due to lack of skills here. All that will change is less people from the EU, more from the Asian subcontinent. Let’s see how that is received.

[Doctoroncall]

That’s because Jezzas a Brexiter and Mays not.

 

The other positive about this plan is that May will probably have to commit to leaving office pretty soon afterwards. I’d imagine Brexiters will demand that in return for their vote.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

May has already played that card in trying to get her deal through. She will not be PM leading the Conservatives into the next GE.

[Weston Super Saint]

In today’s news, we discover that UK factories are stockpiling goods at fastest pace in 27 years in the event of a no deal. Arron Banks has been fined for serious breaches of electronic marketing laws during the 2016 referendum. Meanwhile Gary Lineker has written a letter of love to the Germans

 

It’s a laugh a minute in Brexit Britain. What an utter mess.

 

Not sure why they're bothering. Everyone keeps telling us that the world will almost end and whatever export market we have at the moment will be obliterated on the 29th March. Seems fairly pointless to stockpile goods if there is no way to sell them! No point pretending they'll be sold in the UK as we're told that will implode as well with impending doom and the worst recession in history so no-one will have any money to buy anything!

 

Either that or it's all ********.

 

#MSS

[Highfield Saint]

A Professor Aikharts (sp? He sounds Dutch and not sure I caught his name) was on Today programme this morning with some interesting thoughts on negating the Backstop and therefore avoiding a no deal. Something along the lines of proceeding with the Withdrawal Agreement in order to allow the Transition phase to begin on a provisional basis.

 

It's about 1:17:30 in and is on for a couple of minutes.

 

As I say it sounded interesting to m but I am by no means an expert so would appreciate thoughts and analysis from you guys if you have any time to listen...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m00028bl

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Not sure why they're bothering. Everyone keeps telling us that the world will almost end and whatever export market we have at the moment will be obliterated on the 29th March. Seems fairly pointless to stockpile goods if there is no way to sell them! No point pretending they'll be sold in the UK as we're told that will implode as well with impending doom and the worst recession in history so no-one will have any money to buy anything!

 

Either that or it's all ********.

 

#MSS

 

If there is a 1% decrease in sales across the board, what effect do you think that will have on the economy? How about 5%, or 10%? No-one is predicting no sales whatsoever.

Edited 1 February, 2019 by Unbelievable Jeff

[shurlock]

A Professor Aikharts (sp? He sounds Dutch and not sure I caught his name) was on Today programme this morning with some interesting thoughts on negating the Backstop and therefore avoiding a no deal. Something along the lines of proceeding with the Withdrawal Agreement in order to allow the Transition phase to begin on a provisional basis.

 

It's about 1:17:30 in and is on for a couple of minutes.

 

As I say it sounded interesting to m but I am by no means an expert so would appreciate thoughts and analysis from you guys if you have any time to listen...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m00028bl

 

It’s Piet Eeckhout, professor of EU law and dean of UCL law school. His suggestion is certainly possible, though don’t know how politically feasible it is. I think there are strong incentives to time-limit any extension, especially as there’s a high chance that no resolution will be found.

[Lord Duckhunter]

May has already played that card in trying to get her deal through. She will not be PM leading the Conservatives into the next GE.

 

Not quite, her wording was that she wouldn’t lead them into the election scheduled for 2022. They’ll want her gone before she gets the chance to involve herself in the future relationship. With her negotiating skills we’ll probably end end giving IOW to the French. Once a PM says they’re going, they always end up going before they want to. They won’t humiliate her, but I’m sure they’ll insist she’s gone by conference, in return for their support.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Lord Duckhunter]

Oh dear. It’s been a bad week for Chucka, his local PLP has adopted one member one vote, making it easier for the Corbyn cult to deselect him.

 

Reports are that he stormed off before the result was announced. Not so keen on the people voting in Streatham.

 

 

 

 

http:// https://mobile.twitter.com/streathamsllab/status/1091101177989742595

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Highfield Saint]

It’s Piet Eeckhout, professor of EU law and dean of UCL law school. His suggestion is certainly possible, though don’t know how politically feasible it is. I think there are strong incentives to time-limit any extension, especially as there’s a high chance that no resolution will be found.

 

Many thanks Shurlock.

 

Maybe as realisation dawns that a compromise is inevitable it could be that it is more about finding a structure and set of words that allow all parties to claim success?

[Plastic]

And what a shame it is that a majority of the electorate who voted to leave the EU can't be as worldly, well-informed and intelligent as you claim to be.

 

Hey, tell it to this guy...

 

The sad fact is that most voters are sheep, don't think too carefully when they vote, go with the sound bytes, what their mates do and aren't that smart.

 

I think he nailed ‘most voters’ there.

[buctootim]

Ha just found out 96% of the vets employed by the Food Standards Agency are from EU countries. Kick em all out and poison ourselves I say. We have the right to die!

[Lord Duckhunter]

Ha just found out 96% of the vets employed by the Food Standards Agency are from EU countries. Kick em all out and poison ourselves I say. We have the right to die!

 

Pathetic attempt

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Verbal]

Oh dear. It’s been a bad week for Chucka, his local PLP has adopted one member one vote, making it easier for the Corbyn cult to deselect him.

 

Reports are that he stormed off before the result was announced. Not so keen on the people voting in Streatham.

 

 

 

 

http:// https://mobile.twitter.com/streathamsllab/status/1091101177989742595

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Crapatalk

 

How odd. Not at all like a kipper to attack a black man for having the sheer nerve to be a moderate.

[hypochondriac]

How odd. Not at all like a kipper to attack a black man for having the sheer nerve to be a moderate.

Looking at the responses, it seems there's quite enough hostility from Labour Party members to go around.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

And so it starts...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47036119

[badgerx16]

And so it starts...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47036119

So if they have their way we will go from being a member of the EU to a vassal of the USA. How much of a level playing field do people think any trans-Atlantic talks will take place on ?

 

#MAGA #americafirst

[Unbelievable Jeff]

So if they have their way we will go from being a member of the EU to a vassal of the USA. How much of a level playing field do people think any trans-Atlantic talks will take place on ?

 

#MAGA #americafirst

 

It's massively scary. If people think the EU are bad...

[saint1977]

Had they implemented things as they wanted, we would have already crashed out.

 

Just look at the record Brexiters who have had a free hand at their departments because they don’t directly impinge on negotiations with the EU. Liam Fox at Dit can’t even roll over the EU’s existing FTAs -never mind improve on them because the world is a bit more complicated than he imagined while Michael Gove at Defra is vigorously championing May’s deal because he knows the alternative would be disastrous for his stakeholders.

 

It’s pretty clear the buck stops with the headbangers who promised the undeliverable.

 

As Michael Heseltine said in his book ‘my colleagues on the right think they always know how things should be done’ but lack the real world experience and need for attention to detail and compromise in negotiation when it comes to it. Gove has found a number of problems with no deal and Brexit, not least the huge reliance of water purification chemicals from the EU with disasterous results for consumers and farmers.

 

You didn’t mention the worst of all - Chris Failing and Fat Boris, the latter couldn’t put his cream cake or latest mistress down for long enough to bother to any read any of his briefings and embarrass the UK around the world. Endorsements from the DT are irrelevant when none of those are proper journalists but the Barclay Brothers subservient minions. Grayling - cabinet equivalent of Pellegrino at SFC.

 

I haven’t seen a single Brexiteer fit for office yet.

 

If anyone is surprised that the US pre-talks are so lopsided, they should stayed on at school beyond 15 and paid a bit more attention.

[buctootim]

Pathetic

It’s hyperbole to make a point. So many of our services are utterly dependent on EU labour doing jobs Brits don’t want to. How you going to resolve that ?

[Winnersaint]

https://www.ecowatch.com/13-ways-the-eu-beats-the-u-s-on-food-safety-1881850175.html

 

Putting politics aside I know what I'd prefer.

[van Hanegem]

So if they have their way we will go from being a member of the EU to a vassal of the USA. How much of a level playing field do people think any trans-Atlantic talks will take place on ?

 

#MAGA #americafirst

 

I had the idea you were a part of the USA already...

 

[video=youtube_share;1osdqwaiu08]

[Lord Duckhunter]

It’s hyperbole to make a point. So many of our services are utterly dependent on EU labour doing jobs Brits don’t want to. How you going to resolve that ?

 

So let’s get this straight. According to you there are jobs that Brits don’t want to do. Being a leftie I presume you think it’s ok to pay people welfare, whilst they pick and choose jobs they deem good enough for them.

 

There will not be a labour shortage after Brexit, not a chance. Don’t worry people will still want to serve your Latte, or wipe your arse, they maybe Africans or Asians or god forbid working class English, but you won’t notice much difference at all. I doubt immigration numbers will change much at all, especially with the sopping wet Parliament we have now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[badgerx16]

It’s hyperbole to make a point. So many of our services are utterly dependent on EU labour doing jobs Brits don’t want to. How you going to resolve that ?

 

So let’s get this straight. According to you there are jobs that Brits don’t want to do. Being a leftie I presume you think it’s ok to pay people welfare, whilst they pick and choose jobs they deem good enough for them.

 

There will not be a labour shortage after Brexit, not a chance. Don’t worry people will still want to serve your Latte, or wipe your arse, they maybe Africans or Asians or god forbid working class English, but you won’t notice much difference at all. I doubt immigration numbers will change much at all, especially with the sopping wet Parliament we have now.

It really isn't hyperbole, and we are not talking about unskilled or low skilled workers; the British Veterinary Association have stated that - "...Brexit could exacerbate existing shortages and recruitment problems in the workforce and is calling for vets to be reinstated on the Shortage Occupation List to safeguard against shortfalls in capacity. Nearly half of vets registering to work in the UK every year come from the EU, and 95 per cent of Official Veterinarians working in abattoirs come from overseas, mainly the EU."

 

https://www.bva.co.uk/news-campaigns-and-policy/newsroom/news-releases/vets-warn-no-deal-brexit-could-leave-parts-of-the-workforce-at-breaking-point/

[Unbelievable Jeff]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/02/02/brexit-blamed-for-nissan-pulling-manufacture-of-x-trail-from-u-k/

 

Going to be a few job losses there then. At least it's a heavily Brexit area - you reap what you sow.

[Lord Duckhunter]

It really isn't hyperbole, and we are not talking about unskilled or low skilled workers; the British Veterinary Association have stated that - "...Brexit could exacerbate existing shortages and recruitment problems in the workforce and is calling for vets to be reinstated on the Shortage Occupation List to safeguard against shortfalls in capacity. Nearly half of vets registering to work in the UK every year come from the EU, and 95 per cent of Official Veterinarians working in abattoirs come from overseas, mainly the EU."

 

I’m puzzled as to what your issue is. Any country that has control of its immigration policy can decide the numbers and professions of its immigrants. If we’re short of vets it’s perfectly reasonable to let any vet from The EU or indeed anywhere else in the world work here. If Parliament so wish, nothing will change in respect of vets. If they decide to impose restrictions on veterinary immigrants , we can vote them out.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[CB Fry]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/02/02/brexit-blamed-for-nissan-pulling-manufacture-of-x-trail-from-u-k/

 

Going to be a few job losses there then. At least it's a heavily Brexit area - you reap what you sow.

Sunderland knew precisely what they were voting for.

[shurlock]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/02/02/brexit-blamed-for-nissan-pulling-manufacture-of-x-trail-from-u-k/

 

Going to be a few job losses there then. At least it's a heavily Brexit area - you reap what you sow.

 

No, no, no it’s nothing to do with Brexit. It’s all down to the decline of diesel. And gibberish about state aid for Slovakia and dodgy loans from the EIB

[Verbal]

Sunderland knew precisely what they were voting for.

 

I'm sure they did, but the lawbreaking enterprise that was Leave.EU - now under criminal investigation - said this about Nissan in 2016:

 

"Project Fear claims Nissan would scale back UK operation could not be further from the truth!"

 

Yet another Project Fear prediction proves correct. Yet another Leave Lie threatens the livelihoods of people.

[Winnersaint]

You voted out, Don’t f*u*c*k*i*n*g whine just because your jobs have gone

[RedArmy]

I bet Ford took the transit production to Turkey because of Brexit too.

[moonraker]

Leavers only care about one thing, leaving, people’s lives, jobs and welfare are secondary.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Leavers only care about one thing, leaving, people’s lives, jobs and welfare are secondary.

 

Pony

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Tamesaint]

Pony

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

A good intellectually based argument that sums up in one word the Brexiteers's case.

[Wes Tender]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-02/queen-to-be-evacuated-in-case-of-no-deal-brexit-riots-times

 

Now I've heard everything. The Queen and Royal family to be evacuated to a secret location in the eventuality of a no deal Brexit to protect them from the possibility of riots. Let's hope that Philip isn't the designated driver.

 

According to the leading remoaners on here, forecasting violence is tantamount to advocating it, so let's hear their condemnation of those who are reporting this ludicrous story. And who is going to be rioting here? A combination of the yoof and the metropolitan champagne socialists and the academics should make for an interesting spectacle.

[John B]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-02/queen-to-be-evacuated-in-case-of-no-deal-brexit-riots-times

 

Now I've heard everything. The Queen and Royal family to be evacuated to a secret location in the eventuality of a no deal Brexit to protect them from the possibility of riots. Let's hope that Philip isn't the designated driver.

 

According to the leading remoaners on here, forecasting violence is tantamount to advocating it, so let's hear their condemnation of those who are reporting this ludicrous story. And who is going to be rioting here? A combination of the yoof and the metropolitan champagne socialists and the academics should make for an interesting spectacle.

 

So you would be happy for the Queen to be target of abuse if Brexit goes badly wrong

 

Just 54 days to go before Mr. Putin's Brexit and the huge triumph for Russia by the way

[Plastic]

And who is going to be rioting here? A combination of the yoof and the metropolitan champagne socialists and the academics should make for an interesting spectacle.

Why do you spend your time citing tabloid fantasies and detailing your response to them, yet devote no effort to analysing the actual economic consequences of Brexit?

Are JLR, Barclays, Nissan et al of any interest to you? What is your opinion on the proposed job losses? Do you feel these losses are coincidental with Brexit, or caused by it? Is this a good thing, bad thing, or if no consequence?

Just ‘loling’ at the imagined opposition tells us nothing of value.

Edited 3 February, 2019 by Plastic

[Guided Missile]

Why do you spend your time citing tabloid fantasies and detailing your response to them, yet devote no effort to analysing the actual economic consequences of Brexit?

Are JLR, Barclays, Nissan et al of any interest to you? What is your opinion on the proposed job losses? Do you feel these losses are coincidental with Brexit, or caused by it? Is this a good thing, bad thing, or if no consequence?

Just ‘loling’ at the imagined opposition tells us nothing of value.

F***ing behave:

 

[shurlock]

F***ing behave:

 

 

How much of that is made up of part-time workers who want full-time jobs, inactive workers who would like to return to the labour market, and non-traditional forms of working such as the gig economy and zero-hours contracts? Asking for a pal.

Edited 3 February, 2019 by shurlock

[Guided Missile]

How much of that is made up of part-time workers who want full-time jobs, inactive workers who would like to return to the labour market, and non-traditional forms of working such as the gig economy and zero-hours contracts? Asking for a pal.

 

You tell me. You're the socialist economic genius. How about commenting on these facts, Herbert?

 

Venezuela’s Unemployment Rate is forecasted to be 33.350 % in Dec 2018 as reported by International Monetary Fund - World Economic Outlook. It records an increase from the last reported number of 27.096 % in Dec 2017. Looking ahead, Venezuela’s Unemployment Rate is projected to stand at 44.315 % in Dec 2023.

 

 

On Friday Jeremy Corbyn tweeted: “The future of Venezuela is a matter for Venezuelans. Jeremy Hunt’s call for more sanctions on Venezuela is wrong. We oppose outside interference in Venezuela, whether from the US or anywhere else. There needs to be dialogue and a negotiated settlement to overcome the crisis.”

 

[aintforever]

Leavers only care about one thing, leaving, people’s lives, jobs and welfare are secondary.

 

Not really, most people voted leave because of the effects of mass immigration - wage depression, lack of affordable housing and pressure on services. A similar argument would be remoaners don’t care about any of these, they just want someone cheap to clean their car or serve up their coffee.

[Guided Missile]

Spot the difference:

 

 

Throwing his support firmly behind Venezuela’s elected leader, Russian President Vladimir Putin spoke with his Venezuelan counterpart Nicolas Maduro in a phone talk on Thursday.

 

“The president of Russia expressed his support to the legitimate Venezuelan authorities in the context of the aggravation of the internal political crisis provoked from the outside,” said a Kremlin statement, referring to the U.S. and other countries calling an opposition leader the country's “interim president.”

 

Putin “stressed that destructive external interference grossly violates the fundamental norms of international law,” the statement added.

[CB Fry]

That famous EU nation, Venezuela.

 

Jesus wept.

[shurlock]

You tell me. You're the socialist economic genius. How about commenting on these facts, Herbert?

 

Venezuela’s Unemployment Rate is forecasted to be 33.350 % in Dec 2018 as reported by International Monetary Fund - World Economic Outlook. It records an increase from the last reported number of 27.096 % in Dec 2017. Looking ahead, Venezuela’s Unemployment Rate is projected to stand at 44.315 % in Dec 2023.

 

 

On Friday Jeremy Corbyn tweeted: “The future of Venezuela is a matter for Venezuelans. Jeremy Hunt’s call for more sanctions on Venezuela is wrong. We oppose outside interference in Venezuela, whether from the US or anywhere else. There needs to be dialogue and a negotiated settlement to overcome the crisis.”

 

 

Where have I defended Venezuela’s economic record or Corbyn’s defence of what’s going on there? And what does that have to do with the UK’s unemployment rate?

[Tamesaint]

Where have I defended Venezuela’s economic record or Corbyn’s defence of what’s going on there? And what does that have to do with the UK’s unemployment rate?

 

There is a separate thread on Venezuela. I suspect that the old boy has been drinking again and has got confused - hic.

[Guided Missile]

Where have I defended Venezuela’s economic record or Corbyn’s defence of what’s going on there? And what does that have to do with the UK’s unemployment rate?

 

Herbert the champagne socialist trapped in a doomed dogma:

 

He (GM) ..... makes an entirely spurious claim that Corbyn and the Labour manifesto wants to run the UK along similar lines. I've been very critical of the Labour manifesto but the reductio ad absurdum in conflating it with Chavez .... is patently ridiculous.

 

After Chavez’s death in 2013, Corbyn paid tribute, saying: “He showed us there is a different and a better way of doing things. It’s called socialism, it’s called social justice.” Now the Labour leader’s manifesto shows the same markers to economic destruction, with its anti-enterprise agenda and promises of a class-led “reckoning”. Some of the plans “could have been written for Chavez”, warned former MP and Latin American expert Jacques Arnold.

 

Keep digging, Herbert and I might keep you off ignore.

[Guided Missile]

That famous EU nation, Venezuela.

 

Jesus wept.

That famous UK politician, PM in waiting and Hugo Chavez fanboy, Jeremy Corbyn offering to lead the UK post Brexit to a brighter economic future, free of unemployment and social ills.

 

Jesus is weeping...

[CB Fry]

Have I been in a coma for five years, in which time Corbyn took power and enacted loads of policies that have turned us into a sub-Venezuela?

 

If not, what the fu ck is this idiot chatting sh it about?

[CB Fry]

That famous UK politician, PM in waiting and Hugo Chavez fanboy, Jeremy Corbyn offering to lead the UK post Brexit to a brighter economic future, free of unemployment and social ills.

 

Jesus is weeping...

When it comes to Brexit, I think you'll find Corbyn, Milne, Mann, Dennis Skinner and the rest are far more on your side than mine, sweetheart. Snuggle up, comrade.

[Tamesaint]

Still don't understand what Venezuela has to do with Brexit.

 

Are Nissan moving their jobs there from Sunderland ?